Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

NAO

(3,425 posts)
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 12:19 PM Jun 2016

Article - Too Sick To Lead: The Lethal Personality Disorder Of Donald Trump

Too Sick To Lead: The Lethal Personality Disorder Of Donald Trump
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-north-patterson/too-sick-to-lead-the-leth_b_10086768.html


excerpt

"...But there is nothing more “current” or important than Donald Trump’s psychological fitness to be president. All the hyperventilation of the media - parsing his “positions”, pontificating on his” strategy” and intuition- is a poisonous form of the “political correctness” he otherwise deplores, normalizing the abnormal by shoehorning him into the usual analytic boxes. And what it yields is, in great part, rubbish.

There is only one organizing principle which makes sense of his wildly oscillating utterances and behavior - the clinical definition of narcissistic personality disorder.

The Mayo Clinic describes it as “a mental disorder in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance, a deep need for admiration and a lack of empathy for others.” This is bad enough in selecting a spouse or a friend. But when applied to a prospective president, the symptoms are disqualifying.

With Trump ever in mind, try these. An exaggerated sense of self-importance. An unwarranted belief in your own superiority. A preoccupation with fantasies of your own success, power and brilliance. A craving for constant admiration. A consuming sense of entitlement. An expectation of special favors and unquestioning compliance.

A penchant for exploiting or disparaging others. A total inability to recognize the needs of anyone else. An incapacity to see those you meet as separate human beings. An unreasoning fury at people you perceive as thwarting your wishes or desires. A tendency to act on impulse. A superficial charm deployed to disguise a gift for manipulation.

A need to always be right. A refusal to acknowledge error. An inability to tolerate criticism or critics. A compulsion to conform your ever - shifting sense of “reality” to satisfy your inner requirements . A tendency to lie so frequently and routinely that objective truth loses all meaning.

A belief that you are above the rules. An array of inconsistent statements and behaviors driven by your needs in the moment. An inability to assess the consequences of your actions in new or complex situations. In sum, a total incapacity to separate the world from your own psychodrama...
"

Full Article:

Too Sick To Lead: The Lethal Personality Disorder Of Donald Trump
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-north-patterson/too-sick-to-lead-the-leth_b_10086768.html
29 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Article - Too Sick To Lead: The Lethal Personality Disorder Of Donald Trump (Original Post) NAO Jun 2016 OP
since when do republicans think a twisted psyche is a problem in their leaders? unblock Jun 2016 #1
+1,000,000. n/t Different Drummer Jun 2016 #2
sadly, toooooo true. niyad Jun 2016 #4
yep BlancheSplanchnik Jun 2016 #7
They were defective, but not psychopathic NAO Jun 2016 #19
Thanks for posting this. nt ProudProgressiveNow Jun 2016 #21
of course, many have been pointing this out for months now, and nobody paid any attention. niyad Jun 2016 #3
Too busy bashing Clinton to see the real problem WhiteTara Jun 2016 #5
sadly, so very true. niyad Jun 2016 #6
Or maybe too busy bashing Bernie and his supporters to see that both Trump and Dustlawyer Jun 2016 #8
+1000 nt phazed0 Jun 2016 #10
Exactly Wibly Jun 2016 #13
+ another 1000 sendero Jun 2016 #16
It's striking how many of these points don't only apply to Trump nxylas Jun 2016 #17
Exactly the kind of socipathic person that rises to the top everywhere lunatica Jun 2016 #9
We've known for some time that Trump was nuts; but, what does his candidacy say about us? LongTomH Jun 2016 #11
Les Moonves...owner of CNN... RichGirl Jun 2016 #14
CBS, not CNN - CBS is broadcast TV, not cable. scarletwoman Jun 2016 #23
Read Christopher Lasch's "The Culture of Narcissism" (1978) for an answer to your KingCharlemagne Jun 2016 #20
When you look up Narcissistic Personality Disorder in the DSM... backscatter712 Jun 2016 #12
there is danger in assigning a mental illness diagnosis to a non-patient arithia Jun 2016 #15
good points eShirl Jun 2016 #22
I agree, but even an untrained layman can see the narcissism evident in Donald Trump. smirkymonkey Jun 2016 #24
With all due respect arithia Jun 2016 #25
He is a textbook narcissist. smirkymonkey Jun 2016 #26
If you think I'm defending Trump, please re-read my previous posts. arithia Jun 2016 #27
Fair point, but really, you don't have to be a shrink to see Trump's behavior patterns. backscatter712 Jun 2016 #28
I'm not entirely sure why arithia Jun 2016 #29
Excellent article!! Everyone should read it ailsagirl Jun 2016 #18

unblock

(51,974 posts)
1. since when do republicans think a twisted psyche is a problem in their leaders?
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 12:26 PM
Jun 2016

nixon, reagan, poppy and shrub were all defective.

NAO

(3,425 posts)
19. They were defective, but not psychopathic
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 05:15 PM
Jun 2016

I think Reagan and Poppy were basically sane, I just despise their ideology and what they did to the country.

Nixon and Shrub had pretty severe psychopathology, but NOTHING like Trump.

Trump is genuinely psychopathic in the clinical (not necessary the colloquial) sense.

Although he's not a clinician, this guy has extensive experience with Narcissists, their behavioral charastics, and the abuse they inflict on their victims:


WhiteTara

(29,676 posts)
5. Too busy bashing Clinton to see the real problem
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 12:54 PM
Jun 2016

that awaits us all if we don't come together and stop him.

Dustlawyer

(10,493 posts)
8. Or maybe too busy bashing Bernie and his supporters to see that both Trump and
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 02:01 PM
Jun 2016

Hillary are the problem!

Wibly

(613 posts)
13. Exactly
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 03:24 PM
Jun 2016

Clinton supporters spend so much time trashing Sanders supporters, they can't see their candidate is very very weak and has a penchant for saying whatever she thinks will make her popular.
They seem unable to differentiate the person from the weak platform and even weaker candidate.
They really do not understand that all these calls for Sanders to quit, and all the claims that Clinton has already won, are nothing more than fear-born attempts to subvert due process because they know deep inside, Clinton is not the best candidate.

nxylas

(6,440 posts)
17. It's striking how many of these points don't only apply to Trump
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 05:44 PM
Jun 2016
A consuming sense of entitlement. An expectation of special favors and unquestioning compliance.

A penchant for exploiting or disparaging others. A total inability to recognize the needs of anyone else. An unreasoning fury at people you perceive as thwarting your wishes or desires. A superficial charm deployed to disguise a gift for manipulation.

A compulsion to conform your ever - shifting sense of “reality” to satisfy your inner requirements . A tendency to lie so frequently and routinely that objective truth loses all meaning.

A belief that you are above the rules. An array of inconsistent statements and behaviors driven by your needs in the moment. In sum, a total incapacity to separate the world from your own psychodrama...


Sounds familiar, and I'm not thinking of Trump.

lunatica

(53,410 posts)
9. Exactly the kind of socipathic person that rises to the top everywhere
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 02:21 PM
Jun 2016

I bet there are a large percentage of CEOs who are Sociopathic Malignant Narcissists.

The definition of Sociopaths fits many world leaders (Vladimir Putin, Saddam Hussein, Osama Bin Laden, Mao, etc.), and I'm sure business leaders and managers. It's because the cut throat personalities are the one's that want to be at the top and are willing to do anything to get there.

Bullies also fall into the same behavioral description as Narcissists, Sociopaths and Psychopaths. Being at the top of the heap is their reason to live. Especially if they can destroy others who are a threat to them.

LongTomH

(8,636 posts)
11. We've known for some time that Trump was nuts; but, what does his candidacy say about us?
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 03:04 PM
Jun 2016

How can a vile creature like this be the choice of a significant portion of the voting public?

RichGirl

(4,119 posts)
14. Les Moonves...owner of CNN...
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 03:34 PM
Jun 2016

Had said "Trump is bad for the country, but good for CNN." Then they went Trump 24/7 because obviously it's more important for a rich man to get richer that what's best for the country.

If you haven't done so already...STOP watching cable news and write Moonves a letter he'll never forget!

 

KingCharlemagne

(7,908 posts)
20. Read Christopher Lasch's "The Culture of Narcissism" (1978) for an answer to your
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 05:41 PM
Jun 2016

ever-relevant question.

backscatter712

(26,355 posts)
12. When you look up Narcissistic Personality Disorder in the DSM...
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 03:13 PM
Jun 2016

...you'll find Donald Trump's picture in there.

arithia

(455 posts)
15. there is danger in assigning a mental illness diagnosis to a non-patient
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 03:36 PM
Jun 2016

While this article was really well written for the most part, there are valid reasons good psych professionals will not try to diagnose popular media figures/celeb.

If you need the "why" explained to you, I suggest reading this article.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/brick-brick/201401/psychologists-should-not-diagnose-celebrities

That "lethal" disorder that the author claims there is no "cure" for is treated by (and improved by) long-term psychotherapy. Using the bully pulpit of the media like this to say "there is no treatment" for the condition can discourage people from seeking treatment.

Trump shouldn't be anywhere near the presidency. We don't need to assign a clinical diagnosis to him in order to justify why he shouldn't be anywhere near the presidency.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
24. I agree, but even an untrained layman can see the narcissism evident in Donald Trump.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 07:13 PM
Jun 2016

The man is clearly mentally ill. I don't think we need professionals to tell us that.

arithia

(455 posts)
25. With all due respect
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:42 PM
Jun 2016

You would be wise to leave the clinical evaluations to the professionals who, for very good reason, do NOT diagnose people they have not personally evaluated in a clinical setting. If I had a nickle for every incorrect comment about my conditions that I've heard from "untrained laymen" (or quack docs, for that matter) over the years, I'd be a very wealthy woman.

When "untrained laymen" open their mouths about things they don't fully understand (much as the writer of the article didn't understand, as they claimed there is no "cure" for the disease- there is no "cure" for genetics), they run the risk of further stigmatizing mental illness and contributing to the wall of falsehoods that the average person "knows" and believes about serious mental disorders.

Mental illness is a serious and nuanced subject- many people who are ill are too sick to realize they are ill in the first place. Seeking treatment might be beyond their capability, even when presented with credible evidence of their disorder. More often than not, this is the result of biology. While the exact mechanism for onset of NPD isn't known, countless studies of twins point to biological factors as the source for personality disorders. The disease isn't a choice.

Trump is an unapologetic racist. That is a choice.

Trump is an unapologetic misogynist. That is a choice.

Trump is an unrepentant liar. That is a choice.

Trump is a bully. That is a choice.

Trump is a con man. That is a choice.

Imo, nail him for what he chooses to be, not what the fastest derpy swimmer in his daddy's sack made him.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
26. He is a textbook narcissist.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:46 PM
Jun 2016

I don't think there could be any doubt about that by anyone's measure. Why are you defending him anyway?

arithia

(455 posts)
27. If you think I'm defending Trump, please re-read my previous posts.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 09:07 PM
Jun 2016

I'm not defending Trump. I'm attacking the assumptive practice of laypersons assigning mental illness diagnoses to people they have never met and are unqualified to discuss.

http://www.livescience.com/37684-narcissistic-personality-disorder-brain-structure.html

If Trump DOES have this disorder, his brain is broken. By no fault of his own. To sit here and harp on anyone for having a biological mental illness is not much different in terms of prejudice and ignorance as Trump saying that a judge cannot adjudicate fairly because of their race. To diagnose someone with such a serious disorder in order to say "they aren't qualified to be president" isn't much better.

As a layperson, you are missing important data necessary to assign accurate labels. You can say some of his behavior is narcissistic, but beyond that anything is conjecture. Allow me to demonstrate: Based on my observable behavior, which 3 conditions have I been diagnosed with? I've only openly stated one of them.

See the problem now?

backscatter712

(26,355 posts)
28. Fair point, but really, you don't have to be a shrink to see Trump's behavior patterns.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 09:27 PM
Jun 2016

They are so obvious - look in the DSM and start checking off boxes:

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1519417-overview

In the American Psychiatric Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fifth Edition (DSM-5),[1] NPD is defined as comprising a pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), a constant need for admiration, and a lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by the presence of at least 5 of the following 9 criteria:

  • A grandiose sense of self-importance
  • A preoccupation with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
  • A belief that he or she is special and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people or institutions
  • A need for excessive admiration
  • A sense of entitlement
  • Interpersonally exploitive behavior
  • A lack of empathy
  • Envy of others or a belief that others are envious of him or her
  • A demonstration of arrogant and haughty behaviors or attitudes


  • Sound familiar? Trump demonstrates these traits to such an extreme it's impossible not to notice.

    arithia

    (455 posts)
    29. I'm not entirely sure why
    Mon Jun 6, 2016, 09:54 PM
    Jun 2016

    people keep bringing this up as if it will change my point. I'm not arguing whether or not he exhibits narcissistic behaviors. I'm saying its problematic (at best) and prejudicial (at worst) to remote diagnose people and WHY that is the case.

    If he has NPD, it's a biological mental illness, complete with physiological changes to the brain when compared to a healthy subject. He did not CHOOSE to be that way. He may very well be too mentally broken biologically to see his own narcissism (much like Dunning Kruger) and unless you are his personal medical doctor with access to a wide array of clinical testing, the simple fact is you don't know and are making an assumption.

    He does, however, choose to be a racist, misogynist, bullying, lying con man. Those are learned behaviors. Why don't we discuss THAT instead?

    Either way, I'm done replying if people are just going to keep repeating themselves (or each other) instead of responding to what I actually said. Quoting the DSM at me won't make remote diagnosis any less in bad taste.

    Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Article - Too Sick To Lea...