Mateen Profile More Like "A Typical Mass Shooter" Rather Than "Individual Radicalized By ISIS"

[kpete]

Investigators Say Orlando Shooter Showed Few Warning Signs Of Radicalization

4:23

As investigators probe the background of Omar Mateen, whose attack on Pulse nightclub in Orlando left 49 people dead, they say he bore few warning signs of radicalization.

Mateen had allegedly pledged allegiance to ISIS in a 911 call during the attack, as The Two-Way has reported. But as further details emerge about the shooter, investigators say Mateen's profile is more like that of a "typical mass shooter" than an individual radicalized by ISIS, as NPR's Dina Temple-Raston reports.

In fact, intelligence officials and investigators say they're "becoming increasingly convinced that the motive for this attack had very little — or maybe nothing — to do with ISIS."

Speaking on Weekend Edition Saturday, Dina says that al-Qaida and ISIS-inspired attacks tend to follow a different pattern. She explains:

"We know that during the attack the gunman posted messages on Facebook saying he was doing this on behalf of ISIS. But officials have yet to find any of the precursors usually associated with radicalization. They've interviewed dozens of people who either knew him or had contact with Mateen.

"And they say that they've yet to find any indication that he became noticeably more religious, which is one of the indicators of radicalization. He still was going to the same mosque. The way he dressed didn't change. His relationship with his family didn't change in any way. And these are all typically warning signs that parents and friends and educators are told to look for if they're worried that someone they're close to is radicalizing."

She adds "this isn't science," but so far the signs of radicalization aren't there, which has led investigators to wonder whether the 29-year-old invoked the name of ISIS to garner more publicity for his deadly attack.

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/06/18/482621690/investigators-say-orlando-shooter-showed-few-warning-signs-of-radicalization

[Agnosticsherbet]

1. I find the concept "Typical Mass Shooter" offrnsive.

Mass murder should not be typical.

[MisterFred]

4. Well,

Typical mass shooter does not equal mass murder is typical.

Denying similarities in the psychological profiles of people who go on shooting rampages is choosing to be ignorant of reality.

[Agnosticsherbet]

65. I am not a psychological denialist

The idea that it is so common that we have defined typical is offensive.

[yardwork]

67. That's not what the term means.

It means that among those few people who are mass shooters, there is a typical type.

[MisterFred]

68. She got that.

Her last comment made it clear that she's protesting even that small data set.

[Agnosticsherbet]

69. Typical - having the distinctive qualities of a particular type of person or thing. I know

the definition.
Sadly, mass shooters are not few. They have become so common that it is no longer considered unusual unless someone breaks
the record count of bodies.

I've been around for a long time. The first I know of was Howard Unruh in 1948. The first I remember was Charles Whitman, the Texas Tower shooter.

[yardwork]

74. Sorry, I misunderstood your earlier post.

[IronLionZion]

5. Are you new to America?

Be careful. If you don't know what is now an all too common American tradition, then you might be deported.

[Agnosticsherbet]

66. Being deported back to Oklahoma would be a noghtmare.

Gives me nightmares.

[MariaThinks]

6. there is an ongoing attempt to make the murderer seem ordinary and not inspired

by the Taliban supporting father's hatred of homosexuality and the killer's devotion to isis. Even though he made the call, people are trying to discount it because apparently his admission to support isis is not good enough.

and the murderers in the boston marathon didn't use guns, they used explosives. So while I hate guns and want much better gun control, this murderer also had improvised explosives.

it would be interesting to see if any apologists actually had solutions to stop the continuous radical islamist attacks.

[MisterFred]

11. Uh.

Tablian & al-Qaeda & ISIS are three different groups. None of which had direct contact with Mateen. This attack is not fundamentally different from the Umpqua Community College shooting or the Planned Parenthood shooting or the Charleston shooting. The only significant differences were the groups being targeted and the # dead.

Speaking of which, the Planned Parenthood and Umpqua shootings and even Columbine used explosives. That's not a hallmark of Islamic terrorism. It's pretty common in U.S. mass shootings.

[King_David]

19. This vermin said he was inspired by ISIS

He left clues about it every where and spelled it out at the end.

So no need to Twist in a pretzel to find an alternative motives.... The monster mad murderer POS Islamic terrorist told us himself... And for added emphasis ISIS claimed it too .

[MisterFred]

35. Ok, let's see.

He has a past history as a homophobe.

Eyewitnesses said he claimed the attack was in retaliation to the United States' actions in his home country (which is the United States, but he was probably referring to Afghanistan - not an area of ISIS influence).

The FBI was previously watching him because coworkers said he claimed family connections to al-Qaeda and actual membership in Hezbollah (Hezbollah is currently fighting against ISIS in Syria).

He claimed in a 911 call near the end of the attack he was inspired by ISIS.

.... oh, yeah. This guy has totally rational motives that are absolutely by-the-book ISIS. *rolls eyes*

Not to mention you're basing part of your belief on the idea that ISIS is an honest organization. Seriously, ISIS would claim credit for this attack whether or not they had anything to do with it. Why the hell would you believe them? Here's what actually happened. The FBI said he might have connections to ISIS. ISIS read the newspaper and immediately sent out a statement saying it was them.

[King_David]

46. The guy said he was ISIS

But now you have to somehow cleanse this scum's record ?

Unbelievable

[MisterFred]

72. What cleanse?

He's scum no matter what label he puts on. It's a question of countering future scum. If we lump in his evil with ISIS, it becomes foreign and it's too easy to avoid necessary steps like publicly confronting homophobia in the United States regardless of what label it pretends to wear.

[MariaThinks]

80. i'm wasting my time - but ever wonder where his homophobia came from?

the dots are so hard to connect when you're trying to ignore facts and whitewash everything

[MisterFred]

82. Probably not ISIS.

Probably the general conservativeness of the South with added garden-variety Islam flavoring instead of the usual Christian Leviticus nonsense.

I'm assuming the guy was exposed to that kind of bigotry before ISIS was even founded.

[MariaThinks]

95. his taliban supporting father is anti-gay. People who deliverably ignore facts are not stopping

the ongoing bloodshed or even helping islam.

[MisterFred]

97. Strange.

I have yet to figure out why you think I'm trying to help Islam, a belief system I oppose.

[trumad]

43. Really---

because I've read numerous articles the last two days saying investigators are having a hard time finding any of what you are talking about.

[King_David]

47. I'm not sure what you're reading exactly:

Omar Mateen: Angry, violent 'bigot' who pledged allegiance to ISIS

http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/13/us/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen/

[Marr]

73. I'm noticing the same thing.

Over and over, these people flatly *tell us* why they're doing these things, and we insist on saying it's something else.

And I have to wonder, just to take this article on it's own merits, how many 'signs of radicalization' would one expect to see in a person who was raised in a radicalized environment to begin with? It seems to me that he didn't need a transformation.

[Crunchy Frog]

29. It shouldn't be, but in this country it is.

[King_David]

2. So the last two times the FBI had him on their radar

was not for radical Islamism but for radical mass shooterism?

[MisterFred]

3. Selection bias

The FBI doesn't look for people who match mass murder profiles. They do actively look for anyone with an interest in extremist Islam.

Also, the FBI - correctly - stopped watching him. He didn't give a shit about ISIS. They were just a convenient label to attach to a shooting he probably would have committed anyway. He was a homophobe before he heard of ISIS.

[MariaThinks]

7. that's fiction. the fbi made a blunder

[CanSocDem]

63. Exactly.

Finding a person capable of murder isn't difficult in the USA. Being able to match that person to 'a cause' is the next step and then wait, or 'Let It Happen'...and you'll soon have a big event to exploit.




.

[DustyJoe]

8. apt description

In some worlds I guess it it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then it's a fish

[passiveporcupine]

15. Well, they were looking at terrorism

Mateen first came to the FBI’s attention in May 2013, after making a series of “boasts” to co-workers about his various ties to terrorist groups

FBI Director James Comey told reporters on Tuesday that Mateen had claimed to have “family connections to al Qaeda,” and that he was also “a member of Hezbollah.” (As Comey pointed out, these seemed to be contradictory claims since al Qaeda is a Sunni terrorist organization and Hezbollah is a Shiite organization.)

there is a lot of information about why the took him off the lists and what changed might be done in the future:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/06/14/fbi-tracked-orlando-killer-omar-mateen-and-came-up-empty.html

[IronLionZion]

9. Doesn't matter. People will still ignore the last 50 mass shooters

because that would be too hard and too scary. It's easier to pretend that the problem has a tan year round, especially if one benefits from racism.

[MisterFred]

12. Sadly true. nt

[Violet_Crumble]

24. Yep. So true n/t

[X_Digger]

10. Aka, people are stupid and can't chew bubblegum and walk at the same time.

How about: 1) he was raised in a culture that despises homosexuality, 2) in a family that occasionally spews fringe/radical islamic language, and possibly some self-loathing.

It doesn't have to fit one goddamned pigeon hole. People, even violent shitstains, aren't two-dimensional cutouts.

[MisterFred]

14. Actually that fits a pidgeon hole pretty well.

Planned Parenthood shooter, Charleston shooter, McVeigh, all match your #1 & #2. Just replace homosexuality with abortion, black people, or the federal government and fringe/radical Islamic language with fringe/radical language of your choice.

[treestar]

75. I agree; it is amusing to see the contest

between those who want it to be one or the other.

[Albertoo]

13. Except that his religion was already radical to begin with

In mainstream Islam, gays must be punished, from prison to death.

Is that radical or not?

[MisterFred]

16. Yes.

But that's only marginally more true for Islam than other major religions. Taken as a whole, American Muslims don't seem to be significantly more or significantly less anti-muslim than American religious people.

Note that many if not most officially Christian countries outlaw or until very recently outlawed homosexuality. The same is true for India (Hinduism).

[King_David]

21. Can you name these Christian countries that outlaw Homosexuality?

Besides Uganda , Gaza/Palestine, Saudi Arabia, Iran , Islamic State , Bharain , Yemen etc etc etc are not Christian countries...

Your post is BULLSHIT !!!!

[Violet_Crumble]

23. Here's a list of majority Christian countries where homosexuality is criminalised...

I'll break it up into the different global regions as the report I found this in did. As your question was to name only Christian countries, I've left off the Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist countries, and the ones where the majority religion was indigenous religions.


Africa:

Angola
Benin
Botswana
Burundi
Cameroon
Eritrea (50% Christian, 48% Muslim)
Ethiopia (63% Christian, 33% Muslim)
Ghana
Kenya
Liberia
Malawi
Namibia
Nigeria (58% Christian, 41% Muslim)
São Tomé and Príncipe
Seychelles
South Sudan
Swaziland
Uganda
Zambia

Latin America and the Carribean:

Antigua and Barbuda
Barbados
Belize
Dominica
Grenada
Guyana
Jamaica
Saint Kitts and Nevis
Saint Lucia
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines
Trinidad and Tobago

Oceania

Cook Islands
Kiribati
Nauru
Papua New Guinea
Samoa
Solomon Islands
Tonga
Tuvalu

http://old.ilga.org/Statehomophobia/ILGA_State_Sponsored_Homophobia_2015.pdf

[MisterFred]

39. Wow, thank you.

And in further response to King David, I'd note that list doesn't even include countries like Russia and Georgia where gay sex is technically legal but a number of other laws suppress the gay community.

[King_David]

44. The world has a long way to go

And so many places I can not travel


But : Here are the 10 countries where homosexuality may be punished by death

Yemen: According to the 1994 penal code, married men can be sentenced to death by stoning for homosexual intercourse. Unmarried men face whipping or one year in prison. Women face up to seven years in prison.

Iran: In accordance with sharia law, homosexual intercourse between men can be punished by death, and men can be flogged for lesser acts such as kissing. Women may be flogged.

The Islamic State's war on homosexuals is another shocking examples of the group's brutality. (TWP)

Mauritania: Muslim men engaging in homosexual sex can be stoned to death, according to a 1984 law, though none have been executed so far. Women face prison.

Nigeria: Federal law classifies homosexual behavior as a felony punishable by imprisonment, but several states have adopted sharia law and imposed a death penalty for men. A law signed in early January makes it illegal for gay people countrywide to hold a meeting or form clubs.

Qatar: Sharia law in Qatar applies only to Muslims, who can be put to death for extramarital sex, regardless of sexual orientation.

Saudi Arabia: Under the country’s interpretation of sharia law, a married man engaging in sodomy or any non-Muslim who commits sodomy with a Muslim can be stoned to death. All sex outside of marriage is illegal.

Afghanistan: The Afghan Penal Code does not refer to homosexual acts, but Article 130 of the Constitution allows recourse to be made to sharia law, which prohibits same-sex sexual activity in general. Afghanistan’s sharia law criminalizes same-sex sexual acts with a maximum of the death penalty. No known cases of death sentences have been meted out since the end of Taliban rule in 2001.


Somalia: The penal code stipulates prison, but in some southern regions, Islamic courts have imposed sharia law and the death penalty.

Sudan: Three-time offenders under the sodomy law can be put to death; first and second convictions result in flogging and imprisonment. Southern parts of the country have adopted more lenient laws.

United Arab Emirates: Lawyers in the country and other experts disagree on whether federal law prescribes the death penalty for consensual homosexual sex or only for rape. In a recent Amnesty International report, the organization said it was not aware of any death sentences for homosexual acts. All sexual acts outside of marriage are banned.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/06/13/here-are-the-10-countries-where-homosexuality-may-be-punished-by-death-2/


You can't manipulate facts .

[Violet_Crumble]

50. Yep. A long way to go. The full list is in the report I linked to...

It's a third of all countries. The report also had a list of countries where homosexuality can be punishable by death, and a list of countries that have implemented it:

The death penalty for same-sex sexual intimacy is currently codified as being in operation in eight UN States, but it appears to implemented only in five: Iran, Mauritania, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, and Yemen. While not officially codified in a sixth UN State, the death sentence is implemented widely across Iraq .It is also enacted provincially in 12 northern states in Nigeria and the southern parts of Somalia. We are not aware of contemporaneous evidence that consensual same-sex sexual activity has been targeted for the death penalty in Afghanistan, Pakistan52 or Qatar. However, there is evidence that
people who express their sexual or gender diversity are targeted in the areas occupied by Daesh (ISIL/ISIS) in northern Iraq and Syria. Brunei Darussalam is currently phasing in a Syariah Penal Code that sees, in black letter law, the death penalty introduced for certain same-sex sexual activity in 2016, but seems unlikely to be implemented in actuality. We have categorised our information on the death penalty accordingly.

1. Death penalty for same-sex sexual behaviour codified under Sharia and implemented countrywide (5):

Africa – Mauritania, Sudan.
Asia – Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Yemen.

2 .Death penalty for same-sex sexual behavior codified under Sharia and implemented provincially (2):
Africa – 12 northern states in Nigeria and the southern parts of Somalia.

3 Death penalty for same-sex sexual behaviour codified under Sharia but notkn own to be implemented for same-sex behaviour specifically (3):
Asia – Afghanistan, Pakistan and Qatar.

4 Death penalty for same-sex sexual behaviour codified under Sharia implemented by vigilantes/non-State actors (2):
Asia – Iraq and Daesh (ISIS / ISIL)-held territories in Northern Iraq and northern Syria.53

5 Death penalty for same-sex sexual behaviour codified under Sharia due in 2016
countrywide (1):
Asia – Brunei Darussalam.54

[MisterFred]

36. Uganda is 85% Christian.

That's probably an overestimate, but Christianity is clearly the dominant religion politically & by the numbers in Uganda.

Edit: much of the post deleted. I mistakenly believed you were referring to only the death penalty, not imprisonment in your reply. Unless you edited. Whatever.

[King_David]

49. Uganda I already mentioned,

Here are the 10 countries where homosexuality may be punished by death



https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/06/13/here-are-the-10-countries-where-homosexuality-may-be-punished-by-death-2/

[MisterFred]

70. My mistake.

I thought you were lumping in Christian Uganda with the other Muslim-majority countries. That said, I'm still going to criticize all religions that want to shame and divide people on the basis of sexuality or any identity trait that isn't philosophy. Christianity and Islam very much included.

[justiceischeap]

42. Until the 2003 Lawrence v. Texas decision

Sodomy (i.e. homosexuality) was illegal in 13 states. There are still calls in the US today to criminalize homosexuality, and to overturn marriage equality.

We don't routinely kill people in the US that are gay but in the last 6 months GOP led legislators have tried criminalizing the LGBTQ community 200+ times.

Don't act like we don't have a problem in this country with religion and homosexuality. To this day I can still legally be denied housing and a job based on my sexual orientation in this country.

[King_David]

45. Yes but we are progressing here,

Not so much in places where they throw Gay guys off buildings or stone us to death.



Here are the 10 countries where homosexuality may be punished by death



https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/06/13/here-are-the-10-countries-where-homosexuality-may-be-punished-by-death-2/

[MisterFred]

71. Yes, but.

Omar Mateen IS "we", assuming we are progressing here means Americans in the United States.

[justiceischeap]

76. Yes but

we still have hate crimes here. We still have members of the LGBTQ community killed here. What does it matter what religious banner those deaths live under when the outcome is the same?

If all US Muslims were radical, we'd be seeing the same types of crimes against the LGBTQ community in the US, but we don't. So to equate all Muslims (or Christians) with extremists is just as wrong as how radical Islamists in the ME treat gay people. And I say this as an atheist. I know what it's like to be marginalized and stereotyped just because I'm gay. I sure as hell am not gonna do the same to other people.

[Nye Bevan]

22. Which Christian countries impose the death penalty for homosexuality? (nt)

[MisterFred]

38. Other than Uganda, off and on?

None currently, but several in recent history. And if you go back several hundred years in history, most of what was then called Christendom punished homosexuality by death. For explicitly religious reasons.

The reason a lot less Christian countries punish homosexuality by death is because Christian countries tend to have adopted secular governments. Not because Christianity is less anti-homosexual than Islam. Though I would acknowledge that a number of significant denominations within Christianity have fully embraced homosexuality recently, something lacking in Islam.

[uponit7771]

55. Did the reponse change your mind any? tia

[Nye Bevan]

59. I thought the answer was "zero" and it seems that I was correct.

The cruel, brutal, hatred of gay people in most Islamic countries, where gays are routinely beheaded, thrown from buildings, and have their heads crushed with rocks, is absolutely worse than homophobia encountered in Christian countries. And the fact the Orlando murderer was raised by parents from a country that executes gay people should not be ignored.

[uponit7771]

62. Doesn't excuse bigotry against Islam, sects of Hindu are just as vitriol. Any religion can be ....

.... perverted to justify hate

[uponit7771]

54. Wingerishly bigoted shit, all religions can be perverted to justify killing people

[kpete]

60. unfortunately

i agree
all religions can be perverted to justify killing people

i just want peace,
kp

[Albertoo]

84. True, but mainstream Islam currently takes the cake

compared to the other mainstream superstitions/religions

[Odin2005]

78. This kind of bigoted shit does not belong here.

Freeperland and Trump's Reddit board is over there.

[Albertoo]

85. Too cute: explain why Islam is not homophobic

[hay rick]

17. I for one wish to welcome our Islamophobic trolls.

Islam bad. Buy guns. Pay Halliburton. Suspend rights. Build wall.

[Crunchy Frog]

31. Pretty much sums up DU right now. n/t

[uppityperson]

79. I disagree. It sums up some loud duers, but not the majority of us

We notice the outspoken because it's so noticeable, and they are being called out, given facts, moving goalposts. There are too many but it's a video minority.

[Albertoo]

86. Don't like the fact Islam is homophobic? Paint the messenger black.

I suggest you call anyone mentioning Islam's homophobia a Dick Cheney.
That should keep them quiet. Not to mention it's brilliant debating.

[hay rick]

90. Like I said, Islam bad.

Plus I don't know of any homophobic Christians. Christianity good.

[Albertoo]

91. The Quran has some sexist, homophobic and violent passages. Do you condone them?

And I couldn't care tuppence about Christianity, except when African bishops support anti-gay laws or when the Pope condemns condoms which might have slowed the spread of HIV in the developing world.

[hay rick]

92. I don't read the Quran- or cherry-picked selections from the Quran.

Should I condemn all Christians because the Bible contains Leviticus 18:22?

[Albertoo]

93. Except that the Quran is the perfect word of god and it says kill the infidels

So I see cause for worry here.

Despite the fact I told you I have no interest for the Bible, you bring it up again. So, what's your point? Some passages in the Old Testament mention unruly kids should be stoned to death. Jews and Christians apparently do not take this text as seriously as Muslims take the Quran. Which is why Islam is currently more dangerous than Judaism and Christianity, even though these two religions are deeply flawed ideologies too.

[wallyworld2]

18. And

Nobody in the M$M will even bring it up.

They don't care a bit what their reports do to the population

[Midnight Writer]

20. This is like the guy who beats his wife and claims it is because she burnt the potatoes

The whole ISIS/Al Queda/Hezbollah Allah Akbar thing is an excuse for deranged psychopaths to paint their shameful action as Holy Martyrdom inspired by a Higher Power.

The truth is they are full of hate and if they weren't claiming status as political religious terrorists they would be terrorizing their families and neighbors over some other exaggerated grievance.

[womanofthehills]

25. Elementary school teachers say Mateen talked about violence & sex (obscenities)

ORLANDO -- Orlando shooter Omar Mateen's behavioral issues went as far back as elementary school,
where his disruptive conduct and "lack of remorse" as a small boy were noted in his school records.

Early school: "Verbally abusive, rude, aggressive"

In 3rd grade at Mariposa Elementary School, a teacher writes that Mateen is verbally abusive, rude, aggressive, and "much talk about violence & sex (obscenities)." The teacher writes that Mateen's hands are all over the place and, "on other children."

A guidance counselor in 4th grade writes that Mateen lacks control, and says he is academically behind "at least two years."

In Mateen's 5th grade school record, a teacher at Mariposa Elementary School writes of Mateen's inability to stay focused, his "lack of remorse," and his opposition.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/orlando-shooters-omar-mateen-early-school-records-note-he-lacked-remorse/

[Ilsa]

83. I have wondered before now if

he had some sort of learning disability that is behavioral, like ADHD, etc.

[womanofthehills]

26. CBS - women are now coming forward saying Mateen stalked them

The woman interviewed said probably someone at the club rejected him.

[6chars]

27. Phew! no need to examine any issues with Islam

what a relief.

[Bensonhurst_braciole]

28. I know, right? That was a close one.

[MisterFred]

40. People who are Muslim ought to leave their religion for a whole host of reasons.

That doesn't mean we should demonize Muslims or engage in some fantasy that makes Islam out to be so much worse than other major religions.

[IronLionZion]

52. The first issue we can examine

is why some people think they can benefit if some other demographic of humanity is viewed as the enemy.

[6chars]

64. can take that comment many ways

[uponit7771]

57. or bigotry, .... yeah... what relief

[Nye Bevan]

61. Just a coincidence that he was raised by parents from a country that executes gay people (nt)

[Albertoo]

87. You want facts, you are an islamophobe, shame on you, 6chars ;)

[malaise]

30. Truth will out

I maintain what I wrote last Sunday morning. Mateen was no jidahist.

[HepKitty416]

33. I agree. He was an attention seeker.

The news I've seen and read notes that he (I refuse to use his name to further glorify his actions) claimed loyalty to Isis when he called 911 to report his own crime. Add to that his internet searches during the shooting for "Pulse", "Orlando", and "shooting", and it seems obvious he was out for his 15 minutes, as are many mass-killers. Of course he's got mental problems- right-minded people don't up and kill other people. But as a country, we're encouraging the problem by continually using descriptions that elevate his actions to near-hero status: special graphics on the news, chilling headlines, high body counts, phrases like "no one could predict this;" or "lone wolf", take power away from citizens by lulling us into the notion that there were no warning signs of his actions (there were plenty, as we're learning now); worse, that there are no warning signs to watch for from these solitary predators in general; and hands power to those who commit these crimes by feeding the notion that they can go out in a blaze of glory by taking out a large number of dull sheep (or sinners, or bullies, or infidels, etc.) all at once.

Regardless of his intent, he should only be referred to by his case number on the news. We're making him into a hero.

[malaise]

48. Hero? Who is making this

scumbag into a hero?
My question is always who benefits from this -in this case the slaughter of gay Latinos (the vast majority of dead and injured)?

[Crunchy Frog]

32. Dammit! I wanna hate Muslims.

[Violet_Crumble]

34. No, no, no! You got the terminology wrong...

Picked this tactic up from some of our resident investigative experts on all things Islam. It should read: 'Dammit! I wanna discuss Islam' and then go on to talk about Islam as if it were a person, for example. "Islam thinks... " and "Islam everywhere are extreme, brutal and hates everything coz that's what Sharia tells Islam to do". Then finish it off with a short but cutting 'Religion of peace!' and go for gold by linking to the site of the same name and then arguing strenuously that it's a factual and informative resource even though it gets a guerney over at the Southern Poverty Law Centre. Double points for portraying oneself to be more knowledgeable about what being a Muslim means than Muslims themselves

[Crunchy Frog]

37. I prefer to be brutally frank and straightforward.

No beating around the bush.

[King_David]

51. I've see so many straight people recently portraying themselves as more knowledgeable

Than Gay people about what it means to be Gay - here on DU.

[Violet_Crumble]

56. That sucks. I find all those kind of resident 'experts' ridiculous....

It seems pretty straight-forward to me. If I want to find out about how discrimination affects someone who's gay, I'll go talk to my niece. She's a lesbian and my cruise ship smoke buddy and she's faced some nasty discrimination because she's gay. Likewise if I want to find out about things like what it means to be a Muslim and how they interpret the Q'uran (which I wouldn't coz religion's boring as hell), I'd go ask a friend of mine who's a Muslim. Even if I was time-poor and really lazy, I don't think I'd go for the paying attention to anonymous 'experts' who don't happen to belong to either group

[King_David]

58. Agreed

[FLPanhandle]

41. These "experts" sure have done a great job so far.

Are these the same "experts" that concluded Mateen wasn't a threat?

[ileus]

53. Probably an NRA member also...

[Odin2005]

77. Cue angry rants by our islamophobic bigot members.

[Albertoo]

94. Do you like a religion that calls for the stoning of adulterers?

If so, that's real progressive. I suppose.

[McCamy Taylor]

81. Homophobia killed those poor people, not Islam.

The shooter hated himself--and he took out his self hatred on innocents. If he had been brought up by a caring family in a caring society this would not have happened.

[Albertoo]

88. And you know Islam's homophobia had no bearing on the shooter's homophobia?

[Albertoo]

89. And Islam had no share in the actions of this "Typical Mass Shooter"?

Let me venture a guess: If the shooter had been a believer in a religion of non-violence with no homophobic bias, the outcome of his mental issues might have been very different.
Homophobic, sexist, violent 7th century ideologies can have a negative influence on people.

[Angel Martin]

96. One way OM was very much the jihadist

and not the "typical" mass killer is that he shot it out with police and had to be killed by them, rather than shooting himself when the police arrived.

But of course this whole discussion is nonsense.

Once DU is done "ISIS washing" Omar Mateen, they will start in on how John Wilkes Booth wasn't motivated by support for the Confederacy.