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Wed Jul 27, 2016, 04:31 PM

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This message was self-deleted by its author (guillaumeb) on Wed Oct 4, 2017, 11:27 AM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

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Reply This message was self-deleted by its author (Original post)
guillaumeb Jul 2016 OP
Shandris Jul 2016 #1
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #3
Shandris Jul 2016 #7
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #8
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #26
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #39
LeftyMom Jul 2016 #2
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #5
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #27
giftedgirl77 Jul 2016 #34
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #49
giftedgirl77 Jul 2016 #56
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #59
LeftyMom Jul 2016 #43
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #50
LeftyMom Jul 2016 #57
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #58
Avalux Jul 2016 #4
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #6
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #28
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #37
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #46
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #51
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #48
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #52
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #60
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #62
LanternWaste Jul 2016 #9
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #11
treestar Jul 2016 #25
ronnie624 Jul 2016 #61
JI7 Jul 2016 #10
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #12
Bluenorthwest Jul 2016 #19
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #20
malaise Jul 2016 #13
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #15
malaise Jul 2016 #17
PrideofJefferson Jul 2016 #14
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #16
Bluenorthwest Jul 2016 #18
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #21
PrideofJefferson Jul 2016 #22
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #36
treestar Jul 2016 #24
PrideofJefferson Jul 2016 #30
treestar Jul 2016 #32
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #38
PrideofJefferson Jul 2016 #42
MariaThinks Jul 2016 #29
treestar Jul 2016 #23
davidn3600 Jul 2016 #31
treestar Jul 2016 #33
davidn3600 Jul 2016 #35
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #41
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #40
JesterCS Jul 2016 #44
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #53
MinM Jul 2016 #45
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #54
Igel Jul 2016 #47
guillaumeb Jul 2016 #55

Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 04:41 PM

1. "Most stories say the government is deliberately hiding this from 'reliable sources'.

 

But see, these sources from the government say that they're not, so that's that. Also, in a total shock, a vast majority of crimes in a nation are committed by the group that is most prominent, so we'll try to spin that into percentages and stuff because most people don't understand statistics. Finally, we'll LITERALLY halve the number (and then some) because the 'investigations are still ongoing' and, as such, fully half a year's statistics are completely misrepresented."

Yeah, I can't imagine why. Enjoy your $00.10.

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Response to Shandris (Reply #1)


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #3)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 04:52 PM

7. Ooh, another dime. Good job.

 

PS: I know the list. I'm not engaging because frankly, you're not good enough at it. Have a nice day!

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Response to Shandris (Reply #7)


Response to Shandris (Reply #7)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:01 AM

26. you are right. i'm not taking the bait where someone is excusing murder and sex assault.

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #26)


Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 04:42 PM

2. If the posters flipping out about migrants actually cared about the safety of women and children

they'd be a lot more interested in getting women and children out of warzones and off of the migration trails where they're often sexually abused.

So one is left with two options: they only care about the safety (or at least the preservation of the perceived purity) of white women, or they're using the situation to advance their real agenda of xenophobia.

Probably both. Misogyny and racism usually go hand in hand, and using the excuse that Those Other People are going to abuse our precious white ladies (with ownership entirely implied) is the oldest excuse for racism going.

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Response to LeftyMom (Reply #2)


Response to LeftyMom (Reply #2)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:02 AM

27. Really?

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #27)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:37 AM

34. Yes, they're blinded by their bigotry.

 

Much in the same way POC are demonized here. Anyone that's been on the receiving end of this type of hate can recognize it from a mile away.

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #34)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 02:23 PM

49. i really wasn't hating anyone at the point that i heard that a muslim radical killed a kindly priest

that fact is not going to change regardless of the attempts at somehow blaming the people who react to the killing - instead of focusing on the killing itself.

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #49)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 02:50 PM

56. Lol, the problem is you are waaayyyy more concerned with what

 

the scary Muslims are doing instead of the Israelis, Christians, white power folks & police in this country. Are fucked up actions only reprehensible when committed by Muslims or brown ppl in general?

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Response to giftedgirl77 (Reply #56)

Sun Jul 31, 2016, 10:02 AM

59. who said they were? I'm not hearing of Israelis commitment suicide bombings around the world.

and if you're referring to the Gaza issues, they have nothing to do with Belgium, France, Germany or any other countries that are seeing muslim militants attack.

I'm able to have feelings and strategies dealing with each of these issues you mention - including extreme anger to what the police are doing.

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #27)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 12:05 AM

43. Absolutely.

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Response to LeftyMom (Reply #2)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 02:24 PM

50. allowing the migrants in was a gesture of caring. The migrants killing the innocent people is not.

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #50)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 02:52 PM

57. The fact that you think "migrants" and "innocent people" are separate categories proves my point.

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Response to LeftyMom (Reply #57)

Sun Jul 31, 2016, 09:59 AM

58. not at all. you're missing my point. Do you have any sympathy and ideas for the innocent

people murdered by those in the migrant pool?


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Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 04:48 PM

4. Sort of related - I was just on Reddit reading stuff from Drumpfsters

They're posting questions for an AMA with Drumpf.

One of them claims to be German, and wants to know how they can stop the wave of 'Muslim' crime in Germany. Asks him what they should do.

There are racist people everywhere. This one may really be German, or may just be a lying POS American.

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Response to Avalux (Reply #4)


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #6)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:05 AM

28. i thought there was a beheading of a priest in France last week by a 'radicalized muslim'.

nothing to see there I guess.

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #28)


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #37)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 02:22 PM

46. it doesn't take much to find it. look on any newspaper or website on any given day and the murder is

there to see.

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #46)


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #6)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 02:22 PM

48. without the crime there would be nothing to push.

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #48)


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #52)

Sun Jul 31, 2016, 10:04 AM

60. only in the threads you seem to respond to - examples

I write extensively against what the police are doing against black Americans. It's disgusting and stop.

I am extremely against white supremist crimes and allowing them to get guns

I'm against those lunatics who kill innocent kids and attack gathering around the country and the world.

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Response to MariaThinks (Reply #60)


Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 04:54 PM

9. Judging from specific posts and specific responses, the pattern I'm, seeing is this...

Judging from specific posts and specific responses, the pattern I'm seeing is this: the violence against women specific to Germany has been championed only as a cause to better advertise a prejudice against Muslims.

Remove the word Muslim or immigrant from any other story about violence against women, and they are no where to be found. So my firm belief is that they are piggy-backing a prejudice on top of a valid cause to make that prejudice appear more valid.

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #9)


Response to LanternWaste (Reply #9)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 09:52 AM

25. This ^^^

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #9)

Sun Jul 31, 2016, 10:39 AM

61. 👍

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Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 04:56 PM

10. i think the issue is they aren't the usual crimes

Mainly things like robbery where the intent is to gain money or other valuables.

Or cases of people who know each other getting into an argument which gets out of control.

These are cases of people just wanting to attack and kill others over some personal beliefs.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #10)


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #12)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 07:09 PM

19. That's not what the text you cite says.

 

nt

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #19)


Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 05:22 PM

13. There are folks who hate facts

This will upset them...GOOD

Rec

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Response to malaise (Reply #13)


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #15)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 06:27 PM

17. Excellent

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Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 05:29 PM

14. Taharrush Gamea is a real thing

 

Just ask Lara Logan. I am all for respecting other cultures and people but to put our heads in the sand and thinking this stuff doesn't happen does a disservice to all.

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Response to PrideofJefferson (Reply #14)


Response to guillaumeb (Reply #16)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 06:56 PM

18. What you say here is not what the article says.

 

You: " refugees account for less than 1% of the sex crimes committed in Germany"

Text: " under 1 per cent of crimes committed by migrants in 2015 were sexual offences."


The article you link to cites the percentage of the crimes committed by refugees that are sex crimes, you change that to claim it is stating a percentage of all sex crimes which are committed by refugees. The two things are not the same.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #18)

Wed Jul 27, 2016, 08:28 PM

21. Read #20

Plus both things that you cite are from the sources that I linked.

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Response to guillaumeb (Reply #16)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 09:46 AM

22. Searching?

 

Thanks. I have lurked for many years and I am glad for such a community.

Do you think these attacks would have happened anyway? It's so disturbing to see the experiences of these woman be shoved to the background like this. The German government covered this up (if you can help explaining why) and now people are trying to silence the victims in the name of political correctness. Facts are facts.

Of course all sexual based violence is a problem but incidents like the ones on New Years simply are a new cause for concern. These were groups of young men largely from one group who took mass action to molest women. That's wrong.

This may get me in trouble but I see some parallels to the lynchings we had in the USA back in our history. We had groups of people committing heinous acts of hatred towards others. We can rightly blame the perpetrators of these crimes. We also rightly blame the perpetrators of the crimes in Germany. We can also pay larger blame on the overall culture in the USA for fostering an environment where lynchings had some level of acceptance. On the same note I think it is ok to look at the culture of these young men to find if that culture gives them a cover first these acts. Am I wrong in this thought?

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Response to PrideofJefferson (Reply #22)


Response to PrideofJefferson (Reply #14)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 09:51 AM

24. The head in the sand language is always used

maybe get your head out of the sand about the fact that German men committed most of these crimes and that every group has its criminals.

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Response to treestar (Reply #24)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:13 AM

30. It sounds like you are getting very close to excusing

 

This behavior

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Response to PrideofJefferson (Reply #30)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:28 AM

32. NO it doesn't

There is no reason to post that.

Every group has its criminals and none of them are excused. But no group is inherently more criminal because of their race or religion. Focusing on one type of person committing them is bigoted. Just like right wingers who find and post over and over any case of black on white crime they can find in the US for the purpose of making it look like black men commit most crimes. On DU this has been obvious. No local stories of white German men committing any crime. Single out the refugees. The agenda is obvious. You are invited to think you are burying your head in the sand if we continue to be humanitarian and take refugees from war torn areas.

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Response to treestar (Reply #32)


Response to treestar (Reply #32)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 07:42 PM

42. No offense

 

but it seems that some are more offended by the mere mention of these attacks and what might motivate them than the attacks themselves. We seem to place blame on other systems when offenses are committed (think unarmed black men and systemic racism and white supremacy) but when these attacks occur no one must mention the ideological ramifications of the systems of misogyny from which these attackers arrived on European shores.

I also think pointing to "well it's only 1% of sexual assaults" smells similar to the black on black crime canard foisted at BLM supporters.

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Response to PrideofJefferson (Reply #14)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:08 AM

29. You're actually caring about the victims, instead of finding excuses. Good to see.

it's like the guns don't kill argument (e.g. only a small fraction of guns are used to mass murder, most are suicides) or the old 'science has not proven that smoking is bad' or the science on climate change is inconclusive.

It would be far more effective to accept that radicalization is happening and to be part of a solution to stop it - as opposed to minimizing its number and horror.

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Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 09:50 AM

23. Thank you for that

Yes there are people zeroing in on a few particular crimes in order to support their agenda about Muslims being inherently inferior.

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Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:20 AM

31. Do you view Christianity is misogynist? What about Islam?

 

Frankly....I think they both are.

That's my opinion as someone who's agnostic.

Both these religions want to control women. Both of them have problems with women. To sit here and trash the entire Christian religion for restricting abortion and then turn a blind eye when Muslims perform acid attacks and honor killings in the mid-east is incredibly stupid.

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Response to davidn3600 (Reply #31)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:30 AM

33. and without either of these religions, there is still

sexual assault and other crime. This is the human condition and part of the human problem. Migration will continue also as that is part of the human condition. A country that takes no refugees also has rapists and other criminals. Not recognizing that is "burying your head in the sand."

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Response to treestar (Reply #33)

Fri Jul 29, 2016, 10:45 AM

35. I never said there wasn't

 

But if we are going to sit here and trash the entire Christian religion (which many here do) for being misogynist for the acts of individuals and not say a word about Islam when Muslims commit individual acts.....that's hypocritical. It's a double standard.

I mean I know the progressive fantasy is that Muslims are all peaceful and good people and white Christians are all evil, racist, and misogynist.... but that's not reality. I'm sorry but both these religions have serious problems. Both of them have psychopaths in their ranks.

If you trash Christianity for not allowing gays to marry and then ignore when ISIS throws gays off buildings....who do you think you are helping? What goal do you feel you are accomplishing?

I agree with Bill Maher.....liberals are stupid when it comes to this.

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Response to davidn3600 (Reply #35)


Response to davidn3600 (Reply #31)


Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 04:21 AM

44. I have a good friend in Goldbach (sp?) Germany

She said it's actually been pretty bad, and alot of them aren't reported. Not saying you're wrong about the percentages, but it seems moreso than unsubstancial

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Response to JesterCS (Reply #44)


Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 11:00 AM

45. Meme-jacking by the Breitbarts of the world ..

Given that the right dominates talk radio and cable news .. I guess we shouldn't be surprised when they serve as an echo chamber for the far right blogs ie., Breibart, Alex Jones...

Good job deconstructing and analyzing this, guillaumeb.

On The Media has an episode this weekend that deals with many of these same issues:

@onthemedia

Shows up! Trump v. Putin, the German far-Right's media strategy, and a brand new BNCH for migration.


Here's one segment...
Breaking News Consumer's Handbook: Migration Edition (Abroad)

Jul 29, 2016

Migration and refugees have been in the news a lot in the last two years; a deeper understanding of migration and refugees, unfortunately, has not. From misleading language to distorted facts to the abuse of the very term "breaking news" (when in fact emigration, particularly into Europe, tends to remain constant) -- coverage of refugees and migration is all too often predictably poor.

Brooke talks with Heaven Crawley, Coventry University's International Migration Chair, about mass migration myths and how to identify them when they crop up in the news. The result is Part One of our Breaking News Consumer's Handbook: Migration Edition.

http://www.wnyc.org/story/bnch-migration-heaven-crawley

The transcript will be available Monday but you can listen at the link.

keywords: swarm, flood, wave...

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Response to MinM (Reply #45)


Response to guillaumeb (Original post)

Sat Jul 30, 2016, 02:22 PM

47. Comments

1. The crime rate was disproportionate, about twice what would be expected.
2. They're refugees. The crime rate for those being offered a hand up should've zero.
3. Many of the refugees are in sequestered communities. I suspect most of those are not reported.
4. The perps for many assaults were never identified and cannot be included in the stats. Is there a bias in this category of unknown perps? Probably.

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Response to Igel (Reply #47)