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Sat Jun 3, 2017, 03:15 PM

So, are people going to give Sen. Manchin a pass for supporting Trump's Paris Agreement Withdrawl?




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Reply So, are people going to give Sen. Manchin a pass for supporting Trump's Paris Agreement Withdrawl? (Original post)
n2doc Jun 2017 OP
pnwmom Jun 2017 #1
BlueMTexpat Jun 2017 #6
JCanete Jun 2017 #10
babylonsister Jun 2017 #28
The Velveteen Ocelot Jun 2017 #2
msongs Jun 2017 #3
kacekwl Jun 2017 #27
BzaDem Jun 2017 #4
QC Jun 2017 #5
pnwmom Jun 2017 #8
JCanete Jun 2017 #11
pnwmom Jun 2017 #12
JCanete Jun 2017 #13
pnwmom Jun 2017 #15
JI7 Jun 2017 #17
pnwmom Jun 2017 #18
JI7 Jun 2017 #20
JI7 Jun 2017 #21
JCanete Jun 2017 #22
JI7 Jun 2017 #23
pnwmom Jun 2017 #31
crazycatlady Jun 2017 #37
JCanete Jun 2017 #38
a la izquierda Jun 2017 #24
QC Jun 2017 #25
pnwmom Jun 2017 #33
treestar Jun 2017 #19
Post removed Jun 2017 #7
DanTex Jun 2017 #9
loyalsister Jun 2017 #14
JI7 Jun 2017 #16
Calista241 Jun 2017 #29
JHan Jun 2017 #26
TDale313 Jun 2017 #30
NCjack Jun 2017 #32
SharonClark Jun 2017 #34
sharedvalues Jun 2017 #35
emulatorloo Jun 2017 #36

Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 03:18 PM

1. I'd still rather have a DINO representing his state than another Rethug.

And with all the coal miners in his state, I don't blame him for that position.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #1)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 03:36 PM

6. +1! eom

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #1)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 04:36 PM

10. The automatic assumption that this is as good as it gets is why it is going to be as good as it gets

 

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Response to JCanete (Reply #10)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:20 PM

28. Exactly. nt

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 03:18 PM

2. I sure as hell won't.

Yeah, he's from WVa, but Jesus on a pogo stick, with Democrats like him who needs Republicans?

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 03:21 PM

3. pandering to the coal industry to keep his job. he should lead on renewables jobs for WVa

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Response to msongs (Reply #3)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:18 PM

27. I don't care for the Senator but

he of course will pander to his state. Hopefully he knows trumps "order" means nothing at least for several years and I fully expect pres. Shitstain will be gone well before then.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 03:31 PM

4. Due to Senate non-apportionment, we would have fewer than 40 seats without senators like Manchin

So if you are in favor of a permanent Republican super-majority, by all means you should support defeating Manchin. Political parties that throw away such seats (where the opposing party's presidential candidate won by 40 points) simply are not relevant in our political system.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 03:35 PM

5. His party membership absolves him of any and all sins

that he has committed in the past or might commit in the future.

It's like having an indulgence signed by the pope himself.

(Obligatory disclaimer: I have been a registered Democrat since I became eligible to vote in 1983. I voted for Hillary. I would rather have Manchin in that seat than a Republican. Etc.)

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Response to QC (Reply #5)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 03:52 PM

8. It certainly absolves him of that position. We need more Democrats, even if they don't always

agree with us, if we are ever to win back the House and the Senate.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #8)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 04:39 PM

11. how about agreeing with us on the big things, like this, and Gorsuch? All he does is water down our

 

brand, make us weak as the opposing party, and he will make us weak when we try to pass legislation if we become the majority party, and his position forces the rest of our Dems to walk on egg shells when talking about these things, for fear of putting a target on the heads of our own members that we supposedly need so badly. He's a fucking poison pill.

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Response to JCanete (Reply #11)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 04:43 PM

12. He votes with us most of the time. And he's electable. A pure progressive

who is not electable in W Virginia is worthless to us.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #12)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 04:46 PM

13. that's a shit load of assumption though, and is in large part a self-fulfilling prophecy. nt

 

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Response to JCanete (Reply #13)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 05:01 PM

15. No assumptions. He does vote with us most of the time and he was elected.

More than you can say for your non-existent pure progressive West Virginia Senator.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #15)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 05:50 PM

17. the biggest thing he gives us is one more vote for senate control

If dems could control the Senate they control committes and what issues come up for vote.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #17)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 05:53 PM

18. Yes. Too many people don't understand the importance of that.

Or they do and they just don't care.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #18)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 05:55 PM

20. And what hurt merrick garland was that they did not allow the vote to take place

Rather than having the votes which he did.

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Response to JCanete (Reply #13)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 05:57 PM

21. over 70 percent of them voted for trump

In the dem primary alone over 40 percent voted for a prison inmate over Obama.

These things are facts .

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Response to JI7 (Reply #21)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 06:15 PM

22. hell, then maybe we should run the prison inmate. Maybe there's another way to appeal to these

 


voters than the way we're doing it. Just accepting a very very low bar as all we can get actually means that that is all we can get. Fuck it, if Manchin wins in the primaries, that's a pretty fair statement to your point, but if he isn't primaried, and we aren't given a chance to see if the people there want something else, by, I don't know, actually offering something else, then we are arresting ourselves in this reality..

what is wrong with primarying these people?

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Response to JCanete (Reply #22)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 06:18 PM

23. there people are conservative and many are racist. if you want to appeal to them

You do it by going after minorities.

That's why voted for the priSon inmate over Obama.

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Response to JCanete (Reply #22)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:28 PM

31. Manchin votes with us over 70% of the time. That's pretty good for a Senator

coming from a state that strongly supported DT.

And challenging a Democratic incumbent in a primary in a conservative district or state is a good way to kneecap him in the general election against the Rethug. You'd think Democrats would have learned that by now.

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Response to JCanete (Reply #11)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 11:41 PM

37. He is representing the voters of his state

Frank Underwood always said to vote your district. This is precisely what Joe Mancin is doing.

His state voted 70% for Trump.

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Response to crazycatlady (Reply #37)

Sun Jun 4, 2017, 03:05 AM

38. he is not representing them. If you put someone like Gorsuch on the court, or praise not joining

 


a climate change accord, you are not "representing" your voters...you are fucking them. If they don't know that to be the reality, that doesn't change that it is the reality. If he isn't going to actually protect their interests then what is he good for.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #8)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 07:56 PM

24. He voted for Sessions too.

I'm supposed to be okay with that?
Fwiw, I live in WV. I'm supporting his opponent. I don't care if that gets me banned from here.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #8)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:11 PM

25. How about some "Pro Life" Democrats?

Maybe some "Pro Traditional Marriage" Democrats? They will probably vote for the leadership most of the time, after all.

I understand the reasoning here, that someone who will vote for the party leadership and that having the speaker's chair / majority leader spot means a lot in terms of scheduling votes and appointing committee chairs and issuing subpoenas and such, but I wish we wouldn't give a pass to wretched behavior by our own, which is something we have long criticized the Republicans for doing.

Yes, it's better to have Joe Manchin in that seat than a GOP knuckledragger, but that doesn't mean he's a progressive hero.

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Response to QC (Reply #25)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:33 PM

33. No one is saying he is a progressive hero. We are saying that it's better to have

a DINO in a conservative district or state than a Rethug. And Manchin votes with Democrats about 70% of the time. A Rethug would vote with Dems 20% of the time. Which is better?

progressivepunch.org

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Response to QC (Reply #5)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 05:53 PM

19. No, it is the state he comes from

that absolves him of this one.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)


Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 04:13 PM

9. Not me. But it's still much better to have him than a Republican.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 04:51 PM

14. I'll leave the to West Virginians

They are the ones who vote for or against him, and they know a lot more about his service to their state.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 05:48 PM

16. he is from west virginia so his voters agree with him

People outside of west virginia are not able to vote in that state.

What you need to do is convince voters in the state to support liberal positions if you want their reps to do the same.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #16)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:24 PM

29. Agree with this.

Joe Manchin doesn't represent me, or most of the people on this board. He only represents people from West Virginia, and he probably has his finger on the pulse of what W VA voters want better than we do.

And I'd rather have a Democrat, any Democrat, in that seat than a random Republican.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:15 PM

26. One of many jackass statements Manchin has made, he cannot outrage me anymore..

If someone stronger can be found who can primary him, and who will surely keep WV* Dem, then let's hear it.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:25 PM

30. Nope. He's an asshole on many issues.

Better on some than a right wingnut- but frankly that's an awfully low bar.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 08:33 PM

32. Yes. Trump has left him hanging with no coal mining jobs and

no replacement jobs. He is trying to stay in the game. Now, I feel dirty and need a long hot shower, with lots of soap and scrubbing.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 09:01 PM

34. He didn"t have to issue a statement, he could have been honest about the coal industry"s future

Unless he believes his own rhetoric.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 10:04 PM

35. Never speak ill of a fellow Democrat.

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Response to n2doc (Original post)

Sat Jun 3, 2017, 10:14 PM

36. No, we are going to give him a pass for his support of Obamacare and

Strong opposition to Trumpcare.

Dumbass statement on Paris accord though.

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