Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

progressoid

(49,825 posts)
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:20 PM Dec 2016

Jeez Michigan. What the Fuck?

Half of Detroit votes may be ineligible for recount

...

Michigan’s largest county voted overwhelmingly for Democratic candidate Hillary Clinton, but officials couldn’t reconcile vote totals for 610 of 1,680 precincts during a countywide canvass of vote results late last month.

Most of those are in heavily Democratic Detroit, where the number of ballots in precinct poll books did not match those of voting machine printout reports in 59 percent of precincts, 392 of 662.

According to state law, precincts whose poll books don’t match with ballots can’t be recounted. If that happens, original election results stand.

...

Republican President-elect Donald Trump won Michigan by a razor-thin margin, 10,704 votes. Presumably, Clinton’s best opportunity to eliminate that margin rested in finding uncounted ballots in Wayne County, which she carried by a 2-1 ratio.

Disqualifying huge numbers of precincts would make it “almost impossible” for the former New York senator to make up the votes, said Ernest Johnson, a Democratic political activist who worked to get out the vote for Clinton.

“It’s a real long-shot now because, if I were looking for 10,000 votes, the first place I’d look is Wayne County,” Johnson said. “That’s a huge problem. ... But if anything good comes of this it brings up this problem (with voting machines) that needs to be corrected.”

...http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2016/12/05/recount-unrecountable/95007392/
15 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies

MichMan

(11,789 posts)
4. Who are you protesting against ?
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:43 PM
Dec 2016

Go ahead and protest elected Democratic officials in those counties that are in charge of recruiting and training election workers . Probably will get a lot of Trump supporters to join you .

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
5. Protesting against the use of an easily hacked system is not a "who."
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:46 PM
Dec 2016

Protesting against the use of an easily hacked system is not a "who," regardless of whether you petulantly want Trump supporters to assist or not...

dumbcat

(2,120 posts)
14. What is your evidence they were "hacked"
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 06:27 PM
Dec 2016

and not just the result of normal human error? (Especially by maybe poorly trained humans.)

hurple

(1,304 posts)
2. I say...
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:39 PM
Dec 2016

And, call it extreme if you like, but I propose we hit them hard and hit them fast with a major - and I mean major - leaflet campaign.

MichMan

(11,789 posts)
3. Not a conspiracy
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:40 PM
Dec 2016

Incompetent or poorly trained election workers. Unfortunately it appears that while this can occur in isolated examples in countries across the state, it was more prevalent in Wayne county (Detroit)and Genesee County (Flint)

While conspiracy advocates would love to blame Republicans, both of these counties have been run by Democrats for decades . This includes the County Clerks that oversee elections. They need to be held accountable by voters in the next election. Nobody usually pays any attention to these offices until something goes wrong

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
7. A premise lacking any verifiable, objective or supporting evidence
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:47 PM
Dec 2016

"Incompetent or poorly trained election workers..."

A premise lacking any verifiable, objective or supporting evidence is little more than a bumper-sticker.

jmg257

(11,996 posts)
8. "Incompetent or poorly trained..." vs. shitty machines..
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:50 PM
Dec 2016
"Eighty-seven of Wayne County’s decade-old voting machines broke on election day, according to Detroit’s elections director, Daniel Baxter. He told the Detroit News, which first reported the story, that ballot scanners often jammed when polling place workers were trying to operate them. Every time a jammed ballot was removed and reinserted, he suspects the machine may have re-counted it."

MichMan

(11,789 posts)
10. Why so many in just a couple counties?
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 06:19 PM
Dec 2016

All the other counties using the same or similar machines made sure that the counter was reset and the vote totals matched the poll books or could explain any discrepancies. There were isolated instances of issues with one or two occasions in a few other counties. Wayne County had issues in hundreds of precincts and just turned it in with no explanation.
L
The people complaining the most around the metro Detroit area are Trump supporters who believe that the same ballot was run through several times giving Hillary extra votes. They think not recounting is proof that fraud was committed and nothing is being done

progressoid

(49,825 posts)
9. Not saying its a conspiracy.
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:50 PM
Dec 2016

But it is very sloppy and incompetent. Regardless of what party is in charge.

jmg257

(11,996 posts)
6. Seems as long as the number of actual ballots square with the numbers issued per the poll books
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 05:47 PM
Dec 2016

a hand recount should be possible. They know what the issues were, so can explain the machines mis-matching.
Don't see the issue here (other then media running with doom and gloom?).



"There are three vote totals: the total number of votes the electronic ballot scanners report; the total number of people who signed the electoral roll, or “poll book”; and the total number of paper ballots filled out and stored in sealed containers. The poll books and the electronic ballot scanners do not match, so the paper ballots will be counted by hand. If hand-tallied ballots can’t resolve all the mismatches, the votes will stand in the counties where the errors remain.


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/05/us-election-recount-michigan-donald-trump-hillary-clinton?utm_source=esp&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=GU+Today+USA+-+morning+briefing+2016&utm_term=202998&subid=17536001&CMP=ema_a-morning-briefing_b-morning-briefing_c-US_d-1

ThoughtCriminal

(14,011 posts)
15. This would seem to violate equal protection
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 07:51 PM
Dec 2016

Which was a key rational in Bush v Gore. But then there was a reason the majority justices threw in that "Not a precedent" clause - They seemed to be worried that it might be used by a Democrat someday.

Voters in precincts that have buggy machines or sloppy election workers get disenfranchised vs other voters in the state.

And isn't it just grand that suspect vote count results in itself disqualifies those precincts from a recount? It's like saying if the cash in the register doesn't add up, don't recount it.


BSdetect

(8,989 posts)
13. Yes America, you need to send this type of denmocracy abroad.
Tue Dec 6, 2016, 06:23 PM
Dec 2016

This is what the world needs?

Fucking laughable BS election process full of ridiculous State anomalies.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Jeez Michigan. What the ...