General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe next time you are thinking about praising Bernie Sanders....
...remember that he didnt lift a single finger to help John Ossoff in GA6. Not a tweet, not a comment, nothing.
And on the same night that John Ossoff was fighting to get to 50%, Bernie was on Chris Hayes' show again reiterating that he is NOT a Democrat and never will be.
Bernie is right on all of the issues, but he needs to recognize his position as a thought leader and help candidates like Ossoff who are busting their asses trying to provide a check on Trump.
Bernie let America down on this one.
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retrowire
(10,345 posts)This leads one to think. I never considered Bernie perfect. But he has a very loud voice right now that should be used for good as much as possible.
I don't know why he didn't use it for ossof, maybe he had reasons.
olegramps
(8,200 posts)He knew he didn't have a snowball change in hell of winning. So he signs up to run as a Democrat yet he doesn't support the party or its candidates. I think he should shit or get off the pot.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)These identity politics are just confusing everyone.
What are his goals? The same as mine. Drop the brand loyalty and understand the substance of what the Democratic party wants to be. Because it's the substance that matters, not the stupid title.
I'm only proudly a democrat because of our goals,not our title. And Bernie's goals align with mine.
Norbert9
(494 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)retrowire
(10,345 posts)Because I had a feeling it MIGHT mean something else. But I'll try to explain.
I mean identity politics as in, the battle of whether or not our identity is because of a simple label or something else.
And I believe we shouldn't care so much about the label as much as the substance of our goals.
I hope I didn't fuck that explanation up.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Them very deeply. As if their concerns are nothing compared to all those Trump identity voters who's fear of POC and women's advancement was a major factor in electing DT.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)Could you further educate me so I don't make that mistake again? I'm still a little confused.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Advocating for social change. There was tons of dismissal of this very idea last year as is these policies should not be important to women, POC, immigrants and others who value equality. Many wanted to "set aside" these issues as they might "alienate" the rust belt /WWC vote.
Others pointed out that Trump ran using people's fear of America losing its "identity" - as a majority white patriarchy- to catapult himself into office. That is very much the schism that Putin has used all over Europe as well. I'm thinking that part of DTs campaign was inspired by Putin's successful leverage of bigotry in Europe.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)Like, women and POC were accused of making politics all about their identities? Like that?
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)How POC "can't be blamed" for voting for Obama. It's always accompanied by a patriarchal attitude of "they don't know what's good for 'them'." "them" (being the MOST loyal base the Dem party has) being asked to sit down and shut up so we don't scare the men of the rust belt.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)
SammyWinstonJack
(44,316 posts)
LisaM
(29,599 posts)One party supports choice. The other doesn't.
One party instituted Social Security. The other disparaged it.
One party pushed through the Civil Rights Act in the 1960s, knowing full well it would come at a giant electoral cost for decades (which proved true) but still didn't back down.
One party has nominated both a POC and a women as its candidate. The other hasn't.
I could go on, but you should get the drift. There is a lot of difference between parties.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)Substance above title.
Democrats from the olden age are not the same as today for example.
LisaM
(29,599 posts)The problem is marginalization of message.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)
Paka
(2,760 posts)My sentiments exactly.
yodermon
(6,153 posts)does this really need explaining.
SticksnStones
(2,108 posts)yodermon
(6,153 posts)and split the liberal vote on election day.
Some of his die-hards argue that he would have won anyway. It was never polled, so who knows. I don't think he would have won.
SticksnStones
(2,108 posts)Still, we're stuck with this worthless excuse for a 45th
CrispyQ
(40,906 posts)SticksnStones
(2,108 posts)
whopis01
(3,916 posts)If he had run as an independent, he would have ran in the Presidential election.
He did not run in the Presidential election.
WhiteTara
(31,254 posts)olegramps
(8,200 posts)I think that a party in more than just a name. It has a plank stating its values and mission. What is the plank of the Independent Party?
lapucelle
(21,040 posts)Sanders was candid about needing the organizational resources of the DNC.
https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2016-03-15/sanders-yes-im-a-democrat-of-convenience
brush
(61,033 posts)by saying he isn't a Democrat and never will be.
There's a word for that.
lapucelle
(21,040 posts)yodermon
(6,153 posts)1) he would have split the vote
2) he needed the party's apparatus
I know, I know, how dare he exist.
lapucelle
(21,040 posts)He said he was running as a Democrat because he needed the structure and resources of the party apparatus. He never said he was reluctant to split the vote, and none of his actions demonstrated that this was a concern.
You do not speak for Senator Sanders. He speaks for himself, and I take the man at his word.
Plucketeer
(12,882 posts)He also didn't know he didn't have a snowball's chance of winning on the Dem ticket either. And it wasn't because he couldn't inspire folks - it was because they'd already chosen their winner - they just forgot to tell Bernie that!
Gore1FL
(22,937 posts)Unlike Parliamentary systems, we build our coalitions before the election rather than afterward. Third Party Candidates for president are always going to fail because of the mathematical issues created by the electoral college rules.
Historic NY
(39,962 posts)other than they like to hear the sound. Dear Leader has a loud voice.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)He accomplished plenty.
Gothmog
(178,858 posts)retrowire
(10,345 posts)I don't know why. But it does alter my perception.
calimary
(89,816 posts)He had NO good reasons for not helping.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)calimary
(89,816 posts)
retrowire
(10,345 posts)Your opinion of Bernie is certainly different from mine but I'm just saying, I'm not above judging the man for his actions.
heaven05
(18,124 posts)
retrowire
(10,345 posts)The democratic party sure didn't get the attention of millions of young voters because of Bernie!
/S
heaven05
(18,124 posts)in my travels and yes, he did get their votes and when he lost, they went home and stayed home election day. That did not help our Party defeat the thugs.....HRC was still our best hope in keeping this country somewhat centrist/left. Establishment politician or not, she WAS our best hope.
The country is now watching the con man do what every one of the HRC detractors used as an excuse for not voting for HRC or for the boy-potus. She was in league with the bankers/goldman sachs BS. Well con-job is right there with his hand out to be filled by bankers/goldman sachs.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)I'm sure plenty of others did as well.
heaven05
(18,124 posts)is that what you mean?
retrowire
(10,345 posts)I stayed with the party and voted Hillary as Bernie advised!
Eliot Rosewater
(34,282 posts)I know what I know about Bernie, Thom and others.
I wish my theory about them wasnt proved everyday in one way or another, but it is.
lapucelle
(21,040 posts)They didn't take his warnings seriously enough to actually listen to him.
But I guess getting attention from millions of people is an accomplishment.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)I am living proof your assumption is wrong.
And Hillary won the majority.
You are wrong.
lapucelle
(21,040 posts)he couldn't turn out his voters for Democrats in sufficient numbers to make a difference.
It's wonderful that Sanders got you to the polls. I'd caution you, however, about making hasty generalizations based on single instances.
I always vote, whether the election is for president or library board member. I don't understand people who need to be led to the polls or inspired to vote. Nor do I understand those who weaponize their votes in ways that work against the greater good. For all the party's imperfections, my default position has always been and still remains Democratic.
http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2016/11/why-clinton-lost-bitter-bernie-crooked-comey-and-wounded-working-class
http://www.newsweek.com/susan-sarandon-third-party-candidates-jill-stein-gary-johnson-hillary-clinton-519032
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/11/dissecting-the-youth-vote/507416/
The Wielding Truth
(11,433 posts)not Bernie.
lapucelle
(21,040 posts)Comey, the Russians, the casual promulgation and acceptance of gender-based double standards, a right-wing funded Clinton misinformation industry that has existed for 25 years, a media narrative that has hardened into stone, the BoBs, the Steiners, the lazy no-shows. And she still won by 3,000,000 votes.
Absent any one of those factors, she probably would have won the electoral college.
I'm looking ahead. I'll be hubdialing from NY for Ossoff in Georgia and attending my county DNC Women's Caucus meeting next week. I'm not giving up.
mythology
(9,527 posts)He's not Kim Jong Un nor does he have any desire to be a dictator. You could have made your point without the inaccurate and childish insult.
Historic NY
(39,962 posts)retrowire
(10,345 posts)
druidity33
(6,907 posts)
QC
(26,371 posts)
lefthandedskyhook
(1,177 posts)I'm sure it was an unpleasant choice
lefthandedskyhook
(1,177 posts)He was not opposed by most Dems because they understand
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)It's extremely clear.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)
JudyM
(29,785 posts)Please 
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)I can oppose Trump and the GOP ... AND ... I can defend Democrats and the Democratic Party from smears and lies (no matter the source.) Nobody gets a free pass.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)I'm only with the Democratic party because Bernie led me here.
And then he taught me to stay here.
He told me to vote Hillary and I did.
He's not doing as much harm as so many think he is. Put down the pitchforks.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Because it's obvious to me doesn't mean it's obvious to you. Nor does it mean I am right, tho I am certain I am.
No clue what you mean by "pitchfork" with respect to my comment. If that is the direction I wanted to go I have plenty of ammo against Sanders. Yet I don't. I try to be respectful to the many good Sanders people here, all of whom are very aware of his legendary ego. It's not some kind of secret and is a trait possessed by many career politicians.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)I don't see that in Bernie or his actions. How do you?
Akamai
(1,779 posts)of a lot of it was from treasonous, lying billionaires and corporations), there were independents willing to consider a Democratic candidate, especially as Bernie focused on top ideas that appealed to Americans in general.
I think that Bernie greatly grew the party. And I sure as hell hope that we address important issues that most of us agree with.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)We're all allies god damnit! lol Who the fuck cares who leads us? As long as it gets people to see that Republicans are shit and Democrats are the best bet at making things right again.
Bernie may not be perfect, I might not have spoken actively about Ossoff, BUT HE ISN'T HELPING THE OTHER SIDE. And that's the point!
Progressive dog
(7,597 posts)The Wielding Truth
(11,433 posts)
Cha
(318,631 posts)snip//
Sen. Bernie Sanders wrongly claimed that voter turnout in 2016 was “the lowest … in 20 years.” In fact, turnout was higher than it was in 2012.
The overall turnout was 60.2 percent in 2016, up from 58.6 percent four years earlier. In addition, the percentage of eligible voters casting ballots for president in 2016 was 59.3 percent — the third highest in the last 44 years. Only 2008 and 2004 were higher.
More..
http://www.factcheck.org/2017/04/sanders-wrong-voter-turnout/
BS also said on Chris Hayes that the Democratic Party needed to be Open to Independents.. forgetting that the Democratic Party let him in when all he had done was bash it for years.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)The ACTUAL and TRUE voter turnout numbers are MUCH BETTER than he's saying. I'm very pleased to learn that things aren't as bad as we're being told. Someone should send him an email or a tweet to let him know that he's been mistaken about this important FACT. The doom and gloom and negativity toward the Democratic Party needs to stop, and maybe if everyone knew the TRUE numbers, their outlook and attitude would improve. I myself am very optimistic about the future of our great party. I'm exceedingly proud to be a Democrat and I'm sincerely happy to support the Democratic Party.
Cha
(318,631 posts) Jackie!
spooky3
(38,549 posts)Cha
(318,631 posts) rgbecker
(4,890 posts)I'm eager to see what comes of the real election coming up between the chosen Republican and Ossoff. Will Ossoff have moved to the district by that time? Reports are that he isn't able to vote there. Is that possible?
I don't get all the Bernie bashing on DU. Is there one major issue you disagree with him on?
I'm waiting word from powers that be on this board about who we are supporting for President in 2020 now that Clinton declares she is not running again. Trump has already raised millions and has been holding rallies. We are licking our wounds in the corner waiting for the impeachment.
delisen
(7,342 posts)Norbert9
(494 posts)left-of-center2012
(34,195 posts)
virtualobserver
(8,760 posts)while people on this site trash him.
Bernie bad. Bad Bernie.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)
Eliot Rosewater
(34,282 posts)it here on DU.
some of us arent fooled
virtualobserver
(8,760 posts)they are trying to repair it.
Eliot Rosewater
(34,282 posts)not voting or voting 3rd party and spending all your spare time attacking it.
Personally, neither the party or ANY of you so called progressives are anywhere NEAR liberal or left enough for me, but I also am aware of how the two party system works.
virtualobserver
(8,760 posts)A party will not evolve without critical voices.
Eliot Rosewater
(34,282 posts)understand the two party system and more importantly I dont have an agenda to actually elect more republicans.
Some here do.
virtualobserver
(8,760 posts)JudyM
(29,785 posts)fortunately.
rgbecker
(4,890 posts)He ran for Democratic nominee for President. What else do want from him? He brought good ideas which were adopted by the Convention in the platform. Why do you bash him and his supporters? Which positions of his don't you support and why?
His criticism seems aimed at moving the Party towards what people have said they want. A healthcare system that works for everyone, minimum wage that will actually provide a living and schooling beyond high school for everyone who wants it to prepare for the future. Enough with the bank bailouts, trade policies that drive down wages and special tax deductions for fossil fuel miners. Save Social Security by raising the exemption from payment for those wages over $118,000 to at least $250,000.
What is it you can't support?
Eliot Rosewater
(34,282 posts)and educating myself on Bernie over 10 years ago LONG before most here knew who he was.
What I cant support is convincing millions of young, often new voters that all of a sudden it is OK to demand perfection in a candidate.
What I cant support is Bernie spending most of his time criticizing one party to the benefit of the other. You see when you constantly attack the democratic party while simultaneously becoming interesting to millennials, and you spend very little of that time explaining how the two party system works, many of those millennials end up NOT voting or voting 3rd party when the democratic candidate doesnt stand up to BERNIE quality standards.
This is what happened last year and is going to happen again in 2018. I say some folks are doing this on purpose.
Where was Bernie on Ossoff?
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)The guy that is trying to help us the most, is consistent, not wishy washy, and one of the most progressive members in Congress gets trashed almost as much as Trump does.
It's pitiful. Yes, the guy makes mistakes. He's human. He's not going to support everyone you want him to support. But he is a hell of a lot better than most members of Congress from either party.
Demit
(11,238 posts)
lark
(26,058 posts)Hyperbole much? Yes, there are a number of people here who are disappointed at how he isn't supporting a nationwide progressive movement and seems to be all about himself only. However, you will never see anyone here disparaging him like we do Drumpf. There is no real comparison at all and I don't know why you would play into this inaccurate meme? It's just divisive and unproductive.
BS has defined himself as not a democrat, let's believe him and stop acting like he is the only person out there working to get DEms elected. I watched in 2016 where he talked his game but didn't follow up, like with the guy he was supposedly supporting in Fla.
lark
(26,058 posts)Post the link where someone said Drumpf is better than Sanders, just one. I'm on here every day and I've never ever seen anything even equating the 2, much less putting Sanders below Hair Furor. Don't know why you would promote this divisive and totally inaccurate meme?
Cha
(318,631 posts)I just call him out when he's wrong.. like this..
Sanders Wrong on Voter Turnout
snip//
Sen. Bernie Sanders wrongly claimed that voter turnout in 2016 was “the lowest … in 20 years.” In fact, turnout was higher than it was in 2012.
The overall turnout was 60.2 percent in 2016, up from 58.6 percent four years earlier. In addition, the percentage of eligible voters casting ballots for president in 2016 was 59.3 percent — the third highest in the last 44 years. Only 2008 and 2004 were higher.
More..
http://www.factcheck.org/2017/04/sanders-wrong-voter-turnout/
Cha
(318,631 posts)with accusations of "feeble" "can't fight back" on Rachel's show and more insults.. "..the Democratic Party of liberal elites.." in Boston with Sen Warren..
When ssarandon is the Elitist..
Who suckered the LOW INFORMATION voters with LIES like these..
"The prominent Sanders backer also predicted that a Hillary Clinton indictment was "inevitable"
Susan Sarandon: Hillary Clinton more dangerous than Donald Trump
http://www.salon.com/2016/06/03/susan_sarandon_hillary_clinton_more_dangerous_than_donald_trump/
poor ssarandon
"had to change her phone number.." while the rest of the country that isn't so well off have to worry about this among other trumpshite..
Link to tweet
Hekate
(100,133 posts)Norbert9
(494 posts)
And he scolds no one more than trump by the way. So just not true.
JTFrog
(14,274 posts)The things he thinks are helpful I can't understand. Calling to primary a sitting Democratic President, claiming our Democratic nominee was not qualified to be President, calling the party corrupt and the primaries rigged. About as far as you can get from valid or constructive criticism.
Democratic party "corruption" has kept Bernie Sanders in Washington for the last twenty five years. He whines about "rigged" Democratic party processes, about insiders, about the party keeping the little guy out of power. Bernie Sanders is actually fine with all of that. As long as it benefits him. Take a look at his electoral history sometime. Did he go off about corruption when the Dems turned their back on Dolores Sandoval for him? How about all the other times he has benefited?
TDale313
(7,822 posts)I'm sadly starting to thing a friend of mine was right. Too many Dems would rather have lost to Trump than have won with Bernie.
SammyWinstonJack
(44,316 posts)
joet67
(624 posts)him for saving the party from itself. I watched it all unfold right here. Hopefully at some point we can all agree not to give up on everything we have stood for for the last 80 years. We are too close to winning it all back, now that the Republicans are spontaneously combust-ing. We really ought to think about amnesty on DU for some of the Bernie took who were booted. I have a feeling he's already running for 2020. ??
secondwind
(16,903 posts)Demit
(11,238 posts)which is going on NOW. Bernie is using it to be very vocal about how he's not a Democrat.
JudyM
(29,785 posts)but that isn't of any concern to them.
Leith
(7,864 posts)Do we know how much campaigning that people like John Lewis did? How about Nancy Pelosi? Keith Ellison? How much support did Ossoff get from them?
Yet this thread points out that someone who isn't even a Democrat didn't do enough. That sounds like a main symptom of Sanders Derangement Syndrome.
thesquanderer
(12,976 posts)...made a great point in their posts. This being a very traditional Republican district, it's possible that visible support from Sanders--or other prominent Dems for that matter--might not have been a positive. (And they may well have realized that too.)
murielm99
(32,944 posts)That is always true for women.
thesquanderer
(12,976 posts)And not my impression on DU overall. But without doing a mathematical analysis of the threads, I guess there's no way to know for sure which of them is more often held to the higher standard here.
Cha
(318,631 posts)with accusations of "feeble" "can't fight back" on Rachel's show and more insults.. "..the Democratic Party of liberal elites.." in Boston with Sen Warren..
When ssarandon is the Elitist..
Who suckered the LOW INFORMATION voters with LIES like these..
"The prominent Sanders backer also predicted that a Hillary Clinton indictment was "inevitable"
Susan Sarandon: Hillary Clinton more dangerous than Donald Trump
http://www.salon.com/2016/06/03/susan_sarandon_hillary_clinton_more_dangerous_than_donald_trump/
poor ssarandon "had to change her phone number.." while the rest of the country that isn't so well off have to worry about this among other trumpshite..
Link to tweet
LovingA2andMI
(7,006 posts)As in all of the Bernie Bashing as if it is Bernie's fault Ossoff did not get 50% + 1 because he did not go down to Georgia. Last time we checked, this is not Bernie's job to go everywhere and do everything. 
Here's a better question, did Tom Perez go because if so, we missed it? 
Paladin
(32,354 posts)
grantcart
(53,061 posts)He was asked to help he would have been happy to help.
I assume they asked him not to say anything because that worked better in that particular district.
Earth Bound Misfit
(3,584 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)WoonTars
(694 posts)...just so we're consistent...
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)Kentonio
(4,377 posts)But of course the rules are never evenly applied when it comes to Bernie. Anything bad that happens is clearly his fault, while anything good is despite him not because of him.
Bernie let America down? Give it a frikkin rest already..
secondwind
(16,903 posts)Where was Tom Perez, or Hillary for that matter?
Nope, this is somehow Bernie's fault....or something
SammyWinstonJack
(44,316 posts)
Thank you. 
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)not doing enough in the other recent special election, despite the fact he himself did nothing.
I don't know how it's possible to continually point the finger at others without thinking about his own actions or lack thereof.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)BainsBane
(57,741 posts)as do campaigns. So if that is the standard, why is Bernie complaining?
PatsFan87
(368 posts)money went instead of adequately funding state parties. Former vice chair Ray Buckley never even saw the budget. Thompson was asking for help and money and was denied. I guess the 50 state strategy is just good to use in speeches and not in practice.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)which you would know if you had volunteered for a campaign.
The DNC raised far less than Sanders last year. Not even close.
And that was due to corporate sponsors. Yet it's only about 1/3 of what Sanders had raised.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)The fundraising numbers you included are irrelevant since they are from 2016 and we all know the party has seen an increase in money and grassroots volunteering after Trump was elected. Do you have more recent, updated numbers? How the party chooses to spend that money is the question. Hopefully more useless ad buys and bloated contracts for failure consultants aren't in the future. And perhaps if you actually followed what Bernie is doing, he was the only politician who appeared in Kansas with Thompson. Perez was Casper the ghost- nowhere to be found.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Last edited Wed Apr 19, 2017, 10:43 AM - Edit history (1)
You provide the numbers. That was all I could find. Besides, Bernie supporters were making those claims about DNC money during that same period.
The DNC is one organization of many. It is not "the party." People contribute to individual candidates, to the DCCC to the DSCC, to state parties. Even if Democrats have seen an upsurge in contributions, that doesn't necessarily mean the DNC has, particularly given the war on the DNC being waged by Democrats and independents with higher incomes.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)That is false. He was the one politician to go to Kansas with Thompson (while our 50 state strategy supporting DNC chair was nowhere to be found) and Our Revolution helped with fundraising and GOTV. Please stop spreading falsehoods just because they fit your narrative.
If you would like to know where I get my claims about the DNC, watch the DNC chair and vice chair debates on Democrats.org as well as some of the coverage. They were extremely enlightening.
And about the Kansas Dem. party being broke.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/4/6/1650871/-Kansas-Democratic-Party-didn-t-have-20k-to-help-a-House-special-election-5-days-away-Why
"I don’t think it’s atypical for campaigns to ask parties to chip in. We asked the party to pay for a $20,000 mail project that would essentially be an early voter outreach," Curtis [Thompson’s campaign chief] said.
Curtis referenced the party’s latest filing with the Federal Election Commission, which showed the party had $274,111 cash on hand at the end of February.
That figure appears to be in error, however.
A Feb. 20 letter from the FEC to the party says the filing lists a $143,000 transfer from "Hillary Victory Fund." But the FEC letter says a review shows only $14,300 was disbursed.
That would mean the party’s actual cash on hand was closer to $145,000.
Where did the $143,000 go?
Also:
In the days before Hillary Clinton launched an unprecedented big-money fundraising vehicle with state parties last summer, she vowed “to rebuild our party from the ground up,” proclaiming “when our state parties are strong, we win. That’s what will happen."
But less than 1 percent of the $61 million raised by that effort has stayed in the state parties’ coffers, according to a POLITICO analysis of the latest Federal Election Commission filings.
Our party has become insular and we should not forget about our state parties if we're serious about a 50 state strategy. Where is the money going?
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)As does Perez. That doesn't change the fact that DNC fundraising pales in comparison to Sanders own fundraising. To expect the DNC to rake in cash while trashing it is illogical. The clear result is that they, and in turn state parties, have less money. It's one thing to express concerns in DNC debates and meetings and another to use it in the media to bolster one's personal popularity. Clearly it has worked out very well for him.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)1) A lot of people don't trust and/or have high expectations in the DNC, and I can't say that I blame them.
2) Other political operations like Organizing for Action take resources away from state parties and grassroots movements. For perspective:
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/obama-democrats-party-building-234820
“It created a shadow organization that was recruiting the same volunteers [as the DNC], using resources from a very limited number of donors, and therefore, as a result it weakened the DNC and the impact that the DNC and state parties could have on politics during his tenure,” said South Carolina Democratic Party Chairman Jaime Harrison, a candidate for DNC chair. “You’ve got five organizations knocking on the same door with five different messages. That’s not conducive. In the age of Trump we need to be a lean, mean, strategic machine."
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Point the finger but assume no responsibility. The culture starts at the top.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)There's plenty of blame to go around.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)despite their constant attacks on the DNC. That was my point, one that you refuse to acknowledge.
When you all trash the DNC and the party, obviously their fundraising is down. Blaming everyone else for that is precisely what I have come to expect.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)leading the helm. Bernie supporters aren't responsible for her being a hot mess. That's on her and she can own her own words and actions. I acknowledge your point, I just think it's bs. Of course people aren't going to donate to the DNC when they've been losing seats all over the country and cling to failed strategies. You yourself posted low DNC fundraising numbers for the 2016 year which would be before the DWS/DNC drama came out. And the link I posted about OFA taking resources away from the DNC/state parties wasn't acknowledged either. That has been happening for years, before Bernie even ran for president. Care to talk about that?
PatsFan87
(368 posts)It's more suburban, wealthier than other districts, and typically Republican. Having Bernie come in wouldn't have helped and in fact might have hurt Ossoff when he's trying to appear as more of a moderate Dem. Let's play smart, folks!
Not to mention this race has already received huge attention, tons of outside money, and all of the attention of the Democratic party at the expense of other races like Thompson's and Quist's. We can spread out the love.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Doesn't apply to Bernie.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)If you want to parade Bernie through this wealthy, suburban, status quo Republican instead of populist Republican district while expecting his presence to help Ossoff, by all means go ahead. But you will be disappointed when it doesn't pay off. It's better to use him where his presence will pay off like in Quist's race in Montana which is more rural and populist. I know having an actual winning strategy is a novel concept for the party, but it will win seats.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)And are you actually suggesting that there exist people on earth who do not love Bernie?
PatsFan87
(368 posts)a candidate's chances rather than helping. That's a bad strategy. I'm sure there's some people in rural Maine where I live who like Nancy Pelosi. But a Democratic candidate would be off their rocker to parade her around up here just to excite the portion of very left Dems in the district who like her and are most likely voting for you anyways. What would be the purpose in doing that, to alienate the moderate voters you need and shooting yourself in the foot? If your overall strategy is to win over centrist and moderate Republicans, you are going to bring in centrist and moderate Dems to help. Pretty common sense.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)in political strategy. My point is a simple one: people should hold themselves to the same standards they demand of others.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)Hillary Clinton, to her credit, didn't campaign with Jason Kander in red Missouri. He almost won. Bernie won't campaign with Heidi Heitkamp in North Dakota just to excite his supporters in a deep red state all while giving Republicans ammo to tie her with a "big leftist". That would be insane. Bernie is one senator. We have 40+ other senators, we have governors, state reps, etc. Everyone can go to where they're needed and where they will be of the most assistance. Bernie is on a tour with Perez as we speak. If Perez wanted Bernie helping Ossoff, he'd have him there. This doesn't discredit what Bernie is criticizing the party of. If you're going to have a 50 state strategy, you have people SHOW UP. Everywhere. It doesn't have to be the same senator in every state, it should be the people tailor made for the voters in that district/state.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)And that is infinitely more important.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)Good luck to your team next year (unless they're the Jets, Broncos, or Ravens)! haha
pangaia
(24,324 posts)In football--- GO PACK !!!!
PatsFan87
(368 posts)And I was definitely rooting for the Packers over the Steelers in 2011!
pangaia
(24,324 posts)Weird, eh.
LOL !!!
PatsFan87
(368 posts)If I did that with the NFL, I'd have to root for the Seahawks. I love that dark blue & lime green combo.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Why doesn't Bernie spend the time he devotes to attacking Democrats on TV to calling up representatives and asking them to campaign?
PatsFan87
(368 posts)They're the ones who are supposed to be coordinating strategy and funds to get candidates elected. If they think a politician is needed in a state/district, they are the ones who are supposed to be setting that up.
I do find it interesting though that the same anti-Bernie folk who kick and scream about him having a leadership position in the party are the same ones who expect him to be the savior of the day- being the leader who's to do all the heavy lifting and the jobs of other party members. Which is it? You can't have it both ways.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)We are continually told he is the leader of the party. We hear him continually criticizing the party in the media, yet we are also told we have no right to expect anything from him. Personally, I expect nothing. I've been paying attention long enough to know where his concerns lie.
And your post confirms that you also know his attacks on Democrats on TV are not about improving the party.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)give you the sun, the moon, and the stars is rather unrealistic. Expecting him to be a full-time senator, DNC chair, fundraiser, deliverer of money to every single senate, representative, state senate/rep, gubernatorial candidate, full-time talking head on the news channels, traveler of the country to deliver our message, GOTV volunteer for every candidate, the person who wipes your rear end, does your laundry, and walks your dog, etc. is rather unrealistic. There's only so much time in the day. It's as if anti-Bernie folk have set an unreachable bar that can't be attained by any one person just so they can say "OMG LOOK, HE'S NOT DOING THIS! WHAT A FAILURE!!! SEE WHAT WE TOLD YOU??? HE'S NOT WHO YOU THINK HE IS!!!" He's one man who plays a PART in the process but this is an all hands on deck movement going on. And in spite of all of the anti-Bernie folk's efforts to try to undermine him, he has a huge following and will continue to have one. He's continually ranked as one of, if not the most popular Senator for a reason.
And his criticisms are absolutely about improving the party. If people don't want to consider what he, as well as many average Americans have to say, we can continue to hemorrhage seats and stay in the minority.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Last edited Wed Apr 19, 2017, 04:18 PM - Edit history (1)
and Bernie chooses to spend it in front of the cameras.
If his criticisms were about improving the party, he would communicate them directly to party officials, to which he has unfettered access, as opposed to his crowds.
He's "continually ranked" . . . out of 8 options. And even if he is the most popular, so what? Justin Bieber and Mylie Cyrus are popular. It doesn't mean I owe them fealty. I can still believe their music sucks.
The idea that Sanders has some sort of unique insight is absurd. Most of his comments about the loss have been proven false by data from voters. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2017/04/17/racism-motivated-trump-voters-more-than-authoritarianism-or-income-inequality
He's used the loss as an opportunity to rehash old complaints rather than basing them on an analysis of any data from the election.
http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2014/11/19/365024592/sen-bernie-sanders-on-how-democrats-lost-white-voters
I can't help but notice that Sanders now talks about returning to a Democratic Party from the 60s, when he decried the party back then.
Don't worry. I'm not trying to convince you he isn't infallible. I know full well that his supporters care first and foremost about his career, and that evidence is meaningless. You will just have to accept the fact that not all people value him, or any great men, over issues and citizens. I will never acquiesce to such a view of politics, regardless of the individual. I believe elected officials serve the voters and that obsequiousness toward them runs counter to democracy.
PatsFan87
(368 posts)working with Tom Perez, working on legislation, shedding light on important issues like workers wishing to unionize in Mississippi, working to elect progressives at all levels, etc. You'd be hard pressed to find a politician who works as tirelessly as he does.
You speak about him not bringing his criticisms to party officials as if you're his handler and follow him 24/7. You nor I know what he has and has not said behind the scenes to party officials.
And he's not ranked out of 8, the most recent poll had him on the top among every senator. http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/328214-poll-sanders-most-popular-senator-in-the-us
His popularity doesn't mean that you can not criticize him- just as I can criticize the DNC. Everyone has an opinion and falsehoods should be corrected on all sides.
Of course race played a factor in this election, as did rising healthcare/drug costs, job loss, drug related issues, etc. We should be asking previous Obama now Trump voters WHY they voted the way they did but many on here continue to dig in their heels, saying we should not reach out to Trump supporters to which I ask- So we never win the presidency again? We write those voters off? That seems unwise.
To many Bernie supporters, he is not a 60s era Democrats but a 30s/40s FDR Democrat proposing a new New Deal. He is proposing something modern Democrats hadn't been which is part of the appeal.
To dismiss his supporters as only caring about him and not the issues he has consistently stood for for 20+ years is both naive and condescending. His supporters are fight for $15 activists, anti-fracking activists, BLM activists, Occupy Wall Street activists, etc. What brings us together are the issues and standing up for the little guy and taking on the big guy. That's the overarching theme and the thread that ties us all together under one tent.
For someone who claims to not "heroicize" a politician, you sure do have extremely high, hero like expectations for Bernie. Perhaps use some of your anti-Bernie energy and direct it back to the issues you care about.
Plucketeer
(12,882 posts)If you're willing to listen, they'll tell you it was Bernie who handed the Oval office to Trump. I find it intriguing that I hardly see ANY mention of DWS anymore - the "leader" who presided over SO MANY lost government seats across the nation! Whar's the love for Darling Deb??? Or, where's the hate for her??? Nah - nothing to learn from that debacle. Blinders up and follow the leader!
I don't dwell on it too much, but I have to wonder what sorta criticism President Sanders would be pummeled with by Dems if he were at his 100-day mark. How much of themselves would Ryan and the Turtle have eaten at this point? Where would health care, infrastructure, wages and foreign policy be under Sanders at this point? How many of his current-day detractors would secretly be giddy as an un-harnessed (read that - un-obliged to special interests) fighter unabashedly confronted the other establishment?
PatsFan87
(368 posts)ehrnst
(32,640 posts)for thinking that getting behind more lefty candidates in very red state status quo Republican district races would pay off.
For sharing what appears to be uncommon sense.
secondwind
(16,903 posts)Cha
(318,631 posts)think it would be most helpful if he would stop insulting the Democratic Party when he gets a mic in front of him.. like on Rachel's Show when he accused us of being "feeble" and "can't fight back" and then when he was in Boston with Senator Warren attacking us for being the ".. the Democratic Party of the elite".
When it's ssarandon who is the elitist and lied about Hillary in the GE..
Who suckered the LOW INFORMATION voters with LIES like these..
"The prominent Sanders backer also predicted that a Hillary Clinton indictment was "inevitable"
Susan Sarandon: Hillary Clinton more dangerous than Donald Trump
http://www.salon.com/2016/06/03/susan_sarandon_hillary_clinton_more_dangerous_than_donald_trump/
poor ssarandon "had to change her phone number.." while the rest of the country that isn't so well off have to worry about this among other trumpshite..
Link to tweet
PatsFan87
(368 posts)There is an elitist wing that has crept into the party. Van Jones, who people on here love, said the same thing- yet you don't see anyone going after him. Clearly many rural voters all over the country feel the same way. Look at how they voted. And I agree we are feeble. We have trouble going on offense and defending our proposals. Look at the ACA for example. We let Republicans frame the narrative at first when we should have been the ones having messengers out framing the narrative. Take job losses in the rustbelt for example. Instead of going on offense and going into these communities to explain what was happening, Democrats were on the sidelines until it blew up in our faces. There are many Democrats and left-leaning independents who criticize the party not to trash it, but to make it better. It's time we put on our big boy pants and stop throwing tantrums when people work to make the party more successful, unless of course we enjoy being in the minority.
QC
(26,371 posts)or post respectful pictures like this:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=6106026&mesg_id=6116269
He really should try to follow the edifying example of this person:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4903995&mesg_id=4907131
Cha
(318,631 posts)snip//
Sen. Bernie Sanders wrongly claimed that voter turnout in 2016 was “the lowest … in 20 years.” In fact, turnout was higher than it was in 2012.
The overall turnout was 60.2 percent in 2016, up from 58.6 percent four years earlier. In addition, the percentage of eligible voters casting ballots for president in 2016 was 59.3 percent — the third highest in the last 44 years. Only 2008 and 2004 were higher.
More..
http://www.factcheck.org/2017/04/sanders-wrong-voter-turnout/
bahrbearian
(13,466 posts)Michigan , Ohio, , Pennsylvania ect. but there is lots of time for fundraising in California.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Complaining on national television about how Democrats haven't done enough for candidates. The logical question then is what has he done.
demmiblue
(39,642 posts)
Now, off to trash this thread!
Iggo
(49,884 posts)I'll remember that next time I praise Bernie Sanders.
pnwmom
(110,250 posts)BainsBane
(57,741 posts)environmental racism, defense spending, sugar subsidies . . .
panader0
(25,816 posts)BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Sierra Blanca.
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)BainsBane
(57,741 posts)as is putting municipal garbage incinerators in black and Latino neighborhoods.
We could use Paul Wellstone now more than ever.
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)It's when environmental policies tend to adversely affect PoC such that they endure the environmental burden more than non-PoC. I assume he's referring to Sierra Blanca situation in which he cosponsored and ushered a bill to allow the dumping of low level nuclear waste at a site in a impoverished (average income of 8k), predominately Hispanic community.
In my town, a lot of the low income, government housing that AAs can afford are built in areas that flood and the state has basically sat on their hands when it comes to devising new methods to release water from the Dam in such situations.
DAPL wouldn't be happening if the pipeline ran through a predominately white neighborhood.
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)panader0
(25,816 posts)I mean, she cleaned Bernie's clock in the South during the primaries.
Wouldn't she have been a great one to push Ossoff?
scheming daemons
(25,487 posts)... Bernie is the most popular non-Republican elected official in the country right now.
He is a thought leader. He needs to help Ossoff.
panader0
(25,816 posts)She beat Bernie handily in the South--much more popular than him there.
Or is this just another anti-Bernie divisive post?
disillusioned73
(2,872 posts) LovingA2andMI
(7,006 posts)1%. Just 1% period. So, YES, Hillary would have been helpful to Ossoff's chances of reaching the 50% + 1 and did not go and campaign for him.
Should be blame her for not doing so, OF COURSE NOT --- and NEITHER SHOULD Bernie be blamed. This is just another Bernie Sanders divisive thread. Plain and simple.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)complaining about how the Democratic Party didn't do enough for candidates.
panader0
(25,816 posts)BainsBane
(57,741 posts)also she's never been a TV pol. She's the type that gets to work.
panader0
(25,816 posts)Not following your logic.
This OP is just more Bernie bashing.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)When I said she wasn't on TV talking about how the party hadn't done enough.
I don't think it at all unreasonable to ask why doesn't someone do what they accuse others of not doing.
That you consider it "bashing" is sadly par for the course. I am having to figure out how to cope with the realization that people want a political system bound by fealty toward great men rather than issues or ideology.
JTFrog
(14,274 posts)then perhaps you should think a little harder about what he did.
He says he doesn't consider himself a Democrat. Neither do I.
His words.
panader0
(25,816 posts)Just like Hillary, Perez, Schumer, Warren and other famous Democrats.
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)If she was, then one would expect her to get out there and do the work to earn that privilege.
Exilednight
(9,359 posts)They just don't do from an elected position. Do you believe the CGI isn't in the business of promoting policy ideas, or OFA doesn't?
Just because they do not have the limelight on them does not mean they aren't trying to drive policy. Bernie is out front doing it since he's an actual elected official and not the leader of a large non-profit that he can hide behind.
Stinky The Clown
(68,951 posts)Sanders would have been MUCH more helpful. But of course he was MIA and doing self promoting teevee shows.
panader0
(25,816 posts)She is much more popular than he is in that area. Therefore, she would have been
a much greater asset than him in this election. Look, I voted for Hillary, but
this relentless Bernie bashing serves no purpose whatsoever.
George II
(67,782 posts)
angrychair
(12,193 posts)Put she swept the south in the primaries and won the popular vote in the General Election by over 6 million votes so her not being an elected official has nothing to do with her ability as a campaigner or to bring in votes.
George II
(67,782 posts)
progressoid
(53,102 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)progressoid
(53,102 posts)* the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee
* the official campaign arm of the Democrats in the House of Representatives
* the only political committee in the country whose principal mission is to support Democratic House candidates every step of the way to victory
George II
(67,782 posts)progressoid
(53,102 posts)Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee Chairman Ben Ray Luján issued the following statement announcing his leadership team for the 2018 cycle:
“I’m energized by the opportunity to serve alongside such a strong and diverse leadership team,” said DCCC Chairman Ben Ray Luján. “We have hit the ground running this cycle and have already started strengthening our Committee to protect incumbents and maximize gains on an expanded battlefield. Every member of our leadership team knows that House Democrats are on offense and they are committed to channeling the grassroots energy we see across the country into wins at the ballot box.”
DCCC 2018 Leadership Team
Recruitment Chair: Denny Heck
Recruitment Vice-Chair: Rep. Katherine Clark
Finance Co-Chairs: Reps. Don Beyer & Suzan DelBene
Frontline Chair: Rep. Annie Kuster
WomenLEAD Co-Chairs: Reps. Val Demings, Debbie Dingell, Lois Frankel
Nat’l Chair for Candidate Services: Rep. Jan Schakowsky
TEAM Co-Chairs: Reps. Dan Kildee, Raul Ruiz, Norma Torres
Partners & Allies Council Co-Chairs: Reps. Jim Himes, Richie Neal, Terri Sewell, Joaquin Castro
Labor Council Co-Chairs: Reps. Mark Pocan & Bobby Scott
angrychair
(12,193 posts)I think this line of discussion to be a bit hyperbolic. This is the first time Ossoff has run for public office and this was a special election. The threshold to win outright was very high, 50% in what is a very red state. Ossoff won 48.1% and got more than the next three republicans combined. His republican opponent in June only got 19.8%.
I think it was very wishful thinking that a Democrat was going to win a special election, outright, in a very red state, against 18 opponents.
StubbornThings
(259 posts)This whole post is nothing more than Bernie bashing.
George II
(67,782 posts)StubbornThings
(259 posts)It's clear you have deep disdain for him.
You can't even recognize that he's the most popular active politician in the country.
George II
(67,782 posts)StubbornThings
(259 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)thesquanderer
(12,976 posts)...as others have pointed out, whether Sanders' presence would have been a plus or a minus in this very traditionally Republican district is not a given.
I half expect that, if Sanders HAD gone down and campaigned, there would be people here posting "What the hell did he do that for? This isn't Sanders territory. He's too liberal, and we already know the South hates him. Sanders' getting involved just makes it harder for Ossoff to appeal to the moderate Republicans he needs to win over. Sanders is just about Sanders and totally full of himself and can't bear to stay out of the spotlight. If he can't clearly help, he should STAY AWAY. Hillary's much more popular in the South and even she was smart enough to not get involved here."
StubbornThings
(259 posts)The hypocrisy is pretty blatant with some.
bahrbearian
(13,466 posts)Or is she too busy with the Foundation now.
bucolic_frolic
(54,868 posts)did us a favor on this one
New York Jewish intellectuals from rural states sell like falafel in Atlanta
onenote
(46,120 posts)And the fact is that we need someone like Bernie to be out there pushing the "independent" voters to support Democrats. By setting himself apart from the Democratic party he doesn't help that effort.
bucolic_frolic
(54,868 posts)but Jon Ossoff lives in the area. Bernie has Brooklyn NY roots. These are two different
types of people to southern constituents.
A party or a politician in the minority hunkers down and picks its spots cautiously so as
not to slide further into the minority. If the DNC or Bernie rush in to help, and Ossoff loses,
they have spent their capital for a bit. Keeping one's powder dry allows one to live to fight
another day.
'He who lives and runs away, will live to fight another day;
But he who is in battle slain, will not live to fight again.'
Arazi
(8,859 posts)Why must it be just Bernie's fault that Ossoff didn't get to 50%?
This is just more Bernie bashing
So fucking tired of it
Tribalceltic
(1,000 posts)The only one I have seen on TV is Bernie... why could he not help?
I'm so Tired of this Bernie hero worship... He lost!
Arazi
(8,859 posts)So it's bullshit to say "only" Bernie is on tv. Even Hillary is giving speeches again.
Hell, she blew Bernie out of the water in the south. She could have gone down and really helped
This is just more divisive bullshit. It's sick
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)calimary
(89,816 posts)And if this thread is any indication, he continues to be a tremendously divisive figure at a time when we Dems should all be coalescing together as one mighty united front.
snort
(2,334 posts)and it works here. Who would want to do that?
mac56
(17,819 posts)Next you'll add "Get over it!"
Looks familiar, doesn't it?
ehrnst
(32,640 posts)full attention of the DCCC, and then didn't get the victory that he felt his endorsement would endow.
Arazi
(8,859 posts)Carry on
Cha
(318,631 posts)with accusations of "feeble" "can't fight back" on Rachel's show and threw this accusation out.. "..the Democratic Party of liberal elites.." in Boston with Sen Warren?..
When ssarandon is the Elitist..
Who suckered the LOW INFORMATION voters with LIES like these..
"The prominent Sanders backer also predicted that a Hillary Clinton indictment was "inevitable"
Susan Sarandon: Hillary Clinton more dangerous than Donald Trump
http://www.salon.com/2016/06/03/susan_sarandon_hillary_clinton_more_dangerous_than_donald_trump/
poor ssarandon "had to change her phone number.." while the rest of the country that isn't so well off have to worry about this among other trumpshite..
Link to tweet
ProfessorGAC
(76,538 posts)You're over the top on this stuff. We agree about tons of stuff, but you call what he said an insult, i see it as merely criticism. So, insulting or criticizing a party structure is a line so subjective that it creates these types of "oh yeah, oh yeah" threads around here.
No such thing as perfect, so i think whether it's Bernie or anyone else, and whether it's a pol or a position, this bickering has to stop..
Everyone is not going to get a perfect candidate for their personal consolidation of ideas, so finding fault over and over for anyone who is, generally speaking, on the right side of the issues (no not every single issue), we should welcome as an ally.
This puking on our allies is getting old.
QC
(26,371 posts)about the party or anyone in it as the things you said about then-Senator Clinton here in this very forum.
Some of us were around then, you know.
JTFrog
(14,274 posts)How did that work out for you?
Historic NY
(39,962 posts)I'm sorry but Bernie isn't a Democrat and it time he step back to his previous role, he carps and whines about the party he won't be a part of.. Perhaps he should start his own party. He want a say in things like who was picked to head the DNC, he is way over his bounds.
As for Biden & Obama being out there its way too soon other than the subtle digs. They are out of elected office.
Greybnk48
(10,715 posts)when Nixon and Kennedy duked it out in 1960. When I think of the Democratic platform, I think FDR and Kennedy. It was almost unrecognizable to me after Bill Clinton moved us so far to the right so as to make people like him, like a slavish dog. Something he did NOT have to do. And BELIEVE ME, I defended Bill to everyone. My co-workers said all that was left of his support was me and Buddy the dog.
That said. Bernie is not a "new" Democrat that is in the pockets of lobbyists and corporations OR big fat cat donors like the GOP's Sheldon Adleson, or the Koch's, Bradley's, or whomever is trying to govern without running for election. He's a traditional Democrat like Kennedy and FDR. AND he's showing us, the DEMS, that we don't have to be like the Repukes and sell our souls for votes. We don't have to move right anymore. We need to move BACK LEFT where we used to be! It's what people crave. Before Bernie, we were to the RIGHT of NIXON ffs.
Bash and flame me if you like, but this is the truth and Bernie is serving a purpose that he could not if he identified as Democratic right now. He answers to no one and can do things his way, which he could not do if he had to placate the right of center of the Democratic Party.
End of rant. Edited to add: I sent CA$H to Ossoff, anyone else?
JoeOtterbein
(7,868 posts)Gore1FL
(22,937 posts)calimary
(89,816 posts)I gave some pretty substantial ones (at least for me), especially when the campaign was a quadruple match. That made them REALLY substantial.
snort
(2,334 posts)Duppers
(28,469 posts)++++
nini
(16,824 posts)Thank the Religious Right for taking over the party and moving them so far right left is now center.
They planned this over decades and it worked. Just like we have to plan it and pull the masses back.
Sucks.. but it's reality. It's not going to happen over night
mac56
(17,819 posts)panader0
(25,816 posts)QC
(26,371 posts)It's almost like people are trying to keep us divided or something, like maybe they don't want us talking about the monster in the White House.
Cha
(318,631 posts)LovingA2andMI
(7,006 posts)Yet, it stands?
CousinIT
(12,489 posts)Our party is notably absent in these races. I'm not sure why. Warren, Schumer, Perez...- the National or his local Dem Party - none of them that I know of have done much. Maybe they have and I didn't see it? That's quite possible.
I'm just saying that if you expect such from Sanders do you expect the same from your own party members? If not, why?
Greybnk48
(10,715 posts)I sometimes still think the Russians are working very hard to disrupt this site and any unity that begins to develop. It's very different here now, and I've been here since 2004.
Duppers
(28,469 posts)As I imagine others here also did.
Cha
(318,631 posts)snip//
Democrats are pumping millions into the Georgia congressional election set for Tuesday, hoping 30-year-old political upstart Jon Ossoff can leverage celebrity endorsements to deliver a rebuke to President Trump and his first 100 days in office, and help the party reclaim lost momentum.
Paving the way is actor Samuel L. Jackson, who helped create a radio ad urging voters to flip the seat previously held by Republican Tom Price, who is now Trump’s health secretary.
His ad highlighted “Pulp Fiction" references as he announced: “Vote for the Democratic Party. Stop Donald Trump, a man who encourages racial and religious discrimination and sexism. We have to channel the great vengeance and fury we have for this administration into votes at the ballot box.”
http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/04/18/democrat-jon-ossoff-gets-hollywood-help-in-georgia-special-election.html
Greybnk48
(10,715 posts)tiredtoo
(2,949 posts)The DNC was lacking in support of the Bernie supporting candidate in Kansas last month. Unless we find a way to work together, we will continue on our downward spiral and the Oligarchs will continue controlling our lives.
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)I suspect that didn't play well with Berniecrats.
Cha
(318,631 posts)trump.
Sanders Says He’ll Work With Trump on Trade
https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2017-01-24/bernie-sanders-says-hell-work-with-trump-on-trade-while-some-gopers-wary
Bernie Sanders: I see areas where I can work with Trump
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/bernie-sanders-can-work-with-trump-233532
Trump is scared of Jon Ossoff: The president blasts Democratic candidate ahead of Georgia’s special election
http://www.salon.com/2017/04/17/trump-is-scared-of-jon-ossoff-the-president-blasts-democratic-candidate-ahead-of-georgia-special-election/
Response to Cha (Reply #60)
Post removed
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts) 
ornotna
(11,460 posts)You would be willing to work with Trump yourself?
humbled_opinion
(4,423 posts)with the divisive tactics, concentrate on things that make us stronger together. Don't blame Bernie for Ossoff not getting 50% Let's create the message that gets us winning again.
Greybnk48
(10,715 posts)I think we need to aggressively go after people here that try to start fights all the time. It's really tiresome.
nini
(16,824 posts)Bernie has put himself in a spot that does indeed turn off many Democrats the way he is doing things. If you want the party to be stronger together he is going to need to stop saying he is not a Democrat and slamming our side more than the right. He himself is divisive whether he means it or not. That's what people are turned off by.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)And I find both absurd and offensive the idea that the comments of individual citizens are divisive while Sanders comments on national television are not.
And I certainly don't blame Sanders for Ossoff's falling short yesterday, but when he criticizes Democrats for not doing more, the question of what he did is entirely reasonable.
His continuing to remind everyone that he's not a Democrat is something I find tremendously off-putting.
Griefbird
(135 posts)with one hand on the button and the other holding my nose, just as I did for Kerry and Gore/Lieberman. The first time I voted for Obama, I thought, "finally, I'm voting for someone, not against someone." The second time, maybe not so much, but other than his negotiating for the Republicans, he seemed to do well, considering his obstacles. Sanders points out the problems with candidates that need to be addressed, which, if given consideration, will make the party stronger, not weaker. If you want to be sure people stay home on election day, give them a choice between a radical right Republican and a moderate Republican. Hillary's policies, if not her rhetoric, are on par with Ronald Reagan's.
Greybnk48
(10,715 posts)But props to Hillary for adopting a lot of Bernie's platform in the end. I will no longer support Republican lite either. No more Reagan Dems. I want the real deal, FDR, Kennedy Democrat like Bernie and so do most Independents and many, many Dems.
I sure hope after all these decades I don't get driven away from the Democratic Party by people who don't realize the shift to the right the party took under Bill Clinton, who I LOVED, but would now like to kick in the balls (metaphorically speaking).
nini
(16,824 posts)Last edited Thu Apr 20, 2017, 12:29 AM - Edit history (1)
You can't compare almost 40 years ago to today for one thing. The repubs have skillfully pulled this country to the far right since Reagan. They knew they weren't going to turn the masses in one election cycle - they carefully planned out their strategy and the idiots fell for it and now think all the crap being done to them is better than being a LIBERAL!!!!
That's the problem with today's far left. They think it's going to take a year or two to change enough people - it simply is not going to happen no matter how bad we want it. That is the main reason the Democrats have to play this middle of the road game. I hate it too but I'd much rather have someone like Hillary than Trump.
I fall into the Socialist spectrum on political tests - to the left of Sanders himself. However I am practical enough to know that's not gonna happen in this country any time soon. Until then.. lots of stuff has to be done and it ain't gonna happen by someone telling me how to do stuff and not even acknowledge the party he wants to control is decent enough to bother with.
R B Garr
(17,980 posts)the authority to remake the Democratic party, yet he picks and chooses his battles to fit his limited "populist" message and/or candidates and regions that voted for him.
There is no excuse for him not to have at least used his twitter machine to promote the Southern candidate. It looks like sour grapes and regional bias on his part since the South went heavily for Clinton. He is promoting the Montana congress candidate by calling him a "populist" and because Montana voted for him.
None of this fits what is needed as a new leader for Democrats.
Baitball Blogger
(52,228 posts)We're told we need to move on from the last election, and these things just keep popping up - almost always anti-Bernie.
LovingA2andMI
(7,006 posts)These Threads Are ALLOWED to STAY PUT. Amazing, indeed (not in a good way, at all)....
Baitball Blogger
(52,228 posts)to the situation and concluded we should move on.
katmondoo
(6,524 posts)QC
(26,371 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts) lies
(315 posts)Of what every Democratic Party politician was doing on that night and the ones not helping should be immediately booted from the party because they don't care about the party and are helping Trump.
TNLib
(1,819 posts)n/t
democrank
(12,530 posts)Perhaps it would be more in line with Democratic Party purity if you listed all Democrats who did not "lift a single finger to help John Ossoff in GA6", unless you simply want to concentrate on what Bernie is or is not doing. I'm certain there is a long list of Real Democrats that could have been of help to John Ossoff.
Even better....why don't you contact Tom Perez and Keith Ellison and demand they stop appearing with Bernie and stick to appearances with Real Democrats who can help get out the vote in 2018?
Since Bernie isn't a Real Democrat, we should tell him to get lost. We don't need him or his couple hundred followers, right?
downeastdaniel
(497 posts)of damning Bernie for nor acting, you may trying to invest energy yourself. Besides,
of Birching about Bernie, just get yourself behind Ossoff or however.
Bernie is focused on the BIG PICTURE. Peace.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)TV appearances are what really matter.
stonecutter357
(13,042 posts)
betsuni
(29,010 posts)
ananda
(34,982 posts)He speaks for me and all people who want to see
a fair and just society free of all the corruption and
corporate madness we are experiencing now!
That he says he is not a Democrat is meaningless to me.
He is pro human and not afraid to embrace policies that
some people fear because of the word "socialist." Too
bad, those are exactly the same policies that help create
a society that protects people from corporate sociopathy.
I'm sorry he didn't help Ossoff, but then, I think Ossoff
did damm well anyway, didn't he? I don't need or want
either a friend or a savior representing me! And I don't
expect perfection or operate with a double standard the
way the Reeps do.
People power, not saviors, is where it's at!
California_Republic
(1,826 posts)We are DU. Surely we have contacts with the Sanders campaign.
calimary
(89,816 posts)Indeed, we are DU. I'd guess there might be people here who do have contacts within the Sanders campaign, maybe DUers from Vermont as well?
Response to scheming daemons (Original post)
Post removed
Txbluedog
(1,128 posts)But as he has stated time and time again he DOES NOT consider himself a democrat and is NOT a member of the party or its leadership, thus he bears no responsibility to help democrats get elected---and I prefer it that way.
Baitball Blogger
(52,228 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts) 
comradebillyboy
(10,953 posts)
DeminPennswoods
(17,442 posts)whenever I watch him, I see a lefty version of Trump. It's all Bernie, all the time. I agree with most of his policy positions, but I can see why he turns a lot of people off.
snort
(2,334 posts)Don't get me started.
aintitfunny
(1,424 posts)lifted fingers?
Georgia Democrats clearly preferred Hillary, voting for her 71% to his 28% in the primary. His advocacy may not have been as helpful as you imagine.
Sienna86
(2,153 posts)Unfair accusation without knowing the facts. Bernie may have hurt him in Georgia.
WoonTars
(694 posts)...shame on Bernie...
Texin
(2,851 posts)do you mean Ossoff?
I'm going to just flat out say this, but I think in deep red districts like this one (where rTrump had/has no special appeal for the majority of their educated, affluent, younger block of constituents), perhaps Hill & Bill & the national Democratic 'leaders' need to stay the hell out of those districts. I've been around long enough to remember that most of the traction the rethugs gained throughout the years has been directly related to the anathema rethug voters feel about the Clintons and the 'lbrul' Democrats (and the more educated and affluent they've been the more adamant they've been about the Clintons). I've worked around the folks for a couple of decades or more, and I've seen it firsthand.
tRump didn't do well in that Georgia district because he's a fucking gasbag idiot and scares the hell out of any intelligent voter. They ended up holding their noses and voting the kompromat candidate from idiot drop-out skool because his last name wasn't Clinton. Period. Full stop. That doesn't mean they'd have been fall down eager to vote for Bernie though. Someone like Joe Biden might have been able to pull off a win in that district in November, and someone like Ossoff is more of an unknown quantity - until anyone named Clinton or closely associated with them is seen or heard campaigning for them. I hate to say it because I very willingly voted for both Clintons, but I'm a wide-eyed realist and I know that they are both deeply flawed (for different reasons) and they've BOTH been lightning rods for opposition and outright hatred for as long back as I can remember (and I'm from Texas and the same holds for this red state as much as any other in the south).
mcar
(45,931 posts)running Ossoff down last week. He supported Hillary, corporatist tool, etc, etc.
Perhaps Bernie didn't want to offend them.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)
Oooookaayy..
No...........
Bernie did not let AMERICA down..
Bernie is way to the left of the GA6 district. He would not have been of help in this case. I think it was wise not to go there.
Gothmog
(178,858 posts)I agree with the analysis in the OP
Response to Gothmog (Reply #120)
Post removed
StubbornThings
(259 posts)How about the actual Democrats, current and former politicians. Shouldn't they be criticized just as much for not lifting a finger?
This OP is just Bernie bashing.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... if there's little or no actual "outreach" going on? I was under the impression that was the main reason for the assignment in the first place. I guess this would be a good time for Schumer to step forward and offer some clarification on what his instructions and expectations were... and onlookers can make appropriate adjustments to their own expectations as well.
StubbornThings
(259 posts)when a non-Democrat is bashed for not supporting a Democrat.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)In my opinion, anyone who accepts that outreach task would have a greater obligation and responsibility than ordinary "rank-and-file" Democrats. People have noticed, and people are asking legitimate questions.
ProfessorPlum
(11,461 posts)and supports and promotes humane policies, and works against the corporate robo-screwing of citizens that motivates the GOP.
He is an ally, and an important one.
Stop trying to generate negative feelings about him here. There is no useful point.
Bleacher Creature
(11,504 posts)I supported Hillary in the primaries, but really tried to hold off on bashing Bernie. I have my issues with his tactics, but his policies are spot on.
No more. This, along with the fact that he went out of his way to point out that he's not a Democrat, are the last straws for me.
I'm realistic enough to know that he's virtually unbeatable in VT, but I still wouldn't mind seeing a real Democrat run against him.
StubbornThings
(259 posts)Not being a Democrat should be the last of anyone's worries. It's just a label.
And, why is Bernie the only person that should be helping Ossoff? Can you name one other Democrat, former or otherwise, that has lifted a finger to help? John Lewis is the only one I can think of that has done anything.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)and as a result I contributed money. I don't believe your statement is factually correct.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)I'm proud to be a Democrat and I'm proud of the Democratic Party. (Our party doesn't deserve the smears and insults and face-slaps that others continually hurl in our direction.)
StubbornThings
(259 posts)And, apparently he's the only politician, current or former, that should be blamed.
I mean, did any other politician "lift a finger" to help (other than John Lewis)?
And this OP is getting 60+ recs.
KG
(28,795 posts)jalan48
(14,914 posts)Texin
(2,851 posts)I sat there and the more he talked the more disappointed I was in him. He needs to either get on onboard with the program or go off on his own. I feel that his own sour grapes about not getting the Democratic nomination is demonstrative of his own variety of thin skin (tRump doesn't own the patent on that!) and, to be honest, I'm going to put him in the same category of liberal deplorables as Susan Sarandon, and dodgy ideologues like Kompromat? Jill Stein whom, as far as I'm concerned can all go to hell.
Ossoff did ALL the heavy lifting with his supporters and all he needed was a teeny, tiny percentage of voters to move in his direction. Folks like Bernie Sanders could have helped him (IMO), but they sat this out. I also am pointing a finger of blame for all the other Dem candidates in the race who didn't have snowball's chance in hell of pulling anything out at the end, who could have announced WEEKS ago that they were going to drop out of the race and throw their complete support and efforts toward an Ossoff win. All he needed was less than 1% of the votes, and it appears he might have gotten them absent these ass clowns and folks like Sanders.
flamingdem
(40,854 posts)There’s also support from the left-leaning Daily Kos website, which so far has raised nearly $1 million for Ossoff.
That’s painted something of a bull’s-eye on Ossoff’s back. No leading GOP contender has directly confronted him, but the National Republican Congressional Committee painted the Democrat as a “far-left Bernie Sanders guy.” (Ossoff, for his part, said he backed Hillary Clinton.)
Duppers
(28,469 posts)I donated to Ossoff thru Daily Kos. Guess I should've sent a direct donation.
tallahasseedem
(6,716 posts)So, that's that. 
Response to scheming daemons (Original post)
Post removed
TygrBright
(21,356 posts)I'm so confuzzled.
I expect my miracle-workers to work miracles CONSISTENTLY, as in, "whenever I think they should wave those wands" yanno...
disappointedly,
Bright
PS: To clarify, I'm disappointed in both "the Democrats" and Sanders right now. Every conceivable disappointment is a FAILURE on someone's part-- if we can just hold enough pissed-mortems and apportion blame with sufficient emphasis, we can keep from being disappointed, amirite?
northoftheborder
(7,636 posts)KPN
(17,328 posts)Look, Bernie can't possibly be to blame for every Democratic Party shortcoming. Heck, how can anyone take yesterday's GA6 result as anything but a victory in the first place? And yet we have the same old Bernie bashing going on as we do every day here at DU despite that. Them's some pretty recalcitrant grudges!
Someone up-thread mentioned that maybe Bernie's absence was strategic, like the DNCs absence in Kansas (well, according to the DNC the Kansas thing was strategic). Maybe so.
Or maybe it's a tit-for-tat thing? Who the hell knows. I'm just amazed that anyone would even think to ask where was Bernie yesterday. It strikes me as rather vigilante-like.
So, what about the Kansas thing? Bernie went there. What do you all think about this:
- - - - - -
While Thompson managed to raise $292,000 without his party’s help, 95% of which came from individuals, neither the DNC, DCCC, nor even the Kansas Democratic Party would help him grow that total in any substantial way. His campaign requested $20,000 from the state Democratic Party and was denied.
…
The national Democratic Party gave him nothing until the day before the election, when it graced him with some live calls and robo-calls. He lost by seven percentage points. …
In an interview with The Washington Post, Perez confirmed the DNC would not be giving Thompson a dime. “We can make progress in Kansas,” he said. “There are thousands of elections every year, though. Can we invest in all of them? That would require a major increase in funds.” Fact check: the DNC has a fund just for Congressional elections, of which there are just ten this year.
…
In defending their decision, party mouthpieces have taken the ... line that giving Thompson money would have actually hurt his chances of winning, because then everyone would have known he’s a Democrat, and Kansans hate Democrats. ...
“You do not get to the single digits in a district like this if you’re a nationalized Democrat,” DCCC communications director Meredith Kelly told The Huffington Post. “End of story. That’s just the way it is. There are just certain races where it is not helpful to be attached to the national D.C. Democrats.”
Nobody must have told Kelly that Thompson was already attached to the “national DC Democrats” by virtue of being in their party, a fact Estes (Thompson's opponent) was happy to exploit in an attack ad ... “The liberals are trying to steal this election by supporting a Bernie Sanders backed lawyer, because they know he will vote how Nancy Pelosi tells him to,” he claimed.
One person the party does not think will be hurt by their help is Jon Ossoff, who is running in a similarly red, but much wealthier, district in Georgia. To date, the DNC has raised some $8.3m for him and has committed to sending nine field staffers to organize on-the-ground efforts.
Although he is young, he’s an acolyte of the Democratic establishment, having worked for Representatives John Lewis and Hank Johnson, and he endorsed Hillary Clinton in the primary.
...
Democrats think Ossoff is just the guy to bring his affluent suburban district back into the fold. (Clearly, losing a national election was not enough to reverse course on that most doomed of 2016 strategies: trading blue collar whites for wealthy, suburban ones.)
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/apr/13/progressive-democratic-candidates-james-thompson-loss
Me.
(35,454 posts)50 state means all of the 50 states. Perez and company better wake up. Enough with the so-called unity tour, they need to get back to the basics.
LisaM
(29,599 posts)Correct. He did nothing.
askyagerz
(901 posts)You forgot to read the script the centrists sent you. Bad doggie!
progressoid
(53,102 posts)LovingA2andMI
(7,006 posts)It's Bernie Fault, Of Course.
progressoid
(53,102 posts)
Clearly he's trying to hamper us.
LovingA2andMI
(7,006 posts)And how do you know what Bernie thinks about Toes or Cheerios? Considering it seems as if you've a overwhelming dislike for Bernie Sanders (which would make it highly doubtful you would have a conversation with Bernie, ever), how would you know what he likes or dislikes?
Hamlette
(15,556 posts)he was asked if he would campaign in the general election for down ballot dems and he would not commit. I wouldn't have expected him to campaign for some ass who just happened to run for some office but that's not what he said and not what he meant. It is the top of the ticket that helps parties win enough seats in "smaller" elections so as to govern. He needed to commit to helping house and senate candidates win. He didn't. Made up my mind that very day.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... and to this day, I've heard no explanation for that behavior that makes sense.
Me.
(35,454 posts)BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Yeah. I gather others he endorsed were treated similarly.
I think the poor guy was counting on bona fide support and no one showed up/
StubbornThings
(259 posts)What has the Democratic party politicians done to "lift a finger" to help Ossoff? John Lewis is the only one I can think of that's done anything.
QC
(26,371 posts)StubbornThings
(259 posts) mac56
(17,819 posts)and haven't bothered to "un-ignore" them yet.
Looks like it's gonna get more crowded in there.
Duppers
(28,469 posts)But I don't ever intended to remove anyone on my growing ignore list. If DU didn't have the ignore function, I'd leave.
lapucelle
(21,040 posts)did little else, and then blamed the DNC for the loss.
While some local chapter members of Our Revolution conducted phone banks for Ossoff at their homes, I don't think there was an official endorsement.
https://ourrevolution.com/press/our-revolution-endorses-two-special-election-congressional-candidates/
https://ourrevolution.com/candidates/
alp227
(33,250 posts)After ending his campaign he said his supporters to keep up the activism. It is no secret he does not want to lead the parade.
LexVegas
(6,958 posts)mikehiggins
(5,614 posts)the election is over. Hillary lost. Could we have won if Bernie had been our candidate? No way to know. If he had been Trump might not have gotten the GOP nod because the regular Repukes would have marginalized and ignored him. Everyone from Obama to Jeb to Stein knew Hillary was unbeatable. Dem regulars and Goldman Sachs VP's were all looking to see what jobs they could get in her administration.
Well, things are what they are. Trump is President. Those who want to keep blasting Sanders feel free to do so. Its your time to waste.
aikoaiko
(34,214 posts)It could well be that the DNC/DCCC said explicit Bernie endorsements could hurt Ossoff in District 6. Karen Handel specifically brought up Bernie and Bernie supporters as a source of out of state money (doesn't even matter if it is true).
Are you so connected that you can say that the Ossoff campaign or DNC wanted Bernie to endorse Ossoff? If not, it appears you're creating a responsibility for Bernie after the fact to say that he "let American down."
aquamarina
(1,865 posts)Did Hillary Clinton campaign for Ossoff?
Did President Obama campaign for Ossoff?
Did Vice President Biden campaign for Ossoff?
Did Senator Schumer campaign for Ossoff?
Did Representative Pelosi campaign for Ossoff?
Why aren't you complaining about them not trying to help Ossoff?
It's like a broken record here with the constant, endless, redundant, over-the-top Bernie bashing.
Really, isn't it enough already.
Now that Ossoff is in the runoff, perhaps Bernie will and the rest of the Democratic Elders will come together and help this guy win in the runoff. Perhaps even with all the gerrymandering, enough I's can be persuaded to move to the D column in June.
QC
(26,371 posts)and set Democrats against one another, so what's the point.
Have you noticed that when things are going especially badly for Trump, the level of division here always gets cranked up.
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)Last edited Wed Apr 19, 2017, 03:51 PM - Edit history (1)
then so do the fan threads posted every single day.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... thank you.
QC
(26,371 posts)every time Sec. Clinton's name is mentioned in any way?
Wouldn't you find that odd, at least?
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)The thread on Chelsea NOT running for elected office was such an example. And of course we spent months being told how she was the devil incarnate. You picked a poor example to advance your argument.
There is a difference in frequency because we don't see the constant parade of fan threads for Hillary.
QC
(26,371 posts)I don't hate the Clintons. I give them credit for what they've achieved. I just want to see new people and policies.
And you're right about people demonizing HRC. I remember people right here calling her "morally depraved" and calling her "a fucking waromonger who has blood dripping off her lying fangs."
No Democrat should be spoken of that way here.
LiberalLovinLug
(14,656 posts)What kind of bizarre theory is that?
So its the positive aspect of the person that is to be pissed on. The rule about rehashing the primary is about being too positive on a Democrat or Democrat ally. With your logic, as long as there are positive OPs on what Bernie, or Hillary for that matter, is doing, working with the party, then you and your cohorts feel that its the same thing as to wade into that thread and disrupt it with negative posts and personal insults on that person being praised for their work?
BainsBane
(57,741 posts)not bashing. To claim that any critical discussion of Bernie in the present is rehashing the primary is patently and willfully false. But if one is to make that argument, then the fan threads would also qualify. Bashing Democratic public figures is another category, not dependent on the primary. The rule about the primary is not about positive or negative, but about letting the damn thing go. That of course is impossible since some have based their entire political consciousness on him. Note how these discussions are never about issues. They are always revolve around outrage that someone somewhere doesn't like Bernie, as though that actually matters.
The problem is that Bernie supporters have decided that even quoting his own statements amounts to bashing. You're just going to have to face that fact that not everyone considers him infallible, and some of us still value independence of thought.
aquamarina
(1,865 posts)It's like a food fight at an all-you-can-eat buffet.
QC
(26,371 posts)zentrum
(9,870 posts)...special election.
From The Hill:
Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) said Sunday that Democrats should’ve done more to support the party’s candidate, James Thompson, during the special House election in Kansas last week.
"It is true that the Democratic Party should have put more resources into that election," Sanders told host Jake Tapper on CNN's "State of the Union.” "But it is also true that he ran 20 points better than the Democratic candidate for president did in Kansas."
Thompson might have won because he did really well. But, see--he wasn't the establish candidate. As I understand it the Dems didn't lift a finger for him. Why is that?
I agree that Bernie should have helped Ossoff. I'm thinking of calling his office and finding out what the back issue was.
StubbornThings
(259 posts)Maybe they just didn't want to pick sides in a race where multiple Democrats were running.
Cattledog
(6,654 posts)There were lots of Big Rs endorsing candidates. They weren't afraid to pick sides. Anyway the 4 Ds got a total of 1,521 votes between them. They were never in the race.
StubbornThings
(259 posts)Cattledog
(6,654 posts)Last edited Wed Apr 19, 2017, 05:10 PM - Edit history (1)
You as well as all of us knew what the deal was and who had a chance to crack 50%.
StubbornThings
(259 posts)Since you obviously are missing it.
mac56
(17,819 posts)That dead horse has been beaten enough.
billpolonsky
(270 posts)Never does enough.
the_sly_pig
(752 posts)I love Bernie. I think he's great!
LiberalLovinLug
(14,656 posts)
Highway61
(2,587 posts)Wish this crap would stop on DU. Enough already
lunatica
(53,410 posts)Let it go. Bernie is out there fighting for you as well, unless you think Universal Healthcare, a free college education and stopping the giveaway of money to the 1% is bad. In that case, go ahead and keep trashing him.
Sigh...
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)Duppers
(28,469 posts)
PBass
(1,537 posts)He's more Pantsuit Nation.
Nobody is obligated to give money or rally for candidates who don't really represent your values.
Getting Ossoff elected helps Democrats numerically, and a great symbolic victory. But he's not a progressive champion. Bernie is not obligated to go to bat for centrist Dems.
markpkessinger
(8,900 posts). . . learning the lessons of 2016, not so much.
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)He's the head of outreach. The most popular senator. The most prominent Independent in America. He has the most popular ideas. He's also not expected to campaign for Democrats by his fans on Democratic Underground. This passage from the WSJ is telling.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/democrats-reload-for-georgia-runoff-but-party-divisions-remain-1492626238?tesla=y
“If you run as a Democrat, you’re a Democrat,” he said. “Some Democrats are progressive and some Democrats are not.”
Asked if Mr. Ossoff is a progressive, Mr. Sanders, an independent who challenged Hillary Clinton in the 2016 presidential primary, demurred. “I don’t know,” he said.
"Isn't prepared to back Democrats just because of a party label"
Sorry, if I'm not ready to elevate someone like that.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts) 
Vinca
(53,829 posts)I'm totally puzzled why this is a focus of so many people. We should be grateful he caucuses with the Democrats and that he ran for POTUS as a Democrat rather than slicing and dicing the general election vote in a 3 way race. Sometimes I think half the party is in a vehicle stuck in the mud and rather than shoveling it out they'd rather sit and spin their wheels.
padah513
(2,710 posts)2018 will be here sooner than we think and now is the time to come together and unify. Forget about the primaries already! Let's stop fighting amongst ourselves or the republicans are gonna pick our carcasses clean again!
tallahasseedem
(6,716 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts) uponit7771
(93,528 posts)Response to scheming daemons (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
PoliticalPie
(37 posts)ideas?
https://electjon.com/
Do we want more Manchin style Dems?
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)A candidate like Warren or Sanders would lose to the Republican in WV. Is that what you want?
quakerboy
(14,837 posts)The OP should be praising Sanders for not getting involved in a district where he would lose.
PoliticalPie
(37 posts)do except provide the fodder for the "both sides are the same liars."
JI7
(93,510 posts)so both sides are not the same.
orleans
(36,854 posts)but--i'm wondering, in relation to what you said,
would it have made much difference if he *had* supported ossoff?
i mean, the liberals didn't vote for a republican, they voted for ossoff
and perhaps a few of the republicans who voted for ossoff (just assuming there might have been a few) may have been scared off if bernie had openly been backing the candidate for change.
just a thought
Omaha Steve
(109,011 posts)He will be here tomorrow stumping for a former State Senator running for Omaha Mayor. I'll be there.
By Robynn Tysver / World-Herald staff writer Apr 9, 2017 Updated 1 hr ago
Bernie Sanders is expecting a crowd in Nebraska.
The former presidential candidate will be in Omaha on April 20 at the Baxter Arena, stumping for Democratic mayoral candidate Heath Mello.
Mello is attempting to unseat Republican Mayor Jean Stothert in next month’s election. The former state senator came within 3 percentage points of winning Tuesday’s five-way primary, putting him within striking distance.
Sanders’ visit makes it clear the race will attract national attention, as Democratic leaders say it could be one of several examples of Democrats’ rising up and re-engaging at the local level in the wake of Republican Donald Trump’s victory in November.
FULL story: http://www.omaha.com/news/politics/city-election/bernie-sanders-set-to-stump-for-mello-at-baxter-arena/article_16d1a8ec-1ba6-11e7-a236-f729281eb1d2.html#utm_source=omaha.com&utm_campaign=%2Fnewsletter%2Fbreakingheadlines%2Fpopular%2F&utm_medium=email&utm_content=headline
dlk
(13,235 posts)Bernie cares about Bernie, first. That's one of the many reasons he won't join the Democratic Party, although he has no problem accepting Democratic resources. He has a good message about income inequality but...
left-of-center2012
(34,195 posts)I didn't follow the race.
