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portlander23

(2,078 posts)
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 11:09 AM Dec 2016

Opdycke: All voters should be eligible to vote in all elections, including primaries

Can the Democratic Party become a voice for democracy?
John Opdycke
The Hill

Sen. Bernie Sanders, who is playing a vocal role in the DNC Chair election, spent the last months of the presidential primary describing in detail how the system is rigged. He lambasted closed primaries that excluded independents, the super delegate system, and the tilted playing field. But since endorsing Hillary Clinton, he has put less emphasis on the need for a structural overhaul.

Virginia Delegate Sam Rasoul recently made statewide news after resigning as Treasurer of the Democratic caucus and declaring that the Democratic Party wasn’t going far enough to build trust with the American people. He recently told me, “I love our platform. That’s not the problem. When we say we are the ‘party of the people’ but then we defend a political system that excludes millions of people from voting in primaries, why should people trust us? I think people have lost trust with both parties but that lack of trust is a bigger issue for Democrats because the gap between our rhetoric and our actions is wider. Nobody will believe us on the issues if we don’t start telling the truth about our broken political process.”

The American people are distressed by the decline in our world standing, by the growing gap between rich and poor, and by the lack of a level playing field in politics. A recent poll by pollster Pat Caddell showed that 67 percent of Americans believe that the real struggle in our country is not between left and right but between the ruling political elites and the rest of the country. American democracy needs to be overhauled to address the gap between insiders and outsiders. All voters should be eligible to vote in all elections, including primaries. Districts should be drawn fairly, not to serve party interests. State legislatures, Congress, and the Federal Election Commission should not be controlled by party caucuses and special interests.

The Democratic Party has an opportunity to become a voice for democracy. That means building a more inclusive political process. It may also mean giving up some short term privileges. But by dedicating itself to rebuilding our democracy, the Democratic Party has a real chance to reverse its fortune and help our country move forward in the process.


I know this won't be popular to say here, but Opdycke is correct. We like to think of party primaries as playing a role akin to a first-pass vote and the general as quasi run-off where the strongest candidates run.

As we saw in 2016, the primary process on the Democratic side didn't produce the strongest candidate with the widest support, and on the Republican side produced a disaster. When you consider not the percentage of actual voters, but the percentage of Trump voters out of all possible voters, Trump was elected by 27% of the eligible voting population. Clinton got 28.5%. That's not exactly a representative democracy.

When you take a look at the primaries, again assuming percentage of voters out of all citizens able to vote in 2016, Trump was selected by 6% of the voting population and Clinton was selected by 7%. Given this, it's not hard to see why somewhere around 90 million people didn't even bother to vote.

I understand the position of only allowing Democrats to vote in Democratic primaries, but if the assumption is that the Party is so fragile that allowing too many people to vote in a primary would destroy the Party, then the Party is in serious trouble.
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Opdycke: All voters should be eligible to vote in all elections, including primaries (Original Post) portlander23 Dec 2016 OP
I supported Bernie in the primaries and voted for Hillary in the general. libtodeath Dec 2016 #1
You lost me at... yallerdawg Dec 2016 #2
+1... SidDithers Dec 2016 #7
YOU BETTER BELIEVE IT! nt JTFrog Dec 2016 #3
What about republicans crossing over to screw up our primary? MichMan Dec 2016 #4
That's a fair point portlander23 Dec 2016 #5
Also think crossovers by Democrats won the primary for Snyder MichMan Dec 2016 #9
I'm less concerned about crossovers than I am about lack of participation portlander23 Dec 2016 #10
Kill The Caucus Then otohara Dec 2016 #11
+1,000,000 JHan Dec 2016 #13
We should do away with caucuses portlander23 Dec 2016 #14
Nope. You may like foxes in your henhouses, but I think it is stupid to lead them into mine. Squinch Dec 2016 #6
Absolutely not. Primaries are for party members to choose who will represent them. NYC Liberal Dec 2016 #8
I have met and like Keith Ellison but I do not support his bid for DNC chair Gothmog Dec 2016 #12
Plus 1000 JustAnotherGen Dec 2016 #16
No - disagree JustAnotherGen Dec 2016 #15

libtodeath

(2,888 posts)
1. I supported Bernie in the primaries and voted for Hillary in the general.
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 11:12 AM
Dec 2016

She won by 3 million votes.
There was nothing wrong with our candidates.

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
2. You lost me at...
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 11:29 AM
Dec 2016

"the Democratic side didn't produce the strongest candidate with the widest support..."

Senator Sanders (I-VT) never had to run as a Democrat, and could have at anytime left "the corruption of the Democratic Party primaries" and the tyrannical impositions of the monstrous Debbie Wasserman Shultz and run as the independent he was.

He never stuck his neck out, did he?

No, what he did was weaken our nominee and give major, repeated talking points to the freakin' nut job he helped put in office.

Thanks for delivering the Rust Belt, Bernie.

SidDithers

(44,228 posts)
7. +1...
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 11:56 AM
Dec 2016

Especially this part:

No, what he did was weaken our nominee and give major, repeated talking points to the freakin' nut job he helped put in office.




Sid

MichMan

(11,858 posts)
4. What about republicans crossing over to screw up our primary?
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 11:39 AM
Dec 2016

I am not in favor of open primaries because it is too easy for an opposing party with an incumbent to cross over and sabotage our primary by voting for the weakest candidate

 

portlander23

(2,078 posts)
5. That's a fair point
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 11:46 AM
Dec 2016

And certainly one with historical evidence. Republican voters were able to interfere in the Michigan primary in 1972 and select George Wallace. While that was an embarrassment, I don't think it changed the outcome of the primary at the national level.

I'm sympathetic to this, but I have to think given the extremely low participation in primaries that opening it up to more voters is going to counteract aberrations like this.

MichMan

(11,858 posts)
9. Also think crossovers by Democrats won the primary for Snyder
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 12:25 PM
Dec 2016

I am convinced that Democratic voters crossing over in the Republican primary in Michigan in 2010 was what gave Rick Snyder the nomination and eventually the win.

Governor Granholm was term limited and with the recession hitting Michigan so hard, it was clear that it would be a Republican in office in 2010. Her Lt Governor, John Cherry declined to run and the only one that stepped up was Lansing mayor Virg Bernero along with speaker Andy Dillon.

Snyder, a relatively unknown businessman with no political experience, won the Republican primary over several others in a surprise upset. Polling indicated that a significant number of Democratic voters crossed over in an attempt to knock out the Republican favorites, US Rep Peter Hoekstra and Mich AG Mike Cox.

Snyder won the primary and defeated Bernero in the general election. The consequences of that would have major ramifications for the state during his term, so these "spoiler" crossover votes in primaries can sometimes have unintended consequences.

I don't know if any Dems crossed over and voted for Trump after Bernie withdrew believing Trump was a joke and would easily lose to Clinton. I imagine there were quite a few and they will have to live with their decision.

 

portlander23

(2,078 posts)
10. I'm less concerned about crossovers than I am about lack of participation
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 12:29 PM
Dec 2016

If you look at the numbers, very small numbers of people are participating in primaries. I'm less concerned about the small percentage of the voters who voted in GOP primaries trying to screw over the small percentage of voters who vote in Democratic primaries. The problem, especially in 2016, was the entire populace was presented with the two least popular candidates in history and 90 million people stayed home.

More people voting is going to benefit Democrats, not Republicans.

 

otohara

(24,135 posts)
11. Kill The Caucus Then
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 12:51 PM
Dec 2016

if you're so concerned about people participating just kill the caucus. I read a Twitter post the other day by a Sanders supporter that said he won in a landslide in Maine. Only 4000 people caucused in Maine and in my blue progressive state Colorado only 127,000 participated in this ridiculous antiquated voter suppressing mess.

Problem solved - lots more participate - in my state a million more would have participated.

Thank God we voted to rid CO of the caucus system - nobody was happy and Hillary would have won had there been a primary as she did in Washington state.

NYC Liberal

(20,134 posts)
8. Absolutely not. Primaries are for party members to choose who will represent them.
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 11:58 AM
Dec 2016

Why should Republicans get to choose who represents us in the election?

Gothmog

(144,833 posts)
12. I have met and like Keith Ellison but I do not support his bid for DNC chair
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 01:03 PM
Dec 2016

I do not want a Sanders supporter to be DNC chair. I also believe that the Democratic Party needs to eliminate caucuses and hold closed primaries

JustAnotherGen

(31,769 posts)
15. No - disagree
Tue Dec 27, 2016, 01:48 PM
Dec 2016

There are others parties bettter suited to them - and they should grow their own belief system within those parties. I.E. if Democratic Socialism and the Green Party ran candidates in every election - from the dog catcher to the county clerk - they could grow their base.

They wimp out unless its the White House. Note this is the Democratic Underground and I only support Democratics here.

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