General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsU.S. Senate Votes Yes on National GMO Labeling Bill, but Food Activists Call It Flawed
The party of fewer regulations adds some more.
The nation's first state law mandating labels on foods containing genetically modified ingredients went into effect in Vermont on July 1. But less than a week later, the U.S. Senate moved to overrule the state law.
On July 7, Senators passed a bill in a 63-30 vote that would override state laws by creating a national standard for GMO labeling. Food activists and political insiders have speculated about a bill ever since another measure was defeated in March, but the sudden presentation of the new proposal took organizations on both sides of the issue by surprise.
The sponsors, Sen. Pat Roberts of Kansas (R), chairman of the Senate Agriculture Committee, and Sen. Debbie Stabenow (D), hail the bill as a compromise for both sides, and, more important, a way to prevent a "patchwork" system of individual state laws, which food industry members argue would prove costly and confusing.
How do the rules differ?
Vermont's law requires most food products that contain genetically modified organisms (GMOs), which means an ingredient was produced by scientists altering its DNA, to state "partially produced by genetic engineering." Because 90 percent of soy and corn grown in the U.S. has been genetically modified and 90 percent of cheese has been produced with genetically engineered rennet, a majority of processed foods would probably bear the label. (Vermont does include several notable exceptions, howevercheese gets a pass, as do many meat products.)
Food industry executives, who fought hard to stop Vermont from passing the law, have said it is too cost prohibitive to develop special labels just for Vermont. They are opting to either label all their products containing GMOs or to simply stop shipping to Vermont stores. Coca-Cola and Pepsi recently announced they will do the latter. But with other state governments considering similar laws, companies may no longer have a choice.
The Senate bill would require all food manufacturers to disclose genetically modified ingredients on products sold in grocery stores, but the disclosure can be in the form of a text statement, a symbol or a QR code that consumers could scan with their phones to access more information. Smaller companies could instead list a website or phone number for further information.
-more-
http://www.winespectator.com/webfeature/show/id/Senate-Votes-Yes-on-GMO-Bill?utm_medium=email&utm_source=HealthEletter071316B&utm_campaign=HealthEletter071316
longship
(40,416 posts)All of it!
It's what humans do to feed the populace. And we've been doing it for thousands of years.
There is nothing special about tweaking a gene or two, or three, or the many genes tweaked by cross-breeding. The only difference is that cross-breeding has far less specificity. One rolls the dice and one gets what one gets. Whereas genetic modification allows one to specify and test that specificity, using science.
That is the difference, and it is a rather huge difference.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)between crossbreeding and injecting DNA from plants that couldn't crossbreed outside a laboratory.
And there are multiple, separate issues involving the issue of genetically modified food.
Setting concerns about health aside, my biggest concern involves corporate ownership of the food supply.
I think individuals should be able to grow their own food, and I think individuals should be able to save the seeds produced by the food they grow to be used in future growing seasons. I think that should be an "inalienable right." I don't think any corporation should be able to patent the food supply.
longship
(40,416 posts)All life on this planet shares a common heritage. That means that a vast proportion of your DNA is shared in common with every lifeform on the planet, including bacteria. This is biology 101, and it is something everybody should have learned by 9th or 10th grade.
If one counts the number of cells in your body, there are by far more bacterial cells than human cells.
Complaining about Frankenfood is useless. Your cells contain a substantial amount of bacterial DNA, and that of sponges, slugs, worms, trilobites, fish, amphibians, dinosaurs, and fucking chimpanzees, just about every other life form on the planet.
You are Frankenfood! Get used to that idea!
No difference between lab-created organisms and naturally evolved, with or without human "assistance." Okaaaay.
But way to ignore my point. You've got nothing, nothing, nothing, about corporate ownership of the food supply?
longship
(40,416 posts)Almost all genetic research is not funded by corporations. It's academic, basic science.
So much for Monsanto conspiracies.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)it's not a non sequitur.
longship
(40,416 posts)Again, most genetic modification research is not corporate funded.
There's a lot of it that's just basic science.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)reasons for dissent, thanks. I think I'm better versed on my own pov than you.
longship
(40,416 posts)Ones opinion should be informed.
Just saying.
YMMV.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)But when the objection is based upon politics and economics, "one's" opinion should be inclusive of that objection.
longship
(40,416 posts)Again, ones opinion should align with the evidence. That's what it means to have an informed opinion.
My best to you.
Rex
(65,616 posts)I just throw seeds out there, water them and they grow. Where does the modification come in?
longship
(40,416 posts)But humans have been cross breeding cultivars for thousands of years, since the origins of agriculture. None of our food -- NONE OF IT -- is as it was before agriculture began. It has all been genetically modified. ALL OF IT.
Rex
(65,616 posts)Maybe it is hard for some to think human's can be involved in the evolutionary process. Maybe they get stuck on the idea of natural mutations being the only way plants evolve. Dunno, but what you said of course makes sense.
1000s of years will do that.
longship
(40,416 posts)Humans can do with agriculture what nature takes a very long time to do.
It has fed the world, mostly.
Genetic modification is just a logical extension of the same exact processes which both nature and humankind have already been doing.
It really is simple science, if one understands it.
BTW, people have been eating genetically modified food for decades. I don't see them dropping dead because of it. In fact, all the science says that it is safe. ALL OF IT!
Rex
(65,616 posts)do that in a lab in mere months. Dunno, I just know some folks are scared to death of GMOs.
longship
(40,416 posts)However, Mother Nature makes no such distinctions. It's all the same. It's all genetic modification.
GaYellowDawg
(4,449 posts)"Natural mutations" are not the only way that plants, or any other species evolve. This is a bit of an oversimplification, but there are four general mechanisms that drive evolution: natural selection, sexual selection, mutation, and migration.
Migration involves organisms either leaving or entering a population, thereby changing the genetic variation of a population. Mutation adds to genetic variation. Sexual selection means exactly what it sounds like: females choosing which males to mate with. If you're strong, fast, smart, and courageous, but you are so ugly that no one finds you attractive, your genes don't make it to the next generation. Natural selection is often characterized as survival of the fittest, but I prefer to characterize it as non-survival of the least fit. Essentially, the genetic variation of a particular population means that some organisms have the ability to survive a particular environment and pass on their genes, and some don't.
Darwin elucidated the mechanism of natural selection, and the reason why he called it natural selection was to differentiate it from artificial selection, in which humans select specific individuals to breed, based on traits that they find desirable.
What I'm saying is that artificial selection is not considered to be evolution. A chihuahua is not the result of evolution. Nor are cultivars. They are the result of artificial selection.
Genetically modified organisms are also the result of artificial selection. The difference is that the changes are more precise, faster, and can involve genes from other species. Transcription and translation occur in the same fashion in all eukaryotes (basically all organisms other than bacteria and archaebacteria). If you put a gene sequence from one organism into another, the second organism will produce the same amino acid sequence, and the protein will fold in the same fashion - thereby carrying out the same function. This is how you can take, for instance, a protein called green fluorescent protein from a jellyfish and if you insert it into a kitten embryo's genome early enough, the resulting kitten's cells will produce GFP and glow green under UV light, like so:
GFP is a good example demonstrating that exogenous proteins are quite faithfully reproduced, with correct folding. If the GFP in the kitten folded improperly it would most likely lose the ability to fluoresce. You can do the same thing transferring GFP to plants:
That plant is accurately producing a jellyfish protein. So basically, if a particular gene product in one plant is transferred to another, then the second plant will faithfully reproduce the protein with exactly the same structure as the first plant. For example, if you transfer the gene for beta-carotene (the precursor to vitamin A) into rice, which does not produce beta-carotene, then the beta-carotene that the GMO rice produces will have a structure identical to the beta-carotene produced naturally in carrots, will be just as good for you, and will not be one bit more toxic. It's also the reason why blanket condemnation of GMO's is ignorant and stupid.
longship
(40,416 posts)Natural evolution also has horizontal gene transfers (cross species). And all life on Earth also shares genes with all other life forms anyway.
Good post, GaYellowDawg.
Il_Coniglietto
(373 posts)Most people I've spoken with who are anti-GMO or don't really care, but are okay with labeling have little to no understanding of or education about basic genetics and DNA. Because of this you get surveys showing 80% of the public thinks food containing DNA should be labeled. DNA! A very similar number (84%) support GMO labeling, which begs the question: do those respondents even know what GMOs are, or indeed, what DNA is?
Which makes me wonder: who is benefiting from all this? The science is clear on the safety of consuming GMOs. But few people talk about the greed of the companies who are pushing labeling and are profiting off our general ignorance.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)Really?
Chathamization
(1,638 posts)before?
longship
(40,416 posts)The same science that says GM is safe says that climate change is a real problem.
So there's that. If one accepts one conclusion, one should accept the other conclusion.
Chathamization
(1,638 posts)also show that GMOs aren't referring to just any organism (but generally Living Modified Organisms as defined by the Cartagena protocol).
It'd be good if people stopped using the same tactics that right-wing climate deniers do and pretending these words have a different meaning.
Moliere
(285 posts)I guess I missed the science lecture where they discussed the natural evolution of roundup.
There is a difference when one food has a carcinogen baked into its core and another doesn't, and then I'm not allowed to know which one will kill me.
ananda
(28,885 posts)these are serious problems
I do not wish toneat any foods grown
by the likes of Monsanto.
longship
(40,416 posts)Anti-GMOers always play the glyphosate card when most of genetic modification has nothing whatsoever to do with glyphosate.
Please stop this tiresome, dishonest argument.
It just does not work.
Moliere
(285 posts)"most of genetic modification"
If even 5%, hell 1%, of GMOs contain concinogens then I want to know. If people vote to have the transparency and visibility into their food supply then they deserve to know. It's a shame you can't acknowledge either of these two fairly basic arguments.
Why is ok to obfuscate what we're eating? If it's a profit or marketing based concern, then you really ought to stop your dishonest arguments.
longship
(40,416 posts)Whether it is genetically modified or not.
So the glyphosate screeching is worthless in context of genetic modification.
It is also horribly dishonest.
Person 2713
(3,263 posts)longship
(40,416 posts)AntiBank
(1,339 posts)Equinox Moon
(6,344 posts)HuckleB
(35,773 posts)"...
But the new survey suggests that most Americans dont have a solid understanding of the science behind GMOs at all. Conducted as part of the Annenberg Science Knowledge survey project, the survey included more than 1,000 participants throughout the country. Surveys were conducted by telephone and included six questions on GMO labeling and the safety of genetically modified crops.
Altogether, 88 percent of participants said they thought products containing GMOs should be labeled, and 91 percent said they thought people had a right to know if they were buying or eating products containing GMOs. This is in keeping with multiple surveys conducted by other organizations that have indicated wide support for GMO labeling.
However, in the new survey, 58 percent of respondents also said they had only a fair or poor understanding of GMOs, compared with 40 percent of respondents who thought they had a good or excellent understanding.
Additionally, 48 percent of resp
ondents either disagreed or strongly disagreed with the idea that scientists have not found any risks to human health from eating genetically modified foods, as opposed to just 22 percent who agreed or strongly agreed (and 29 percent who neither agreed nor disagreed or just didnt know). These results not only suggest a large proportion of Americans hold factually incorrect beliefs about GMOs but were also somewhat at odds with responses to the next question, in which 39 percent of respondents agreed or strongly agreed that GMOs are safe to eat, while only 27 percent disagreed or strongly disagreed.
..."
___-----------------------------------------
Yikes. On many levels.
RapSoDee
(421 posts)...and Obama would be a fool to sign it into law. You'd be a fool to sit silently by while this "you have a RIGHT TO REMAIN IGNORANT" law is shoved down your throat, and the throat of your children and your children's children, on forward into the future.
Find a petition urging the President to veto it, and sign it. Now. Time is super short.
This law is a giant step forward in the march toward Corporate Fascism, now steadily creeping into governmental CODE REGULATING THE PROLES (you).
Act now, or forever remain ignorant (by law) about what corporations, in their insatiable hunger for profits, are doing to the stuff you eat.
nationalize the fed
(2,169 posts)"We'll let folks know whether their food has been genetically modified because Americans should know what they're buying" Candidate Barack Obama, 2007
Jul 14, 2016: Rep. Tulsi Gabbard Calls for Real Food Transparency for American Consumers
#Tulsi2020
RapSoDee
(421 posts)Time for President Obama to keep his word. Time to respect the will and the wishes of over 90% of the American people.
This thread has (as always) a dedicated cabal of Ignorance Champions who keep arguing - almost as if it were their jobs - that we should all embrace IGNORANCE, and that we'd all be a lot better off if we just shut up, sat down, and placed our full faith and trust in the GMO and CHEMICAL CORPORATIONS.
Horseshit.
I stand with the vast majority of Americans (over 90%) in choosing intelligence and knowledge over the fundamentally misguided position of the IGNORANCE ADVOCATES.