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are we ready for reparations? (Original Post) reddread Jul 2016 OP
The peeps who deserved reparations died a hundred years ago. Lance Bass esquire Jul 2016 #1
You mean the peeps who keep getting blasted by police? brush Jul 2016 #3
This. Silver_Witch Jul 2016 #29
Thank you so much for the link OhioBlue Jul 2016 #40
Yep +100 840high Jul 2016 #31
damn right I'm ready and not just for slavery reparations but jim crow reparations too. craigmatic Jul 2016 #2
LOL...let me know how that works out for you. n/t Lance Bass esquire Jul 2016 #4
the LOL reddread Jul 2016 #6
LOL Thank You! n/t Lance Bass esquire Jul 2016 #8
Inform yourself. Read Ta-Nehisi's landmark article on reparations brush Jul 2016 #9
I've read it. I still say no to reparations. Unless you can find some slaves who are 150 yrs. old. Waldorf Jul 2016 #10
So hundreds of years of stolen labor means nothing to you? brush Jul 2016 #11
One side of my family got here way after the war... citood Jul 2016 #30
Not that complicated, nor entirely unprecedented brush Jul 2016 #35
I'm sure I am more familiar with the Dawes Rolls than you citood Jul 2016 #41
i would have no problem with my tax dollars going for reparations . and my family got here 100 or so JI7 Jul 2016 #47
Well, that makes you a philantropist citood Jul 2016 #52
i have no problem paying any of that JI7 Jul 2016 #55
I did and like I said Let me know how that works out for you. Lance Bass esquire Jul 2016 #12
Just curious what ethnic group you are? brush Jul 2016 #17
Jews were justly paid reparations by Germany. Lance Bass esquire Jul 2016 #18
Post removed Post removed Jul 2016 #19
Are you really publishing a link to a Holocaust denial site? Joe the Revelator Jul 2016 #23
Not my intention. Just trying inform a poster that Germany reparations to Jewish . . . brush Jul 2016 #37
By using a holocaust denial site, you're not really disproving his point Joe the Revelator Jul 2016 #39
I only have first hand expierience..growing up with the few Lance Bass esquire Jul 2016 #26
this 840high Jul 2016 #32
Don't feel sorry for yourself. Your family deserves compensation also. brush Jul 2016 #38
I have truly seen it all now. An actual live link to IHR neo nazis on DU AntiBank Jul 2016 #34
Regarding Japanese Americans Dyedinthewoolliberal Jul 2016 #20
That's it? That's all you have to say without backing it up? brush Jul 2016 #22
Says the person posting links for a holocaust denial site. Joe the Revelator Jul 2016 #24
Backing it up? Dyedinthewoolliberal Jul 2016 #27
LOL You owe me a new keyboard! Lance Bass esquire Jul 2016 #28
Send me the invoice! Dyedinthewoolliberal Jul 2016 #46
Germany has repeatedly rejected reparations for descendents of the Herero and Namaqua genocide Chathamization Jul 2016 #43
Your sincerity is suspect. nt LexVegas Jul 2016 #5
for no particular reason I presume? reddread Jul 2016 #7
I'd imagine simply due to the consistency of narrative in your posts. LanternWaste Jul 2016 #54
You do understand that in History, Arab and African merchants were the greatest enslavers? Albertoo Jul 2016 #13
No. n/t X_Digger Jul 2016 #14
Do Clarence Thomas and Ben Carson get checks? (nt) Nye Bevan Jul 2016 #15
I agree that the time for reparations has long passed. SheilaT Jul 2016 #16
Medicare is partially "means tested" now 1939 Jul 2016 #49
That's true. I'd forgotten, despite the fact that my first year on Medicare SheilaT Jul 2016 #53
Depends on what you mean by reparations, but I'm open to talking about different options aikoaiko Jul 2016 #21
Great Society???? NT 1939 Jul 2016 #50
We have to give the country back LuvNewcastle Jul 2016 #25
Stop calling us Indians. We aren't from India. cherokeeprogressive Jul 2016 #45
My ex preferred to be called an Indian, LuvNewcastle Jul 2016 #51
I don't think reparations will ever be passed in the US--but maybe, just maybe they could stop tblue37 Jul 2016 #33
reparations will never be paid, but you knew that already AntiBank Jul 2016 #36
No(nt) jack_krass Jul 2016 #42
I am! You fucking bet! MY ancestors owned this WHOLE FUCKING CONTINENT. cherokeeprogressive Jul 2016 #44
For who? What group? JustAnotherGen Jul 2016 #48
Start a GoFundMe Acct. greytdemocrat Jul 2016 #56
 

Lance Bass esquire

(671 posts)
1. The peeps who deserved reparations died a hundred years ago.
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 09:37 PM
Jul 2016

Any talk of such things is all it will ever be..just talk.

brush

(53,475 posts)
3. You mean the peeps who keep getting blasted by police?
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 09:44 PM
Jul 2016

Whose ancestors had their labor stolen for hundreds of years of uncompensated work, and were therefore not able to past anything down to descendants (considering the principle of compounding, that wealth if it came due would bust the treasury. If paid though, African Americans as a whole would be on more equal footing economically with the larger society whose wages weren't stolen, but who's counting).

The peeps who for decades were denied mortgages because of racism and were again, unable to build wealth to pass down to their children?

Try reading Ta-neshi Coates article on reparations.

The legacy of enslavement is still having devastating effects in the black community.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/06/the-case-for-reparations/361631/

OhioBlue

(5,126 posts)
40. Thank you so much for the link
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 12:19 AM
Jul 2016

I read it all and it is very enlightening. I don't know how I feel about reparations, but I do think John Conyer's HR 40 should be passed for a study and national conversation.

Waldorf

(654 posts)
10. I've read it. I still say no to reparations. Unless you can find some slaves who are 150 yrs. old.
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 10:37 PM
Jul 2016

brush

(53,475 posts)
11. So hundreds of years of stolen labor means nothing to you?
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 10:39 PM
Jul 2016

If you read it before ok, but you couldn't have finished it that quickly since I posted the link.

But don't bother responding.

I'm not interested in you and privilege anymore.

citood

(550 posts)
30. One side of my family got here way after the war...
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:34 PM
Jul 2016

And on the other side, my ancestor arrived here in the middle of the civil war and served in the Union army.

Would I be expected to help pay for reparations? Do you see how complicated this gets real fast? Especially since our largest immigration waves came after the civil war.

brush

(53,475 posts)
35. Not that complicated, nor entirely unprecedented
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:48 PM
Jul 2016

Ever heard of the Dawes Rolls?

They're researched and document lists that prove membership of Native American tribes.

The same can be done for descendants of enslaved African Americans whose labor was stolen.

Very doable. And of course citizen would not pay for it. The government and corporate descendants that enforced slavery and wage theft, and/or profited by wage theft (and there are many institutions and corporations whose roots can be traced to this that are still extant).

citood

(550 posts)
41. I'm sure I am more familiar with the Dawes Rolls than you
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 12:25 AM
Jul 2016

But that has nothing to do with the question I posed.

You do understand that if the government pays reparations, that means we all pay reparations, don't you?

JI7

(89,182 posts)
47. i would have no problem with my tax dollars going for reparations . and my family got here 100 or so
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 02:05 AM
Jul 2016

years after the civil war.

citood

(550 posts)
52. Well, that makes you a philantropist
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 10:12 AM
Jul 2016

You could go out and donate money to a civil rights organization tomorrow, no big deal and nobody else's business. But reparations are meant to right a wrong...a wrong performed by the payer of the reparations. Practically, reparations cannot be voluntary.

rep·a·ra·tion

repəˈrāSH(ə n

noun

the making of amends for a wrong one has done, by paying money to or otherwise helping those who have been wronged.


So, while you might have no problem paying yourself, would you be in favor of making others pay? How about a first generation immigrant family, recently arrived from some war zone. Should their tax dollars be used for reparations? What about Native Americans...many still living on reservations and hardly enjoying any of the fruits of slave labor - should their tax dollars be used for reparations?

Its too complicated and way too much time has passed for anything even close to fair being worked out.


 

Lance Bass esquire

(671 posts)
12. I did and like I said Let me know how that works out for you.
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 10:43 PM
Jul 2016

My family was also..enslaved...butchered, gassed and had our farms taken away.

That's life.

No one owes us a damn thing.

We are over it...nothing to see here...move on.

Good luck with your cause.

brush

(53,475 posts)
17. Just curious what ethnic group you are?
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 10:57 PM
Jul 2016

Jews were justly paid reparations by Germany.

Japanese Americans were justly compensated by our government for WWll internment.

Why shouldn't African Americans also be justly compensated for hundreds of years of stolen labor?

It's racism in itself for it to be ok for other ethnic groups but not for African Americans.

What is with the automatic "no" from so many when the subject of just compensation for African Americans is raised?

And I'm not talking about checks being cut to individuals but for better neighborhood schools, college funds, small business grants, community facilities that benefit neighborhoods.

Response to Lance Bass esquire (Reply #18)

 

Joe the Revelator

(14,915 posts)
23. Are you really publishing a link to a Holocaust denial site?
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:14 PM
Jul 2016

Seriously??

The Institute for Historical Review (IHR), founded in 1978, is an organization primarily devoted to publishing and promoting books and essays described by critics as pseudo-historical that attack the mainstream historical consensus concerning the Nazi genocide of Jews.[2][3][4][5][6] It is considered by many scholars as the center of the international Holocaust denial movement.[2][7][8] IHR is widely regarded as antisemitic and as having links to neo-Nazi organizations. The Institute published the Journal of Historical Review until 2002, but now disseminates its materials through its website and via email. The Institute is affiliated with the Legion for the Survival of Freedom and Noontide Press.[9]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institute_for_Historical_Review

brush

(53,475 posts)
37. Not my intention. Just trying inform a poster that Germany reparations to Jewish . . .
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:53 PM
Jul 2016

people held in labor camps during WWll were not "comedy gold" as he mockingly wrote.

He didn't seem to be aware of that history.

 

Joe the Revelator

(14,915 posts)
39. By using a holocaust denial site, you're not really disproving his point
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:55 PM
Jul 2016

and not just any holocaust denial site, possibly THE birthplace of holocaust denial.

Come on now.

 

Lance Bass esquire

(671 posts)
26. I only have first hand expierience..growing up with the few
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:17 PM
Jul 2016

of my clan that survived. Sitting on my uncles lap and wondering what that tattoo was on his arm. Wondering why he had weird fake teeth. I wouldn't have understood why they were pulled out as a form of torture.

When I got older they explained to me what happened and why every 10 years people in my family go to visit a camp in Poland because that's where family members are buried in mass graves.

My family never blamed.
They never felt sorry for themselves.

That's life.

Some live..some die..you move on.

That's what I know.

 

AntiBank

(1,339 posts)
34. I have truly seen it all now. An actual live link to IHR neo nazis on DU
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:45 PM
Jul 2016

what's next a Stormfront Appreciation Group???

you are one messed up human

Dyedinthewoolliberal

(15,485 posts)
20. Regarding Japanese Americans
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:08 PM
Jul 2016

being justly compensated; that ain't what I've heard from those who know.....

brush

(53,475 posts)
22. That's it? That's all you have to say without backing it up?
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:13 PM
Jul 2016

There was compensation paid. Maybe not what the recipients thought was enough, but funds were paid.

Nothing was paid to African Americans.

 

Joe the Revelator

(14,915 posts)
24. Says the person posting links for a holocaust denial site.
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:15 PM
Jul 2016

Sorry, but I don't trust your information. At all.

Chathamization

(1,638 posts)
43. Germany has repeatedly rejected reparations for descendents of the Herero and Namaqua genocide
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 12:30 AM
Jul 2016

That was only a few decades earlier than the Holocaust. Not saying that it's not a good idea to talk about reparations, though.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
54. I'd imagine simply due to the consistency of narrative in your posts.
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 11:49 AM
Jul 2016

I'd imagine simply due to the consistency of narrative in your posts, regardless of presumptions.

 

Albertoo

(2,016 posts)
13. You do understand that in History, Arab and African merchants were the greatest enslavers?
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 10:44 PM
Jul 2016

From memory, cumulated enslavement since Antiquity by origin of merchants:
Arab/Muslim merchants: 25M, African merchants: 20M, Euro/American 15M
(numbers rough order of magnitude from memory of study by Petre-Grenouillau)

Who is going to organize a fair system of reparation?
How does one track the descendants of slaves? Of enslavers?
Obama is a descendant of both: does he both pay and collect?

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
16. I agree that the time for reparations has long passed.
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 10:56 PM
Jul 2016

That's not to say there still aren't huge injustices, but reparations are not the way to go.

And as someone else has already pointed out, how about those with one white and one black parent? Plus, my own grandparents arrived from Ireland more than a generation after the end of slavery in this country. Many millions of others arrived well after the Civil War. I don't feel especially responsible for what happened so long ago.

I have no problems whatsoever about affirmative action, and to all those who cry about how unfair it is, I invite them to look around and show me the corporate suites that aren't still almost totally male and white. Or look at legislatures from the Congress on down. Still almost entirely white and male.

As for the Supreme Court, I honestly think that going forward Presidents should only nominate women, and once we have a 9 woman Supreme Court, it should last that way for going on 200 years. That would be fair.

Here's something else, that is perhaps slightly aligned with the notion of reparations: We should have a guaranteed minimum income. Or if that's too horrifying to contemplate, then every person should be eligible for and receive SNAP (food stamps). Those well enough off not to need them can pass them on to those who do. But just as Social Security and Medicare are not and should never be means tested, there are certain basic things that all citizens should receive.

1939

(1,683 posts)
49. Medicare is partially "means tested" now
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 05:55 AM
Jul 2016

The amount you pay for Medicare Part B per month in 2016 is based on your gross income reported on your 2014 income tax return.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
53. That's true. I'd forgotten, despite the fact that my first year on Medicare
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 10:59 AM
Jul 2016

I had to pay a higher premium myself.

Thanks for pointing that out.

aikoaiko

(34,127 posts)
21. Depends on what you mean by reparations, but I'm open to talking about different options
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:10 PM
Jul 2016

Reparations can take different forms and not just writing a big check.

It could include special programs that target black Americans access to resources and opportunities.

LuvNewcastle

(16,820 posts)
25. We have to give the country back
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:15 PM
Jul 2016

to the Indians first. I guess we can pay some reparations with whatever the Indians let us have. We can't wipe all tears away and right all wrongs in life. It doesn't work that way. You play the hand you're dealt.

LuvNewcastle

(16,820 posts)
51. My ex preferred to be called an Indian,
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 06:06 AM
Jul 2016

so that's why I used that term. He didn't like to be called Native American because his ancestors were here long before there was a concept of America. He hated to be called indigenous. I meant no offense, and I'll gladly call people whatever they prefer to be called.

tblue37

(64,982 posts)
33. I don't think reparations will ever be passed in the US--but maybe, just maybe they could stop
Thu Jul 14, 2016, 11:40 PM
Jul 2016

unjustly harassing, jailing, and killing black people in the US, and maybe stop trying to deprive them in every way possible of their right to vote.

I bet that a lot of black people would be satisfied--nay, thrilled with such an outcome.

Unfortunately, police harassment, inappropriate and unjust incarceration, and extrajudicial killing of unarmed and innocent black people are as likely to stop in this country as reparations for centuries of stolen labor and oppression are to be offered.

 

cherokeeprogressive

(24,853 posts)
44. I am! You fucking bet! MY ancestors owned this WHOLE FUCKING CONTINENT.
Fri Jul 15, 2016, 12:41 AM
Jul 2016

How much am I going to get? Bring it!

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