If Michael Flynn isnt fired over Russia tomorrow, it means Donald Trump is going down with him

[flamingdem]

** The Palmer Report might be right! You never know. Many are coming to the same conclusion not just Palmer. Seems like they are both stupid. Drunk with power they thought they could do anything. Plus, the Russians knew how to engage with their simplistic personalities and some form of brainwashing, or at least the use of psychology as weapon must have occurred.

http://www.palmerreport.com/opinion/michael-flynn-isnt-fired-russia-tomorrow-means-donald-trump-going/1507/

So tomorrow is the moment of truth. If Donald Trump doesn’t fire Michael Flynn, it’ll be because he’s concluded that Flynn would retaliate by revealing Trump’s own involvement in the Russia scandal. In such case, Trump will be choosing to keep an obviously guilty Flynn in the fold just to keep him quiet awhile longer. If Flynn is still employed by end of business on Monday, it means Trump is guilty. And at the rate the intel community is moving against Flynn, it’ll be just a matter of time before they’re both taken down.

It’s now Sunday night. Donald Trump is back in the White House after his ill timed Florida vacation. The weekend headlines have been dominated by the Russia scandal, which he had surely been hoping had gone away. The current controversy all centers around National Security Advisor Michael T. Flynn, a guy Trump doesn’t even like, and who could easily be scapegoated. So if Flynn isn’t fired tomorrow, it’ll mean that Trump can’t fire him – which will mean that Trump is going down with him.

Real News. Fake President.

To underscore how much of a liability Flynn has suddenly become, he’s been caught lying about having colluded with the Russian ambassador before and after Election Day, meaning that the current sanctions revelation is just the tip of the iceberg; eventually we’ll see headlines about how Flynn definitively colluded with Russia to rig the election. And Mike Pence has now been dragged into the scandal, because he previously vouched for Flynn that the sanctions had not been discussed with Russia – and now Pence’s office is implying that Flynn lied to him. On top of it all, Trump’s own newly appointed CIA Director Mike Pompeo has responded by denying security clearance yesterday for Flynn’s top deputy. The entire Trump administration, sans Trump himself, is now trying to march Flynn immediately to the door.

Impeach Trump Now

And so now we’re about to find out how deep this scandal runs. If Michael Flynn was a mole who with the Russian government to rig the election on Donald Trump’s behalf, and the conspiracy didn’t rise any higher than Flynn, then Trump can simply fire him tomorrow and push the entire Russia scandal back to the backburner for awhile. But if Flynn was acting on Trump’s orders or with Trump’s knowledge, or if another key Trump advisor such as Steve Bannon was pulling Flynn’s strings on Russia, then that means Trump can’t fire Flynn – because Flynn knows everything.

[leftstreet]

1. Sunday PM, and no Fireside Tweets from Trump?

DURec

[flamingdem]

2. He's with the Russian bagman in Florida

That is an example of how power drunk they are - he's there along with Flynn and flew in from Russia to "play golf" - this guy is a Russian oligarch and he bought Trumps run down mansion worth some 30 million for 95 million.. nothing to see here..

[BadgerMom]

34. Right?!

I know this is overused and shopworn since 11/9/16, but I feel like I'm living in some other dimension. Effing oligarch flies in for golf with US security chief and President and the news media is MIA! WT ACTUAL F!

[volstork]

21. oh, c'mon

he won't get fired up until 3AM EST

[TrekLuver]

3. Maybe he had Phlegm sign a Non disclosure agreement. LOL

[flamingdem]

4. LOL! He's that dumb

Mr. Businessman yeah

[trueblue2007]

5. Is there any way HILLARY would be put in as President ???

[regnaD kciN]

10. No.

It'll be Pence -- unless he can be impeached as well for some unknown cause. But then, next in line are Ryan, McConnell, and Tillotson, followed by other members of Cheeto Benito's cabinet.

Like it or not, we're going to be led by a conservative Republican for the next four years. If we're lucky, at least the one we get won't be mentally-unstable.

[Blue Idaho]

16. Unknown Cause?

Try willing co-conspirator... even then as you say we'll be stuck with that knucklehead Paul Ryan... the most we could hope for is a totally neutered administration and a congress that can't find its ass with both hands...

[meadowlander]

24. Only possible other scenario

is Dems get supermajorities in the house, senate and governorships in 2018 and introduce a crisis of confidence bill that would move up the 2020 elections but I would imagine that would require very significant proof of systemic Russian infiltration of the republican party and would probably also require a constitutional amendment.

[flamingdem]

35. We need a parliamentary system

I like the vote of confidence idea

[former9thward]

54. Which would have meant Bill Clinton would have been tossed after 2 years.

When the Republicans took over in 94. Yeah, that would be brill ant.

[meadowlander]

80. Well,

another election would have been called and Clinton would have won again because his approval ratings actually went up through the whole impeachment shenanigans. And once he was reelected and had the mandate again, he could have told Ken Starr to f off.

You can craft the rule to avoid partisanship to some extent - for example requiring 75% of the Senate to vote for it.

That way it would provide a pathway during a obvious constitutional crisis like the present one, but wouldn't be as open to abuse when things are merely partisan.

[former9thward]

84. '94 elections were long before the impeachment stuff.

Clinton was at a low point after the healthcare debacle. I don't think there is any "constitutional crisis" but that's me.

[meadowlander]

85. I think there is a constitutional crisis

to the extent that there is significant evidence that the election was tampered with to some extent by a foreign government, there is good reason to suspect that the President is compromised by that government, but because the President's party won a majority of seats in the House and Senate (possibly also as a result of the same tampering) there is no constitutional mechanism to remove that President from office for four full years no matter what his actions are and no matter what percent of the American public think he should be impeached.

Most governments using the Westminster system have the ability for parliament to introduce a vote of no confidence when they think that their leader has lost the ability to govern effectively as a result of some scandal or other. If the vote passes, the election moves up.

If an opposition party tries it against a President who is actually reasonably popular, it can backfire against them. Lots of people don't like parties that play politics by constantly trying to oust the government and will vote to keep the sitting leader unless the situation has really become untenable. And if the leader is brought back by a significant margin, it sends a message to the opposition party to stop whining and get back to work.

[CrispyQ]

76. Such a depressing post.

My friends don't see how dire it is. They think if we get rid of Trump, all is well.

[thejoker123]

6. Agreed unless...

Trump has all kinds of shit on Flynn to keep him quiet.

In general these guys are basically the mob. You're in for life for obvious reasons. I'd be surprised if Trump fires him.

[meow2u3]

18. If the Feds can turn mobsters against one another

It should be a piece of cake for them to turn Flynn against Cheato Benito and co. if the price is right.

[lagomorph777]

67. Not necessary. Cheato uses a hackable phone.

Not that it matters; NSA has everything on everybody.

[AgadorSparticus]

7. I hope to god there is truth to this. I just can't wrap my brain around the fact that

This MUCH would go unaccounted.

[Hortensis]

44. Palmer Report is a FAKE NEWS site that just like those

on the right specializes in twisting, misleading and inflaming.

88 recs for a Palmer piece and counting on DU? Really???

Attempts to use people as fools are no more admirable from the left than from the right. And DUers are supposed to be more aware than most.

[CabalPowered]

45. Agreed

PR is not a trustworthy site.

[AgadorSparticus]

61. Ugh. There should be a rule about posting fake news on DU

[Hortensis]

62. A balancing act, right? These sites usually contain pieces

without much, occasionally nothing, to complain about. Making a site appear acceptable to its targets is important to the process of slipping lies into the national dialogue.

[flamingdem]

73. People speculating on the internet is not the same as FAKE NEWS

Let's work our analytical skills here, this is not an attempt to deceive

[Hortensis]

74. Yes, this site really is. It iand the other are attempts

to develop him into a left-wing power figure by a developing a following who turn to these sites for "alternative truth," otherwise known as what's "really" happening.

Visitors will probably be fine as long as they run everything by people respected by respectable people in their fields. They don't have to be employed by MSM. But that's a LOT of unnecessary work, and I strongly suggest identifying honest sources and just going straight to them.

[JI7]

8. would Putin allow him to get rid of Flynn ?

[pkdu]

9. Retweeted by Louise Mensch in past hour...

Things are starting to heat up for Mike Flynn. 4 reports dropping tonight (from WSJ, NYT, WaPo, Politico) cc: @LouiseMensch

[flamingdem]

11. She's right leaning but seems to know what's up

Also John Schindler, Malcomn Nance and the most fun today:

https://twitter.com/Khanoisseur

Link to tweet

[Bernardo de La Paz]

12. Trump has a very important day tomorrow meeting Justin Trudeau, Prime Minister of Canada.

The US biggest trading partner, trade balance with Canada is favorable to the US.

39 states have Canada as their biggest trading partner.

Departmental Secretary meetings with the Defense Minister, Finance Minister, and Foreign Minister have gone well.

[flamingdem]

13. So that means he can't tweet all night

and he must feel deprived.

[ElementaryPenguin]

14. Exactly! Flynn and Bannon were political liabilities but they know what Trump did...

So he's been married to both of them. There's actually a way in which Flynn could receive the death penalty, and could be singing like a bird about Trump's involvement in order to spare his own life!

NO OTHER TRUMP STORY SHOULD BE COVERED AT THIS JUNCTURE!!

The press and the public should not let the Drumpf Administration change the subject! They HAVE to go down over this - or this nation is truly a goner!

[flamingdem]

15. Something has got to break

What starts the unraveling..

[jannyd65]

58. I agree...

Now, I am not a lawyer or, associated with law enforcement-just a person who is looking and connecting the dots.

With that, let me say this-I believe that all of this nonsense is being investigated. IF what I believe is true, there could be a small group of people who are investigating these ties to Russia. When you are not hearing things in public, it does not necessarily mean that things have gone unnoticed-it means that finding trusted sources and gathering evidence takes time.

And again, IF there is an investigation, we have to understand that the people who are conducting these investigations have to go through irregular channels now. They do not know they can trust in this administration, so these investigators have to probably proceed with a LOT of care and precaution. I know it was posted on here that one Russian informant may have been compromised-so I can see that things need to progress slowly, to gather information and make a case.

It may not be tomorrow, it may not even be this year, but I do believe something will break and to quote the orange tyrant-it will be "YUGE!"

[manicraven]

38. Agree! The media needs to chomp down on this story and not let go.

[world wide wally]

17. Trump must be in emergency meetings wth Putin all day about this.

He hasn't even tweeted about SNL

[missingfink]

19. Flynn isn't going anywhere

I am sure they have all agreed to deny everything. Congress certainly isn't going to do anything about it.

[meadowlander]

25. Can the president be sued by the states

if there is evidence of election tampering?

Obviously not a lawyer, but there must be some law about interfering with an election and I would imagine states could show that downticket races would have been harmed by that tampering undermining confidence in the state legislatures.

Or is that why we have all those mysterious ballots in Detroit where people didn't vote for the President but voted in every other race?

[lastlib]

20. The whole mess of 'em need to RESIGN! NOW.

(Maybe keep the Postmaster-General as the "designated survivor." But the rest gotta go--that INCLUDES Lyin' Ryan and McTurtle!)

[Takket]

22. He can't fire Flynn

Firing Flynn would basically mean acknowledging that the coordination between the Trump campaign and Russia is true and happened, and then the shit hits the fan. He has no choice but to hold onto Flynn and deny deny deny.

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

23. What will go first?

That dam (spillway) in CA or Flynn?

Hopefully, the dam will hold and Flynn won't.

[flamingdem]

28. Both are

nearly certain to go

[still_one]

26. Has the Palmer Report been right about anything

[womanofthehills]

30. Yes

Palmer report seems to have the scoop a day before it comes out in the news.

[Hortensis]

43. Only if it suits Palmer. This is a left-wing fake news site,

and thanks for putting that question out there.

[Bohunk68]

53. Could you please share with the rest of us why you think the

Palmer Report is a "fake news site?" Maybe some links or whatever, something besides just an opinion? Searching for some truth is all I am doing here. If you can demonstrate to us the reasoning?

[Hortensis]

56. Check Snopes for an extremely incomplete but quick start.

A lot of professionals have (of course!) become concerned about the pernicious effect of massive political deception on our nation, evaluating sites for verity, and reporting their findings.

Bill Palmer also has a larger site with a deservedly unsavory reputation. Anything that Palmer is issuing should be checked against other sources, preferably ones that do investigative journalism. If nothing is found for a couple of days, as is common, it's usually because other sources are, like, INVESTIGATING and VERIFYING? OR because it never happened at all.

The only reason I go to fake news sites at all, though, is to find out what and what version of it they're feeding others.

[Bohunk68]

82. Thanks for your reply.

You state he has a larger site and didn't identify. Could you? It would be helpful to know. For many of us who live in rural areas, wifi is incredibly expensive and limited. One of the reasons that the policies of the new FCC head is downright scary. It severely limits our ability to fact-check and still do other functions. So, I often rely on others to do some of the checking. 8 GB doesn't really go very far in today's information world. Thanks again for your patience.

[Hortensis]

83. With you in nervousness about the FCC. Our pub friends

are convinced they're THE people who value freedom, so let's hope at least some are displeased enough to act like it. Daily News Bin.

[Leith]

27. I Refuse to Get My Hopes Up

Just to have them dashed again. There have been too many predictions of that final straw while the stinky camel keeps on keeping on. The best we can hope for is for each new scandal to take a few more supporters until the balance finally tips. It won't come soon enough.

[Crash2Parties]

29. *OR* Trump won't fire him & Congress will do nothing about either b/c the party leaders are involved

[Eyeball_Kid]

31. Giving Trumpy until Monday is very generous. Too generous.

Flynn should have been fired Friday evening. It would have shown Trumpy as characteristically OUTRAGED and impulsive. That's who he normally is. But that didn't happen... I wonder why.

Trumpy needed the extra time to think about how to cover his ass because he's guilty. Even holding off until tomorrow shows a degree of calculation when there shouldn't be any. It's cut and dried. Flynn needs to go now. But he won't because Trumpy is protecting himself. That's where flamingdem is correct.

[flamingdem]

33. Allegedly he spent the weekend with Flynn and the Russian oligarch bagman

who flew in on his private plane. Wonder what they've come up with.

[keithbvadu2]

32. Stories that the intel community fears a Russian mole in the White House.

Stories that the intel community fears a Russian mole in the White House.

More tunnels than between the Walmarts in last year's Jade something exercise.

[Warpy]

36. I wouldn't put such a strict time limit, but it appears clear Flynn is being set up

as the sacrificial lamb over the whole Russian connection. He will have to be cut loose at some point, sooner better than later, in order to make it convincing and properly protect Trump, Bannon, Manafort, and the rest of that nest of spiders.

[flamingdem]

37. Yes, and the Dems and patriotic Repugs need to track this story relentlessly so it doesn't fade out

as it did with Manafort who was let go and continues to counsel Trump - he bought an apartment at Trump Tower.

To much pressure to get back to status quo if they "get the mole".

It's muuuuch more complicated than Flynn

[Doitnow]

39. Crooked people have the goods on each other. Like a mob. They stick together-----until they don't.

[MedusaX]

40. Part of the Plan

Flynn likely agreed early on to be the fall guy if necessary (to be rewarded, of course, with a one way ticket to Russia and a hefty retirement fund)

Contacting Russia about sanctions served multiple purposes:
* the obvious- convey sanction related reassurances
* Create a diversionary trail to be followed
* Create opportunity to implicate Pence /others as they publicly deny initial allegations - in support of Flynn
* conveniently sets up Flynn as sole Russia partner/ lone wolf to be sacrificed in order to publicly "close" the Russia investigation....
thus allowing the Putin/Bannon/Drumpf
Trinity of Destruction to enjoy eternal life.

[Dream Girl]

59. I doubt they are that smart. when he called the ambassador they were in the exuberant

Afterglow of the election...visions of great powers and a very, very big pay day. I'm sure they were feeling pretty inviviblr at the time though I'm puzzled as to how he wouldn't have known they were being monitored. Still Trump lifted those sanctions as soon ad he possibly could clearing the way for a very,very big pay day for their little cabal. Clear evidence of quid pro quo.

[butdiduvote]

41. Any chance this story gets the entire election, up and down ballot, thrown out?

I mean I'd take it, but I'm not content with just Pence and Trump being tossed out if this election was essentially stolen from us. The costs of winning an election illegitimately shouldn't be that your party still gets to remain in power just under a different person.

[Egnever]

66. I don't think with our current congress there is much of a chance of any repercussions at all.

The only thing at this point holding this country together is the judiciary and they are doing their damnedest to weaken that.

[byronius]

79. +1000.

[tandem5]

42. Trump won't keep Flynn because he worried he'll talk.

He'll keep him because Flynn is part of the Russian influence Trump has no hope of disentangling himself from. Of course Trump is complicit.

There is not a limitless supply of alternates. If Flynn has no acceptable replacement that maintains that Russian connection then he's not going anywhere. He might be recycled the way Lewandowski and Manafort were, but Flynn is in such a high profile spot I'm not sure that's possible in which case there is no option, no crossroads.

The GOP ultimately wants Pence so he can take a lot of misdirected blame, but hopefully not from Trump himself -- that would be stupid, but unfortunately for him, he is kinda stupid.

So the bottom line is yes, if the ship is going down, Trump is going down with it, but he made that choice a long time ago.

[mnhtnbb]

46. In a situation like this--with Flynn--we all know what Pooty Poot does.

Flynn better have someone tasting his food for him. Problem solved!

[Dream Girl]

60. He should also watch out for pointy umbrellas!

[Buckeyeblue]

47. Why wouldn't congress step in

The republicans don't like 45. They don't trust him. They've had to tolerate him. So if they had the opportunity to take him down, why wouldn't they?

Or are they?

They need to get the base behind them before they act. The base has been dupped. We are dealing with the egos of dumb people who think they know something. It's going to take some fancy talk.

Next few weeks should be interesting.

[Mike Nelson]

48. This article is...

...speculation. Flynn could be paid not to squeal, after resigning. Then, Republicans don't investigate.

[Achilleaze]

49. Monday, Monday. Can't trust that day.

[Progressive dog]

50. That actually makes sense,

if we assume Trump bases his actions on facts and thought. I'm sure not ready to make that assumption.

[Motley13]

51. If they have transcripts, I'm sure they will point the finger at blotus,

why would Flynn do it otherwise, if not for blotus?

President Pence, at least he is not insane. The repugs are looking for their chance to get rid of blotus.

Buuut, Reagan did it for the Iran hostages
Nixon did it with North Vietnam to extend the war

[njhoneybadger]

52. Ex Director of the Defense Intelligence Agency

Doesn't think his communication with Russian ambassador Sergey Kislyak might be monitored. Really, does that make sense to everyone.

[Ligyron]

64. No, It certainly does not.

That has me suspicious something else may be going on but exactly what I can't figure.

[former9thward]

55. Is this going to turn into another "24 business hours" thing?

[get the red out]

57. Here's my fear

That if information is true, it isn't going to be revealed to us peons, which makes the cynical part of me think nothing that seems hopeful is information that will be acted on. But we, the non-brainwashed peons, have been reading about incredible coincidences that lead to Trump and his cronies being virtually controlled by the Kremlin. But how can we know something like that and all pertinent authorities have their fingers up their ass???????

This is like watching a movie and screaming warnings at the main characters like they will hear you through the TV.

[Orsino]

63. If Pence wants to serve out the remainder of the term, he'll be drafting pardons.

Yes, there will be outrage, but not as much as letting the many crime, incompetencies and embarrassing tales "trickle" out would engender.

It would be a cover-up, but part of me says it might be for the best.

[meadowlander]

65. I think Pence is in it up to his neck too

since he was vouching for Flynn.

[triron]

77. Me too.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

68. WELL it happened - Conjob said T sticking by Flynn !!! So guess T in on it ALL yeah !!!

[flamingdem]

69. So it's going to take a lil' longer but

the big fish is going to get into the net too this way.

The Koch brothers want him out so there's impeachment on the horizon.

They want their boy Ryan in there but it might take several more months

[Laura PourMeADrink]

70. Ryan jumps Pence? Get rid of him too? or Ryan for VP to Pence?

[Laura PourMeADrink]

71. Hmmm. Now CNN saying that Trump is "evaluating" So Conjob jumps gun

[flamingdem]

72. I wonder if they are trying to figure out if they have unencrypted the flynn russia

phone calls. If they have Flynn is probably toast and maybe Trump as well.

Pence, not so much, but who knows

[Laura PourMeADrink]

75. I am so glad you said that. Couldn't get anyone else to answer - "If they know Flynn

talked about Sanctions, they must not have a full tape or they would know if he's in deep shit."

It's because they are still trying to encrypt?

[flamingdem]

78. I know what you mean, I just read this today - see the post here about Adam Schiff

the Rep on the foreign relations comm - he brought up this issue of the encrypting. However the issue might be that if he was encrypting - who is he hiding from? Not clear if they unencrypted it or not

[flamingdem]

81. badda bing - good job Palmer

only thing is this means Trumpy gets to stay a while longer.. Flynn doesn't have enough on him or will be paid off by the Ruskies for not talking.

That's why the Russian oligarch bagman came to play golf with Flynn and Trump last weekend, very little doubt bout that.