You don't think we're getting our hopes up about the indictments do you?

[a kennedy]

[Iggo]

1. I know I'm not.

It's a process. Let it happen.

[bearsfootball516]

2. It's hard to stay level headed since the news broke.

We all hope it'll be Manafort, Flynn, Kushner or Jr.

But there's a good chance it'll be a low level person that we haven't really heard of. That's just how the process works sometimes, baby steps.

It's also possible that nobody gets taken in on Monday. Note that all of the reports on Friday said that Monday was the earliest possible date, not that it was specifically happening ON Monday. It could be Tuesday, or Wednesday, or another day. We don't really know, because Mueller runs such a tight ship with so few leaks.

[FreeState]

33. NBC confirmed it will be made public Monday

https://www.mediaite.com/online/indictment-in-mueller-investigation-to-be-made-public-on-monday-nbc-news-reports/

[hlthe2b]

3. Some are, for sure... This is a marathon, not a sprint

and I think it is quite possible that this may be a fairly pro-forma indictment based on finished investigations that may be merely tangential to Trump-related & bigger issues.

Still, it is tantalizing to consider the more important possibilities involving figures far more central to Trump et al.

[emulatorloo]

6. Well said and +1

[marylandblue]

4. I am, but I understand I may be disappointed

What's really going is that things are coming to a head. Either Trump is going down, or the rule of law is finished. The tension is worse for me than any disappointment I may feel tomorrow.

[a kennedy]

5. This helps put things in perspective......

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10029764916 Thanks for this thread. Helps with my nerves.

[emulatorloo]

8. Yes that's a good thread. My thinking is similar

I do think some here are hoping for Kushner or Trump himself, but that's not how these investigations go. "Little folks" get indicted first, then prosecutors try to flip them and get them to cooperate w investigation and tell what they know about the people above them.

[DonaldsRump]

31. Generally, I agree, but not this time.

On conspiracy cases, where obstruction of justice may be at play, prosecutors will often go for the smaller fish first, tightening the noose on them and hoping they will flip and tattle on the bigger fish.

However, this is not a normal case. The stakes are gigantic (outside of a war, I can't imagine anything else of this magnitude). If there is a shred of truth to the Russian collusion allegations, it must be stopped immediately, particularly given Trump's incredible ineptitude.

The Republicans have only one card they can play, which they have played like crazy until now - to hope that nothing comes out and/or to not investigate, which is why they are puttering around in the House and Senate. That's why we have great intellects like Nunes and Grassley, who are doing everything to not investigate the Trump campaign - they know what's there (although Nunes is such a dummy, I have my doubts about him).

Mueller, by contrast, doesn't care what he finds, and he is the ace in the hole. I would think he would be tackling this with a vengeance where time is of the essence. IMHO, that's why I think this investigation is going to come to a head sooner rather than later, as there is simply far too much for our country to lose. Once the truth comes out, the Republicans have no choice but to abandon the Buffoon-in-chief. Putting it another way, the Repubs can't handle the truth, but I think the truth is so easily ascertainable in this matter that they won't be able to hide their collective heads in the sand much longer.

The appointment of and relative independence of Mueller was the best possible thing that could happen, and it's exactly why Trump went ape-shit with Sessions when Mueller was appointed - Trump could no longer control the investigation.

I'm just wondering if the sealed indictment relates to somebody, or several somebodies. Trump and the goons around him have no ethics, and they aren't really the brightest bulbs in the ceiling. I bet you there is a digital trail that's miles wide and miles deep that would be easily be traceable. This stuff can't be hidden forever and it had to have involved several different persons, none of whom are smart enough to figure out how to evade a detailed forensic technology-based investigation.

Anyway, I'm just speculating. Let's see, but it's great fun watching these insane tweets from these fools as they see this charade being exposed.

To paraphrase Gerald Ford on August 9, 1974, I hope our long national nightmare is over soon.

[Guilded Lilly]

11. My nerves are fairly shot by now. I hope, but I dont expect what we all want.

[Snackshack]

7. Yes.

[MFM008]

9. look

they are not going to indict Hillary.

A Janitor, a dog catcher...........its probably Manafort or Flynn or blissfully both,
just get out the


and we will see.

[Docreed2003]

10. EH....after Fitzmas Im a realist...but Ill relish in the intrigue

Until the full story comes out!

[BainsBane]

12. This has been reported by a legitimate news service

which actual reporters. It's not comparable to Fitzmas. Wasn't that just the fantasy of Truthout and Will Pitt?

The indictment could take a while to be released, or it might be someone so low we're disappointed, but I expect the news is real.

[Docreed2003]

13. Oh I know its real news BainesBane

I’m just trying to keep my expectations low...but I truly hope this is the beginning of the end for this cabal!

[fallout87]

15. what does the news

source have to do with it? We know someone will be charged, just like Scooter was. This could very well be the same thing.

[emulatorloo]

22. Because Jason Leopold kept claiming Rove would be indicted in 24 business

hours or something like that. Which was nonsense.

Current sources are much more cautious about triple checking their stories and getting facts right, they aren't claiming who will be indicted based on rumor or wishful thinking.

[BainsBane]

24. Fitzmas was about Rove, was it not?

Not Libby? The source determines the reliability of the story, whether it is based on evidence or wishful thinking.

[fallout87]

35. yes...

there was a ton of speculation that fitzmas would result in the indictment of Rove and possibly even Cheney, among others in the Bush administration. And what did we get? Lewis Libby charged with lying. In other words, a big dud.

[WinkyDink]

14. You know what? I feel a song coming on! From the original Off-Everywhere "West Wing Story":

I’m excited!
So delighted!
The indicted will soon get “the knock”!
And tomorrow
I will watch them as they all “perp-walk”!

‘Tis the season
To stop treason!
That’s the reason our Mueller’s on fire!
And he’s ready
To remove the traitors from the mire!

Get that nasty Flynn chanting, “Lock her up!”
Will Paul Manafort take a plea?

Maybe Carter Page?
And next Jared K!
Even Donnie fils,
If not Donnie pére!

Yes, I’m hoping,
And I’m wishing!
Can’t stop scoping
The dishing of scoops!

Pray let’s wake
To the marching of Mueller’s troops!



~~~To the tune of "I Feel Pretty"

First song, sung to the tune of "Maria":
Post #143, https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=9758880

[mythology]

16. That depends on who the we is

I don't expect the indictment if it is made public will be any really high level person. But there are those here who seem to think that if Trump isn't removed yesterday that the world is over. Those people I think are going to be disappointed, but I don't think they are fully grounded in reality in that sense.

[Takket]

17. Mueller is throwing chips in the pot for the first time

in a poker match that is going to play out over weeks or months.

but the fact he is moving forward on monday is a sign that he now feels he has everything he needs to bring down drumpf, and he's ready to get in the game.

[EL34x4]

18. I'm not getting my hopes up. I'm not expecting anything.

It's going to be Paul Manafort who's indicted and it will be for process violations completely unrelated to the collusion investigation. And this will be the end of Russiagate.

Trump will not be going anywhere until at the very minimum, Democrats have strong control of both chambers of congress. Honestly, if I were a betting man, I expect the GOP will soon cut off funding the investigation and I'd say there's a very good chance Mueller will resign before Thanksgiving.

[GoCubsGo]

19. Not necessarily in whether or not they will happen, but

more in the "Who will it be?" department, and possibly when. Based on the way The Dotard and his cult followers are reacting to the the news, something is coming down. It is just a matter of when it will happen, and who will indicted. It might not be tomorrow, and it might not be any of the big fish Mueller will likely fry at some point. The old "chess game" game comparison tends to get overused, but that's pretty much what is going on here. Sometimes you have to take out a few pawns and rooks before you can get at the king and queen.

[Irish_Dem]

20. I assume Mueller is being very strategic when unfolding his plan.

He has carefully thought out who and when.
Step by step.

[spanone]

21. trump could have leaked this...who knows

so monday he'll declare his innocence

[ananda]

23. Oh no, absolutely not!

Not a bit.

[Adrahil]

25. Hopes up? How?

I mean, folks expecting the entire house of cards to fall Monday are certainly unrealistic.

IMO, this first set of indictments will for crimes not directly related to Trump. It'll be Flynn's failure to register as a Foreign agent and his failure to disclose foreign contact.... or something similar to Manafort. Or money laundering.

IMHO, this set of indictments is leverage. And if the leverage does not work against the target, it's at least an example to others that Mueller means business, so maybe they will be more inclined to cooperate, when they believe they can and will be prosecuted.

My only dear is that with hardcore support at about 30%, it'll be hard to find a jury that will actually convict. The far right is utterly committed to jury nullification to advance their cause. Truth doesn't matter anymore.

[Sneederbunk]

26. There is always the possibility that nothing happens tomorrow.

[kimbutgar]

27. I get nervous thinking back to Patrick Fitzgerald investigating Bush and Cheney

And only Scooter Libby got indicted and lost his license to practice law. And didn’t Bush pardon him at the end?

[louis-t]

29. Sentence was "commuted".

But everything else stayed in effect.

[Vinca]

28. It just occurred to me it feels like Christmas eve when I was a little kid.

The anticipation is almost too much to bear. Any indictment is just a taste of what's to come.

[UTUSN]

30. I'm innured to disappointment, after so many election and other disappointments for scores of years

I'm 70, so the disappointments go *way* back to seeing my mother and elder sister crying over Adlai's second loss. But even before seeing, since my mother would tell us who Al SMITH was and how she was crushed over his loss.

Besides the elections, the types under "other" are Fitzmas, the KKKarl indictment that never happened, and many more.

So. I’m not gloating because I won’t be happy until TWITLER and ALL of his cartel are gone for good. David GERGEN on CNN thinks it will be FLYNN. Others say MANAFORT. There might be MULTIPLE ones. Might be somebody under the radar, might be somebody small, might be one of THEIRS and one of NOT-theirs.

Unfortunately, there have been so many disappointments for years that my expectations are low. He doesn’t care about anybody else who has supported him, so as long as it’s not HIM, he’s cool with it. Not that he cares about his spawn, either.

[blueinredohio]

32. I'm really hoping but it has gotten to the point that I don't believe anything I hear anymore

[shanti]

34. It's beginning to look a lot like Fitzmas

Remember that one?

[oberliner]

36. Yes

Understandably so - but it will lead to disappointment.

[Crunchy Frog]

37. Anybody else here remember "Fitzmas"? n/t

[Skittles]

38. I am just glad to know SOMETHING is happening

need to know WHAT before I start getting truly hopeful