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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSome Trumpers have apologized for their part. Have 3rd party or non-voters started apologizing yet?
Last edited Fri Oct 13, 2017, 10:32 AM - Edit history (1)
Do they care? Are they serious about their "values"
Have they recognized that they were duped. That they let themselves be played by fakers.
Anyone still listening to Susan Sarandon? She seems very proud of herself.
As I like to say at any chance I get:
Anyone who says that the 2 parties are the same is lying & has an agenda.
Anyone who said that the 2 parties are the same lied & had an agenda.
Remember that next time.
NOTE: If you care! If you want to be an ally! Start by showing good faith & apologize for your TRUMP vote.
If you thought you were in a safe State you still did plenty to poison the well. You made it OK to gamble with our well-being.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Do they care? Are they serious about their "values"
Have they recognized that they were duped. That they let themselves be played by fakers.
Anyone still listening to Susan Sarandon? She seems very proud of herself.
As I like to say at any chance I get:
Anyone who says that the 2 parties are the same is lying & has an agenda.
Anyone who said that the 2 parties are the same lied & had an agenda.
Remember that next time.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)DFW
(56,316 posts)Last edited Sat Oct 14, 2017, 12:09 AM - Edit history (1)
Trump has no clue who any judges are. He just passes on the names given to him, and the Republican Senate rubber-stamps them.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)DFW
(56,316 posts)But as a jurist herself, she would have known and recognized qualified judges without the need to have them spoonfed to her.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Gothmog
(153,721 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)or nah!
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)Hillary was never getting a Johnson vote. The Libertarian party is more hard-right in some places than even Republicans. Johnson votes took Trump votes away.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)In fact, were it not for Johnson votes, the Popular vote could very well have gone in TRUMP's favor.
Trust me when I say this - Hillary Clinton was never going to get a Johnson voter's vote. Libertarians are right-wing, not left. If more disgruntled Republicans cast for Johnson, we wouldn't even be talking about this right now.
This also assumes Hillary was entitled to EVERYone's vote. Is that the argument here?
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)brer cat
(26,018 posts)yet voted for Johnson in 2016. Few blanket statements are true, even if they are bolded.
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)You put no value in blanket statements, I put no value in anecdotes.
The Libertarian Party remains right wing. Parts of their platform go even further hyper-right than even Republicans do. General Democratic voters will go for that? DOUBTFUL.
Champion Jack
(5,378 posts)lapucelle
(19,518 posts)https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/election-update-is-gary-johnson-taking-more-support-from-clinton-or-trump/
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/09/gary-johnson-swing-election-2016-president-214251
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)NOTHING ABOUT GARY JOHNSON BESIDES "Legal Weed" IS DEMOCRATIC. Just because a wingnut rag like The Federalist (who thinks every candidate is a statist) says he is don't make him so.
Are they just caring about "legalized pot" and not reading the REST of the Draconian Libertarian Party platform?? FairTax - HOW is that Democratic? Support of the TPP - Again, NOT Democratic. Getting rid of the DEA, gutting the social safety net ("gutting" as in "get rid of completely), abolishing Obamacare, making medical patients pay all expenses out of pocket - HOW are those Democratic values?
Opinionize all y'all want - anyone who votes Libertarian isn't a Democrat or a progressive to begin with.
And where did I bring up Bernie? Are you people STILL blaming him for Hillary losing to the WORST Presidential Candidate in history instead of looking in a mirror? You're mistaking "A national poll of likely voters" for "ALL Democratic voters". A smidgen isn't the rule. You're not entitled to people's votes. There were very clear things she did wrong and very clear outside influences that interfered with this election.
That being said . . . . you really need to stop blaming independents, libertarians and progressives in general for Hillary's loss. It's a false trail. It does nothing but divide us. Third parties are always going to exist. Face facts. The Republican absolutist mantra is killing us in national and state elections. There is no reason whatsoever to vote for Republicans in 2017, but millions and millions still do and millions and millions still don't LIKE us. You need to start figuring out how to win voters over. Stop saying "There's nothing wrong with our message or our methods" . . . because Republican victories by the truckload say otherwise!!
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)There are people who used to be members of this site who left, joined another site and voted Trump. Is Trump a logical vote for anyone who was a 10+ year member here?
lapucelle
(19,518 posts)"Opinionize all y'all want - anyone who votes Libertarian isn't a Democrat or a progressive to begin with."
Wouldn't that mean that all those who voted for a progressive for the nomination and then switched over to Johnson for the general election were never progressives to begin with?
metalbot
(1,058 posts)If you were a California voter and decided to make a protest vote, then your actions had absolutely no effect on this election.
Demsrule86
(70,838 posts)They bypassed great Dem women in order to pick Sen. Sanders. Why would he be picked? Also, the primarying of Democrats...these folks don't care who they hurt, they just want to attack Democrats. If we don't get the house back, we really are screwed...we could have a chance at the Senate...if we weren't stupidly primarying senators like Joe Manchin and Dianne Feinstein...using resources to go after GOP Senate seats...and of course starving the DNC and then complaining that they don't do enough to elect whoever the flavor of the month is. The usual suspects...they costs us the election in 2000 and 2016...still at it.
coolsandy
(479 posts)Demsrule86
(70,838 posts)And of course the big one ...1980.
HopeAgain
(4,407 posts)Frankly pointing the finger isn't going to accomplish that. Growing our base will. Let's figure out how to get more votes rather than just throwing shade.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Kentonio
(4,377 posts)We're selling a vision of the countries future, not forming a youth club.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Kentonio
(4,377 posts)As a political party the responsibility is always on US to earn people's votes. If we fail to do that, then no matter how much we think the public were wrong, or stupid, or deluded, or bad, its still our own fault for not putting forward a more convincing vision than the other side did.
Obviously when the table is rigged it makes that job harder, and sometimes even impossible (as many great young politicians quickly discover when they run against rich, connected incumbents), but at the national level we simply havent been doing enough to pull in enough voters in the right places.
Any time the finger starts being pointed at the voters, its a clear sign that we're not learning from our mistakes. All it ever achieves is further alienation, and makes our job even harder.
Politics is marketing. Our product is a better, fairer, more equal country. You might hate the marketing side, but without it your product will never end up in the hands of Americans.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)If people did not realize or care, they dropped the ball.
Kentonio
(4,377 posts)Our marketing must have really dropped the ball if we couldn't convince the American public that what we were offering was better than what that monster was. Obviously there are many, many reasons for that, and a lot of them are unfair and corrupt, but its still a damning indictment of our efforts that we couldn't win against him, no matter what hurdles were placed in our way.
The only other option is that the America people are just bad, and I don't accept that in a country that very recently elected Obama.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)If people cared they'd feel responsible for aiding the situation we are in!
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)for them. The people who will die, because some voted for trump, and other's voted for stein and others didn't vote because the two major parties "were the same". Their "purity" will cost lives.
And those who will pay the price, they care
adigal
(7,581 posts)2018. Do you understand that we MUST all come together, even if we don't agree with them or are angry with them?? Our lives may depend on this. Literally.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)mcar
(43,348 posts)And voting for Democrats! And supporting Democrats!
adigal
(7,581 posts)Same thing with Biden, or anyone else who runs as our Dem candidate.
In 2018, we need to register people and GOTV. Or we won't have a 2020 vote.
mcar
(43,348 posts)That's the entire point.
adigal
(7,581 posts)BigmanPigman
(52,144 posts)and she defends that her decision with, "I thought Hillary would win". I am really pissed off at her though. I am sure a lot of people did the same thing for the same reason.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)BigmanPigman
(52,144 posts)would win so she doesn't really feel badly or guilty. I haven't spoken with her since I found out. I hold her responsible for this shit that we are in.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)It came out from a post elsewhere and they were unapologetic about it despite what Trump has been like.
BigmanPigman
(52,144 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)BigmanPigman
(52,144 posts)The Genealogist
(4,726 posts)Millions suffer and will continue to, at least part due to her both-sidism. She'll not suffer for it in her cozy cocoon of wealth and fame, of course.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)meadowlark5
(2,795 posts)He voted for Stein. He feels perfectly fine with his vote because he knows any vote not for a republican means nothing for the state electoral votes anyway. Solid red state. But if it were a swing state, I doubt he would have voted for Clinton. He hates them all the way back to Bill.
But man oh man, do I see him daily slamming Trump on FB though I know he played his part with the Clinton hate train during the campaign. He would never admit he was duped. He's a self professed political junkie and no way would Russian propaganda have influenced his decision
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)So not off the hook.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)fescuerescue
(4,465 posts)I suppose it makes my ego feel a little better if someone apologizes to someone else for their vote, but it doesn't really matter.
Those kind of sentiments are valuable as chat board postings.
All that matters if how people voted on election day.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)why would this be different for other complicit parties to do so.
fescuerescue
(4,465 posts)But what does that Good faith buy?
If I could entice all of Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Ohio to all apologize for voting the wrong way, I would go to bed feeling really good.
But the next morning Trump would still be President, and we would all be in the exact same place we are now, and writing about the same things we are writing about now.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)needed next time!
MuseRider
(34,325 posts)Everyone has a vote that they do not have to explain or even tell you about. What do you want? Do you truly want a Democracy where your vote is yours or not?
If they don't feel bad about it what are you going to do?
If they do feel bad about it what are you going to do?
Who cares what anyone else thinks about their vote?
Kentonio
(4,377 posts)Seriously, the idea of asking voters to apologize for their votes. The mind boggles..
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)about what happened on their watch.
MuseRider
(34,325 posts)Not your opinion about it all but your wish to demand people apologize to you before you will think well of them.
Really, their vote is none of your business.
I am not angry and I realize this may sound angry but it is none of my business and none of yours how anyone else votes. Do you really need club cards before you can work with someone?
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Glamrock
(11,937 posts)I seriously doubt that there's more than a few, if any, here that this would apply to.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Thanks for your response though. I know you meant well.
122. Nope, they don't owe you shit. We need to win their vote
View profile
That's our job, not shaming or blaming. We need their vote and it won't be done by demanding an apology or castigating people
Every ally we can get will be critical to overcome gerrymandering, Russian influence, election fraud etc
Get out and work for their vote, one by one. That's how it's done
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)MuseRider
(34,325 posts)If you don't know who they voted for do they go in a box labeled "Hmmmm, not sure about this one." ? That is going to be one big box.
Most people I know vote on issues not on party lines. Ya gonna throw them out because they might have not wanted to vote for President because they thought both candidates were losers? Was that the right thing for them to do? Obviously most of us do not think so but was it the right thing to do? It is their vote, they are allowed to do what they want with it.
Are you going to throw them all out of your little club if they tell you that?
Seriously, this is really stupid.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)MuseRider
(34,325 posts)Anyone who would suggest that someone apologize for their vote because it was not like theirs deserves to apologize.
SMC22307
(8,090 posts)Hell, I'm only half-way through this snowflakish OP and want an apology for the headache it's causing.
Apologies for everyone!
MuseRider
(34,325 posts)There is another around somewhere. You might as well dive in all the way. Be prepared to be carded before long.
Jakes Progress
(11,170 posts)Last edited Fri Oct 13, 2017, 03:18 PM - Edit history (1)
Every one has a right to eat. If I grab two sandwiches from the tray and leave someone else without a meal, I not only need to apologize. I need to make amends.
The apology shows that they are less likely to do something stupid or selfish like that again.
MuseRider
(34,325 posts)unless WE decide to share them. It is not the same. I see and understand what you all are saying but people are all different, as you know. To expect everyone to do as you do and if not you can castigate them is simply acting like an overbearing parent to grown adults. People, grown-ups do not have to comply.
Votes and sandwiches are two different things entirely.
I sincerely doubt anyone with any sense and do feel badly, who actually made the choice to vote differently than you did will feel like they owe you anything. They may very well feel badly but they do not owe you one damned thing, not even an apology because their vote is theirs. In fact they do not owe you or me or anyone else even an explanation and to keep treating them like idiots, no matter how idiotic they were to vote that way, is to chase them further away. I would find it hard to even stomach this party if the actual party was asking for this.
Jakes Progress
(11,170 posts)Last edited Fri Oct 13, 2017, 11:13 PM - Edit history (1)
It's about personal responsibility. It is to show that they understand that they were duped and will not be so gullible next time.
And I must disagree with the last part of your post. Those who voted in ways that is harming millions do owe. They owe an apology to the Dreamers, to Puerto Rico, to the LBGTQ community. They owe it to the children and grandchildren who will grow up in a diminished America with debased parklands, more befouled environment, and the greater threat of nuclear devastation. Yes. When someone wrongs other people, they owe.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Those who voted in ways that enabled Trump may ultimately have horrific events in Iran or North Korea on their tab.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)SMC22307
(8,090 posts)during the Bush reign of terror, only to have them eventually tell me that I was right all along. Did they learn or feel the need to apologize? Hell no. As soon as Sarah Palin burst on the scene, they rallied behind her. These candidates match their belief system, and it doesn't matter what package they come in: Drumpf, Carson, Rubio, Cruz, etc.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Not Ruth
(3,613 posts)The reason to teach kids to apologize isn't to make the wrong-doer feel better. It's to make the person wronged feel better. ... Rather than coercing apology, he says, it would be better to create a loving environment, where the children feel safe and confident enough to apologize.Apr 3, 2013 The Atlantic
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Although it is interesting that you would try to use children as analogies to describe Democrats and Progressives who voted either Johnson, Stein or Trump.
The rationalizations they used were definitely not adult rationalizations. The lunatic who shot the Republican Congress folks at the softball game had crap on their social media pages that said something along the lines of If everyone who believes inX votes Stein we will win! And they clearly believed that would happen.
Again that is the belief and rationalization of a child, not an adult. And that is only one example.
NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)because they think they were right. Susan Sarandon was a 3rd party voter who "did not vote with her vagina" and who called Hillary Clinton "more dangerous" than Trump. This is the typical mindset of those voters. Some of them are actually GLAD that Dump is fucking up so badly...that'll show the Clinton supporters!
Bastards.
Me.
(35,454 posts)They cannot be trusted
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)Welcome back.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Jakes Progress
(11,170 posts)that Hillary was nasty. Who are you going to believe? History and reality or an anonymous story probably cooked up in Odessa. Can't apologize. That story from the internets was so juicy.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)regretting their vote. Public shaming is not appropriate.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Thank you but I refuse. Take back your word. No thank siree!
Lil Missy
50. inappropriate. No one has to publicly apologize for their vote. They either are or they aren't
View profile
regretting their vote. Public shaming is not appropriate.
louis c
(8,652 posts)If you want your opinion to be taken seriously, then tell us how you voted and if you changed your mind.
If not, please keep your vote and your opinions to yourself, as they carry no credibility.
I know you voted for Hilary and so did I. We both know what a "binary choice" is and the consequences of not choosing the right side of the choice.
I made this mistake in my lifetime. I did not support Hubert Humphrey in 1968. I learned the lesson of a "binary choice" the hard way, at a young age. I saw it happen in 2000, and again last year.
Every time Democrats think it doesn't matter which way we vote in a GE, we get fucked.
Every generation or so, we learn our lesson the hard way. All the OP wants to know, is have the voters who voted 3rd party, sat out or wrote in learned their lesson. If they haven't, their opinion in useless to me.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)and realize how many were fucked b/c of the ramifications of this election.
louis c
(8,652 posts)Here's how I voted my whole life in GE (I was born in 1952, but was politically active at 16 YO, hence the Humphrey reference in my previous post)
McGovern (1972)
Carter (1976)
Carter (1980)
Mondale (1984)
Dukakis (1988)
Perot (1992) This needs some explaining. I'm a union guy and that whole election cycle was about NAFTA. That was the issue I voted on. I admit that that could have turned out to be a mistake, but Perot actually was ahead as late as June. He actually did have a chance, even though he finished with just 20%. I never thought that was a wasted vote.
Clinton (1996)
Gore (2000)
Kerry (2004)
Obama (2008)
Obama (2012)
Hilary (2016)
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)joshcryer
(62,371 posts)ClarendonDem
(720 posts)Last edited Fri Oct 13, 2017, 08:27 PM - Edit history (1)
Not voting for HRC in 2016, and that they don't make the same mistake in 2020. If they do realize that, and Trump is voted out of office in 2020, I don't really care if anyone apologizes for their vote in 2016. Won't change the outcome of this past election.
KPN
(16,032 posts)What's needed is votes. We need to do a better job gaining peoples' confidence and support. Demanding an apology and/or blaming is pointless. Working to change things, including what people think about our party, is better. But you can only do that if you understand and give merit to their grievances. I think we as a party are beginning to and can do that. We can win this thing back -- but we need all of us.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)Eliot Rosewater
(32,420 posts)I would say more, ALL of it supportive of actual Democrats, and the actual Democratic party, but I dont dare.
MineralMan
(147,299 posts)what people will do the next chance they have to vote. I hope the lessons learned since November, 2016 have been well-learned. We'll get another chance, if Trump doesn't blow everything up. What we do with that chance will determine whether we recover or continue to go into the toilet.
I have no idea, at this point, what will happen. At age 72, I only have a few more chances to make my wishes known at the polling place. How many I have no idea.
I hope to leave this world on an upward trend, a progressive trend. I hope I don't go while watching this country descend into a morass of intolerance and uncaring.
I hope people have learned and will join together to move things forward. If not, I will regret that we did not do that.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)MM we are in this together. Thank you for caring.
MineralMan
(147,299 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)This makes each of us stronger. This is LIFE GIVING!
I go forth knowing that real human beings all over the nation got my back.
Because you seem to be an avatar here but I know a warm person (in all its meanings) is on the other side.
I know I am not alone in feeling this.
briv1016
(1,570 posts)It'd be near impossible to prove otherwise.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)elehhhhna
(32,076 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)77. This is just divisive venom
elehhhhna
(32,076 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)elehhhhna
79. LOL? How is this funny?
BainsBane
(54,530 posts)though I myself don't find it amusing in the least but rather revealing.
Champion Jack
(5,378 posts)Mariana
(14,951 posts)Why isn't all this rage being directed at Trump voters? By and large, they still support him and would enthusiastically vote for him again. They're the ones who put him in office, and they should not be deprived of the credit.
HughBeaumont
(24,461 posts)Ultimately (outside interference from Russia aside), the ones at fault for Trump are:
* Trump voters.
* The people who sat out November 8th.
That's who's at fault for Trump - the ones who thought "President Donald Trump" would be a great idea.
Still find it weird that he won four swing states by 1% or less. TOO uncanny.
BainsBane
(54,530 posts)How do you not get that?
Mariana
(14,951 posts)Trump voters voted for Trump. Hillary voters voted for Hillary. Third party voters voted for third party candidates. Nonvoters didn't vote for anyone. Someone who stayed home did not for Trump, it is an impossibility and it's dishonest to say they did. A third party voter voted against Trump, by definition. It is dishonest to say they voted for him.
Anyway, even if you assume their votes would have gone to Hillary if they had done otherwise, why are they more deserving of scorn than the tens of millions of actual, real life Trump voters? You know, the ones who voted for him on purpose? Why?
BainsBane
(54,530 posts)In voting third party, they chose to relinquish their vote to the winner. Trump won.
However, in many cases they explicitly voted for Stein out of resentment about the primary and animosity toward Clinton. They pretend to have been Democrats but claim they just couldn't vote for Hillary for a whole litany of bullshit reasons unrelated to issues or policy. Not only they, they actively argued that she was worse than Trump--which means they chose Trump.
The reason I believe they are more deserving of scorn is because Trump voters thought they were making the best choice. They believed Trump would help their lives in some way. The fascist collaboration knew that Trump was bad, but they choose to allow him to become president out of anger and ego. Some of them purposefully intended to punish the poor and the marginalized for refusing to acquiesce to their demands in the primary. I saw those arguments on JPR. I literally saw people argue they were now opposed to LGBT rights, women's rights and civil rights because those voters supported Hillary. They claimed their anger was that the Democrats didn't support "equality." That is literally the word they use, Equality meaning more for them and less for everyone else. It's naked self interest, racism and misogyny. Of course they preferred Trump, which is why they continue to defend him.
MuseRider
(34,325 posts)they want to punish people they don't get to unless someone wants to tell them how they vote. Even then it is none of their GD business to punish someone for what their conscience told them to do at that time. They will learn the lessons on their own like we did back before there were Internet possies.
This entire thread is based on the assumption that they are the best EVER and they get to know how you voted and then judge the hell out of you until you get on your knees and beg forgiveness so you can be part of the club.
Democracy dies in so many ways but nobody gets to do what this entire thread is about.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)NOT just me. So I don't accept your logic per se. Democracy dies quickly when people allow Racists Dictators.
MuseRider
87. The good thing is that no matter how much
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they want to punish people they don't get to unless someone wants to tell them how they vote. Even then it is none of their GD business to punish someone for what their conscience told them to do at that time. They will learn the lessons on their own like we did back before there were Internet possies.
This entire thread is based on the assumption that they are the best EVER and they get to know how you voted and then judge the hell out of you until you get on your knees and beg forgiveness so you can be part of the club.
Democracy dies in so many ways but nobody gets to do what this entire thread is about.
MuseRider
(34,325 posts)I am not disagreeing that their votes caused calamity but what I am saying is that YOU nor anyone else gets to hear how they voted or a reason unless they want to come out with it. You do not get to demand it. That goes against much of what this country stands for.
I am a grown up, I am assuming you are too (?). I prefer to be treated as one and not demanded by others to prove something that is frankly none of their business. What don't you get about the fact that you do not have the power to do this and you should not be demanding others beg your forgiveness. Not unless you intend to do the same for them. They perhaps think things are going swimmingly and want to know why the hell did you not fall in line.
I agree this country was taken down by stupid people. I heard enough, "I would NEVER vote for her you can peel my skin off and I would never vote for her." Much could have been done about that but wasn't and then you have to add all the other very unfair things that happened and we KNEW much of that was going to happen (maybe not the Russian stuff). None of that matters to what you are saying. You STILL DO NOT GET TO find out how others voted and then treat them like miscreant children just because they did not do what you wanted them to do. They have the right to stay quiet and hidden from this kind of treatment.
I am done with this. I have a Bernie avatar so I am certain I am suspect in your eyes, I can and will live with that and not shed one tear or drop of sweat. I will never, not in one million years tell you or anyone else how I voted. This is all so childish. Nobody owes you that.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Its no longer a move on kind of issue.
It requires regularly throwing Trump in the face of those who enabled him until they acknowledge their mistake.
SMC22307
(8,090 posts)Expect that someone apologize for their vote?
BainsBane
(54,530 posts)Indeed. This, however, is a site for Democrats, not Trumpers, fascists, and the Vichy collaboration. There are no shortage of sites that seek unity around the white nationalist agenda. That is not the purpose of this site.
Jamaal510
(10,893 posts)some 3rd party/non-voters who have apologized, I haven't heard of any yet. If I had to guess, most of them haven't learned a thing. They're that self-righteous that instead of questioning whether they should continue to support perennial losers with lofty promises, shaky agendas, and no foundations for their parties on local and state levels, they'd rather continue down their current path because, you know...a former Secretary of State/Senator who advocated expanded health care and a higher minimum wage was as unbearable as a draft-dodging perverted racist Twitter Warrior. If anything, they're probably expecting Democrats to apologize for Dolt 45 even though his margin of victory in a few key states was small, and even though HC did do plenty of campaigning in those states.
mcar
(43,348 posts)It's why I fear for future elections. The Sarandon types are secure in their moral righteousness, no matter what.
mcar
(43,348 posts)It's up to those 3rd party voters to realize they made a mistake and join us to move forward. I don't get the school of thought that Democrats need to kowtow to them. It's nreally the other way around.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)mcar
(43,348 posts)If people want change, or at least to get back to some semblance of sanity, they need to vote for the party that has the best chance of doing that. Anything else is immature and destructive.
Eliot Rosewater
(32,420 posts)in PR and will die by the tens of thousands next year when ACA is destroyed.
And I am still not allowed to say why this is happening. NOt sure how much longer I can stand that.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)And that goes double for the liberal bloggers/writers/pundits who carried water for Donnie all last year and now want to pretend they had nothing to do with it....
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)we should have started hearing about some apologizing or something to that effect.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)nolabels
(13,133 posts)you the right to void the sale?
I find myself wondering about the people who think they are always correct. Sometimes watching them when they find out they were wrong here or there I just wonder if they learned anything.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)enfolds...
nolabels
(13,133 posts)There is little of it to be sure because we are mostly creatures of habit and instinct. We run in herds and we often only question after some type of pain or loss is involved. We all mostly have been conditioned by civilization and society to do that repetitive movement and act. Telling someone they are wrong for one reason only leads to more debate and not much changing.
This website came to being because of the stolen election in 2000 and not much has changed except that some of us are wiser, so go figure
Arazi
(6,882 posts)That's our job, not shaming or blaming. We need their vote and it won't be done by demanding an apology or castigating people
Every ally we can get will be critical to overcome gerrymandering, Russian influence, election fraud etc
Get out and work for their vote, one by one. That's how it's done
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Allies that don't take their ally-dom or ally-ship with us seriously & don't give AF when confronted with a Hitler wannabe and don't recognize what they helped release on all of us. Ah, no! We will find better allies.
Glad that you are such a sincere UNITER though. Good on ya!
Arazi
122. Nope, they don't owe you shit. We need to win their vote
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That's our job, not shaming or blaming. We need their vote and it won't be done by demanding an apology or castigating people
Every ally we can get will be critical to overcome gerrymandering, Russian influence, election fraud etc
Get out and work for their vote, one by one. That's how it's done
elehhhhna
(32,076 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)AM A FAN!
137. Wow.
elehhhhna
(32,076 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Here looking at you babe! winky winky
142. So edgy
SMC22307
(8,090 posts)Nah, it's easier to fuck around online demanding apologies. God help us in 2018 and beyond...
BainsBane
(54,530 posts)They explicitly deny it. We see countless denials of Russian interference, defenses of Trump, and claim the whole controversy is sour grapes because Clinton couldn't close the deal. Their hatred for Hillary, the poor, women, and people of color far outpaces any desire to see Democrats elected. In fact, that is precisely why they despise the Democratic Party. They instead support a White Nationalist agenda, even if they refuse to identity it as such. They make excuses for the Nazis and insist their is nothing new about a president serving as an apologist and supporter of white nationalists.
Certainly get-out-the vote activities don't involve blaming or interrogation about past voting, but that isn't what this site does. It's purpose is to promote Democrats, not Trump enablers.
Besides, at this point there are far graver concerns than the next election. Now we can only hope, or pray if so inclined, that John Kelly and Mattis can keep Trump's itchy trigger figure off the nuclear football. If not, chances are good there won't be any elections to worry about. But that's not the fault of Trump and third-party voters who chose to put the madman in office. The Democrats went and ran a woman, immediately after the horror of a black man in the Oval Office. Now the world has to pay for it with millions of lives. And what do those lives matter compared to the egos of the self-entitled?
BainsBane
(54,530 posts)Some may regret their choices, but others are intent on doubling down and repeating their past behavior. It's clear to me that they want far right wing, fascist power, only they don't have the courage to admit it. They are fundamentally narcissists, who are incapable of thinking about anything but their own ego. That others suffer and even die is of no consequence to them. They may even enjoy the suffering. Remember that most of them think the Democratic Party no longer represents 'working people," meaning white men. They hate women and people of color, and want to see them punished. They make excuses for the Nazis and insist they are nothing new. People have already died because of their efforts to put Trump in office, and they don't care. Those lives are inconsequential compared to their egos and their demands for wealth and privileged.
Hitler depended on people like them to rise and remain in power. That crowed is no different. We are poised on the edge of nuclear annihilation, and their goal is to ensure that the Democrats stay out of office. They want Trump because he is as hateful and narcissistic as they are, and if he succeeds in killing their enemies--the poor, marginalized, Democrats--all the better. Millions could die in the Korean peninsula, throughout the East and even in California, and they would be complaining about Hillary as a supposed stooge of Goldman Sachs and that the 2016 primary was "rigged."
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Incredible the people that don't get my question and want to weaponize the idea of UNITY against us.
3 rd party voters & non-voters dropped the fucking nuke-ball on the whole world & future generations to come.
Heck our earth as in this big-ball made of soil & clay was also on the ballot.
They decided to gamble it all instead.
G_j
(40,429 posts)demand apologies from strangers. Would you also punish them if you could? If you think that is working for unity and the overall good, I have to question your reasoning.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Living LA VIDA UNITED, EH?
140. I have an innate distrust for people who
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demand apologies from strangers. Would you also punish them if you could? If you think that is working for unity and the overall good, I have to question your reasoning.