What am i missing. We are provoking a war with NK. They are a sovereign nation.

[nikibatts]

Where do we get off denying another country the ability to test weapons for their own protection? WTF!!!
They test missiles every time this year in celebration of their anniversary. WTF They have been doing this for years. So what? Are we all insane as 45? i bet we will throw some bombs at them for no good reason. This is insanity!

[NCTraveler]

1. It's not possible to...

"Throw some bombs at them."

That's why the situation is and has been so frightening.

[Warpy]

3. Exactly, and we all know the administration doesn't get this

The SK government is still in a certain amount of flux after the impeachment, so I don't know if they've managed to tell Asshole to back off convincingly enough. Maybe the Japanese will get through the cement under that idiotic hair.

[Ezior]

2. It's because of their continued threats against the US, I guess (nt)

[nikibatts]

13. What f*ing threats? They respond to our threats.

[treestar]

25. The purpose of those is to get food aid

and keep the Kims in power. That's all.

[guillaumeb]

4. Starting a war is a proven way to increase approval levels and support.

That people could die is secondary to those who start the wars.

[Tom Rinaldo]

21. The same though must be said about North Korea, more so actually

The entire regime rests on a permanent war footing - whereas the public is indoctrinated to rally tightly behind their leader because the whole world is against them and supposedly always on the verge of attacking them. North Korea is the poster child for using war and the threat of it to shore up domestic support. This behavior predates Trump becoming President by decades.

[lies]

5. The US

Has a long history of not giving a shit about other countries sovereignty.

This is just the first time the US has tried this against a nation with nukes.

[PragmaticLiberal]

6. Not fan of this admininstration (obviously) but NK isn't just testing weapons.

They're testing weapons while also threatening their neighbors.

A little different.

[MineralMan]

7. NK is not a well-meaning nation,

in any way. Truly.

[nikibatts]

14. I get that. But why don't we leave them the f alone?

Proving them makes us not well-meaning also. They live in a regions surrounded by nukes and US military. They should sit back and just not feel threatened? Technically they are still in a state of war with S.Korea. We have sanctioned them, reneged on previous agreements since back in the 80 s, and we keep dissing them and their leader. What should they do, just say they see themselves as unequal and undeserving as a nation and that they will do anything we say? I don't get it.

Every day there are more deaths in the Congo under the brutal leadership of some nasty leaders. We don't give a damn about the children being killed there. But let's go saber rattle with a nation that is making or already has some nukes because they keep testing their missiles.

[MineralMan]

18. North Korea would invade South Korea if it were not

for US forces in the south. There is no question about that. South Korea is an ally and trading partner with the United States. North Korea is not building nuclear weapons for defense. It is building them to threaten South Korea.

North Korea's leader is demonstrably not mentally stable. The threat of his potential for using nuclear devices on his neighbor to the south is a real one.

That is why we do not leave them alone.

[hack89]

23. They are a global criminal enterprise that encompasses drugs, counterfeiting and arms trafficking

besides illegally selling nuclear and missile technology to anyone with cash, they are involved in organized crime on a massive scale.

The alleged illicit activities of the North Korean state extend to the manufacture and sale of illegal drugs, the manufacture and sale of counterfeit goods, human trafficking, arms trafficking, counterfeiting currency (especially the United States dollar and Chinese yuan), and other areas.[1][2] Many of these activities are undertaken at the direction and under the control of, the North Korean government and the ruling Korean Workers' Party, with their proceeds going towards advancing the country's nuclear and conventional arms production, funding the lifestyles of the country's elite, and propping up the national economy.[3]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea%27s_illicit_activities

[WinkyDink]

29. And Lord knows, WE would never engage in such activities, especially arms trafficking! Ahem:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/william-hartung/from-iraq-to-egypt-to-yem_b_11723370.html

[hack89]

30. Just explaining why the world has good reasons not to "leave them alone".

I would also point out that the US is not peddling nuclear weapons technology nor drugs.

[d_r]

8. but last night the plans of a future war was all I saw on channel 4

[Calculating]

9. Every year they're developing longer range ballistic missiles

And they continually threaten to nuke the US about 20-30x per year. Seems like a cause for concern right? What happens when they get nukes that can actually reach us? The longer we wait to deal with little kimmy, the harder it will be. He's not a sane or rational leader in any sense. The NK government is also guilty of obscene human rights abuses on par with things done by the WW2 era Germans and Japanese.

Watch this video, and then tell me about how you're fine with NK developing longer ranged nuclear arms.

[nikibatts]

16. So how many countries now have nukes? Are these countries treating us? Who is treating us?

Those without nukes are our biggest and real threat. Nuking by anyone is suicidal. We suffer more real acts of terror from people without nukes, who see the US as occupiers, invaders, disrespect of their religion, supporters of harsh dictators, and electors of imbeciles to run their government.

Meanwhile we maintain thousands of military in bases all over the world in welcoming and unwelcoming environments. Why can we not see that we are the imposing threat to so many people? Why can't we see that we are the bully with the nukes? Why don't we understand what it means to be the only nation to have EVER used nukes on civilian populations? WTF is wrong with us? No we don't care about human or civil rights. We support coups of legitimately elected heads of governments, turn our backs on black people suffering under the most repressive military regimes that we could take out with a few automatic weapons, disproportionately in-prison our black and brown populations, and carry out some of the most vicious police brutality actions and murders of our citizens. Think about it!

[jberryhill]

28. "Nuking by anyone is suicidal"

Suicide is one of the leading causes of deaths.

Suicide is a common human behavior. In the US, more than 40,000 people are going to kill themselves this year.

When you say it would be "suicidal", then the implicit conclusion of that statement, to you, is that "therefore no one would do it."

But people demonstrably do suicidal things every day.

In the larger political context, it was suicidal for Germany to wage war on two fronts against countries with access to larger industrial resources. Hitler did it anyway, and in the end he did indeed commit suicide.

So, what is it you mean to suggest by saying it is "suicidal"?

Because if you mean to suggest "therefore no one will do it", then the obvious fact that people DO commit suicide in large numbers clearly doesn't support your argument.

[spanone]

10. trump's been emboldened by all the love he got from both sides of congress

he knows what moves hearts & minds now....killing people

[Oneironaut]

11. This post is a laughable absurdity.

NK is by no means interested in just its own self-defense. They want nukes so that they can use them. They want to reunite Korea by any means necessary.

I can almost guarantee that, when NK gets nukes that can reach the US, the ransom demands and terroristic threats will begin. Given enough nukes, NK will preemptively strike the US mainland, SK, and Japan. They're trying to hide and grow their military capability at the moment in preparation for the Dear Leader's "Great War." North Korea is a cancer.

Kim Jong-Un is not a rational actor. He's not like the Soviets were at all. He believes that his destiny is to destroy the US and unite Korea under his rule, and he doesn't care how many die to do so. If he is not dealt with, the consequences can be catastrophic. This is a ticking time bomb that grows in strength every day.

I'm not for invading NK, but that bomb needs to be defused before the world turns to shite.

[Kentonio]

26. There's absolutely no indication that they would pre-emptively strike anyone

They're a regime of vile, grubby little gangsters would want to hold onto their ill-gotten power and wealth, not suicidal fanatics. I'd expect them to bluster and threaten just like they do now, but actually using them would mean the immediate destruction of themselves and everything they control. They're thieves and bullies, not idealists.

[treestar]

27. Kim wants to stay in power

That's all. The reunification stuff is a feel good goal to throw out there.

[SaschaHM]

12. Wow...

North Korea and that unhinged fat kid aren't testing nukes for their own protection. Be a Dove, that's fine, but don't be naive.

[MicaelS]

15. What part of he keeps threatening...

To nuke the US do you not get? Apparently any, and all of it.

[nikibatts]

43. I get it all. How many years has this been going on? And what do you mean by "threatening?"

Has N.K. even bombed any place since the Korean War?

[EX500rider]

48. I'll help:

This list is just since 2010:

January 27, 2010: North Korea fires artillery shells into the water near Baengnyeong Island and South Korean vessels return fire.[29][30] Three days later, North Korea continued to fire artillery towards the area.[31]
March 26, 2010: A South Korean naval vessel, the ROKS Cheonan, was allegedly sunk by a North Korean torpedo near Baengnyeong Island in the Yellow Sea. A rescue operation recovered 58 survivors but 46 sailors were killed. On May 20, 2010, a South Korean led international investigation group concluded that the sinking of the warship was in fact the result of a North Korean torpedo attack.[32][33] North Korea denied involvement.[34] The United Nations Security Council made a Presidential Statement condemning the attack but without identifying the attacker.[35]
October 29, 2010: Two shots are fired from North Korea toward a South Korean post near Hwacheon and South Korean troops fire three shots in return.[36]
November 23, 2010: North Korea fired artillery at South Korea's Greater Yeonpyeong island in the Yellow Sea and South Korea returned fire. Two South Korean marines and two South Korean civilians were killed, six were seriously wounded, and ten were treated for minor injuries. About seventy South Korean houses were destroyed.[37][38][39] North Korean casualties were unknown, but Lee Hong-gi, the Director of Operations of the South Korean Joint Chiefs of Staff (JCS), claimed that as a result of the South Korean retaliation "there may be a considerable number of North Korean casualties".[40]
October 6, 2012: An 18-year-old North Korean Army private defects to South Korea. He is apparently not detected as he crossed the DMZ and has to knock on an ROK barracks door to draw attention to himself. The soldier later tells investigators that he defected after killing two of his superiors.[41][42]
September 16, 2013: A 47-year-old man is shot dead by South Korean soldiers while trying to swim across the Tanpocheon Stream near Paju to North Korea.[43]
February 26, 2014: South Korean defense officials claim that despite warnings a North Korean warship has repeatedly crossed into South Korean waters overnight.[44]
March 24, 2014: A North Korean drone is found crashed near Paju. The onboard cameras contain pictures of the Blue House and military installations near the DMZ. Another North Korean drone crashes on Baengnyeongdo on March 31.[45][46]
October 10, 2014: North Korean forces fire anti-aircraft rounds at propaganda balloons launched from Paju. South Korean military return fire after a warning.[47]
October 19, 2014: A group of North Korean soldiers approach the South Korean border and South Korean soldiers fire warning shots. The North Korean soldiers return fire before retreating. No injuries or property damage result.[48]
June 15, 2015: A teenaged North Korean soldier walks across the DMZ and defects at a South Korean guard post in north-eastern Hwacheon.[49]
August 4, 2015: Two South Korean soldiers were wounded after stepping on landmines that had allegedly been laid on the southern side of the DMZ by North Korean forces next to a ROK guard post.[50] Kim Jin Moon of the South Korean-based Korea Institute for Defense Analyses, suggested that the incident was planned by members of the General Bureau of Reconnaissance to prove their loyalty to Kim Jong-un.[51]
August 20, 2015: As a reaction to the August 4 landmines, South Korea resumed playing propaganda on loudspeakers near the border.[52] In 2004 both sides had agreed to end their loudspeaker broadcasts at each other.[53] North Korea threatened to attack those loudspeakers, and on August 20 North Korea fired a rocket and shells across the border into Yeoncheon County. South Korea responded by firing artillery shells back at the origin of the rocket. There were no reports of injuries on either side.[52][54] Following threats of war from the North, and various troops movements by both North and South Korea and the United States, an agreement was reached on August 24 that North Korea would express sympathy for the landmine incident in return for South Korea deactivating the loudspeakers.[55]
January 3, 2016: South Korean soldiers fired warning shots at a suspected North Korean drone near the DMZ

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_border_incidents_involving_North_Korea#2010s

[Demsrule86]

17. They are a threat to us no doubt...but this entire thing is being mishandled.

And the orange asshat is on record as saying nukes could be used...so are the generals... big boys who want to play with their deadly toys. Literally millions could die...the fear of course is he will have missiles that can reach the US.

[spanone]

19. you are not missing anything. we have a raving lunatic in the white house

[Tommy_Carcetti]

20. My biggest concern is that it's a death trap.

The Kims have always been lunatics, yet they've always managed to be contained.

The problem comes in when you now have a lunatic on the other side as well.

[Initech]

22. It's fucking insane. It's the military industrial complex's fault.

And they need to stop stepping in places where they don't belong. As someone who lives on the West Coast, I'm incredibly fearful of what would happen if Trump were to provoke North Korea.

[Calculating]

34. Worst case scenario is they detonate a nuke off the coastline

After smuggling it here on a ship.

[hack89]

24. They are also an international criminal enterprise

besides illegally selling nuclear and missile technology to anyone with cash, they are involved in organized crime on a massive scale.

The alleged illicit activities of the North Korean state extend to the manufacture and sale of illegal drugs, the manufacture and sale of counterfeit goods, human trafficking, arms trafficking, counterfeiting currency (especially the United States dollar and Chinese yuan), and other areas.[1][2] Many of these activities are undertaken at the direction and under the control of, the North Korean government and the ruling Korean Workers' Party, with their proceeds going towards advancing the country's nuclear and conventional arms production, funding the lifestyles of the country's elite, and propping up the national economy.[3]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea%27s_illicit_activities

[nikibatts]

41. About whom are you speaking? N.K. or the USA or Russia?

[hack89]

42. Please don't play stupid.

It is not a flattering look and, besides, you don't do it well.

[Rustyeye77]

31. Great... Let them keep developing nukes.

That's right , "who are we"?

When they nuke the west coast eventually, you will figure it out.

[Javaman]

32. welcome to america!

after george w. moron* chose to invade another sovereign nation, all bets were off after that.

[sarisataka]

33. What you are missing

Is that there is an ongoing war on the Korean peninsula. There has only been a, oft- violated, cease-fire in place. North Korea has declared that it considers the Armistice over, that all non-aggression Agreements are void and that it has the right to a nuclear preemptive attack.

Seoul is a city of over 10 million people and the most likely target of a preemptive attack.

[Yo_Mama]

39. Yes, and I think the slowly growing opinion is that this guy is so nuts he might do anything.

China does seem concerned at this time.

He's in violation of the UN. This is not a situation in which these other countries, including the US, are picking a fight.

[Adrahil]

35. While I agree that Trump is handling this badly....

The idea that we would allow any "sovereign" nation to do whatever it pleases is a little.... naive.

[taught_me_patience]

36. They torture and enslave people

I don't know why we've let them get away with it for so long. I completely disagree with your op... I think we should do more to facilitate regime change there.

[Calculating]

37. I agree

After the holocaust people all said NEVER AGAIN! It's happening again to innocent people, and the world is standing by doing nothing. NK is guilty of human rights abuses which are on par with those by the Nazis and Japanese of WW2. The only difference is the scale.

[Yo_Mama]

38. They are threatening other countries. Testing weapons is one thing, testing and

threatening other nations is another.

Here is a BBC article from 2015:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-21710644

Personally I have no idea. Their leader is a nutcase. Anything could happen. China seems concerned. Obviously SK & Japan are too.

[nikibatts]

40. So which nations have they threatened and when?

[hack89]

44. You have to be trolling

no one can be so ignorant, especially with Google at their finger tips.

[former9thward]

45. Why the apologies for North Korea?

They are a nation ruled by a madman dictator who has enslaved his people. He has threatened to unleash nuclear weapons on the U.S. and several other nations. We are not required to wait until a bomb or missile finally gets it right. He richly deserves whatever he gets.

[EX500rider]

46. "What am i missing?" A lot...

Where do we get off denying another country the ability to test weapons for their own protection? WTF!!!

Sorry, it's the UN sanctions in place that prevent missile tests, not the US.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_Nations_Security_Council_resolutions_concerning_North_Korea

[Alea]

47. This thread is bonkers

But with some darn good replies