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NanceGreggs

(27,814 posts)
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 01:43 AM Feb 2017

Yes, We DO Think You ARE Stupid

I have often seen Democrats being chastised, lectured, even vilified for stating that Republican voters are stupid.

You think that we think you are dumber-than-dumb. And the fact is WE DO think exactly that. We don’t call you brainless idiots in order to be provocative. We don’t refer to you as dumb-asses because we are determined to anger you. We don’t label you as mindless, low-IQ voters in an effort to be divisive or combative.

We do it because the evidence is in – and it invariably points to the fact that you are every bit as undeniably stupid as we think you are.

The election of Donald Trump is the perfect case in point.

You were stupid enough to vote for a man who has always outsourced all of his own manufacturing jobs, because you believed he would bring YOUR outsourced job back.

You were stupid enough to listen to your “Christian” pastors when they told you a thrice-married, self-proclaimed pussy-grabber is an upstanding moral man, chosen by God himself to lead a nation.

You were stupid enough to think a man who tweets incoherent nonsense was intelligent enough to run an incredibly complex government in an increasingly complicated world.

You were stupid enough to support a man who stated outright that he intends to take your healthcare coverage away from you.

You were stupid enough to believe that a billionaire – who has never in his entire life done anything for anyone other than himself – had suddenly become a champion of those of you struggling to make ends meet.

You were stupid enough to elect a man who has a very long history of cheating hard-working Americans – people like yourselves – out of their fees for materials delivered, and services rendered.

We Democrats are not – contrary to your stupidly-held beliefs – all over-educated Ph.D.s who sip $24 lattes between Mensa meetings. We are not ‘elitists’ who spend our time looking down our noses at the less educated, especially in view of the fact that many of us are no better educated, nor financially well-off, than you are.

The difference between us is that we Democrats look beyond the political rhetoric in order to find the facts, while you simply swallow whatever bullshit is spewed by FOX-News, or Rush Limbaugh – even Alex Jones. We have the common sense to know that in today’s world, those facts are as close as a mouse-click away. We understand that the truth is out there, if only you have the minimal intellectual capacity it takes to find it.

So, yes, we DO think you’re stupid – because you are. You demonstrate it daily. You are the people who think Obama was president on 9/11, the people who believe that illegals working 12-hour days in the fields are stealing your six-figure-per-annum jobs, the people who believe that the Bowling Green Massacre actually happened.

What else are we to think, other than that you are unbelievably, mind-bogglingly, beyond-all-imagining, STUPID? How are we supposed to ignore your incredible, self-imposed ignorance? Why should we pretend that people who are still complaining about Obama’s botched response to Katrina (which happened more than three years before he was in office) are anything more than dumber-than-dumb ignoramuses who lack the necessary skill to interpret something as complicated as a calendar?

Look, the truth is YOU ARE STUPID. And what’s worse, you are actually proud of being stupid. So don’t blame us for pointing out what you yourselves have gone out of your way to make obvious. Don't wave your stupidity around like a neon flag if you don't want anyone to notice it. Don't regurgitate quotes from people proven to be liars if you want to be perceived as people capable of independent thought - or even common sense.

There is, of course, a way to stop being called stupid. You can always try NOT being stupid.

It’s so crazy, it just might work.

139 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Yes, We DO Think You ARE Stupid (Original Post) NanceGreggs Feb 2017 OP
You nailed it. 3catwoman3 Feb 2017 #1
Agree! iluvtennis Feb 2017 #8
Not enough cow bell. nt NCjack Feb 2017 #78
Especially if u think being stupid is a personal choice..... Cryptoad Feb 2017 #129
They are not only willfully ignorant, they are stupid and mean. NCjack Feb 2017 #130
I agree they are all those things,,,, Cryptoad Feb 2017 #131
Thanks for this. Merlot Feb 2017 #2
Especially if they are unable or unwilling to own up to it Proud Liberal Dem Feb 2017 #75
Yup. Kimchijeon Feb 2017 #3
Bravo...but I'd change this SHRED Feb 2017 #4
I agree. Excellent point. Pacifist Patriot Feb 2017 #37
I agree. I think some 'can' learn... WePurrsevere Feb 2017 #107
K&R times a million LW1977 Feb 2017 #5
K&R smirkymonkey Feb 2017 #6
These are people who believe that fictional massacres are real drm604 Feb 2017 #7
Yup! Bowling Green real, Sandy Hook fake. Initech Feb 2017 #12
Thanks for saying that. world wide wally Feb 2017 #9
So what he lied to everyone else griloco Feb 2017 #10
Jedi mind tricks work with Republicans... if we ever get the chance. yuiyoshida Feb 2017 #11
They are stupid and gullible! herding cats Feb 2017 #13
Well said! Canoe52 Feb 2017 #14
They're smart enough to show up and vote - and that's all the smarts they need. NBachers Feb 2017 #15
True enough. NanceGreggs Feb 2017 #18
I tried to tell my friends who were voting third party notdarkyet Feb 2017 #22
still furious nocalflea Feb 2017 #40
Excellent point, NBachers. the trump voters are voting Cha Feb 2017 #26
The person the Russians wanted there? Alternative facts is leaving out information too no? uponit7771 Feb 2017 #32
I tried desperately to convince several family members/friends Zero System Feb 2017 #64
Thank you. sheshe2 Feb 2017 #16
Beautiful and right on! Kath2 Feb 2017 #17
True dat. Oh the pain...the pain. Marcuse Feb 2017 #19
Awesome essay amuse bouche Feb 2017 #20
Perfect. Great writing. They are as dumb as doorknobs but seem proud notdarkyet Feb 2017 #21
Epic Rant, Nance.. Bookmarked! I know I use the Cha Feb 2017 #23
What is stupidity? vlyons Feb 2017 #24
This message was self-deleted by its author Pacifist Patriot Feb 2017 #39
More than a few of the highly educated RWers in my dept believe in some abysmally stupid shit. HughBeaumont Feb 2017 #47
and I'll bet that more than a few are vlyons Feb 2017 #52
And this ++++++++. n/t BlancheSplanchnik Feb 2017 #55
Yes but understanding what makes them tick can bring a whole new world of understanding nolabels Feb 2017 #74
I think most of us CAN, in fact "see their point of view" NastyRiffraff Feb 2017 #104
This +++++++++++. n/t BlancheSplanchnik Feb 2017 #56
posted wrong spot mnhtnbb Feb 2017 #66
Thank you! colorado_ufo Feb 2017 #25
K&R. dchill Feb 2017 #27
Pod Save America may beg to differ. SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2017 #28
As always... Wonderfully written! WiffenPoof Feb 2017 #29
I did the exact same thing liquid diamond Feb 2017 #92
we're not so bright either daft yank Feb 2017 #30
Very good points. AJT Feb 2017 #34
There is no way to "broaden the tent and allow anti choice people in" without saying that women are Squinch Feb 2017 #54
Yes, it is just a shame that that believing in AJT Feb 2017 #58
Anti- choice is anti democratic so that's a firm never. Separation of church and state matters. bettyellen Feb 2017 #86
non white working class DOES vote democratic. the whites who vote republican connect more JI7 Feb 2017 #121
Lovely prose. Trust Buster Feb 2017 #31
Gosh, that felt good to read..... AJT Feb 2017 #33
Proud Ignorance is a self-regenerating problem.. . . .n/t annabanana Feb 2017 #35
YES! YES! YES! n/t MANative Feb 2017 #36
This needs to be posted on the Free Republic site or FOX comment site and sent nikibatts Feb 2017 #38
This.. cannabis_flower Feb 2017 #41
Another awesome post! BlueJac Feb 2017 #42
WTG Nance Gothmog Feb 2017 #43
yep. Dumb as dirt. bigtree Feb 2017 #44
Great rant - the only thing I'd change NewJeffCT Feb 2017 #45
Amazingly Brilliant! FrankfurtCat Feb 2017 #46
Trump supporters are stupid, but I think their stupidity has hit generational stupidity. BeckyDem Feb 2017 #48
Not just us Dems, the rest of the world thinks they're stupid NightWatcher Feb 2017 #49
May I please post this to FB? moda253 Feb 2017 #50
The GOP has, "ironically", used think tanks ironically to spew out simplistic slogans and BSdetect Feb 2017 #51
Plenty of evil people (not just the stupid ones) voted for him as well. LonePirate Feb 2017 #53
Evil, yes. There are many, mini smart Bannons, who take advantage of the Repub masses stupidity Alice11111 Feb 2017 #111
So true! TNLib Feb 2017 #57
Rants like this prove that some democrats are not so smart after all. RadiationTherapy Feb 2017 #59
Exactly. It's cathartic, but hardly persuasive. alarimer Feb 2017 #63
I think Zizek explains very well how insulting one's ideological rivals empowers one's rivals. RadiationTherapy Feb 2017 #72
+1 leftstreet Feb 2017 #89
Yeah, you dumbasses! What she said! Mc Mike Feb 2017 #60
"There is, of course, a way to stop being called stupid. You can always try NOT being stupid." tazkcmo Feb 2017 #61
Ah, fresh air! Iggo Feb 2017 #62
You said it all! nancy1942 Feb 2017 #65
+ 1,000,000, Nance. My sentiments exactly. (nt) Paladin Feb 2017 #67
Hubby--a psychiatrist and psychoanalyst--always disputes me when I start ranting about stupidity mnhtnbb Feb 2017 #68
I agree with you. Self-destructive is a more nuanced and thoughtful expression of their actions. RadiationTherapy Feb 2017 #73
K&R! stonecutter357 Feb 2017 #69
In this age of information, ignorance is a choice. logosoco Feb 2017 #70
wow...that just isn't true at all. Assumptions color where and what you look for, and how you JCanete Feb 2017 #88
well, thanks for telling me what is "not true at all" logosoco Feb 2017 #93
The question remains, why would they if they've been given every reason to believe their current JCanete Feb 2017 #99
But if they believe FOX is the truth, why... Beartracks Feb 2017 #133
What a GREAT point, logosoco! calimary Feb 2017 #112
Perfectly put. Kentonio Feb 2017 #71
Great post! ElementaryPenguin Feb 2017 #76
Amen underpants Feb 2017 #77
Stupid is a stupid word unless you want to insult someone nolabels Feb 2017 #79
On a roll lately Nance Lochloosa Feb 2017 #80
Normally I'm opposed to calling people stupid retrowire Feb 2017 #81
K&R ismnotwasm Feb 2017 #82
this...100%nt heaven05 Feb 2017 #83
Stupid people don't know they are stupid. Doitnow Feb 2017 #84
BAM!!!! ScubaSteve Feb 2017 #85
No we don't. Don't lump me in with that. It isn't helpful. There isn't an area of discourse where JCanete Feb 2017 #87
Excellent points leftstreet Feb 2017 #90
+infinity NoGoodNamesLeft Feb 2017 #91
Its downright inhumane to expect us to perpetually bite our tongues LiberalLovinLug Feb 2017 #110
Since I am an Independent I can actually look at this dynamic objectively NoGoodNamesLeft Feb 2017 #115
I do agree, especially with your last paragraph LiberalLovinLug Feb 2017 #120
It sounds to me like she is ranting and venting liquid diamond Feb 2017 #95
then we are all a lost cause. The very forces that work on white middle class people will work on JCanete Feb 2017 #97
Continue we will. liquid diamond Feb 2017 #124
totally what I was saying...? Let's breed racism? Lets let racism take over? Fine, make up your own JCanete Feb 2017 #126
So please enlighten us, O Enlightened One Dave Starsky Feb 2017 #98
Tell you what, we didn't know how to mine solar power efficiently, or wind, or anything else, but we JCanete Feb 2017 #100
I accept that as a "I have no idea." Dave Starsky Feb 2017 #114
Thank you Cha Feb 2017 #119
That is dumb. If you don't have the solution for curing cancer calling it heart disease doesn't JCanete Feb 2017 #123
That is an excellent analogy. Dave Starsky Feb 2017 #138
Well, at least we're making strides to cure cancer. You're clearly content to live in a world where JCanete Feb 2017 #139
You could start by not personally attacking them (not you personally, just in general) NoGoodNamesLeft Feb 2017 #103
Absolutely Perfect DoctorJoJo Feb 2017 #94
butbutbut they say we are the stupid racist ones. at least we can spell well. pansypoo53219 Feb 2017 #96
Amen! Dark n Stormy Knight Feb 2017 #101
don't think this works...at all Softail1 Feb 2017 #102
They are stupid or evil, but your point is well taken Alice11111 Feb 2017 #113
K&R!! rury Feb 2017 #105
Excellent again, Nance NastyRiffraff Feb 2017 #106
We didn't need a 70 million dollar congressional investigation to figure this out. iscooterliberally Feb 2017 #108
K & R!! Just because the truth hurts doesn't mean it's not the truth!! 50 Shades Of Blue Feb 2017 #109
The people who hate Obamacare but love the ACA mcar Feb 2017 #116
Nance, you are on fire these days, and I'm loving it. Tarheel_Dem Feb 2017 #117
Another case in point.. Cha Feb 2017 #118
I tried to use your excellent rant as my sig line - wow!!!! erronis Feb 2017 #122
. Takket Feb 2017 #125
We thank you very sweetly for saying it so neatly. njhoneybadger Feb 2017 #127
Excellent Post n/t jrthin Feb 2017 #128
thought I was going to make a friend cry the other night at a party when Laura PourMeADrink Feb 2017 #132
Awesome post n/t lordsummerisle Feb 2017 #134
Willful ignorance: The Wizard Feb 2017 #135
If Frank were alive today I'd love to see what he'd comment on this. Something like?: lambchopp59 Feb 2017 #136
KICK Cha Feb 2017 #137

Cryptoad

(8,254 posts)
129. Especially if u think being stupid is a personal choice.....
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 09:14 PM
Feb 2017

I tellya,, they have a some kinda Brain rot disease or syndrome.

Cryptoad

(8,254 posts)
131. I agree they are all those things,,,,
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 09:44 PM
Feb 2017

u can chose to be ignorant but being stupid is not personal choice..... there is something more going on and the only thing i can think of that woiuld explain it, is some sort of brain dysfunction !

Merlot

(9,696 posts)
2. Thanks for this.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 01:52 AM
Feb 2017

Though I would say that some people are ignorant, which is curable with facts. There really isn't a cure for stupid.

 

SHRED

(28,136 posts)
4. Bravo...but I'd change this
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 02:02 AM
Feb 2017
We understand that the truth is out there, if only you have the minimal intellectual capacity it takes to find it.


I'd change the word capacity to curiosity.

Well done though.

WePurrsevere

(24,259 posts)
107. I agree. I think some 'can' learn...
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 04:21 PM
Feb 2017

but choose not to due lack of curiosity, as you mentioned, or a lack of critical thinking skills.

Why should they actually think and research when they can have someone who pretends to 'know' things spoon feed them what they want them to know. As long as they tell Trump voters what they want to hear, confirming their prejudice and ignorance while stoking their fears and stroking their egos, they're happy. Pfft!

world wide wally

(21,743 posts)
9. Thanks for saying that.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 02:09 AM
Feb 2017

I can't get through a thought like that without throwing in at least a dozen "F" bombs.

herding cats

(19,564 posts)
13. They are stupid and gullible!
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 02:18 AM
Feb 2017

Many of them believed the Sandy Hook shooting was fake. It was all staged because Democrats want to take their guns.

News Flash: If you're stupid and heartless enough to believe that, I do want to take your guns away. You're a danger to society!

NBachers

(17,108 posts)
15. They're smart enough to show up and vote - and that's all the smarts they need.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 02:46 AM
Feb 2017

No "staying home to make a statement," or "alternative *cough*cough* candidate" bullshit.

Who's in office right now?

NanceGreggs

(27,814 posts)
18. True enough.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:11 AM
Feb 2017

As long as the "smart" voters are more interested in "making a statement" than actually keeping someone like Trump out of office, the Stupid will prevail ...

... which begs the question: Just how "smart" are the statement-makers, the stay-at-home brigade, the "both parties are the same" contingent -- or are they just as stupid as the oh-so-obvious stupid?

To my mind, STUPID is STUPID - and contributing to The Idiot being elected by not voting, or voting third party puts you squarely in the STUPID category.

I'm not seeing any difference between the "I believed Trump would be a great president" folks and the "I voted against Hillary because I wanted to send a message" crowd. BOTH groups enabled an Idiot being to be elected pOTUS. There really is no getting around that fact.

notdarkyet

(2,226 posts)
22. I tried to tell my friends who were voting third party
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:50 AM
Feb 2017

That they were helping trump get elected. They felt their protest vote mattered more Than getting a madman elected for president. It was pretty self serving not reflecting a collective unity with other voters. I thought anyway.

nocalflea

(1,387 posts)
40. still furious
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 08:44 AM
Feb 2017

If the possibility of a fascist becoming their president does not inspire someone to vote,what will ?
This was the most important vote of my life.
I knew Trump would appeal to the Reagan- democrats demographic the minute he unleashed his MAGA slogan.
I knew my vote mattered.
"If you dont stand for something. .."

Cha

(297,214 posts)
26. Excellent point, NBachers. the trump voters are voting
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 04:02 AM
Feb 2017

against themselves but by Jove they show up.

Those who think they're making a statement by staying home or voting for someone whose lies they believe, but doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell, are voting against themselves, too.

Both of sides have taken the Planet into the abyss and it's up to us to get it out.

Zero System

(16 posts)
64. I tried desperately to convince several family members/friends
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:19 AM
Feb 2017

not to vote third party. I pleaded, tried to get them to realize what was at stake...and they went right ahead with their self-righteous nonsense anyway. I refuse to discuss anything relative to politics with them now, especially because I can guarantee none of them will take responsibility. I will no longer beat my head against brick walls.

*Edited to add: There was also my son-in-law, who stated he wasn't voting at all, because Hillary "had it in the bag." You can damn sure bet I DO bring it up to him - every time I see him.

notdarkyet

(2,226 posts)
21. Perfect. Great writing. They are as dumb as doorknobs but seem proud
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:43 AM
Feb 2017

Of their stupidity. It really makes me mad when they tweet or comment on easily searchable facts.

Cha

(297,214 posts)
23. Epic Rant, Nance.. Bookmarked! I know I use the
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:51 AM
Feb 2017

word "stupid" a lot when referring to trump voters and him.. even though it's intentionally done to brainwash them. He still comes off as the most stupid, Lying, hatemonger on the Planet.

vlyons

(10,252 posts)
24. What is stupidity?
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:54 AM
Feb 2017

When we call RWers "stupid," what they hear is that they are being accused of having a low IQ. That is not the case. Rather "stupidity" in the Buddhist sense is when someone holds onto mental delusions that are clearly false, illogical, close-minded, and just bloody wrong and unbased on evidence. So one can have a very high IQ and still be stupid in regard to holding on to certain beliefs.

My example to illustrate this is one time my chickens got outside the hen house. To lure them back in, I scattered some cracked corn on the ground INSIDE the hen house. The smart ones ran around and came back in thru the door. But one really stupid one kept sticking her head thru the 2 inch chicken wire, but obviously couldn't get her body thru to reach the corn. Stupidity in that sense is a close-minded adherence to beliefs that are contradicted by evidence. For example, the belief that trickle-down economics tax breaks creates jobs has no evidence that it is so. Or belief in a creator god that can perform magic tricks that are contrary to the laws of physics. Or belief that climate change and evolution are hoaxes. And on and on and on with so many stupid beliefs unsupported by evidence.

So when we tell RWers that their belief in such and such is stupid, we have to make clear that what we mean is that the belief is not based on evidence - not that they have a low IQ. (Although they may have a low IQ.)

Response to vlyons (Reply #24)

HughBeaumont

(24,461 posts)
47. More than a few of the highly educated RWers in my dept believe in some abysmally stupid shit.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 10:25 AM
Feb 2017

Supply-side, Capitalism as an infallible religion, all Democrats are communists, Bush's oil wars are justified, Hillary was the greater evil, etc. etc. etc.

vlyons

(10,252 posts)
52. and I'll bet that more than a few are
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 10:38 AM
Feb 2017

Ayn Rand disciples. The virtue of selfishness and all that. You can ask them why it is that after every Republican tax cut for rich people (you know, the "job creators&quot , why is it that the national debt went up, and the economy tanked. But when Obama modestly increased taxes for the wealthy in 2009, the economy began to recover.

Here's another RWer lie. Cutting gov regulations creates jobs. The exact opposite is true. For example, it only takes 1 guy running a back hoe to dump coal ash into a river. But it takes 40 guys in a factory to clean the pollution from an energy plant. And that's not even counting the guys needed to design and build the plant, or the guys needed to manufacture and deliver the building materials and component assemblys for the plant.

Never mind. Best not to try and argue with fools.

nolabels

(13,133 posts)
74. Yes but understanding what makes them tick can bring a whole new world of understanding
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:32 AM
Feb 2017

And if you cannot see their point of view and how they got there how would you ever expect them to see yours

NastyRiffraff

(12,448 posts)
104. I think most of us CAN, in fact "see their point of view"
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 04:19 PM
Feb 2017

And it's not pretty. I won't engage with people whose point of view is racist, misogynist, xenophobic, and/or homophobic. I already understand them all too well. I know some of them personally, and believe me,they're not going to see my point of view no matter how "understanding" I try to be, which is why I no longer try. They DEMAND not only understanding, but complete agreement with their sick, hatefilled beliefs.

These are people whom I know. I never thought I'd call them cultists, but that's what they've become. Ever try to change a cultist's mind?

WiffenPoof

(2,404 posts)
29. As always... Wonderfully written!
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 05:37 AM
Feb 2017

It's so strange because I started reading before I knew who the author was. About half way through I checked back and saw your name. I totally recognized the style and "wordsmanship."

daft yank

(1 post)
30. we're not so bright either
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 05:56 AM
Feb 2017

I like and agree with most every word of this post, but it must be said that the left/Dems of this country have been a little dim witted as well over the past 25 + years. We became the "party of inclusion" for two reasons 1) because of our belief that all are created equal and entitled to not being discriminated against 2) to get elected (Hispanic, gay, African American voter blocks),but down the road we failed to keep the core voter block, the working/middle class. This movement/party evolved out of the need to put an end to back door politics between corporate America/wealthy Americans having unfair influence (money to get their candidates elected) over government policy. Some how we forgot our core constituency and Fox news picked them up and pickled their brains with false news. Some of it can be blamed on religion because if your a christian first and a democrat second and your faith directs you to believe homosexuality is wrong your gonna find a different party to affiliate with. Now I'm not an outright atheist, in that I do not deny the existence of god, I just have a hard time believing that the bible is the actual word of god, But for many it is. Sp Dems needed to walk a fine line in courting the gay vote. Then bigotry is also a factor, but who wants racists as a voting block anyway. Republicans have been very successful with very little ammunition. Abortion has worked very well for them and when the economy is not so good deregulation has been a good subject to throw in the mix, but this is one that proves the theme of the original post, because deregulation only helps corporate America and the wealthy. Sure it creates jobs but unemployment has not always been the problem the problem has been stagnant wages. I also think that the left have given away too much in an attempt to globalize and thus bring the rest of the world out of poverty(a noble gesture indeed|. They failed too see that technology would slowly devastate the working class here at home, you can only help the rest of the world if you can keep your own head above water while doing so.
sorry for rambling

AJT

(5,240 posts)
34. Very good points.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 06:37 AM
Feb 2017

As far as religion goes, abortion has been made a make or break for evangelicals and catholics. I would like to think we could broaden the tent and allow anti-choice people in, but I don't know how to resolve that with women being as free as men to control their own lives.

Squinch

(50,949 posts)
54. There is no way to "broaden the tent and allow anti choice people in" without saying that women are
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 10:51 AM
Feb 2017

unimportant. For many people like me, it's a deal breaker. If the Democrats did that, I would be gone. Fast.

Oklahoma has just passed a law saying that women need their sexual partners' permission to get an abortion. This is not an issue WE can waffle on. We need to be a strong line in the sand and make it clear that ANY incursions into our self-determination are unacceptable.

And with those evangelicals and catholics, abortion is a make or break until an abortion is needed by their Catholic daughter. I was raised Catholic. I was never in a cohort that availed itself of more abortions than my Catholic college girlfriends. My point is that, while there is a lot of lip service to opposing abortion, in practice it does not go deep. It's hypocrisy.

For those who are anti-choice, I allow them full freedom to be that way. I tell them, "Well then by all means don't have an abortion." That is as far as I am willing to go in letting them have control over my body. If my party went farther than that, they would lose me and I would work against them.

AJT

(5,240 posts)
58. Yes, it is just a shame that that believing in
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:07 AM
Feb 2017

a woman's right to choose means everything to the evangelicals and catholics. It seems all other stances the GOP takes are antithetical to being a good God loving person.

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
86. Anti- choice is anti democratic so that's a firm never. Separation of church and state matters.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 02:14 PM
Feb 2017

JI7

(89,249 posts)
121. non white working class DOES vote democratic. the whites who vote republican connect more
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 07:22 PM
Feb 2017

with wealthy whites than anyone non white.

 

nikibatts

(2,198 posts)
38. This needs to be posted on the Free Republic site or FOX comment site and sent
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 08:34 AM
Feb 2017

to the Rush Limbaugh fan site.

NewJeffCT

(56,828 posts)
45. Great rant - the only thing I'd change
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 10:23 AM
Feb 2017

is that we don't really know if Trump is a billionaire - until he can prove otherwise, he's an alleged billionaire.

A few years back, somebody did extensive research into his finances and estimated that Trump was worth in the $150 million to $350 million range. Trump threatened to sue the guy, but I think it was tossed out of court. Not sure of the resolution.

BeckyDem

(8,361 posts)
48. Trump supporters are stupid, but I think their stupidity has hit generational stupidity.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 10:26 AM
Feb 2017

How can they look at a con man, just his Trump University alone, was a profile in corruption. He has no interest in helping anyone but himself. When I think of the lies they believe about Clinton and Obama it is mind boggling.

 

moda253

(615 posts)
50. May I please post this to FB?
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 10:33 AM
Feb 2017

I found myself sitting in a restaurant last night listening to some guy drone on and on about how Trump is a new yorker and of course he is going to be offensive but he doesn't mean it and blah blah blah how we have to give him time in office to get his feet under him. He was completely normalizing this crap to a group of teachers I believe. Anyway it seemed as though none of them were really buying it but the guy spewing the bullshit was a bit of a bully speaker so the others seemed to let him drone on and on. I was at the restaurant with my kids or I likely would have jumped into his shit right then and there. But I did shoot the guy a few "are you fucking kidding me?" looks.

Anyway your post got me to thinking that I felt myself slip a little last night. I felt myself excusing this person as just an informed moron. And while that is true these fuckwads need to be reminded that Yes, we do think you are an idiot and here's why. Your post spelled it out perfectly and I would like to give it its due in circulation. If I may.

BSdetect

(8,998 posts)
51. The GOP has, "ironically", used think tanks ironically to spew out simplistic slogans and
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 10:33 AM
Feb 2017

ridiculous claims that seem to resonate with many people.

They also rigged the electoral districts to entrench themselves.

Their talking points are created at an industrial assembly line pace and distributed widely each day.

Its a barrage of BS to distract the media and feed their base emotional stimulation.

TNLib

(1,819 posts)
57. So true!
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:04 AM
Feb 2017

I live in South East TN around allot of ignorant Trump voters. Some days I want to pull a Sam Kinison and start screaming in their faces.

RadiationTherapy

(5,818 posts)
59. Rants like this prove that some democrats are not so smart after all.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:09 AM
Feb 2017

For instance, being able to engage in research has no bearing on one's ability to communicate well, and yet both are often associated with the - essentially meaningless - terms of "smart" and "stupid."

Rhetorically, ad hominem attacks are worse than useless; they not only do nothing for your cause, they galvanize the opposition. Ad homs also alert people that you are not interested in communication and, thus, violence is the next step.

alarimer

(16,245 posts)
63. Exactly. It's cathartic, but hardly persuasive.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:18 AM
Feb 2017

And, at least for the time being, electoral math requires the persuasion of at least some of these voters (some of whom voted for Obama, twice, in fact. They weren't so stupid then, I guess).

But this is part of the ongoing problem of people seeming to vote against their own best interests. A good deal of that can be laid at the feet of the right-wing echo chamber that is Fox News and right-wing radio. We simply have no counter to that, for the simple reason that progressive ideas which would help the most people are far more nuanced than can be stated in a sound bite.

I think we need to listen to Thomas Frank and George Lakoff. Both have good ideas about reframing issues and explanations for why Democrats lose. Yelling at those loser Trump voters does no good. And our elected officials do not do it because they represent even those who didn't vote for them. We can rant all we want here, but it won't actually solve the problem.

RadiationTherapy

(5,818 posts)
72. I think Zizek explains very well how insulting one's ideological rivals empowers one's rivals.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:29 AM
Feb 2017

The video is 20+ minutes, but the relevant point is only 20 seconds starting at 3:03. He says, essentially, that the insults and arrogance from democrats toward Trump and his voters helped Trump's campaign tremendously, and so on.

?t=3m3s

Mc Mike

(9,114 posts)
60. Yeah, you dumbasses! What she said!
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:15 AM
Feb 2017

I've seen this sig-line from a post-er here, don't remember who:

“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
― Isaac Asimov

tazkcmo

(7,300 posts)
61. "There is, of course, a way to stop being called stupid. You can always try NOT being stupid."
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:16 AM
Feb 2017

Nope. They're too stupid to do it.

mnhtnbb

(31,388 posts)
68. Hubby--a psychiatrist and psychoanalyst--always disputes me when I start ranting about stupidity
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:25 AM
Feb 2017

of right wingers and Trump supporters. He claims that it is not stupidity at issue, but
self-destructiveness.

Yes, some of them are ignorant and proud of it. Others don't care about facts, because they agree
with the sentiment--whether it's racist or sexist or just hateful of "other".

I think we're in a "values" war, myself, with Trump supporters.

Is it stupid to be self-destructive? I don't know. There's an awful lot of self-destructive behavior in the world.

RadiationTherapy

(5,818 posts)
73. I agree with you. Self-destructive is a more nuanced and thoughtful expression of their actions.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:31 AM
Feb 2017

Calling people stupid is a lazy cop-out that allows one to stop thinking and start hating.

logosoco

(3,208 posts)
70. In this age of information, ignorance is a choice.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:26 AM
Feb 2017

And the repubs/right wing is making that choice. Under normal circumstances, I am pretty much a "whatever" type of person, but now their choices are affecting our country in very adverse ways.

thank you for sharing your rant here! It was very righteous!

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
88. wow...that just isn't true at all. Assumptions color where and what you look for, and how you
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:10 PM
Feb 2017

interpret contradictors of your world view. You don't see how your very argument could be and is used in the most nefarious ways? "it was all in the fine print....should have known better." "If you'd just gone out and gotten the right financial advisor and not that shill who was literally working for a credit card company who you thought was working in your best interest, then you wouldn't be so fucked right now...dumbass. The information was out there, you should have just done your homework."

The obfuscation of truth is by design. The vernier of trustworthiness is effective, especially when people in your life who you trust, themselves trust certain institutions and sources. That gives them credibility. Everybody starts from a place of ignorance, and truth does not glow amidst shit with some special halo.

logosoco

(3,208 posts)
93. well, thanks for telling me what is "not true at all"
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:31 PM
Feb 2017

Your examples are interesting. Perhaps our different life experiences do affect how we look at things.
Using what I think you are using as an example. My mother in law recently lost her home. When my father in law died in 1991, the house was paid for. Over the years, my husband told her and told her what she needed to do. She listened to other family members, so she ended up losing the house. It was a CHOICE she made, even with someone she could trust, standing right in front of her telling her not to do it.

Should I be angry at the bank who let her put up the house as collateral for all the credit card debt she was amassing? Even when her son was telling her NOT to do that? She made a CHOICE even when she was being shown how it would be a bad thing for her.


Just like the tRump supporters who think voting for some rich man is going to help them.
For all people who rely on FOX news as a trusted institution, it would take no effort at all on their part to change the channel or look up another news site. NONE! So, I stand by my statement, ignorance is a choice. If these people are getting information from a TV with cable, they are capable of finding other sources to explore.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
99. The question remains, why would they if they've been given every reason to believe their current
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:48 PM
Feb 2017

sources?

Your example is entirely different than mine. There are reasons there are laws about how companies market to you, and what they have to say in that fine print, but there are reasons why its in that fine print using language that is confusing, and why companies target young students with credit cards with no initial payments...etc. They get you before you know better.

I have a friend that railed against the people who got themselves into the housing mess before the collapse, who says they were stupid. She literally said, " thought about getting in but my dad said stay away from that because of.." such and such reasons. I was like, "can you not see how having a dad who has that insight saved your ass?" What if she didn't have him? What if the people you have no reason to distrust give you bad advice...

Your example is of a person having to choose between voices that were prominent in her life and choosing poorly. That is not the same thing at all. Again, if you don't know what truth looks like, how do you distinguish it from the lies? Do you really think it calls out to you like some singing sword of virtue?

Beartracks

(12,814 posts)
133. But if they believe FOX is the truth, why...
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 10:04 PM
Feb 2017

... would they even bother to look for info elsewhere?

When WE hear something, we may seek to corroborate. When THEY hear something, they may just post it on FB as objective fact. So, yeah, they clearly trust their sources and may not employ much critical thinking.

FOX-loving Repubs probably sit around wondering why dumb liberals don't avail themselves of all the truth on FOX...

==============

calimary

(81,264 posts)
112. What a GREAT point, logosoco!
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 05:27 PM
Feb 2017

"In this age of information, ignorance is a choice."

I bet every one of those deplorables has a cell phone (and YES. I think they've very much indeed earned that name - BECAUSE they willfully ignore reality and truth. I bet every one of them has a computer. And a TV. And a radio. Which they deliberately tune to shitshows like Pox Noise and limbaugh-and-clones on hate radio. There ARE other choices. I bet they're much more likely to watch Alex Jones than Rachel Maddow. Nobody is holding a gun to their heads and forcing them to consume that shit, much less forcing them to believe any of it.

They willfully ignore what this country was and is meant to be about. I'm surprised they haven't headed out to where the Statue of Liberty is positioned - with pick axes and chisels and crowbars, to pry off the plaque from her pedestal. The one that reads "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free..." Yeah. THAT one.

 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
71. Perfectly put.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:28 AM
Feb 2017

I was in the camp a while ago of trying not to demonize them, but frankly after a month of Trump's bullshit if those fucking morons are still supporting him then screw them.

nolabels

(13,133 posts)
79. Stupid is a stupid word unless you want to insult someone
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:49 AM
Feb 2017

Ignorant, selfish, misguided, lacking critical thinking, etc would be more informative to an audience without such afflictions and pure baby talk to those who are

on edit: It also easier to describe such attributes if you have also been there yourself

retrowire

(10,345 posts)
81. Normally I'm opposed to calling people stupid
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 12:49 PM
Feb 2017

But in light of these recent events? I honestly can't see a way out of it.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
87. No we don't. Don't lump me in with that. It isn't helpful. There isn't an area of discourse where
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 02:48 PM
Feb 2017

it is appropriate or effective to claim that the people who see things differently, even if you see that version of reality as steeped in ignorance--as I do--are stupid. That suggests that culture, not just in the microcosms, but delivered and force-fed-- hell, practically engineered from on high--hasn't had an impact on that ignorance.

Yes, your approach is just so crazy, and it will not work. If you have all of the messaging and you can berate and shame people into your version of better behavior, then this kind of peer pressure can work, even if there are better ways to accomplish the same thing, which instead play on people's best qualities ...assume those qualities as natural...and call on them to rise up to, and maintain them. Without total command of the culture, and for that matter, without the mechanisms of power that are going to provide these people and their bigoted, alternate-realities with a safe haven where there's a hell of a lot of echo, not to mention breeding, all you are doing is making it harder to reach them.

You can call them stupid all you want, but you are starting from a place of insult and disdain. You are asking them to either retreat from you and to find friendlier terrain, or to engage on that same plane of discourse, which is, I have to say, pretty worthless. And its an area they are already comfortable in. They take to heart, villainizing and dehumanizing people who disagree with them, or who they've been taught are morally or mentally inferior. You aren't countering that narrative. You aren't showing them how wrong they are. You are giving them more reasons to hate.

How do you see this playing out? Other than pats on the back from people who agree with you, what do you actually see as valuable about this approach? Do you think this fight can be won this way, for real? There is a very concerted financial incentive to make these people "stupid"...to make this base entirely immune to the treacheries of facts. Consider what's been done to public school curriculum in places. Consider what our media has become.

You think those interests don't like it when you engage in battle with their brainwashed pawns? That's just where they want us to channel our vitriol and energy. It keeps us divided. Conquered.

 

NoGoodNamesLeft

(2,056 posts)
91. +infinity
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:24 PM
Feb 2017

Trying to shame, insult and guilt people into agreeing with you is how those on the left engage in bullying. That kind of stupid "peer pressure" only works with people who already agree with you and ensures that they won't stray outside of "group think." It's not healthy at all, nor is it productive. Using this tactic will not only NOT win over any voters...it's likely to alienate people and LOSE some voters. There are an awful lot of rural gun loving voters who are pro choice and believe in social and economic justice for all who DEEPLY RESENT having assumptions being made about them. They are NOT going to be shamed into anything. In fact...they will intentionally thumb their nose to people who do that just to make a point.

Bullies on the left are just as bad as bullies on the right...they just use different tactics. Both turn me off equally.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,173 posts)
110. Its downright inhumane to expect us to perpetually bite our tongues
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 05:01 PM
Feb 2017

We should allow them to spew insults and abuse at us, but we should remain silent and tell them they are just as smart and ethical as we are. Even when, referring to a new story, they shout Fuck You!! in the face of a pastor and his daughter who dared to attend a Trump rally.

I understand where you are coming from, but sometimes we just have to vent. I agree that its not a fulltime strategy for communication to Trump voters. Its true that the clear unrepentant deplorables will only get angrier if they heard this, but they are already lost. Too STUPID for their own good. But I would respectfully submit that calling out the mental cognition of Trump voters in general may just needle those that are not stupid, but just misinformed and brainwashed by hate media, to "prove" how smart they are by researching the alternative facts they adhere to and may just become more enlightened and even realize their mistake.

 

NoGoodNamesLeft

(2,056 posts)
115. Since I am an Independent I can actually look at this dynamic objectively
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 06:38 PM
Feb 2017

Things have devolved so far that now BOTH Democrats and Republicans are just purposely going out of their way to piss the other side off. Trump's biggest appeal to those on the right is that the left despise him so much. Most of them aren't bigots or racists, know he's full of shit...but they know he's causing the left to be more upset than they ever have before. And the reason why they get so much twisted joy out of that? Resentment and anger. Neither side is innocent of wrong doing in this fiasco. The right bullies via intimidation and chest beating. The left bullies via shaming and attempts to make you feel guilty for not agreeing with them. It's opposite sides of the same coin. People agree on most core things and all want the same basic things...they want to be able to provide for their families, keep them safe, healthy and happy. Even the things people disagree on comes down to them holding different views on how to best meet those same goals.

Maybe rather than focusing on what people disagree on we all start focusing on the shared goals first and then discuss WHY each side things that goal is best reached their way. What I do know for a fact is that the majority of the comments I see on this site regarding this issue will only make things worse and will never resolve or improve anything.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,173 posts)
120. I do agree, especially with your last paragraph
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 07:16 PM
Feb 2017

But its BS to keep harbouring this false equivalency that both sides are equally engaged in similar 'wrongdoing', just reversed.

Trump voters (I almost used 'deplorables') blindly adhere to fake news that supports the racist, bigoted narrative that their authoritarian leaders push.

We criticize them for NOT basing their opinion on true facts. That is not engaging in 'wrong doing'.

We criticize them for their unadulterated hypocrisy on many levels, from their abandonment of their Christian family values, accepting of a non-religious vile boor as their leader. Their acceptance of a hollywood celebrity TV star as their leader after decades of ridiculing this segment, of a champagne sipping elite in a limo telling them he understands them. A narcissist who acts like a vindictive spoiled child. Their blind support of a leader elected with the help of an enemy dictator that poisons his enemies.

We criticize them for ignoring experience when Obama, a Senator, was ridiculed for lack of experience.

What are we doing that equals that? Behind the name-calling, like libtards on one side and deplorables on the other, there is an actual difference in the intelligence, both emotional and cognitive, their stupidity in basing their 'rightness' by how many lefties are crying. That they'd rather suffer with bad air and water, no national parks, less civil rights, privatized infrastructure and schools that will cost them more, less food safety for their children, and trillions added to the national debt with increased military spending and tax cuts for Donald and the GOPs corporate class of friends, less social safety net to rely on, etc.....as long as they get to watch a libtard cry. That my friend is as stupid as it gets.

No more Mr. Nice Guy. They should be shamed. Those that can be. Turning the other cheek to these folks only makes them laugh louder.

 

liquid diamond

(1,917 posts)
95. It sounds to me like she is ranting and venting
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:34 PM
Feb 2017

not trying to win over those asshole trump voters. We don't give a fuck about what they think or how they react. They are the enemy and a lost cause. Fuck reaching out to them.

200+ Recs and counting. Great job Nance.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
97. then we are all a lost cause. The very forces that work on white middle class people will work on
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:41 PM
Feb 2017

the next generations, no matter what their color. Divide and conquer works. Getting people to hate each other works. Venting, I understand. Actually saying, "fuck you guy's you're stupid," or "fuck reaching out to them" is so very much appreciated by your corporate overlords. Do continue.
 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
126. totally what I was saying...? Let's breed racism? Lets let racism take over? Fine, make up your own
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 08:36 PM
Feb 2017

dialogue. What I thought I was saying was that we have to talk to people and see them as human with good intentions totally misaligned, rather than as malignant monsters if we want to be able to erode that racism. Otherwise you are only going to feed it. You are only going to continue to foster a rift.

It is well and good to say "why don't you talk to THEM about THEIR actions. They're the shitty ones." I talk to them about their misconceptions, which is the same level I'm engaging here. It's true, I despair more when even liberals start to bring the hate, because conservatives clearly don't have the philosophical wherewithal or incentive to make things better. If we abdicate a functional approach in favor of visiting on them what they visit on other humans, even if its as mild by comparison as calling them stupid or evil, then I am certain that this is the world we are going to have tomorrow and all the tomorrows into the future.

Dave Starsky

(5,914 posts)
98. So please enlighten us, O Enlightened One
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:43 PM
Feb 2017

Tell us how to reach out and engage them in how not to wrap a rope around theirs and all of our necks and strangle us all with it.

If we're not getting it, surely you know how we can do it.

Time is short. So have at it. Let's hear it.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
100. Tell you what, we didn't know how to mine solar power efficiently, or wind, or anything else, but we
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 03:51 PM
Feb 2017

knew we had a damn good reason for figuring it out. I do have thoughts on this, as do others, but how about we start from a place of diagnosing the problem correctly? Do you see anything sensible about being a poor practitioner in this area, just so that we can be smug about our own brilliance and life choices?
 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
123. That is dumb. If you don't have the solution for curing cancer calling it heart disease doesn't
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 08:05 PM
Feb 2017

get you closer to fixing it.

If I don't have all the answers, how does that act as justification for your backwards approach?

Dave Starsky

(5,914 posts)
138. That is an excellent analogy.
Wed Feb 22, 2017, 09:22 AM
Feb 2017

Because it would literally be easier to cure cancer than it is to get through to just one of the Trump dimwits.

 

JCanete

(5,272 posts)
139. Well, at least we're making strides to cure cancer. You're clearly content to live in a world where
Wed Feb 22, 2017, 09:40 AM
Feb 2017

there will always be Trump voters. Hey, its a rigid condition right? Barring genocide, it will always be with us.
 

NoGoodNamesLeft

(2,056 posts)
103. You could start by not personally attacking them (not you personally, just in general)
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 04:09 PM
Feb 2017

How do you react when someone attacks you? Do you just bow down and submit to whatever they want? I bet not. In fact, your first instinct would be to either tune them out and get away or defend yourself and fight back. The one thing you aren't going to do is listen to them or take a single thing they say seriously. That's why they don't listen to all of the Democratic policies that would help them...they don't trust people who call them stupid, insult them or make assumptions about them.

 

Softail1

(56 posts)
102. don't think this works...at all
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 04:02 PM
Feb 2017

..in case we forget..we lost the House, then the Senate, and now the Whithouse. We have been decimated at the state level as well.....calling everyone names who doesn't agree with us, is not going to turn that around. A little more maturity is called for I think.

Alice11111

(5,730 posts)
113. They are stupid or evil, but your point is well taken
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 06:01 PM
Feb 2017

We continue losing. Now, all branches of government are theirs, and when he gets through with the fed courts, we are stuck with those judges for 30 years or more. Plus, their decisions may take us back 50 years, before Roe v Wade. Net loss is about 80 years, even if we start winning. They did get their troops out to vote, while many of ours played around with 3rd parties or said it didn't matter...pretty stupid.

We are clearly better at policy and governing.

They don't know what to do, except obstruct and tear down. They are great at that. Unfortunately, those same characteristics make them better at winning elections!

We won with Obama because he was so good and he inspired passion, plus everyone had had it with Bush and his economics.
However, Obama improved the economy, kept us from a prolonged depression...yet, they tore him down. They even tore him down for things they obstructed him from doing. Trump was a horrible candidate, but they shredded Hillary and obfuscated any rightful criticism of DT...fake news sex tapes, Comey covering up Russian connections and blasting Hillary, on and on.

NastyRiffraff

(12,448 posts)
106. Excellent again, Nance
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 04:20 PM
Feb 2017

They really ARE stupid. Even the ones with high IQs and professional jobs. Maybe especially them.

iscooterliberally

(2,860 posts)
108. We didn't need a 70 million dollar congressional investigation to figure this out.
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 04:27 PM
Feb 2017

Trump told us he was a jerk right to our faces. He said it out loud into hot microphones while the cameras were rolling. Now I can't get this dumpster fire off of my TV unless I just turn it off. It's like the yule log, only it's a dumpster fire instead.

erronis

(15,250 posts)
122. I tried to use your excellent rant as my sig line - wow!!!!
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 07:54 PM
Feb 2017

Instead I'll just manually append it to all of my emails (non-work). Thank you Nance!

 

Laura PourMeADrink

(42,770 posts)
132. thought I was going to make a friend cry the other night at a party when
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 09:47 PM
Feb 2017

I told him I thought less of him because he voted for Trump. He just kept apologizing - saying ALL he cared about was something to spark the economy...didn't mean he respected the guy.

Wonder how many are like that - just thought...Billionaire...he can get us booming again. Didn't see all the slug behavior or just shooed it away

The Wizard

(12,545 posts)
135. Willful ignorance:
Tue Feb 21, 2017, 11:16 PM
Feb 2017

It's in their DNA as much as self delusion and unbridled hatred and bigotry. They hate themselves almost as much as they hate normal people. Let's face it. They're just weird.

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