Kudos to the 12 US Representatives who *publicly* opposed Nancy Pelosi yesterday!

[RiverStone]

Yesterday, Rachel Maddow interviewed Seth Moulton (US Rep from Massachusetts) on why he and 63 other representatives opposed Nancy Pelosi winning re-election as Leader of the House Caucus. I'm paraphrasing here, but Rep Moulton spoke of the need for a new generation of leadership, who offer a compelling and motivating message to address the concerns of working-class/rust belt voters (who turned away from the Dems in 2016).

Of the 63 who voted for Tim Ryan, only 12 (I believe) came out publicly against Nancy. Does someone have those Representative's names and is willing to post? 134 Reps voted for Nancy and it should be noted, the entire vote is held via a secret ballot.

A week ago I posted a thread in support of Tim Ryan, stated similar sentiments as Rep Moulton. I added, with all due respect to Nancy Pelosi's tenure and successes, it's time for new and (((inspiring)) leadership. In particular, Bernie supporters and/including younger voters (ages 20-30) desperately need to see the kind of passion and no-holds-barred strategies which Elizabeth Warren emulates (for example). We need fresh and even radical approaches to mix with the establishment guard of Schumer, Hoyer, and Clyburn.

I was surprised to find via my last OP and roughly 90+ responses, on DU it was 3 to 1 in support of Nancy. While very disappointed in the Caucus vote, and Nancy's luke-warm acknowledgment of resistance to the status quo...till at least 2018, she is the Leader.

I am posting this to encourage and commend those 12 Democratic Representatives who had the guts to speak their truth to power. For the other 51 Reps who opposed Nancy, I also encourage you to come forward publicly and advocate for change! I accept Nancy as our Leader in the House, I also hope she recognizes the weight of those who seek change within the party.

Those within the Democratic Party who agree that losing the past 4 election cycles in the House of Representatives deserves new leadership, should not go quietly into the night. If they do, I fear our party is fucked. I have been a loyal and activist Democratic voter for 40 years; I don't recall ever feeling such concern about our party's current leadership.

I'm fighting for the kind of Democratic party leadership we need to win!!!

I'd be thrilled to rally around very assertive, fresh, inspirational, and bold change tactics within the party. All will be needed in full force to stand-up against a fascist president-elect.

[pnwmom]

1. Nancy Pelosi is one of the most liberal members of Congress

and highly skilled at the maneuvering that is necessary to her job.

Here is where you can compare her voting record to others:

ontheissues.org

The House is the most highly partisan it has ever been and yet some people blame her for not getting progressive bills passed from her position as minority leader. She can only work with the House members that WE send to her.

What they SHOULD be doing is focusing on getting Dems into office at the state level, where Republicans control 32 of the legislatures and 33 of the Governorships -- and have been actively engaged in the gerrymandering that has given them a large majority in the House.

[CurtEastPoint]

2. What she said. Thanks, PNWMom

[RiverStone]

5. While I agree on the added focus to legislatures + Gov, yet on optics....

Nancy is uninspiring and business as usual to VOTERS!

PNWMOM, we debated the merits (or not) of Nancy last week. And as I noted, I was surprised to be in the minority opinion on DU (at least in that one thread). Thankfully, we do not march in lock-step around here, so I opinion onwards.

On issues, Nancy is Liberal (no doubt there) - yet and in consideration that we need RADICAL changes to win against a fascist-elect who is a master manipulator of the MSM...it's now about doing what ever we need to win...that's win VOTES.

It comes down to winning votes. My 20 something kiddos find little inspiration in the current Democratic Party - as we ALL were Bernie supporters in my family, and see his revolution idea is in order. The old establishment Dems do not inspire. I voted for Hillary, yet did not vote for Bernie's message to be marginalized.

p.s. I live in the PNW too!

[pnwmom]

26. Despite what Bernie people think, millions of Hillary supporters, including young women,

ARE inspired by Hillary.

You should read the posts from the "secret" Facebook group that a couple woman set up because they wanted a place where they could talk about HRC without being insulted, or having her insulted. And in a month there were 3 million extremely enthusiastic members of this "secret" closed group. Now almost 4 million.

All our kids need to be encouraged to work at the local level to elect the kinds of people we want to see in the House. Nancy can only do so much -- the rest is up to us.

I just looked at the latest numbers, and Hillary already has more than 65 million voters, with the
count still ongoing. In the end I think she will have "inspired" as many voters, or almost as many, as Obama in 2012 -- despite the millions of votes lost to purging of registrations, new ID requirements, the shutting down of polling places and cutbacks in early voting days, and all the other methods of voter suppression that have occurred since 2013, when the Courts dismantled the voting rights act.

[BlueMTexpat]

31. + a million! eom

[Tarheel_Dem]

43. Thanks pnwmom. The bros are continuing their assault on the Democratic party stalwarts who have....

been there with us through thick & thin. It's disgusting.

[TheCowsCameHome]

3. It was time for a change.

Moulton and Lynch from Massachusetts had the courage to call for it.

[pnwmom]

4. No, it's time for a leader who knows how to pull every switch and lever,

not a newbie just figuring things out.

[RiverStone]

6. What will she do differently to WIN? n/t

[pnwmom]

12. What will HE do? Wave his magic male whatever?

The problem isn't with Nancy's leadership, it's with the fact that she only has a minority of House members to work with -- and that's our fault, not hers.

And you know as well as I do that if she WERE reaching across the aisle and getting more things done that way, we'd be screaming our heads off about her compromising.

[RiverStone]

23. Here is the rational on what he will do from Rep Moulton - who Rachel interviewed:

https://moulton.house.gov/news-stories/moulton-endorses-congressman-tim-ryan-for-leader-of-house-democrats/

And I have yet to get a cohesive answer on if Nancy will do things differently and acknowledge this growing sentiment for change?

ON EDIT : Really, there is no reason to debate Tim anymore because he lost. I'm only hoping that the other 62 Reps who voiced opposition will be heard!!! It's Nancy's charge to hear and integrate this message too. At least, I sure as hell hope she does!

[Proud Liberal Dem]

13. Same question is/was applicable to Ryan as well

Not sure that I heard anything that compelling from him.

[n2doc]

40. What's she going to do?

The house is a republican shop. The rules allow the majority absolute control. It's not the Senate. What is she going to do that she hasn't done over the past 4 years, which is nothing so far as I can tell.

She is 76 years old, has been leader/speaker for 12. We need new blood. Pelosi has been well defined by the R's as a liberal bogywoman. She needs to gracefully hand over the reigns, too bad she won't.

[pnwmom]

42. What's HE going to do? He won't have a magic gavel, and he doesn't have the

confidence of the Democratic House members either, because Nancy easily won the vote.

Bernie is 75 and I never saw his supporters saying he was too old -- and for a much bigger job. She isn't either.

[RiverStone]

7. Yes! Rec that!!

[Skittles]

8. I agree, time for CHANGE

this same old, same old is BULLSHIT

[emulatorloo]

9. "Dago Red Wine"

His "big donors told him to challenge Pelosi for the leadership spot."


http://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/rep-tim-ryan-busted-by-msnbc-host-for-using-dago-red-wine-slur-while-talking-about-pelosi-challenge/

[frazzled]

10. 2/3 of the Democratic congresspersons we elected voted for Nancy Pelosi

Is there something you don't like about democracy? I'm sorry your favored candidate lost, but he lost.
As for power, wanting to put someone else in power just makes them the power. Let's get rid of stupid words like "power." This is about a technical leadership position. The people have spoken. And they consist of more than just the working-class white folk who live in the rustbelt. We are an egalitarian party that is inclusive of all kinds of people, from all parts of the country, all walks of life, all colors, creeds, and sexual orientations.

PS: The minority leader does not run elections. There is a DCCC (Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee) that does that. "They recruit candidates, raise funds, and organize races in districts that are expected to yield politically notable or close elections." Ben Ray Luján (D-NM) is Chair of that committee. Yes, the leader appoints them, but they do the work. When we won a majority in the House in 2004, it was the reviled Rahm Emanuel who was in charge of the recruitment, fundraising, and race organization. So if you're saying that's the purpose of the Democratic House leadership, you should be praising his work in that regard.

You know darned well that gerrymandering and other demographic factors have put Democrats in the minority these past years (plus the factor of the public generally wanting to "balance" a democratic presidency with republican congresspeople).

Is it time for fresh blood in the party? Maybe. But this apparently wasn't the time decided by those we elect. They know the personalities, the needs of the office, and the skills they need a leader to have to keep themselves in office. They voted for Pelosi. You can either rail against the party--which only leads to further losses--or you can accept the results and do what you can to support them, like donating to the DCCC.

[RiverStone]

17. I love Democracy, though we also know it's about Nancy's connection to $$$$$

Her fundraising + BIG donors $$$ welding influence in a big way. Not to mention she is one of the wealthiest members of Congress. I don't like the taste of that nor does it create wide-ranging appeal. The opposite really.

And if I'm a minority voice in the party advocating for fresh blood, I'll keep doing it.

Outside the world of DU, many voters have not even heard of the DCCC. On the street, I'm hearing the Dems have lost their way and please tell me, what unifying message do the establishment Dems bring to the table after losing elections (now national and local) which puts Dems in the worst position they have been in since 1929?

It's about winning!!! As sick as I am of election stuff, we need to radically shift approach today to win in 2018.

If we agree to disagree frazzled, what do you see Nancy should do differently to win in 2018?

[frazzled]

19. No, we don't know that

I don't deny your right to fight for or support whomever you want. I do reject the simplification of complex institutions and national moods.

[otohara]

11. Shaming Longtime Democratic Leaders

can't tell if it's an age thing or a continuation of Sanders supporters just being plain mad and wanting them AKA "establishment" Democrats to be sent packing -

I read posts describing her as a rich old white woman.

Time for us old folks to move on, we're not needed or wanted.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

15. they want the heads of all the leadership who are women

notice no one is calling for the head of the DCCC, who is the arm that actually is responsible for getting house members elected.

[emulatorloo]

18. and/or liberals.

The idea is we move left by something something purging liberals. Female Liberals are apparently extra special double bad.

[RiverStone]

34. I got accused of being sexist when I endorsed Tim Ryan

The fact is, as a father of a very progressive young woman and as a Huuuuuge (as Bernie says) fan of Elizabeth Warren and many other women in leadership, I'm looking at the BIG picture when I advocate for change.

I'm far more passionate about reproductive freedom than Tim, but if we keep losing to a fascist regime who wants to take away that and many more civil liberties, we as a nation will be taken back to the 1950's.

[emulatorloo]

36. I just let that stuff roll off my back. Du'ers accuse each other of lots of dumb things.

Some get super nasty if you don't 100% agree with them. I've been called lots of things I'm not lol. Don't worry about it.

[RiverStone]

41. Thanks emulatoroo!

Don't worry about it! Good advice and it's appreciated.

I wonder how we'd ALL treat each other differently if we were having this chat in person?

OK, I've been bantering on DU for 2 hours and need to kick myself in the ass to get to the gym. And, let it roll off my back.

Have a goodnight!

[La Lioness Priyanka]

14. LOL. on the one hand you guys say you want true liberals, on the other you want to kick out pelosi

for someone was antichoice till last year

[RiverStone]

20. Then tell me, what do you rec Nancy DO DIFFERENTLY to....

...and acknowledge this is NOT business as usual??? Those 63 Democratic Representatives were not just spitting into the wind.

If their 63 voices are marginalized, we will never get Bernie voters stoked up and our party will continue to lose.

Rather than nail Tim Ryan, as I accept he lost --- what should Nancy do now to inspire ALL the Dems (not just the ones who voted for her)?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

21. why do bernie voters want to replace one of the most liberal democrats with a less liberal democrat?

when you guys have been whining the whole time that the left is not left enough for you?

[dbackjon]

35. My rep is NOT liberal. She is a Blue Dog. She backed Ryan

It is the Blue Dogs, not liberals, that want Pelosi out.

Replaced by a GOP=lite

[La Lioness Priyanka]

37. Yup

[emulatorloo]

16. Crucial Lifetime Progressive Score: Moulton 74.68% Pelosi 93.79%

from ProgressivePunch.org:

"ProgressivePunch is a non-partisan searchable database of Congressional voting records, from a Progressive perspective. We show the performance of members within 160 different issue categories, along with detailed vote descriptions.

Y'all want progressive politics yet then ya'll shit on people with progressive track records. Purging liberals is not the answer.

[RiverStone]

22. What then should Nancy do differently?

There is reason behind the 63 Democratic Reps who voted for a change. I have yet to hear an acknowledgement that a new strategy is needed after getting our asses kicked. Their voices represent at least 1/3 of Dems and not recognizing this leads no place.

Besides, a Progressive Score only means shit if those who possess it can WIN! I'd rather have 75% Progressives elected than 93% losing.

Compared to the fascist-elect who will start taking away our civil liberties on January 21st, I'll settle for moderates -as long as we win!

[emulatorloo]

24. What specifically do you think Pelosi has done wrong?

She's done a good job as Democratic House Leader. Which of her duties as Dem House Leader has she failed at?

It is not her job to get Democrats elected to congress, apparently some of you are under that impression. That is not part of the job description at all.

[RiverStone]

27. It's water under the bridge now, but since you asked...

http://www.mercurynews.com/2016/11/21/herhold-nancy-pelosi-should-yield-leadership/

I accept she has won, but it does not mean we who advocated for leadership change as DEMS say fuck it. The 63 Reps voices can still be integrated into the sea change that must happen.

[emulatorloo]

32. Got it. She's old, a liberal, and not from Ohio, Michigan, or Wisconsin.

Sorry if I sound dismissive, but that's the take-away I got from the editorial

I agree that change is needed, but I reject the notion of change for change's sake.

I do expect every member of the house caucus will have a say as apparently one of her best qualities is listening to the needs of her caucus members.

[potone]

29. Saying that "impeachment was off the table,"

for Bush was one thing that I won't forgive her for, nor for sharing Obama's "let's look forward, not backward" attitude toward holding accountable those who lied us into the Iraq war, among other crimes.

I used to respect her much more than I do now. Her voting record is good, but her leadership has been weak.

[RiverStone]

38. Agree, and I remain surprised the status quo in DU land seems to favor weak leadership?

Strong no more she is (sounds like Yoda).

I'll keep fighting on, but for now will take leave of this thread and go work out at the gym.

Have a goodnight potone!

[Maru Kitteh]

25. "change" to a bigoted, anti-choice white guy who wants to embrace/win back other bigots?

Yeah fuck that, and those who would take us there for the sake of "change."

If he's not a bigot, you tell me why he found it acceptable to use the slur "dago red wine" on my TV last night while he and Tweety were having their realamurikanbluecollarwhiteguys love-in last night?

The desire to tell women what to do with their reproductive organs is on record.

That guy is an opportunistic, bigoted piece of shit.

[RiverStone]

28. And do you see the other 62 Democratic Representatives as wanting to win back bigots too?

For fuck's sake, we don't march in lock-step as DEMS.

If the change sentiment is not at least partially embraced, we will have no chance of winning back any majority in 2018. Tim lost, but it does not mean Nancy & co. move on without any regard to their voice.

[BlueMTexpat]

33. Amen!

Hi MK!

[dbackjon]

30. My Blue Dog Rep, Kyrstin Sinema, voted for Ryan

That should tell you all you need to know

[PatsFan87]

39. The problem with Nancy Pelosi is not about how she gets votes together, it's all about the optics.

As a party, we need to take a step back and understand that how something looks to other people is important. Obama is not going to be in office next year. Hillary Clinton will not be in the spotlight either. In 2018, the person Republicans will be tying Democratic house candidates to is Nancy Pelosi. Having an "elitist", establishment, "San Francisco liberal" insider coming from one of the wealthiest districts is rather tone deaf. House candidates in swing districts and Republican leaning districts will be tied to her relentlessly by their opponents and the prospect of winning the seat will be tough for them. It would have been a LOT easier being tied to someone from Ohio representing a rural rustbelt district. I mean, what can Republicans really say about that guy?