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bigtree

(85,971 posts)
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 04:50 PM Dec 2016

Michigan Election Board DENIES Trump Effort to Block Recount

Last edited Fri Dec 2, 2016, 05:30 PM - Edit history (1)

ShesOurPresident ?@MrJamesonNeat 13m13 minutes ago
Hand Recount in Michigan!
MI denied Trump's effort to block the recount & their SOS request for machine count.



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Michigan Election Board DENIES Trump Effort to Block Recount (Original Post) bigtree Dec 2016 OP
This message was self-deleted by its author pnwmom Dec 2016 #1
Yes, they are. LP2K12 Dec 2016 #4
they'll have to decide if it's in their interest to block a recount bigtree Dec 2016 #5
This message was self-deleted by its author pnwmom Dec 2016 #8
How does this square with the Attorney General's emergency suit? Farmgirl1961 Dec 2016 #2
old, if you believe the court will actually intervene bigtree Dec 2016 #7
Someone posted here that that Court is 5-2, Republican. If that's true pnwmom Dec 2016 #9
like I said above bigtree Dec 2016 #10
I sure hope you're right this time. I've stopped feeling hopeful. n/t pnwmom Dec 2016 #11
Me too Farmgirl1961 Dec 2016 #26
Don't underestimate the likelyhood of Republican Judges to jimlup Dec 2016 #35
this isn't necessarily the last recount they'll preside over bigtree Dec 2016 #36
And if they do, it will be appealed. Coyotl Dec 2016 #39
So what happens if the Supreme court splits 4-4? jimlup Dec 2016 #40
Our (MI's) supreme court has been bought and paid for by the Kock's etherealtruth Dec 2016 #16
Isn't that the truth............................... turbinetree Dec 2016 #18
K&R... spanone Dec 2016 #3
Stall, stall stall until it is too late. pangaia Dec 2016 #6
KnR Hekate Dec 2016 #12
Praise be... nt TheFrenchRazor Dec 2016 #13
since when does a Putinist like democracy? TuslaUltra Dec 2016 #14
Our voting machines are easily rigged annielion Dec 2016 #15
the higher number of non-votes is interesting bigtree Dec 2016 #23
I couldn't agree more renate Dec 2016 #29
Firsthand account of the hearing AceIsThePlace Dec 2016 #17
How do you do? Welcome to DU and THANK YOU so much for that detailed report MADem Dec 2016 #19
Thanks AceIsThePlace Dec 2016 #48
Great report, thank you. Starry Messenger Dec 2016 #21
interesting bigtree Dec 2016 #22
Michigan Supreme Court AceIsThePlace Dec 2016 #49
good take, AceIsThePlace bigtree Dec 2016 #54
Thank you for the update! Farmgirl1961 Dec 2016 #28
thank you soooooooooo much! renate Dec 2016 #30
Welcome to DU my fellow Michgander ... N_E_1 for Tennis Dec 2016 #34
Thank you AceIsThePlace Dec 2016 #50
Love this state also... N_E_1 for Tennis Dec 2016 #53
Read that Manafort Generator Dec 2016 #20
R#52 & K n/t UTUSN Dec 2016 #24
Woohoo! Take that you whiney little bitch! lonestarnot Dec 2016 #25
I only wish Stein wasn't sticking Michigan taxpayers with the bill MichMan Dec 2016 #27
priorities enid602 Dec 2016 #31
Killing Medicare will destroy the health care industry. roamer65 Dec 2016 #43
Good and bad news. lark Dec 2016 #32
Haha... trump gets denied. Let him tweet on that.. idiot Cha Dec 2016 #33
Thank you for not capitalizing his idiotic name ailsagirl Dec 2016 #37
I don't take the effort, ever. Cha Dec 2016 #41
Hangin' on ailsagirl Dec 2016 #44
No illusions whatsoever.. I have nightmares. Cha Dec 2016 #45
At least we're the majority ailsagirl Dec 2016 #46
Right.. this is just the relative calm Cha Dec 2016 #47
As predicted, of course. Big news is the hand recount. Coyotl Dec 2016 #38
Hopefully it blocks our EV's from being voted. roamer65 Dec 2016 #42
You want the entire state to get their votes thrown out? MichMan Dec 2016 #51
Never happen and that's certainly not the idea. n/t Coyotl Dec 2016 #52

Response to bigtree (Original post)

bigtree

(85,971 posts)
5. they'll have to decide if it's in their interest to block a recount
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 05:01 PM
Dec 2016

...maybe this time, but it could be a republican seeking one the next.

besides, I'd think the 'electoral college delay' argument was answered by the State Board of Canvassers in moving forward with the count. I don't think the judges would be eager to substitute their judgment for that of the election board, but you never know these days.

Response to bigtree (Reply #5)

bigtree

(85,971 posts)
7. old, if you believe the court will actually intervene
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 05:04 PM
Dec 2016

...The complaint to the court is the exact claim that was just rejected by the State board.

I don't think they have a better case with the court than they did with the State Canvassers, as to whether the count can be completed in time for the Electoral college. I just don't see a serious argument, but I'm not an expert.

pnwmom

(108,953 posts)
9. Someone posted here that that Court is 5-2, Republican. If that's true
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 05:13 PM
Dec 2016

then this could be in trouble.

This board was evenly divided and split along party lines.

bigtree

(85,971 posts)
10. like I said above
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 05:19 PM
Dec 2016

...courts normally don't jump ahead of state election decisions unless there's some clear evidence of harm.

In this case, the state appears to have confidence they can handle the recount in time. I seriously doubt the courts want to set a precedent and halt a recount, even if it benefits their party of choice, because recount efforts don't just originate from Democrats.

However, I don't really know shit because I thought Hillary would be elected president by now.

jimlup

(7,968 posts)
35. Don't underestimate the likelyhood of Republican Judges to
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 11:46 AM
Dec 2016

ignore legal decorum and vote in from partisanship.

bigtree

(85,971 posts)
36. this isn't necessarily the last recount they'll preside over
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 12:15 PM
Dec 2016

...it wouldn't be in the interest of republicans to hamstring future recounts in the state by possibly setting a restrictive precedent which might impact a republican candidate looking for votes.

 

Coyotl

(15,262 posts)
39. And if they do, it will be appealed.
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 01:13 PM
Dec 2016

Republicans also know that each stunt is another half million in donations to fund opposition lawyers.

jimlup

(7,968 posts)
40. So what happens if the Supreme court splits 4-4?
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 01:47 PM
Dec 2016

I guess the recount goes forward.

I honestly believe that there is a chance Hillary will prevail in Michigan. Small errors in Trumps favor wouldn't be a big surprise in MI's red precincts. Republicans are not fair and will always err to their side but retain plausible denial. It is fairly obvious when placed under scrutiny.

annielion

(15 posts)
15. Our voting machines are easily rigged
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 06:23 PM
Dec 2016

Since we vote on privately owned computers with secret programming, we have no idea how the voting machines counted the votes. It is easy to program a voting machines in such a way that your chosen candidate wins. I'm sure this is why Wisconsin and Michigan don't want the ballots to be hand counted.

AceIsThePlace

(4 posts)
17. Firsthand account of the hearing
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 06:58 PM
Dec 2016

I’m from Michigan and I attended the Board of State Canvassers meeting today; getting up at 05:30 to get to the 09:30 meeting in Lansing. There were about four dozen people in attendance of which about half were news people. There were nine television cameras. Trump’s team had two lawyers present and one for Stein. The meeting started a bit late and was promptly adjourned for an hour. It was punctuated by several breaks called by the Board and ran to well after lunch.

Some background. As I understand it, Michigan law states that any candidate who is on the ballot can file for a recount as long as they do so in a timely manner and pay the appropriate fee. As long as they meet those three criteria the recount is granted. The Michigan vote was certified on Monday of this week, Stein’s petition was filed on Wednesday, and the Trump campaign immediately objected. Understand that the recount was already approved and the meeting today (Friday) was to hear the objections to it.

Trumps lawyers spoke first and presented a grocery list of objections. Stein was not an “aggrieved candidate”, she would have no chance of winning in a recount, the recount would be costly, the recount would be time consuming, it would not be finished before the Electoral College vote, there have been no alleged instances of voter fraud in Michigan, and if there was a recount it had to be machine, not hand.

Stein’s lawyer spoke next and said that everything the Board had just heard meant nothing. Stein had followed the exact verbiage of Michigan law in requesting the recount and that nothing else mattered.

Representatives of several Michigan county clerk offices spoke in favor of the recount. They said there were eager to do the recount to show that their results were accurate. Trump’s continual claims of voter fraud during the campaign and his most recent comment of “millions” of illegal votes were mentioned several times. The county clerks wanted to demonstrate that there was no voter fraud. They also said that a manual recount is far easier and far faster than a machine recount, as Michigan uses scanners in most precincts.

Many Michigan voters fill out their ballot using a pen to blacken a spot next to the candidate they wish to vote for. The ballot is then fed into a scanner which tabulates it. To do a machine recount, the scanners would have to be setup again, calibrated, tested, and each ballot fed in again by hand. The clerks said it would be much simpler and faster to just look at the ballot and mark the results.

Some members of the public also spoke to say that citizens deserved a fair and honest vote tally that could be trusted, and why should there be an objection to that?

Then it came time for the board discussion and questions. The Democratic members of the board didn’t have much to say, but the Republican members peppered Stein’s lawyer with questions. One lady member in particular didn’t seem to get the idea that the granting of the recount is pretty much automatic and can’t really be objected to. The Board’s staff tried to explain this, and also said that all recounts in the history of the board have been manual where possible. The staff also said that they felt the recount could be finished in a timely manner.

The Republican members then made several motions, the most important of which was to approve the objections and stop the recount. And here’s why this meeting was pretty much an exercise in futility for Trump. The Board of State Canvassers consists of four members, two Republicans and two Democrats. Remember, that the original petition to recount was granted automatically, but the objections required a vote of the Board. The vote on each of the petitions was 2-2. A tie vote meant that the motion failed.

So each motion was voted on and failed, and as of today at 13:45 the manual recount in Michigan is approved to take place.

However… the Republican Attorney General of Michigan filed a motion with the State Supreme Court at the same time the Board hearing was taking place to stop the recount. So, that will be the next chapter in this saga.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
19. How do you do? Welcome to DU and THANK YOU so much for that detailed report
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 09:21 PM
Dec 2016

on the proceedings! I love the way they hoisted Trump on his own blabbermouthy petard!

Are you a reporter, a party functionary, or simply an engaged citizen?

Anyway, great first post!

AceIsThePlace

(4 posts)
48. Thanks
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 10:38 PM
Dec 2016

Thank you, much appreciated. It may take me awhile to get to 133,000 posts(!).

I am a semi-retired engaged citizen. I work when I want to, which gives me time to go on field trips like this.

AceIsThePlace

(4 posts)
49. Michigan Supreme Court
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 10:53 PM
Dec 2016

If Stein's lawyer was indeed correct, that Stein had followed the exact letter of the law in requesting a recount, then I don't see that the Court would intervene. The Republican Attorney General not liking the idea of a recount or thinking it's too expensive do not constitute valid legal objections.

Besides, someday the Republicans might want a recount and it sets a dangerous precedent to interfere with them.

renate

(13,776 posts)
30. thank you soooooooooo much!
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 12:40 AM
Dec 2016

I was pretty excited till that last sentence but the level of detail in your report is fantastic.

Thanks so so much, and welcome to DU!

AceIsThePlace

(4 posts)
50. Thank you
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 11:09 PM
Dec 2016

Thanks. I love Michigan. I live and work near Lake Michigan. It's very scenic and the Big Lake moderates temperature extremes so the climate is usually temperate.

Your signature quote, Iain Banks and the Culture books?

N_E_1 for Tennis

(9,661 posts)
53. Love this state also...
Sun Dec 4, 2016, 09:58 AM
Dec 2016

Winter is coming! It may be a warning to some but it marks great fun here. Kayaking in the winter is awesome.
Yes, the quote is from the great late Iain Banks. It is the name of an AI ship from "Matter" I do believe. It just seemed to fit my beliefs and personality.

 

Generator

(7,770 posts)
20. Read that Manafort
Fri Dec 2, 2016, 09:23 PM
Dec 2016

Mr. Big Putin guy had told orangehitler to focus on Michigan at the last minute. So smells like old fish to me.

MichMan

(11,864 posts)
27. I only wish Stein wasn't sticking Michigan taxpayers with the bill
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 12:03 AM
Dec 2016

My only issue is why Stein will only be paying 25% off the estimated cost of the recount with the individual counties being responsible for the remainder.

If after this is over she walks away with a few extra million in her pocket, there are going to be a lot of people in Michigan very angry when our counties have to make cuts to pay for it.

enid602

(8,591 posts)
31. priorities
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 12:49 AM
Dec 2016

Just think how much more the good citizens of MI will lose if Il Douche 'phases out' Medicare in early Spring, as he announced the day before yesterday on television.

roamer65

(36,744 posts)
43. Killing Medicare will destroy the health care industry.
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 05:45 PM
Dec 2016

I know our local hospitals depend on it for over 50 pct of their revenue.

That's a LOT of jobs.

lark

(23,059 posts)
32. Good and bad news.
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 10:23 AM
Dec 2016

Good - count going forward based on their own evidence of funny #;s
Bad - recount by machine.

ailsagirl

(22,883 posts)
44. Hangin' on
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 06:19 PM
Dec 2016

I don't have any illusions about that clod-- it won't "somehow turn out alright" because, as far as I can tell, he contaminates everything he touches



PS I love your "OBAMA is My President Until Further Notice"

Amen-- that's how I feel

 

Coyotl

(15,262 posts)
38. As predicted, of course. Big news is the hand recount.
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 01:10 PM
Dec 2016

At least with the hand recount we have a recount.

MichMan

(11,864 posts)
51. You want the entire state to get their votes thrown out?
Sat Dec 3, 2016, 11:19 PM
Dec 2016

I know we are all hoping Hillary could win, but if she doesn't find 10K votes to change the outcome, you are hoping the entire state gets their votes thrown out ? Wow

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