I would like to make something really clear...in regards to Cannabis

[yuiyoshida]

Last edited Thu Aug 3, 2017, 05:19 PM - Edit history (2)

Though Cannabis makes a great entertaining drug, we don't get high because its fun, or because reality sucks and while we might joke about being ''stoners'' this is some serious medicine that's been held in the dark, and there is a social stigma related to using weed.

Most people, smartly smoke it at home, away from neighbors, and out from under prying suspicious eyes because of the bad press weed has gotten over the years. We aren't drug addicts, nor does one become addicted like one does with nicotine. While its funny to watch people smoke a bong, and cough, laugh etc, this drug has a powerful way of combatting what ever thing ails us.

Because Federally it carries a prison sentence, this is not the thing a veteran is going to smoke while on the VA campus. Because of strict Federal laws each of us are potentially OUTLAWS by the DEA and other drug agencies. This is a scary thing, and some won't even indulge knowing that at some point in time, a DEA agent might slap cuffs on us and throw us away in some federal prison (or god forbid some Jeff Sessions for profit prison.)

Using it is like playing with a loaded gun. You might use it for your glaucoma but it doesn't mean the FEDS are going to look the other way, like the local cops do now. So each of us know that its often better not to say anything to anyone, even with a doctor's recommendation.

Imagine going to the local Dispensary, only to find its RAIDED by Trump's goons, and they throw us all for purchasing it, having it in our possession, or being nailed as one who might be included as a part of a group, for "selling" and distributing Marijuana. No one wants to spend the week in Jail or having to go to trial because you were caught in a sting. Even being at a dispensary can be dangerous, if the FEDS swoop in and attempt to shut the place down, taking all the weed for evidence.

Truthfully, would you trust DONNIE TWO SCOOPS, not to have his goons swoop in, when they find their FOR PROFIT prisons are not full enough? Many would rather go and suffer than spend one minute going to a dispensary, with the chance of coming out and finding the DEA there ready to arrest the people on the premise.

Reminds me of the time, I saw cops waiting for people to come out of a bar, to arrest them for public drunkenness! Oh sure they could be out investigating some real crime down the street but the people of the bar, were just easy pickings...a chance for the city to make some extra money in fines, by arresting all the people out in public technically drunk.

Would the DEA do this? I would not put anything past Jeff Sessions. Those for profit federal prisons will not fill themselves..and its a dick enough move, for them to make some personal profit by busting medical patients who made the wrong or "bad choice".

Most of us want to be off those drugs, the doctor prescribes because they have nasty side affects. Weed won't have that.. but if it cuts the funding out from under the Pharmaceuticals companies, they might demand that Sessions arrest these "dope fiends" and get us all back on their products, since they don't have any part in making profits from selling Cannabis.

When our US government thinks that the weed sellers are making more money than they should --than either they want to control the sale of "medicine" by cutting out the small guy or by golly force them out of business by having LAW ENFORCEMENT officers put a stop to it.

[Weekend Warrior]

1. It will be a business decision and we are reaching a tipping point.

It will have little to do with the racist aspect of the WOD. It will have little to do with medicine. It's about profitability and limiting liability. We are getting to the point where more and more business entities could and would enter the market if we changed federal law.

What I think we will see in the next ten years. The feds will legalize it for medical purposes. All good as long as it's doctor prescribed. You will then get it from the pharmacy. What you get from the pharmacy will be provided by the largest drug companies out there.

It will still not be federally legalized across the board. The WOD will rage on.

[yuiyoshida]

2. Not only that but

You know that this, like the gold Rush of the 1800's, everyone will be out to try and make big bucks on weed. Imagine Congress, making weed available only through Dow Chemical or some other big drug company? They are greedy, which is why they might want to corner the market and then and turn around and sell it to us "poor saps" at inflated and outrageous prices.

Right now at my dispensary, Sativa and Indica range for one ounce about 17 dollars a tin. If The pharmaceutical companies than took over, you know they would want huge profits and those prices might skyrocket to 40 dollars a tin. Someone is going to be rolling in the big bucks, and people with serious medical problems are going to be stuck paying those prices for something they want as relief for their glaucoma or what ever medical problem, that weed alleviates.

Republicans have been made rich by these tactics. Its how they can buy off elections, and turn the voting machines to their advantage. It takes money to get Congressman so-in-so elected and re-elected. Where do we think that money is going to come from? For profit prisons...growing and selling Marijuana..ect.

California is about to, if not already, have an over abundance of cannabis. To the pharmaceutical companies, it might be better to burn the extra off or siphon it to some other state secretly (Since its still illegal in other states and selling it over the border is a Federal crime.) rather than to drop the price on Cannabis. This is going to be like the new gold rush...people growing their own Cannabis is a threat to the profitability of companies like Johnson & Johnson who if they get a contract to grow Cannabis will not want any competition whatsoever.

Congress might even pass a federal law making it illegal to grow ones own Cannabis. How else can a big pharama company make profits if everyone is growing their own?

[Weekend Warrior]

3. "Right now at my dispensary, Sativa and Indica range for one ounce about 17 dollars a tin."

I think I might be reading incorrectly. Are you saying one ounce for $17? We get some of our better MJ brought into our area from dispensaries in cali. We get a lot of candy, oil and flower. I paid $360 for my last ounce. That's in FL.

[yuiyoshida]

4. Yes, i said about that price... it really depends on the strain

and how much CBD OR THC is in the product. Obviously the more medicinal help, Cannabis can supply the more expensive it will be. Again, if big Pharma gets their paws on it, expect it to be around 40 dollars an ounce, and they will push legislation to make it illegal for you to grow your own Cannabis. They don't want the competition!


Check out the price for Cannabis from the dispensary I go to;

http://www.harvestshop.com/menu.html

[librechik]

10. FYI,the $40-45 price is for eighths, not ounces

But I get the point. Widespread adoption of legal pot is very bad news for the drug companes. They'l lose half their market if the study that just came out is true. Seems ike half of people stop using other drugs when they take up medical marijuana.

[yuiyoshida]

14. In the case of people with Essential Tremor they are told by the

Medical Community nothing can be done, and they will just have to live with that. But now, Cannabis is an answer to where there was none before. It has properties that help people with that disease, yet the Federal government hates it, and the Big Pharma's are pissed at the profits they are losing, and there are all those FOR PROFIT prisons being built that will NEED NEW inmates.

[librechik]

15. yes yes and yes n/t

[TheFrenchRazor]

5. the "war on drugs" is a war on the liberty and human rights of american citizens. it is BS and needs

to be ended.

[yuiyoshida]

6. agreed...

"Refer madness" was never true no matter what anyone thinks.

[JoeStuckInOH]

7. "...we don't get high because its fun..." LOL What?

Speak for yourself.

That's like... 99% percent of the reason anybody I know (not seeking pain or other medicinal relief) smokes pot. I don't know about you, but there's not many reasons anyone regularly inhales lungfuls of smoke outside of occupational hazards, addiction, and/or it's enjoyable.

Since pot is not addictive and nobody has to smoke it as part of their profession... I guess that leaves most people smoking it for the enjoyment.

[yuiyoshida]

8. I AM saying the stereotypes for stoners are false

while it might be fun to get high and feel good, the medicinal effects are well worth it and more important than just having another avenue to an altered state. Check out this video that
Juju posted about Essential Tremor and how this disease affects many people.

This is one disease that can be controlled now by Cannabis. There was no surgery and no pill that could help these people, but now... guess what works better than anything else?

medical marijuana.

[dixiegrrrrl]

9. One teensy point.....smoking is not the only way to effectively use weed.

In the 29 states which have legalized it, you can buy edibles. My son in washington was telling me of all the options available there, including chocolate chunks, little hard candies, tinctures, etc.
Washington state limits each single item to have no more than 10mgs total of CBO and THC.
Other states may vary.
and, turns out, it is the CBO which provides the medical help aspect.

I may have to move back there.......sigh.

[BannonsLiver]

11. Vaporizers are also an option

I've tried edibles before but find I can't get the equivalent buzz. but I'm a bigger guy so that may have something to do with it.

[JoeStuckInOH]

12. True true.

But are edibles considered for medicinal uses (the primary reason for the OP, I know). Does enough of the active drugs survive the digestion process to be as effective as pulmonary introduction? I thought delivery of the drug as a medicinal tool via vaporizing or smoking is preferred?

[yuiyoshida]

17. You know what?

I have a pipe, I used to use a bong. I have a bad cough now, and it doesn't help. But I can use a vape and still be able to breath clearly and not be coughing from the smoke. I have done edibles but its the kind of thing that takes a while before it goes into effect and than takes forever for you to come down.

With a vape, I can do it for a few seconds, and start to feel it and within a half hour, I am feeling back to normal.

Also, with medical marijuana you have to know there are some strains that have higher THC than others,.Sativa and Indica have higher levels of THC. The THC can help in some situations but it s the high Cannabiol (CBD) that has many of the medical affects. A patient has the choice to buy

High CBD -anti-inflammatory, Pain reief, NOt Psychoactive, and its Relaxing

Sativa -THC-TETRAHYDROCANNABINOL which relieves pain, relieves nausea, is Psycho acitve which gets you high, and its way more stimulating than the rest.

Indica -Cannabinol (CBN) AND (CBG) CANNABIGEROL which is Sedating and gives pain relief at night.


There are also HYBREDS of the above Cannabis.

[jberryhill]

26. Dose titration

With edibles, you are in for the ride. People tend to eat one, think "it's not working or not enough" and eat some more, before really waiting long enough for onset. At that point, it's going to last a while. With smoke/vape, dose and effect are more immediate and, thus, controllable.

[womanofthehills]

31. Edibles are excellent for people with sleep problems and anxiety

definitely for medical use.

[JuJuYoshida]

13. "speak for yourself" I think she was...and for me

I understand people get high for fun, and although it IS fun, until I started using it doing daily tasks like holding a glass of water, using a spoon or typing in your PIN number at the grocery store while the line watches you struggle and shake like you have Parkinson's was a VERY REAL thing for me. I'm not going around all high off my ass either, it does it's job, calms my shakes so yeah, when I get home I have fun with Yui and vape and have a few laughs but there are many of us who feel it's a miracle to have something like weed instead of taking man-made drugs that were literally tearing my liver apart.

Unlike Yui however, I don't fear "the man" will knocking down my dispensary when I'm inside buying, I don't subscribe to all that nonsense seeing as how I have a legitimate medical card to purchase it. I don't fear government taking away my PLANT that's been available for decades now matter how rich they think they can get off it, it'll never happen.

[JuJuYoshida]

16. Also....

So, they are trying to "help" Alcohol wholesalers in case marijuana sales will negatively impact business? News alert: Marijuana > Alcohol. Besides, consumer dollars will drive market forces. Hopefully, the proliferation of legal marijuana dispensaries, will change the public's view on the substance and alcohol sales could (and should) decline. I'm not anti-alcohol, but I think marijuana gets a bad rap and alcohol has more immediate negative side effects and long term use issues than Marijuana. I'm also heavily biased.

also, I think I smoked a strain last night called, "accidentally leave your remote control in the fridge"

[loyalsister]

18. The medical cannabis argument is not as strong as the one for full legalization

The medical evidence is not clinically well defined. It's more like the evidence of herbal teas medicinal properties because optimal doses and delivery have not been narrowly defined.
On the other hand, self determined use has been consistently helpful for people there is not enough specific data. I am in favor of full legalization ("stoners" welcome) that would allow for personal horticulture. It is in the interest of justice, personal decision making, medicinal choices, and it has helped reduce the damage that opiate abuse has been causing.

[yuiyoshida]

19. You know about the CA Gold rush, (1848 1855) right? At Sutter's mill that brought people from

As faraway as CHINA to the United States to pan for gold?

Well, Cannabis is going to be the new gold rush. There will be many people wanting to grow their own Cannabis and in California, I believe that three plants are the legal limit that one is allowed to grow as an individual.

But, a recent newspaper report has stated that California may already be over growing the crop, and since its a FEDERAL LAW that you can not transport it out of state, all that Cannabis has to be sold (probably for cheaper) or removed to keep the current prices and taxes where they were in the beginning.

http://www.dailypress.com/news/nationworld/dp-california-has-too-much-marijuana-20170727-story.html

[JuJuYoshida]

20. "all that Cannabis has to be sold"

TAKE MY MONEY!

[yuiyoshida]

21. Well when you inherit your MILLIONS

you can invest in a Cannabis farm, and i will help you... but i don't slop pigs...so there is that.

[hunter]

22. California is where the War on Drugs, cannabis division, ends.

I'm also optimistic that Session's war on Sanctuary Cities will end here too.

Sadly, it won't be for reasons of ideology, it will be all about the $$$.

[yuiyoshida]

23. Ya know if Trump fires

Jeffery B. Sessions than the possibility that his personal war on drugs will be done for and we will have to deal with someone who might be a little more lenient.

[hunter]

24. I'm not a big fan of "tolerance" or "lenient." And I FUCKING HATE poker.

But forced into a game of poker (my brother is a poker player) you play the hand you are dealt.

Once sixteen hours stoned in Las Vegas I broke $64 above even.

These days I'm laughing my ass off because non-human AI poker players are ahead and they don't know or care shit about "tells" or anything else. They play the cards as they see them.

[yuiyoshida]

30. Well the answer is obvious

Dump the Republicans from the Government and replace them with Democrats. If we had a super majority like Jerry Brown has we'd be on easy street, and heading forwards, not backwards.

[hunter]

34. I'm a huge Jerry Brown fan...

... even though I see him as a center-right politician.

But hugely competent, just like Obama.

We live in a center right nation.

Those are the cards we've been dealt.

[BigDemVoter]

25. Good point.

It's so interesting that using weed reduces the need for other types of medications. For instance, I recently had a nasty back injury and instead of being zonked on Flexeril all day, I had an edible that relaxed me, and I was able to go about my business.

I'm so damned tired of hearing yet more lies from this administration. Hopefully the stigma is going away. I live in San Francisco, so it's very open here, and I don't have a good idea of what other places are like. But here, nobody gives a damn, and LOTS of people use it.

[womanofthehills]

27. I find this strange - using the EB-5 program to attract Japanese investors in a huge marijuana grow

Will this put the local dispensaries in NM out of business? 40 million plants!!! Bright Green claims they will grow lots of herbs but mainly marijuana. So, basically a local businessman hooks up with the pueblo and is relying on Japanese money to get rich.

The Bright Green Group of Companies and the Acoma Pueblo Native American tribe have partnered to create the world’s most advanced, state-of-the-art greenhouse facility and research center for medicinal plants.

The development will occupy approximately 150 acres of the Acoma Indian Reservation. After the two-year construction project is completed, the facility will have the capacity to grow up to 40 million plants per year.

www.brightgreengroup.com

[yuiyoshida]

32. I wonder if a JAPANESE COMPANY WILL Even work...

because the drug is very illegal in Japan. I wonder how the Japanese government feel about being in the Cannabis business. Its not like they can bring the product home and use it! Talk about hypocrisy.. than again they might be too busy worrying about the NORTH KOREAN rocket test dropping missiles just off the shore of JAPAN.

[Warren DeMontague]

45. Yeah, pacific rim countries like Japan, S. Korea etc seem extremely uptight about weed.

I read something about South Korean authorities doing hair analysis to bust people for smoking pot far in the past.

look at a longhair like Willie Nelson- they could find out what he was doing in 1997....

[panader0]

28. I'm 66, been smoking since I was 15.

I've grown almost every year. Plenty for me and my friends.
Laws---whatever......

[womanofthehills]

29. In NM you can grow 16 plants (4 flowering) if you get a card

Most of my friends now have cards. Easy to get because the state needs the income from growers fees and dispensaries.

[yuiyoshida]

36. Its so very amazing how easy it is go get a

California MMJ card. Compared to New York State, where you practically have to be on your death bed before you are allowed to use it.

Patient: "cough"
CA Dotor: "you qualify, stand here while we take your photo, that will be 85 dollars please, and be sure to come back next year to renew your Cannabis card."
Patient : "Thanks doc!'
Doctor: "Take this brochure, it will show you all the Cannabis dispensaries in the city and some even deliver!"

Patient: "cool!"

[Warren DeMontague]

33. There are certainly BS stereotypes about cannabis users. Like lazy couch potatoes.

Whereas the truth is, statistically they tend to be healthier and get more exercise than the general population, for instance.

https://www.civilized.life/articles/420-exercise-cannabis-consumers/

Also the idea that they're stupid, unmotivated and unemployed? Also BS:

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/cannabis-users-success-satisfied-marijuana-weed-study-well-adjusted-rich-a7792991.html

Debunking myths of low motivation and under-achievement, in California it was found that 20 percent of consumers had graduated with a master’s degree while the figure was 12 percent for those who wouldn’t consider trying cannabis.
***
Similar results were found in Colorado with 64 percent of cannabis consumers in full-time jobs, compared to 54 percent of those who would not consider consuming the drug.

[yuiyoshida]

37. WELL you KNOW HOW we are viewed....

[Warren DeMontague]

38. I loved that movie. Still cracks me up.

Honestly in the days when I was a fairly regular stoner, lo long ago, I didn't think much about legalization, except maybe "gee, it'd be fun to go to Amsterdam one day"

Now I'm an old fart, and indulge maybe once in a blue moon. When Bob Weir passes through town, right? Or I get some pain relief on occasion from high CBD products.

But I live in a place where it's fully legal, I see legalization working, I appreciate the tax revenue, and my commitment to individual liberty is as strong as its ever been. Smoke it less, yammer about it a lot more.

For that, I'm told it's a "pet issue" by some here-- and I'm sure they think I'm sitting here with a 5 foot Graphics bong as we speak.

[yuiyoshida]

40. A huge bong is something I have smoked from before....

I prefer the vape now...


it works just as well, I am not coughing from the smoke and it does the job I need it to do for my particular medical condition.

The best part is no weed hangover... You can't say that about Vodka Tonics or Tequila Sunrises or bottles of SAKE.

[Warren DeMontague]

42. It is, from my point of view, a far superior substance to alcohol.

Yeah, my days of having something to prove by taking the bong hit from the balcony while one of my friends lights the thing at the bottom of the stairs..... What can I say? We did a lot of crazy shit while Reagan was telling us to "Just say no".

Honestly I've been most impressed with the quality and reliability of the edibles we get up here. I saw a show at the Moda center a year or so ago, and before taking the max there I had one of these chocolate bar deals, it was probably like a 50/50 THC/CBD ratio... an hour later I was supremely and perfectly high and it lasted a good 4 hours or so. Perfect.

And here you have this nice confluence of people who know both boutique cannabis and boutique chocolate. Put em together... Damn.

[Warren DeMontague]

35. Simple fact is, the feds don't have anything like the resources to go after all the dispensaries

much less users.

Another point to consider, Yui, is that any prosecutions they do are quite likely going to end in a jury trial in the jurisdiction of the arrest. Which means a jury composed of people who statistically are likely to have voted for legalization.

Ever done Jury duty? I have. You're dragged out of your job, your life, haul your ass down to the court for 5 bucks a day. Sure, it's a civic responsibility. But people get a little resentful if the government is fucking with their time and livelihood over something they consider flat-out irresponsible, tax dollar wasting bullshit.


So their options are kind of limited. I think the fact that Sessions hasn't done anything yet and usually tries to change the subject when asked, is a big honkin' indicator of that.

[yuiyoshida]

39. I don't know, i think the reason he hasn't sent out

Trump's goons yet is he's been too busy trying to cover his ass, about meeting with Russians, and Trump is not to happy with him right now,.. his job is on the line, and tends to motivate one to do what they can to stay out of trouble.

[Warren DeMontague]

41. He also has been cornered by Republican Senators like Paul and Gardner over it

so it's not just Democrats pushing back.

I think he's in kind of an uncomfortable position; on one hand, he obviously hates weed, he's got all these salivating culture war ninnies like Hugh Hewitt going "why havent you stopped teh pot, yet"-- but at the same time, he knows the reality of the DOJ and that the Cole Memo didn't come out of Obama's philosophical orientation so much as the reality of Fed vs. State law enforcement and what the Feds are actually capable of doing.

It's important to remember that even in the "glory days" of federal raids on, say, California dispensaries, when Melinda Haag was the widely despised US atty for Northern California; simultaneously, once Colorado passed their MMJ law, the feds mostly left that state alone. A lot of people were confused as to why that was, but really the distinction was in the nature of the state law itself. Colorado fully and completely legalized and regulated mmj, bringing it into a state regulatory framework.. whereas CA only did that in the past couple years. Prop 215- which I voted for, by the way- only provided a legal defense for medical marijuana. A distinction relevant to the question of Federal involvement.

The simplified summary of all this is, there are solid legal reasons why they haven't gone full bore into conflict with state law on this- and state medical mj laws are just as much in conflict with federal law as recreational ones... that's not to say they never could or never would, but it's not a clear cut, easy call.

And then, even if they did, they're opening a poltical shitstorm, taking an unpopular position, and as I said pushing criminal cases very hard to convict with local juries, for very little payoff except maybe shutting up the Hugh Hewitt and Kevin Sabets of the world.

[Bradshaw3]

43. Been using off and on since 1969

but only legally since last year when I moved to a medical marijuana state. Thought I would die before that happened so it was cool to buy legally. Using has been problematic for reasons I won't go into. I have found I like the chocolate edibles, prefer indica or a hybrid. I like the relaxing body feeling and the high is more like it was when I was younger. This high THC sativa stuff you kids smoke is a bit too much for this old hippie.

[yuiyoshida]

44. You are not the only one...

I use Indica because I can be stoned enough to want to sleep, and sleep very well. Sativa is a stimulant, so you will get high and never be able to fall asleep because you are too wired.