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DonViejo

(60,536 posts)
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 12:51 PM Dec 2016

Ex-Nixon lawyer: Trump can't stop lying - even on rare times when he knows what he's talking about

Richard Nixon’s former lawyer is accusing President-elect Donald Trump of constantly lying to the American people.

John Dean, who served as White House Counsel to the former president and was directly involved in the Watergate scandal, says he’s troubled by Trump’s lack of knowledge and penchant for lies.

"It is deeply troubling when you realize that the president-elect generally does not know what he is talking about,” Dean tweeted.

“And when he does he lies.”

more
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/312179-nixons-lawyer-accuses-trump-of-lying

21 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Ex-Nixon lawyer: Trump can't stop lying - even on rare times when he knows what he's talking about (Original Post) DonViejo Dec 2016 OP
Trump "ain't right" as they say. He can't tell fact from fantasy on a good day. Vinca Dec 2016 #1
dementia for sure. so many here recognize the signs. mopinko Dec 2016 #4
I think it's entirely too glib to blame his lying on dementia. PoindexterOglethorpe Dec 2016 #5
"he's the sort of narcissist for whom others are not completely real"" milestogo Dec 2016 #9
I'm a nurse who has worked with dementia tavernier Dec 2016 #6
The difference between a sociopath and a psychopath are important. dixiegrrrrl Dec 2016 #11
A very distinct difference. Thank you tavernier Dec 2016 #12
I was never, not once, bored...lol. dixiegrrrrl Dec 2016 #17
The only saving grace seems to be tavernier Dec 2016 #19
Will the GOP see him as demented and proceed to remove him? RiverStone Dec 2016 #18
He has been the same flaming idiot... awoke_in_2003 Dec 2016 #13
it would be VERY interesting to hear Laura PourMeADrink Dec 2016 #21
yes it is troubling that we have such a sick person barbtries Dec 2016 #2
Liar-in-Chief Trump, the FOX listeners are trained to have lies told to them, they are pros at Thinkingabout Dec 2016 #3
Wow! Jacob Boehme Dec 2016 #7
His own lawyers won't meet with him one-on-one gratuitous Dec 2016 #8
I've known people like that PatSeg Dec 2016 #10
Can we just get rid of him already? smirkymonkey Dec 2016 #14
I'm with you. triron Dec 2016 #15
At this point I'd take G-Dub back, anyone but this idiot rbrnmw Dec 2016 #16
The republicans can't win without lying, cheating, and stealing. Initech Dec 2016 #20

Vinca

(50,261 posts)
1. Trump "ain't right" as they say. He can't tell fact from fantasy on a good day.
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 12:53 PM
Dec 2016

I don't know if we're seeing the onset of senile dementia or if he's just generic batshit crazy, but I think he's the first POTUS who should have the Oval Office lined with rubber mats.

mopinko

(70,077 posts)
4. dementia for sure. so many here recognize the signs.
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 01:31 PM
Dec 2016

there have been maaaannnnnyyyy posts about how much this looks like dementia to folks here who have lived it.
especially the shift to being conservative after being a liberal all his life. common as mud in the dementia wing.
same w loosening of social norms. not that he ever really adhered to them, but now he just cant even comprehend them.

PoindexterOglethorpe

(25,841 posts)
5. I think it's entirely too glib to blame his lying on dementia.
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 02:45 PM
Dec 2016

While I am certainly no expert, although I've been around the occasional elderly relative with dementia, he's had this pattern of lying for as long as anyone can tell. It's not at all anything new.

I've also on occasion known someone who can be characterized as a pathological liar (not sure if there's such a diagnosis, but there's the definition out there) who lies compulsively about nearly everything and doesn't seem completely aware he's doing it. I've also known people who lie about things (like being able to obtain tickets to a Superbowl game) that are really stupid to lie about, but they do it anyway.

I'm sure most people here have likewise known people like this.

People with dementia, so far as I can tell, don't lie about stuff. They can't remember things, and may go through a time when they will make up stuff, but they don't do it in anything resembling the way Trump does. For him, reality is created by what he says. I suspect he's the sort of narcissist for whom others are not completely real. A bit like someone who is very autistic, except he's obviously not at all autistic.

There also seems to be reason to think he's functionally illiterate, or, even if he has good reading skills, he never reads anything. Possibly not even the contracts he signs, let alone books, newspapers, or magazines. What information he absorbs comes to him through Twitter and perhaps some other social media and what those around him tell him. The concept of fact-checking is totally alien to him.

If he had dementia he'd probably be easier to deal with. It seems fairly obvious that Reagan was well on his way into Alzheimer's the last years of his administration, and everyone around him simply protected him and spoke for him. Trump has no problems speaking for himself, and he has nearly zero acquaintance with truth or reality.

milestogo

(16,829 posts)
9. "he's the sort of narcissist for whom others are not completely real""
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 03:04 PM
Dec 2016

Correct - we are like cartoon characters to him.

tavernier

(12,377 posts)
6. I'm a nurse who has worked with dementia
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 02:48 PM
Dec 2016

patients for 40 years.

Trump's symptoms are those of a sociopath. He is demented, but not from Alzheimer's.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
11. The difference between a sociopath and a psychopath are important.
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 08:03 PM
Dec 2016

I am retired from Mental Health field.
It is quite too common that sociopath and psychopath are used interchangeably, but the difference is important.
The key difference appears as control versus lack of control of behavior, or impulsivity.

The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) is the standard in diagnosing mental health problems,

The common features of a psychopath and sociopath lie in their shared diagnosis — antisocial personality disorder.
The DSM-51 defines antisocial personality as someone have 3 or more of the following traits:

Regularly breaks or flouts the law
Constantly lies and deceives others
Is impulsive and doesn’t plan ahead
Can be prone to fighting and aggressiveness
Has little regard for the safety of others
Irresponsible, can’t meet financial obligations
Doesn’t feel remorse or guilt

Psychology researchers generally believe that psychopaths tends to be born — it’s likely a genetic predisposition — while sociopaths tend to be made by their environment. (Which is not to say that psychopaths may not also suffer from some sort of childhood trauma.) Psychopathy might be related to physiological brain differences. Research has shown psychopaths have underdeveloped components of the brain commonly thought to be responsible for emotion regulation and impulse control.

Psychopaths, in general, have a hard time forming real emotional attachments with others.
Instead, they form artificial, shallow relationships designed to be manipulated in a way that most benefits the psychopath.
People are seen as pawns to be used to forward the psychopath’s goals.
Psychopaths rarely feel guilt regarding any of their behaviors, no matter how much they hurt others.

But psychopaths can often be seen by others as being charming and trustworthy, holding steady, normal jobs.
Some even have families and seemingly-loving relationships with a partner.
While they tend to be well-educated, they may also have learned a great deal on their own.

When a psychopath engages in criminal behavior, they tend to do so in a way that minimizes risk to themselves.
They will carefully plan criminal activity to ensure they don’t get caught, having contingency plans in place for every possibility.

( Ted Bundy, classic case)

Sociopaths, in general, tend to be more impulsive and erratic in their behavior than their psychopath counterparts.
While also having difficulties in forming attachments to others, some sociopaths may be able to form an attachment to a like-minded group or person.
Unlike psychopaths, most sociopaths don’t hold down long-term jobs or present much of a normal family life to the outside world.

When a sociopath engages in criminal behavior, they may do so in an impulsive and largely unplanned manner, with little regard for the risks or consequences of their actions.
They may become agitated and angered easily, sometimes resulting in violent outbursts.
These kinds of behaviors increase a sociopath’s chances of being apprehended.
http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2015/02/12/differences-between-a-psychopath-vs-sociopath/


Trump is cold and calculating and knows enough to act mostly civilized. Throw in his narcissism, and there he is.
Sadly, he is, from all accounts, teaching his 10 year son the same way he taught his older sons, to be like him.


Might I just add....psychopaths are not common, compared to sociopaths, who get into the legal and mental health systems more often because of their out of control behavior, and frequent use of drugs and alcohol.
Trump has often been quoted as saying he has never used mind altering chemicals, and that makes sense for him.
He also has been quoted as needing little sleep, that he lies awake at night planning revenge.



tavernier

(12,377 posts)
12. A very distinct difference. Thank you
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 08:37 PM
Dec 2016

for the detailed comparison.

My work has been with people suffering from dementias, including Alzheimer's, which in my experience manifests very differently from most senile or drug related dementias. Sadly they are often thrown into the same laundry basket, one patient treated the same as the next.

My point was that I do not see Trump as having senile dementia or Alzheimer's, based only on my experience with the poor souls who do.

Kudos to you for your life's work. It couldn't have been easy, also knowing that none of us wish to have a child born with this type of mental disturbance.

Sadly, some grow up to be in positions of great power.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
17. I was never, not once, bored...lol.
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 09:11 PM
Dec 2016

Also sadly, is that he is breeding more like him. Both his adult sons are pretty much the same as he is.

tavernier

(12,377 posts)
19. The only saving grace seems to be
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 10:57 PM
Dec 2016

that like the psycho personalities in the past, they are soon outed, discovered by ppl who are sane. Unfortunately, in the mean time, they tend to tentacle with similar ppl with similar personality problems.

The strangest part is that it is almost biblical that history wants to repeat itself with the same crazies at the helm.

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
21. it would be VERY interesting to hear
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 11:28 PM
Dec 2016

From someone who has known him well all along. Like if he had changed. Have thought it odd that someone who is so absolutely evil and insane could have amassed such a fortune and pulled off Apprentice while acting so kind of normal. At least we the public never heard any horror stories

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
3. Liar-in-Chief Trump, the FOX listeners are trained to have lies told to them, they are pros at
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 01:09 PM
Dec 2016

receiving lies, the rest of us not so much, we know if Trump's lips are moving he is lying.

gratuitous

(82,849 posts)
8. His own lawyers won't meet with him one-on-one
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 02:55 PM
Dec 2016

His lawyers always have meetings with Trump in pairs, so that they have two witnesses to whatever was discussed. That should tell folks how trustworthy Trump is, but apparently it doesn't.

PatSeg

(47,399 posts)
10. I've known people like that
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 03:35 PM
Dec 2016

Lying is their default mode, even when the truth is easier and actually serves them better. They've become so used to fabricating stories, they are often unable to tell the truth. If their stories become too absurd, they just double down and lie even more. They often throw in phrases like, "I swear to god" or "Its the god's honest truth" or "You can ask so-and-so", which is usually a give-away. Trump uses the phrase, "Believe me" or "You better believe it" a lot.

If Trump tells the truth, it is usually an accident.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
14. Can we just get rid of him already?
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 08:54 PM
Dec 2016

It's obvious that he is a complete catastrophe. Is there nobody with the power to just put an end to this?

Initech

(100,063 posts)
20. The republicans can't win without lying, cheating, and stealing.
Fri Dec 30, 2016, 11:00 PM
Dec 2016

Someone who worked for Nixon should definitely know this!

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