This is terrible tax plan for middle level managers

[Le Gaucher]

There are those of us who are hard working reliable mid-level managers .. But not quite superstars.. We stuck in middle.. And hung out to dry..

We are going to get fucked.. And there won't be anyone to help us. If you don't itemize your returns - I am sure you are quite happy with the doubling of std. deduction. If you earn mainly through an llc or a corporation.. You are going to be making out like a bandit.

Those of us working 50-60 weeks, killing ourselves for the next promotion and be able to pay our mortgages.. And the super high property taxes (not uncommon to pay 25000 in my town) so that our kids can go to good schools.

For all my troubles - the following things are probably gone: state and local tax deduction, mortgage interest deduction and tax deferred 401 contributions.


I am sure there will be many on DU who don't care much for any of the above.. But just because it doesn't affect you does not mean that it is not a punch to the gut for someone.

I am all for shared burden.. But in this case Republicans are stealing from the educated upper middle class (who mostly vote Democratic) and giving it to the filthy rich.

[taught_me_patience]

1. My wife and I will be hit hard. We're upper middle class in California

We'll lose 35k in SALT deductions. Plus, our marginal tax rate is 43%, so the reduction of the 401k would be a HUGE blow to our ability to save. I'm middle management and wife is a physician who works about 60 hours a week... so we're pretty much in the same boat as you. It sucks. Most here at DU don't really care because it affects those making 150-350k.

[Angry Dragon]

3. I do not have your situation BUT I DO CARE

[taught_me_patience]

7. Thanks.

I really shouldn't have said "most". "Some" on DU don't seem to care about the upper middle class, but we are just hard working democratic supporters too.

[Le Gaucher]

9. All my tax proposal related threads have sunken like stone

I Imagine if DU isn't against this.. This will probably pass with bipartisan majority.

[Johonny]

12. Same here. The net result is an even larger draining of California tax money out of state

My fear is: The state GOP will use this as a driver to demand lower state taxes, but that only lowers the amount of government money available to use within the state. Making 150K in California with a new house and child. I'll be crushed bigly by this and then hit again when the property values plummet like we know it will without the SALT and mortgage.

This is the I'll never vote GOP again, tax plan. It will crush my family finances.

[MyNameIsKhan]

2. I am in your boat ... based on the plan I am looking at 10k more Fed taxes

[Le Gaucher]

4. My fear is that there aren't enough of us to topple this tax reform

I am hoping home builders assn, realtors and money managers like fidelity / prudential oppose this big time.

[taught_me_patience]

5. I hope that republicans in blue states block it

Dana Rohrbacher (R -puke) the rep of my gerrymandered shit ass district... he'll be gone if he votes for this shit.

[MyNameIsKhan]

6. huh ! the russian stooge

[MyNameIsKhan]

8. The issue is how to fund the tax breaks Repukes have promised, 5.5Trillion over 10years and

under budget reconciliation only 1.5T is allowed, they need to find 4T, SALT gives them 1.8T, partial 401k who knows how much... then there is talk about raising other taxes that maynot hit upper middle class.

[Le Gaucher]

10. My fear is that Democrats from poor districts in Red states will support it

Enough to counter Republicans voting against the bill.

Only hope is that Democrats vote lock step against the bill and are joined by blue state Republicans.

[cemaphonic]

44. Yeah, this seems like an incredibly risky gamble for the GOP

There are millions of affluent suburban professional people that are reliable voters, who don't give a rat's ass about either the Republican or Democratic social agenda, but usually vote R because they think it's good for their pocketbook. And these people are financially literate, many with accountants (or ARE accountants). They'll see their taxes raised by a GOP Congress preaching "tax reform," and they're not going to buy whatever chum Fox is throwing out.

And those suburban districts are exactly the sort of places where their current gerrymandered strategy could fall on its face. Not to mention, it could cripple them at the state and local level.

[taught_me_patience]

48. Capping the mortgage interest deduction at 500k makes it even worse

I can't possibly see how blue state republicans can vote for this. Median home price in my district is probably $1M, and this will have a negative impact on housing prices.

[Le Gaucher]

11. I am reading the tax reform.. Looks like 401k and property tax

Deductions are untouched.

The bill is mainly catering to corporations.. 20% tax rate.
However.. More and more jobs are going to be automated leaving fewer people to share the spoils.

Not fair.

[Johonny]

13. Without the personal exemption and state taxes

It's still going to hit us hard.

[Le Gaucher]

17. agreed .. I am still going to be hit.

i am hoping the bill fails the house vote

[WillowTree]

20. They left the 401k alone, but the property tax deduction is capped to $10,000 from what I've read.

[Le Gaucher]

21. not uncommon to have 25k property taxes in my town

[lagomorph777]

14. Trump's Middle Class Tax Hike

The Dems need to repeat this accurate description over and over and over again. If we continue to use weak language about this assault on the middle class, we will lose again.

[roamer65]

15. Just wait until it blows a hole in the deficit and invokes a dollar crisis.

That's when the real fun starts.

[SweetieD]

16. Not sure how the plan would affect me. But being single with no kids and no mortgage and

Student loans out the wazoo. I don't get any breaks except for the student loan deduction which is small. And I hear that is going away or will be further reduced.

[Le Gaucher]

18. I refi'ed my student loan using SoFi

My interest went down from 5.6 to 3.75%

[SweetieD]

19. My student loan situation is a nightmare. And is the subject of another thread. There is no

Refinancing option that works for me. And I will be paying until I die. My student loans are equivalent to a mortgage or greater.

[Le Gaucher]

22. same here .. I pay $700/month in student loans

[smirkymonkey]

45. I am in the same situation as you. It's a nightmare and the republicans are only making it worse.

There is no way out but death. Meanwhile, billionaires like Trump go bankrupt to the tune of millions all the time and just walk away from their obligations time and time again, but people like us can't even get a break.

[Skidmore]

24. We are far below upper middle class

and the children are long gone. If the mortgage deduction and state tax deductions go, we will be in dire straits, especially with the blows to healthcare in this state. We are all in this together Unfortunately, many upper middle/middle class people have been all to willing to step on those further down to gain financial privilege over the past few decades. This parasitic bleeding of those less advantaged is systemic. Forsaking fairness has gotten us to this point. All I can do is try to find like minded candidates to vote for vales of fairness and protection from predation. This is why elections matter. This is why the interests of all groups must be accounted for. This is why promises of ideologues are not helpful.

[Bettie]

25. We're going to take a hit too

in all likelihood.

When my husband (who is the one who likes to look at the numbers) looks it over, it looks pretty bad, or so he tells me.

[Hoyt]

26. I doubt many people will be hurt DIRECTLY in the plan released today. Some will, but

I bet GOPers cave on state income and property tax limits if enough people are impacted.

http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-gop-tax-reform-plan-bill-text-details-rate-2017-10


There are other reasons to oppose this bill/proposal, mainly it doesn't increase taxes at upper end.

[Hoyt]

31. You must be making a ton of money unless by "much increased" you mean a few thousand dollars.

Would love to see your calculations.

[Hoyt]

39. So, you still deduct your $5500 under Trump's plan. You lose some state income tax deduction, but

likely make up for most of that with the slightly lower tax rates (you may even end up benefiting a little, not much, by increased standard deduction, of course at cost of losing personal exemption).

Again, the plan is deficient in other ways, but I don't think the cap of $10,000 on property taxes will have any effect on MOST people except in high housing cost states.

Losing the state income tax deduction might have a small increase on those making under $100,000 depending upon your state.

I bet GOPers don't repeal the state income tax deduction (they'll call that their big compromise) -- even red states will have a hard time explaining support of that.

As to your last question -- I think you have to put what you whine about into perspective. Like I've said before. I'd gladly have my income tax increase from the present rate to $5 Million next year. That would mean I made a bunch of money.

[Hoyt]

47. That would be one of those other matters to criticize ("whine" about).

[Johnny2X2X]

27. It's a big give away to the rich, but not awful for the poor

Doubling the standard deductions will off set the harm to the poor. The working poor will see the 1st $12K of their income as not taxable for singles, The first $24K is not taxable for married couples.

For my wife and I who have no children and make ~$90K a year, are home owners, and save for retirement vigorously, this plan helps us slightly in my estimation, but it's nothing that will change our lifestyle at all. So basically, after the standard deduction we'll be down to $66K in taxable income and that's before we take some of the other deductions.

This blows a hole in the deficit and is a massive giveaway to the rich. They throw the poor and working class a couple bones to placate them, but this is a raiding of the treasury.

[Johnny2X2X]

32. It's not what they want.

The Republicans want only the poor and the working class to pay taxes, if they could they'd have a tax plan where anyone making over $250K a year pays zero in taxes and anyone making less than $100K a year pays 90%. That's their dream.

So this plan will leave the poor a little better off, considering who proposed it, that's good.

[Le Gaucher]

38. That's exactly how I would put it.

A family of four will be slightly worse off

[Hoyt]

35. One thing, they are eliminating the personal exemption, so you aren't getting a doubling of

the personal exemption + standard deduction. You are getting a little extra, but not that much.

[Hoyt]

40. I don't know. Every ignorant GOPer I've ever me thinks they are going to make a million dollars

next year and will benefit from tax cuts for the rich.

[maryellen99]

42. They think they are getting 4K tax refunds next year nt

[Le Gaucher]

46. I wish the media spoke in term of a median and not mean.

or I wish "they" understood the difference between mean and median .

The median like more likely to be $23 or $ 96 or someother amount they can scratch their ass with.

[Demsrule86]

41. I have heard that those things are non-starters.

There may not even be a tax plan.

[Joe941]

49. I'd save quite a bit in taxes with this plan...

I've move from 25% bracket to 12% bracket. This would help me probably by a few thousand less in taxes.

[Le Gaucher]

50. My Republican Congressman is voting against it ..

I am from NJ