General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSo Tell Me, FUCKING AGAIN, How The Democratic Party Has To Change.
Tell me again some shit about Nancy Pelosi being too old.
Tell me again about Tom Perez being lackluster.
Tell me again you don't know what we stand for.
Tell me again how we've got to change to suit you to vote for us.
Tell me, as I kept the poll open last night and threatened the Republican watcher with a judge's order as every voter voted.
Tell me again. Please.
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Chasstev365
(5,191 posts)However, "A better deal" is not enough of a message! Is there no room to improve on articulation?
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)If you ain't getting it, there's not much I can do for y'all.
KPN
(15,647 posts)LOL. No, you can't do much at all.
".Here's the problem: the strategy the Democratic Party has been pursuing in recent years has failed. Since 2009, Democrats have lost more than 1,000 seats in state legislatures across the country. Republicans now control the White House, 34 out of 50 governorships as well as the U.S. House of Representatives and the U.S. Senate. In dozens of states, the Democratic Party is virtually non-existent. Too much is at stake for our country and our people for us not to learn from our past failures and move forward in a way that makes the Democratic Party stronger so we can take on and beat Trump and the right-wing Republican agenda.
What the recently released book excerpt from former interim DNC Chair Donna Brazile made clear is that unless we get our act together, we are not going to be effective in either taking on Donald Trump or in stopping the extremist right-wing Republican agenda. We have to re-establish faith with the American people that in fact we can make positive changes in this country through a fair and transparent political process that reflects the will of voters across this country.
In order to do that, we need to rethink and rebuild the Democratic Party. We need a Democratic Party that opens its doors to new people, new energy and new ideas. We need a Democratic Party that is truly a grassroots party, where decisions are made from the bottom up, not from the top down. We need a Democratic Party which becomes the political home of the working people and young people of this country, black and white, Latino and Asian and Native American ... all Americans... Right now, a Democratic National Committee Unity Reform Commission, comprised of people who supported our campaign, people who supported Secretary Clinton's campaign, and people appointed by DNC Chair Tom Perez are working on a set of policies that will determine the future direction of the Democratic Party. In many ways, this Unity Commission will determine whether the Party goes forward in a dynamic and inclusive way, or whether it retains the failed status quo approach of recent years. It will determine whether the Party will have the grassroots energy to effectively take on Donald Trump, the Republican Party and their reactionary agenda or whether we remain in the minority.
In my view, this Commission must:
* Make the Democratic Party more democratic and the presidential contests more fair by dramatically reducing the number of superdelegates who participate in the nominating process. It is absurd that in the last presidential primary over 700 superdelegates (almost one-third of the delegates a candidate needed to win the nomination) had the power to ignore the will of the people who voted in the state primaries and caucuses.
* Make primaries more open by ending the absurdity of closed primary systems with antiquated, arbitrary and discriminatory voter registration laws. Republicans are the ones who make it harder for people to vote, not Democrats. At a time when more and more people consider themselves to be Independents our job is to bring people into the Democratic Party process, not exclude them. It is incredibly undemocratic that in some states voters must declare their party affiliation up to six months before the primary election.
* Make it easier for working people and students to participate in state caucuses. While there is much to be said for bringing people together face-to-face in a caucus to discuss why they support the candidate of their choice, not everybody is able to attend those caucuses at the time they are held. A process must be developed that gives everyone the right to cast a vote even if they are not physically able to attend a state caucus.
* Make the DNC's budget and decision-making processes more open and transparent. If we are going to build a Party that relies on working people who are willing to give $5, $10 and $27 donations, they deserve to know where that money is going and how those decisions are made.
I look forward to following the progress of the Unity Reform Commission, and I urge Chairman Tom Perez and the entire Democratic National Committee to develop policies which move the Democratic Party forward in a very different direction – a direction that will lead us to national and statewide victories. It's important that you do the same:"- Sanders
lapucelle
(18,303 posts)Politicians should know that individual state election law governs voter registration and primary voting procedures, not the state or national party organizations.
If a politician does not know how elections actually work, he or she is in no position to be peddling ideas to fix the process.
George II
(67,782 posts)ehrnst
(32,640 posts)It's fundraising email for Bernie Sanders.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)lapucelle
(18,303 posts)This is a fundraising email from an Independent who either doesn't understand that states determine the rules that govern primary elections or from one who does understand, but who doesn't mind if supporters believe that the DNC is rigging a system over which it has no control..
George II
(67,782 posts)Under the subject line "Sanders responds to Brazile DNC mess"
"Sent this email to supporters:
.............. Here's the problem: the strategy the Democratic Party has been pursuing in recent years has failed. Since 2009, Democrats have lost more than 1,000 seats in state legislatures across the country. Republicans now control the White House, 34 out of 50 governorships as well as the U.S. House of Representatives and the U.S. Senate. In dozens of states, the Democratic Party is virtually non-existent. Too much is at stake for our country and our people for us not to learn from our past failures and move forward in a way that makes the Democratic Party stronger so we can take on and beat Trump and the right-wing Republican agenda.
What the recently released book excerpt from former interim DNC Chair Donna Brazile made clear is that unless we get our act together, we are not going to be effective in either taking on Donald Trump or in stopping the extremist right-wing Republican agenda. We have to re-establish faith with the American people that in fact we can make positive changes in this country through a fair and transparent political process that reflects the will of voters across this country....."
That's all I'll post from there. Look familiar? The rest of the post above was taken directly from that campaign email as posted on scout.com
https://scout.com/college/kansas/Board/103734/Contents/Sanders-responds-to-Brazile-DNC-mess-110135377
irisblue
(33,018 posts)Gothmog
(145,479 posts)This is a fine message
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)Last night was great, but it was a vote for a party that already HAS changed significantly since the last election, so what is your point?
It's hard to understand what you're so bitter about.
And I say that as someone who worked as hard for HRC and the rest of the ticket as YOU did.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)It's not as though every registered "d" thinks everything is fine.
Other than the two or three people who briefly made comments about not always being pro-choice(and who then abandoned those calls as far as I know)nobody at all has proposed anything that would do us harm.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)list things you think I am "afraid" of.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)and those proposed by people near us who would BE Dems if the party hadn't spent years blaming them for everything bad and driving them away.
If people are proposing changes the Democratic Party might consider, they are proposing them because they believe they would help the party and the country.
I am as much a registered Dem as you are...and I don't know what you're lashing out about here.
No change that any progressive has proposed would do us harm.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Who do you listen to?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)That are part of our traditions or at most a small extension of those traditions.
I listen to rank-and-file people who would have been with us the whole time if we hadn't made a big thing of announcing that their ideas weren't welcome, but that they were somehow obligated to support us even though we were making a big show of leaving them out in the cold. And by that I mean a lot of rank-and-file voters, or voters who became nonvoters when they could have been voting for us had we showed the things they cared about some respect.
I don't listen to Stein. But you knew that.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)guaranteed to cause electoral losses...we saw on Tuesday how working together to get a range of candidate elected and tailoring the candidate for the district or state works...If any disagree...they should read up on McGovern.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)We made big gains in Virginia because the party contested twice as many legislative seats...there was no rigid enforcement of the idea that nothing past a certain leftward point was permissible-and Northam wasn't to the right of previous candidates for governor there.
We don't have to be the enforcers of the limits of change to succeed.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"What proposed changes are you so frightened of?"
Other than your bias, what specifically leads you to incorrectly infer that?
wildeyed
(11,243 posts)A Better Deal is a fine message, particularly considering the magnitude of suckage the GOP and Trump have planned for America.
tavalon
(27,985 posts)Will assume that means a better deal than Cheetolinni's, and that's a really low bar. I know the phrase harkens to LBJ, but I'm a political wonk.
It's one of the worst slogans ever. Luckily slogans don't win elections. Ideas do. Many of the candidates who won were liberal and desperately needed new blood.
tblue37
(65,464 posts)onit2day
(1,201 posts)We are not republicans but we are so much more and we are changing. If we weren't we'd still be losing elections. The new deal now becomes the better deal that does not depend on wall street lobbyists or banksters to win. We are listening to the people. How many millionaires got elected in the special election? How many special interests got elected? If you don;t see the change from 2016 I don't know what to tell you
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)The idea that we nationalize every damn election is foolish...the 50 state strategy which works means tailoring candidates to states and running on local issues.
murielm99
(30,754 posts)He says it is all good to bring new, but we have to create a continuum between past, present and future. He makes more sense than anyone.
People who think they have a right to sashay in and declare that our leadership needs to get out of the way because they are too old or "inarticulate" are wrong. No one walks in to a workplace of any kind, or a government office, and declares themselves in charge without working for it and building experience. They deserve to be laughed at. The far left deserves that in our party.
I am happy we have our experienced people. I am happy for the new people and the experienced people who won last night. Let's build on that. Take your cold water and throw it on someone else. The rest of us will bask in the sun. Then, after the celebration, we will get out and GOTV all over again.
questionseverything
(9,657 posts)from ur post...
They deserve to be laughed at. The far left deserves that in our party.
I do not understand insulting any part of our coalition
murielm99
(30,754 posts)sees a way to bring us all together and is willing to work with all Democrats to achieve our goals.
Anyone who thinks they can shove others out of the way, others who have done the work through thick and thin, does deserve ridicule.
I am through coddling the far left. I think many of them are no better than the tea party on the right. What are you going to do if I laugh at your disruptive and naive behavior? Go way and vote for republicans or fringe candidates? Is that what you will do? I don't think there are that many of you to begin with. I see more of you on internet sites than I do working out in the trenches.
Again, I emphasize the respect I see for this newly elected man. If you do truly question everything, question the behavior of the far left, and ask just WTF they are trying to accomplish by repudiating those who have kept the lights burning, who have raised money and GOTV for years. Question why the far left cannot even allow us one day to enjoy the victories of Tuesday, why they have to criticize incumbents who have worked hard. It is up to you to work with us, not the other way around.
BTW, I used to consider myself far left. Not any more. Not if the behavior I have seen recently is any example.
Did we win without the far left? I don't even know what the hell the far left is any more. Everyone seems to have their own definition. I know I am a Democrat and a liberal. I vote for Democrats and work for them.
Again, I tip my hat to this newly elected Democrat who understands that we are a big tent.
questionseverything
(9,657 posts)if we are to be a big tent seems like dems wouldn't want to laugh at or scorn anyone
the young man didn't say what you said he did, btw,he said...
“It’s all good to bring ‘new,’ but we have to create a continuum between the past, the present and to the future to know has worked and what hasn’t and build on it,” he added.
which doesn't denigrate anyone
I thank you for your work but it is gonna take all of us
I guess the far left is those of us that think healthcare is a human right now..i'm ok with that
mamas
(76 posts)LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)" Is there no room to improve on articulation?"
No one is arguing against that particular point... 
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Wins.... isn't that interesting?
Ukapau
(78 posts)KPN
(15,647 posts)Just remember "Fuck the progressives."
Ukapau
(78 posts)Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)
MFM008
(19,818 posts)In 'constructive criticism' of a WIN.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)their lectures? As I recall they were similar to advice given about not supporting candidates like the new Dem governors we just elected? Not only was the advice premature, it was wrong.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)A weak willed individual, lacking the courage of their own convictions would certainly obey the dictates of a simplistic suggestion on an anonymous message board to censor themselves of those things they're passionate about.
I can only hope you see few of them in your quest to pretend oppression where none exists! Good luck!
Lucky Luciano
(11,258 posts)That was some serious shit right there on so many levels!!
KPN
(15,647 posts)some BS that in other words just says "Fuck you progressives".
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)you are talking about.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)You'll certainly supply evidence to support your allegation, yes?
A simple link containing the sentiment you expressed would be easy for anyone of good character and a reasonably working brain.
KPN
(15,647 posts)Glad you cleared that up for all of us progressives.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)KPN
(15,647 posts)I'm not happy that the first thing I read when I come here this morning to take in the celebration is BS OP like this one that says in other words "Fuck the progressives."
Re: we are all progressives. I really don't think so when it comes to economic policy issues.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)I concur. We gain a majority by being the big tent party...I would add that many left of center people won on local issues...this is a winning formula...as they say all politics are local.
NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)Progressives wasn't even mentioned, yet some are determined to be victims.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)The voters aren't demanding we be indistinguishable from the GOP on the willingness to militarily intervene, for example.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)how many votes?
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)You appear to think that I am in unquestioning agreement with every position Bernie has ever taken. Anyone who has read my posts for any length time knows that is not the case.
I agree with him on economic issues-think he was wrong to say less on the issues of antiracism and police violence-wanted the guy to take an openly dovish position on foreign policy-and don't support his position on guns at all.
I've also repeatedly stated that, even though he clearly HAD to run in '16 and his campaign did not cause Trump, he should not run for president again-so you have no reason to play "gotcha!" with me now.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)Without reservation. We can't stand on the sidelines while pregnancy becomes criminalized or state controlled.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)n/t.
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)About being flexible on that issue. Guess you missed that? Women sure did not.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)And justly so.
I agree with you that we need to be pro-choice. You do realize I wasn't ever one of the people calling for "flexibility", right?
I ask that because it sounds like you hold me responsible for the "flexibility" thing.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)A super progressive message would doom Sen. Manchin who has voted with us this year consistently...how do you suppost the GOP would vote if Manchin loses? In Virginia everyone won something...there was a wide spectrum of progressive beliefs...the big tent is back. This is how we win.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)I haven't denounced the idea because I don't live there(and therefore don't feel I have a right to shake my finger at anyone in that state)and because I seriously doubt that anyone in that state lives and dies by what I post here-nor should anyone else really, which makes the blowback I get even more unjustified.
I'm actually glad that Manchin now backs single payer...that will probably increase his support at the next election.
We don't need to recruit the old conservative wing of the party, a wing that defines itself by saying "no" or "only a quarter of a loaf" to what most Dems in most of the country support.
And progressives made a lot of gains Tuesday as well-it's not as though the only seats we flipped were those who where the candidate said "I'm no damn liberal". In fact, Northam would probably have won by a larger margin if he hadn't made the pointless pander on the "sanctuary cities" issue-the votes he added were almost all in NoVa, where the voters wouldn't be impressed by that.
I'm glad we won. The takeaway from that should NOT be "Fuck you, Bernistas".
Whatever you say about the guy, we need his voters and we need at least some of his ideas.
The only votes up for grabs are going to be voters who are hurting, and they won't be impressed by us being "pro-business".
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)Let make it about healthcare...saving the ACA and local issues... and maybe soon in some areas guns.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)In keeping it local, it still needs to be part of a larger totality. The San Francisco Mime Troupe had a good line about this in a song from their 1980s show "Steeltown".
Towards the end, a local Steelworkers union leader, having been forced to end a wildcat strike by the "International" leadership of his union in exchange for only trivial concessions from management, sings this
"We fight for little things,
We fight on little questions, shorter hours, decent pay
The question we are asking, is "who's to have the say?"
If we ask only little questions...and we do not ask for more
We may seem to win the battle...but still not win the war".
Act locally...but not just locally.
A broader vision matters and no one should fear a broader vision.
Dreams are not our enemies.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)delisen
(6,044 posts)-it's too generic to not cause communication problems.
99% of the population is actually pro-life including all who believe in abortion.
Democrats are progressive . Maybe if you came up with a more exclusive appellation for your particular subset of beliefs it would be easier to communicate.
LexVegas
(6,088 posts)It's pretty simple: we win when we vote en masse. The bigger the voter turnout, the better Dems do.
Think we ought to tattoo this on all foreheads.
betsuni
(25,582 posts)greeny2323
(590 posts)I mostly agree with your sentiment, but I do believe the party leadership is in general too old. I want new fresh blood that will attract young voters.
Part of Trump's appeal is his supposed "straight talk". IMHO, many of the older generation politicians have that stilted language that turns many off, despite the fact that our policies are better.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)are needed.
Whoever shows up and makes themselves useful, is welcome in my & our PARTY!!!
They all make our DEM PARTY.
tonyt53
(5,737 posts)pandr32
(11,601 posts)So tired of ageism. Many cultures on the planet believe their elders are wise and valuable to society and therefore are highly respected. In some, they make up the councils that render decisions for the community they are part of.
The young are full of ideas but have no experience.
Ideas and wisdom=onward together
sagesnow
(2,824 posts)
sheshe2
(83,843 posts)oasis
(49,398 posts)
BlueMTexpat
(15,370 posts)times over! 
uponit7771
(90,348 posts)
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)I am amazed that our leaders don't seem to get that. Blunt, direct, and accurate language, pushing a clear, simple, pro-regular-people agenda will win in 2018 and 2020.
brush
(53,815 posts)lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)
IthinkThereforeIAM
(3,076 posts)... will impress and win elections? Interesting.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)Republicans are robbing you.
Democrats will deliver universal health care.
Democrats will stop taxing the poor to feed the rich.
Concise enough?
IthinkThereforeIAM
(3,076 posts)... you said it too quickly, not everyone gets the message. Why do you hate persuasive speaking skills?
CaliforniaPeggy
(149,678 posts)I found lagomorph777's statements plenty persuasive. And I don't think s/he said them too quickly.
Concise and to the point is very good.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)as slowly as you like.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Well played!
IthinkThereforeIAM
(3,076 posts)... made my point, still, no persuasive speaking skills were shown. Pausing(it called it stilted speech) is part of the talent.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,347 posts)It's not about pauses at all. It's about the vocabulary.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/stilted
Definition of stilted
1 a :pompous, lofty
b :formal, stiff
IthinkThereforeIAM
(3,076 posts)... persuasive, skilled speaking. It comes across as stiff or, "stilted", to the uninitiated. Sorry, been there, done that, got the A+ at a top 10.
That does not mean I feel that the lowest common denominator should be ignored, ie... shouting simple words.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,347 posts)if you think that stiff or stilted speaking is "persuasive" or "skilled". On the contrary, it's a sign that someone is lacking in the skills of public speaking, and is unlikely to be persuasive. If you think your audience needs to be initiated into something before they find you persuasive, then you're probably using jargon, and you won't have any success with communicating with mass audiences.
You also think that a call for avoiding stilted language is a call for "speaking fast" and "using run on sentences", and now you seems to be saying "shouting" is somehow involved. Not only do you not understand public speaking, I don't think your grasp of logic is great either. Your "A+ at a top 10" doesn't seem to have helped you.
IthinkThereforeIAM
(3,076 posts)... so give an example (youtube?) of stilted speech. I read the rant against stilted speech to be one against speech that isn't on the most basic terms, "YO, LUNCH BREAK".
I do understand the need to appeal to the folks with the most basic and rudimentary listening abilities. As long as the Democratic Party wins elections is all that matters. 
muriel_volestrangler
(101,347 posts)And the person most commonly described like that these days is Trump. It sounds as if they're someone else's words that he doesn't care about or truly understand (likely true).
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q="teleprompter"+"stilted"
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)for statewide elections and lefty types for the local legislature or house races in 18 who run of local issues...is a winning formula for moderately left states like Virginia. We get our cake and eat it too.
NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)The biggest Democratic win in years, bigger than anyone had dreamed of, and there's STILL whining about how bad the Democratic Party is. Strange. It's almost as if some people are looking very hard for something--anything--to whine about. Nobody is saying the party is perfect; nothing is. But can't we PLEASE enjoy a huge win for a couple of days at least?
Apparently not. Whiners will whine.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Many people will cheer the desire for simplistic commercial branding directed towards the lowest common demonstrator as you described.
Reach for a Lucky! (as seen on TV)
LiberalFighter
(51,020 posts)Whoever is at the top in leadership is only part of the mix. The daily operations are run by those on the younger side and have the experience at their job. The DNC members consist primarily of leadership from all of the states. They are not all primarily fuddy duddies. As an example, our state party chair is 40 years old and was re-elected to his 2nd term this spring. The guy he replaced was about 34 years old.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)I like our 'older' leaders so no.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)If we want to retain power once the bums have been thrown out we’ll have to do a much better job of differerentiating ourselves from them and connecting with people. See the series of disasters from 2008-16 for reference. Just because we held serve in VA and defeated the lieutenant of the least popular governor in the country doesn’t change that.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Horseshoe theory.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)KPN
(15,647 posts)therefore are lying and have an agenda -- according to you. Aside from the Boomer generation and older, there are far more Independents as a percentage of registered voters than Democrats or Republicans. And, oh, by the way, the Is, Ds and Rs are about even in the Boomer generation.
We Democrats do have an advantage as far as the 'Lean Dem" component of Gen Xers and Millenials goes -- but those are the same folks who supported Bernie in the primary by and large.
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)Some people may disagree with me that our planet is round but it does not change facts.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)
R B Garr
(16,966 posts)for some caucus states on the West Coast, he lost. California is as progressive as it gets, and he lost California. And Democrats won the popular vote by far, so this just looks like sour grapes, sorry.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)And our 2016 candidate for President had a message that rang clear as a bell.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)Our leaders have done a spectacularly piss poor job of defining Republicans from Obama and Clinton on down. We only win big when they define themselves. That's not how we're going to fix this country.
whopis01
(3,521 posts)If people not listening to the message is enough to lose an election, then the message needs to be delivered in way that will cause people to listen. Otherwise you are going to lose the election.
I get what you are saying. She had a clear message. She had a good message. But if you can't get people to listen to it or get people to believe in it, then it doesn't matter.
Just to be clear - I am referring to her campaign as a whole - not her as an individual.
pandr32
(11,601 posts)She would be #45 right now if Russia had not implanted their pick.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)The bullshit argument is in the same place it was last year. In tatters.
"we’ll have to do a much better job of differerentiating ourselves from them"
"Just because we held serve in VA"
We didn't just hold serve last night. Everyone knows that. That manner of omission is necessary to keep the "both parties are the same" fantasy alive.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)about the politics of division. You need to listen more closely. Our opponents defined us as freaks a long time ago and we still haven't figured out how to tell people who the real freaks are.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Necessary as your argument cannot be backed up.
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)Democrats should not be allowed to talk about American politics without saying the word “Republican.”
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)You claim energizing people to vote for Democrats is meaningless. Literally.
Sad.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)If anyone should know...Let’s try something new and spell it out for people. See what happens.
Ukapau
(78 posts)Democrats have been so obsequious, meek, afraid to take names and kick butt that the truly evil people continue to get away with doing incredible harm!
There is a line from Aristotle that says: "Anybody can become angry - that is easy, but to be angry with the right person and to the right degree and at the right time and for the right purpose, and in the right way - that is not within everybody's power and is not easy!"
Time to let others know they have a duty to be angry at the horrible behaviors of the Republicans -- denying climate change, ripping health care away from people, repeating the lie of Obama's birthplace, defending the truly awful gun manufacturers, etc., etc., etc.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)That’s who.
You just trashed Obama for energizing people to vote.
Ukapau
(78 posts)Democrats without a slur or insult added to the statement. His lessons have been embraced since the 90's, day in and day out with the major Republican leaders. On Sunday talk shows, on CNN, etc., they continue to paint Democrats with epithets -- weak on crime, anti-military, immoral, etc.
I sure like the idea of at least recognizing what the Republicans are doing and telling all voters what the major differences are, and how the Republicans have a problem with the truth.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)Welcome to DU, Ukapau.
True Blue American
(17,988 posts)We need to repeat over and over what we stand for.
Calling the former President weak is not helping.
People do not want to lose their health care. That is very clear from all the town hall meetings.
They want better jobs,decent pay,rebuilding our country with an Infrasturcture plan.
It is clear Republicans are trying to tear down all that is good. Just a start on health care,but at least a beginning.
Forget Trump and his ignorance that becomes more clear each day. Concentrate and articulate what we stand for. Republicans have already shown they can not govern.
Republicans used to stand for something. I never agreed with them, but the current bunch are just an angry,hate filled mass. They need to be cleaned out.
BTW,did any of you see Scalise and that other idiot racing their scooters in the halls of Congress yesterday? Both alive because of excellent health care in a scooter paid for by insurance. One of the most pathetic show of arrogance I have ever seen in two men who are determined to kill it for millions.t
http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2017/11/scalise_v_johnson_scooters_in.html
radical noodle
(8,010 posts)And he helped get out the vote... a vote against division.
Response to radical noodle (Reply #160)
True Blue American This message was self-deleted by its author.
KPN
(15,647 posts)of argument and just wanted to let you know that I appreciate your taking the time to try to get through.
Over time we will, I am sure ... and if we don't, it won't matter, the millenials will.
BeyondGeography
(39,377 posts)We can't bank on those better angels of our nature to just show up. Fighting is required.
R B Garr
(16,966 posts)the Resistance won big last night? Sounds like sour grapes.
KPN
(15,647 posts)Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)single payer. The house was then gerrymandered so although we had more votes the GOP kept it...in 12 Obama won and we kept the Senate... a good year. In 14, the 2008 Senators elected with Pres. Obama's coattails in blue and purple states lost...not an unexpected or unusual result...and of course the so called 'progressive left' abandoned the president. In 16, we had the most divisive primary I ever remember, Comey, Democratic Party hate, Wiki and Hillary hate...none of which speaks to policy or progressiveness in general...so all of your 'facts' are just plain wrong. Consider that Feingold lost in 16...a true liberal...so I think your ideas on holding power are inaccurate and would cause us to lose. If any are confused by who is a Democrat and who isn't ...there is as 'D' next to the name on a ballot you know. As Cary says, vote Democratic.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Don't sit and home and pay attention to midterms and lower offices. If we learn that lesson, we don't have to worry about minor details.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Democrats across the country came out swinging yesterday. If Trump teaches us that lesson and we use it, we will get the country back on track and send that moron to jail.
lunasun
(21,646 posts)ehrnst
(32,640 posts)the need to sell out for the "white working class male" appeal.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)
Fresh_Start
(11,330 posts)and the white working class male is stubbornly republican.
I really believe that the white working class male is a seething mass of resentment that they are no longer handed the world and have to start working as hard as the rest of humanity.
Ukapau
(78 posts)media, on radio, on cable TV, etc. (And of course MSNBC can't focus too much on climate change because Koch Industries spends so much money on their network. Also MSNBC can't talk about net neutrality because Comcast is opposed to it. etc., etc.)
Response to Fresh_Start (Reply #60)
Post removed
Garrett78
(10,721 posts)...I suspect losing the white vote is pretty typical in state races, as well.
The party needs to do more to appeal to millennials, but not by embracing the notion that "identity politics" is a pejorative.
DetlefK
(16,423 posts)L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)
The Nucking Futz dividing the nation seems to be failing with that strategy. Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)uponit7771
(90,348 posts)L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)
Madam45for2923
(7,178 posts)DEMS 4TW!!!!
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)
BlueMTexpat
(15,370 posts)NJ! 
mcar
(42,366 posts)CK_John
(10,005 posts)Codeine
(25,586 posts)then it isn't "universal." Perhaps you meant something else but it got lost in your sentence?
CK_John
(10,005 posts)The process has to be defined and give those who will not have the degree to work in the automated world a reason to get up in the morning.
It either UBI or kill each other
Codeine
(25,586 posts)I am arguing that you can't define it only for a particular age or employment group; it has to be universal - every adult in the country from Trumpkin on down to that homeless dude in front of the bodega - in order to be seen as anything other than just another welfare program.
But yeah, eventually it's UBI or we kill each other. On this we agree.
brush
(53,815 posts)Last edited Wed Nov 8, 2017, 05:51 PM - Edit history (1)
radical noodle
(8,010 posts)The idea that everyone should have a basic income from the government that helps sustain them, whether they work or not, succeed or fail, rich or poor.
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)Is the minute we lose what little we still hold.
It is and idea that not even a majority of people on left leaning DU support and is really just a fantasty of the far left.
Rather than spend our energy tilting at windmills how about we do things Americans will actually support. Like insuring all Americans have health care and access to a job that pays them enough to enjoy life in the richest country in the world. Do that and we win.
Dark n Stormy Knight
(9,771 posts)"access to a job that pays them enough to enjoy life," when automation is on a course to do away with a massive number of jobs?
JustAnotherGen
(31,849 posts)
Progressive dog
(6,917 posts)still_one
(92,325 posts)Pushed for Medicare and and Medicaid, and that establishment Bill Clinton who appointed justice Ginsberg, along with other establishment Democrats like President Obama, who not only appointed SC nominees that we could be proud of, but pushed for civil rights, Paris Acords, the Iran nuclear agreement, gettin the foot in the door so healthcare would be expanded to the uninsured, or those with pre-existing conditions, the Lilly Ledbetter act, workers rights, etc etc etc
The message is there all right, but it seems that those that subscribe to the all or nothing principal, don’t seem to grasp that 9 times out of 10 that will get you nothing
Jill Stein is wrong, there is a difference between Democrats and Republicans
airmid
(500 posts)Look at the firsts! I think it's wonderful. The Party needs to evolve and become even more inclusive and filled with new faces and paths to achieve goals. Evolution is a good thing. And turnout was up on an off year! Finally! Is it sinking in that showing up matters? I am giddy today.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Our candidates that won yesterday ranged from moderate to far left. Good for them all.
KPN
(15,647 posts)It's not a reason to belittle people who feel strongly that the Democratic Party needs to do a lot better on the economic front relative to working/labor and middle class.
Progressive dog
(6,917 posts)and the same people with the same talking points will be back.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts) 
DBoon
(22,390 posts)That's why we won - with new blood and candidates that aren't afraid to stand up for human decency
Perez and Pelosi weren't running for office - dozens of ordinary citizens energized by a desire for a better society ran and won
Wwcd
(6,288 posts)fundraising from big name headliners around the country to local efforts.
There was a grand organizing of all fronts through the usual DNC & DEM channels as well as every group & voice that knew the effort to bring about change was to be an all-hands-together mission.
This is the Dem Party in action that I have always known.
Naysayers fell by the wayside. Those that drove their message to be used as a battering ram to splinter the Dem Party stand in the background today and their message is proven pointless.
The Party of the people has always been there & will always remain to those who need a voice.
Human Rights is the base of their platform today as it has always been.
Response to VermontKevin (Original post)
WinkyDink This message was self-deleted by its author.
MineralMan
(146,324 posts)The party and its candidates for office in every state are just fine. We just need our voters to show up, like they did in Virginia and New Jersey yesterday. We don't need stumbling blocks put in their way.
rpannier
(24,331 posts)My suggestion to people has been instead of billionaires that support the party spending money trolling il douche on faux spews, how about several lawyers and dozens of buses. Fly them there. Have them wade through the state's onerous voting requirements, work on helping people get that information together and bus them to the registration office and get them registered
Simplistic description I know. But, the idea I think is fairly clear.
Get people registered to vote while working on fighting the laws
LiberalFighter
(51,020 posts)But not the way others think it needs to change.
Beliefs and positions for the most part. NO.
Messaging and attitude. Probably the key.
Connecting the dots so others see the picture and understand the difference. Yes.
Not allowing others to define us. Yes.
brewens
(13,612 posts)and not afraid to say it. I still say go left. Single payer, economic injustice, social injustice, tell people we should expect government to do good things for us.
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)The numbers aren't all in, yet. The demographics and studies on why people voted they way they did aren't finalized yet.
There are indications this was an anti-Trump thing, but also healthcare and gun control.
We particularly want to know why the suburbians who don't always vote Democratic, voted that way this time more so than in the past.
Wwcd
(6,288 posts)No. The naysayers need to study what happened.
What took place in building up to last night's election took a massive effort.
Something that took many many months of organizing, fundraising, gotv, & campaining on the message of the unity of people engaged for a common cause.
The Dem Party & the DNC & All who contributed to make last night's win come about, already know what happened & how it happened.
sorta like a top football team winning over air force is not cause for high fives
Great for the win - love it. But I strongly suspect a populist progressive would be a landslide.
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)We don't even know WHY the people voted the way they did, yet. It's possible this was a lot of anti-Trump fervor and not as much about the candidates. Although I think the GOTV organization was clearly excellent.
KPN
(15,647 posts)This OP made me angry -- especially in that it was about the first thing I read here this morning while expecting to see and hear nothing but good tidings and cheer after last night's thrilling victories for our party. Not fucking divisiveness!
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)We must do what is necessary.
Thekaspervote
(32,787 posts)Go dems you're great!
UtahLib
(3,179 posts)The Mouth
(3,162 posts)We have a message, we have good folks at all levels, we have the Republicans tied to a dumpster on fire...
When we get out the vote, we win. When we don't, we lose. There are more of us than them.
"Messaging" is nice, pretty words are great, policies that actually help most people are themselves helpful, but none of it means shit if we don't get people to the polls. Personally, I respect the great thinkers and fancy speechmakers and pollsters (I even worked as one), but nothing beats getting people to the polls or registered for early voting; boring assed nuts-and-bolts politics that hasn't really changed a lot since the founding of this country. Well done to the 'boots on the ground' in VA and NJ!
L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)And the great motivation seems to be anger right now. Trump is an antidote to political apoplexy.
We are seeing what could have been in 2016, and why they suppress the vote and divide the Dems.
This situation needs to be transformed into a tradition of high turnout voting, especially among youth voters.
We have a lot of voter suppression and gerrymandering to overcome, a huge task ahead, but very doable.
The Mouth
(3,162 posts)and a few hours of sitting with folks getting them registered to vote by mail
Beats the hell out of hundreds of hours arguing online, or anything else.
Boring as hell, the single thing that any one of us can do, and at the end of the day counts for more than anything else. if everybody who reads DU today made it their mission to get one more person to the polls who wouldn't have gone otherwise - next election we wipe them off the map.
bucolic_frolic
(43,249 posts)on the ground, organizers and activists who are committed and motivated to harness the fear, discontent, disgust that Donald J. Trump, Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan, and every last putrid GOP swine that are boilermaking America to stuff their pockets
People, ordinary people, are painfully aware of what is happening. We must lead and encourage them to do what they can and the most powerful thing they can do is VOTE!
world wide wally
(21,751 posts)GOTV!
Cosmocat
(14,567 posts)While I get some of the points you made, last night was one good night at the ballot box, and due mostly to the other team having a 1 million pound anvil hung from its neck (the worst POTUS in this country's history BY FAR).
AND, it was a five yard run for a first down deep in our own side of the field.
We have 85 yards to go against the most rabid, deranged hatful opposition party ever in our country's history, systemic voter caging, surpression, gerrymandering, a bought and paid for press, russians and epic stupid by our fellow countrymen, get get the massive win 363 days from now to seize control of congress.
This place was super jubilent after 06 and 08, and the hue and cry was the R party was going down!
Except ... It wasn't and it has more power today than ever.
Poing being ... We can win when Rs are Bush post Iraq and 45 bad. CAN win, but this party has MANY issues in the face of a party with MUCH greater consistency of focus and anger.
Kentonio
(4,377 posts)This op and many of the replies actually really scare me. It's one thing to feel delighted (and hell yes do we feel delighted today) but extending that out to a version of 'See! we're doing everything right!' is beyond dangerous.
We have a long and difficult road ahead, so lets enjoy today but then be ready to get back to work tomorrow.
Duncan Grant
(8,280 posts)Thankfully, someone has a comprehensive understanding of this moment in time. I’m relieved to read your post. In addition, we contend with corporate influence(s) that rival clandestine intelligence operations. We won’t survive unless we’re open to change.
Cap locked profanity (re: OP) is a self-righteous dead end.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Duncan Grant
(8,280 posts)You’re a fish in a barrel. You know this about yourself, right?
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)pushed my buttons.
Duncan Grant
(8,280 posts)
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Duncan Grant
(8,280 posts)Thankfully, DU has great tools to manage moments like this. Ciao!
K&R
angrychair
(8,732 posts)But I will continue to fight my fight:
Selling out on human rights is non-negotiable.
The rights of women, people of color and LGBTQ, ARE NOT identity politics but HUMAN RIGHTS.
I have argued with more than a couple people here on this site, why, no matter where you live, a candidate that would or could vote against women’s reproductive healthcare, should not be a candidate for the Democratic Party. Should not hold office in the Democratic Party.
That is a decision between them and their doctor.
A. Women’s. Rights. Are. Not. A. Bargaining. Chip.
People of color. Are. Not. A. Bargaining. Chip.
LGBTQ. Are. Not. A. Bargaining. Chip.
They are human beings and treating their “Life, Liberty and Pursuit of Happiness” as negotiable is not being a Democrat.
Dr Rise
(99 posts)Still too establishment ... still too corporate!
denvine
(802 posts)But to sit back and say everything will be alright is dangerous for we, yes we, Democrats. We just won big in an off year election, one year after electing the most unpopular, narcissistic, unhinged President of all time. To use this as a point that the Democratic party does not need to change or adapt is like saying a merchant who loses money every month of the year except December is doing a great job. Don't be lulled or complacent because of our incredibly welcomed wins last night. One night in a very unusual political climate does not erase the decline of the last eight yrs. So before pointing a finger and saying HA, you were wrong, I think we still need a lot of therapy, organization and learning how to get our message out as a unified party before claiming a long term victory. If there was no reason to change we would not have lost so many seats in the last 8 yrs. I'd also like to add that we already have begun to change as a party so perhaps last night was a signal that we are going in the right direction but not a signal to rest on our laurels and refuse to learn from the past.
hueymahl
(2,507 posts)But I am wary about pointing to one victory and saying "I told you so, everything is fine"
Let's build on this success. Duplicate it, learn from it. Repeat it!
awesomerwb1
(4,268 posts)But we need to modernize. We're still way behind when it comes to the analytics stuff, voter tendencies etc. Technology will make it easier to GOTV.
And let's not act like we just turned the house in 2018 or we swept Alabama. This is just the first step.
Thank you for your work to VermontKevin.
aikoaiko
(34,183 posts)Blue_true
(31,261 posts)A lot of the people that won yesterday are very, very progressive. Let's embrace our big tent instead of pick fights.
IronLionZion
(45,494 posts)There are DUers who will tell you again.
Just you wait and see. Up through the next election in 1 year we will see many threads urging us to focus on purging Democrats instead of electing more Democrats or better Democrats. Once the primaries are over, anyone still urging for a purging in the general election should be suspect.
Snackshack
(2,541 posts)To assign last nights election results as a confirmation of the current Dem party...as opposed to a vote against the current insanity from the other side. There is work to do still...
KPN
(15,647 posts)Not would, is.
JustAnotherGen
(31,849 posts)A $15 an hour minimum wage, pro Union candidate.
He refused to leave women, blacks, Hispanics, Muslims the GLBT community etc etc behind.
It was a regional/in state play.
I HATE the "we must" across ALL STATES and candidates threads around here.
It should be perfectly acceptable for our Governor elect to say "We are better than that" in his acceptance speech. We are better than bigots here.
If that offends a Trump voter in PA who refers to athletes as N*** For Life - then so be it.
He did what what he had to do to win. He shouldn't have been expected to cater to coal miners in WV who don't pay 9$K a year in property taxes on a small home.
KPN
(15,647 posts)Let's take that wedge and drive it deeper. "Fuck the progressives." That's it!
Senseless!
We must be ever vigilant against dissension...
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)I think you are incorrect.
melman
(7,681 posts)VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)melman
(7,681 posts)when it's clear to see.
mjvpi
(1,388 posts)Hearing Mr Perez talk, the DNC has made the move back to a 50 state strategy that will try to function from the bottom up. The management of the DNC was a huge problem during 2016. From finances to strategy. Big changes have been made thanks to both sides of the Bernie Hillary divide. We need to do our part and start fighting for the future rather than about the past.
Iggo
(47,563 posts)samnsara
(17,625 posts)
ismnotwasm
(41,998 posts)
klook
(12,162 posts)Not sure why that is so irritating to some, but I'm glad the Dems are doing those things. If we continue to change and grow in ways that attract and inspire voters, we'll win.
Staying the same is death.
LVNVblue
(9 posts)For months I have been hearing all sorts of negativity about our party. Leadership is too old, they have no message, they aren't progressive enough. FFS we are dealing with Trump in the WH---that's kinda enough for me. Our democracy is not just shaken, it has been shattered by this corrupt idiot and his band of merry oligarchs and yet the press, etc. want to do this both-sidism crap. Of course this won't quiet all the negativity, but we did just shut them up for now--and, I think this is just the tip of the iceberg--next year should be an even bigger reflection of the disdain that is felt about Trump and trumpism.
So, we come together to defeat all of the hate on the other side and our party is just fine--it may not be perfect, but democrats fight for what is right for the country and its people. This is who we are.
Demsrule86
(68,632 posts)Gothmog
(145,479 posts)Tom Rinaldo
(22,913 posts)And United means factions within the Democratic coalition did not fight against each other to any significant degree. Best to keep it that way.
Fighting to improve the Democratic Party in whatever way one sincerely believes it should be improved is never a bad thing. It is the spirit of democracy personified. Fighting among ourselves when it is time to face a dangerous adversary is the height of foolishness.
MaryMagdaline
(6,856 posts)One of the proudest moments of my life when I poll watched for the Democratic Party in Florida in 2004. Got one of the Republican watchers removed (they had one too many); everyone voted ... no provisional ballots at our double poll site; (bogus grounds for trying to make a voter cast a provisional as opposed to a regular ballot were defeated by us); poll watcher in his 80's was told he could not vote at the precinct where he was working/ we shut that down and he VOTED (probably for Kerry based on demographics). I realized Democracy rests on one vote at a time.
Worst night of my life when we lost that election ... up until 2016.
Thank you for shutting down the Republican obstructionists. I know how obnoxious they can be (sometimes the more well-healed poll watchers are the Republicans and they can intimidate the poll workers).
tavalon
(27,985 posts)Of course, the Democratic Party needs to change. Many of us are promising to vote for anyone who has a D after their name so that we can get that creature out of the WH. I've made my deal with the devil on this. In my state, we turned our Senate Blue. And with an actual progressive candidate!
But, after that, if they aren't Justice Democrats, who decline corporate money, then I won't be supporting them.
The Republicans need their clock cleaned. But I think it would be unwise to say that our house doesn't also need a good cleaning.
I know what we stand for and much of it is antithetical to the progressives, and since I am as progressive and liberal as they come, I'm soon going to be done standing up for people who aren't standing up for my progressive values. I keep saying, mantra like, "just make it through the midterms, then I can finally stop compromising my ethics.
A Better Deal? Better than the Orange Shitgibbon? That's an awfully low bar, there. I want us to do better than that. I believe we can be better. Last night was great and it looks like we will carry the midterms handily. After that, we need to clean house. That our house is a smidge cleaner than the Republicans is sad. Corporate money has corrupted both parties.
librechik
(30,676 posts)even with the Russians warring against her.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)There's not always going to be a Trump to scare people into voting Dem. I suspect/hope that what we're seeing is partly due to more successful GOTV efforts by our party, and if so let's see if we can make the magic happen again.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)tavalon
(27,985 posts)I say apparently bevause I'm on my phone and it's a bitch to go research. We turned solid blue though and the woman we sent to the Senate is quite progressive.
So, I think we have a voter turnout issues.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)That's good, but it seems clear that there is a ton of room for more GOTV.
I would like to think that Dems are already better organized than last year, but am afraid this election reads mostly as Trump backlash.
SandyZ
(186 posts)not substance. I do not tend to allow others to decide how i see things. Thankfully, it looks like many voters feel the same way. The is an effort to create the chaos within. We have to recognize it and not allow it to mentally shift our thinking.
tavalon
(27,985 posts)It's a decades old problem that was exacerbated in both parties by legalized bribery that came with Citizen's United.
Sure, let's celebrate a few days but then do a post mortem on the 2016. Not the bullshit one that decided a new slogan was all we needed. A real one, a substantive one. Let's figure out what is important to voters and Democrats ( Venn diagram like) and then relearn how to be civil servants. The repubs have never pretended to be civil servants, at least not in my years.
SandyZ
(186 posts)Then we had the 2016 election that put another conservative on the court making it that much further out of the Democratic reseach to address the issue. They have been fighting it day one. Why do you not know this?
tavalon
(27,985 posts)Last edited Thu Nov 9, 2017, 12:06 AM - Edit history (1)
Don't be rude.
It is only the liberal constituency who have been fighting, State by State to get it repealed by Constitutional Amendment, but I'm sure you are involved in that, right?
I'll be happy to send you information on how to join up with this very liberal cause. Democrats may be against Citizen's United with tbeir words, but they have taken to the endless money trough just as much as the Republicans.
SandyZ
(186 posts)tavalon
(27,985 posts)I guess you stopped reading before you got to that part.
Justice Democrats are using their actions to bring about the actual removal of Citizen's United.
Next time, please read to the end.
SandyZ
(186 posts)R B Garr
(16,966 posts)and negative whining. Quit attacking Democrats. Attack Republicans!
Gothmog
(145,479 posts)egbertowillies
(4,058 posts)Democrats need sustainable Progressive policies that address the Progressive policies Americans say they want but get conned by the Establishment by a Progressive facade to our Plutocracy.
Or check out my write ups.
Dispel the lie once and for all, America is not Center-Right. It’s Progressive
https://egbertowillies.com/2017/11/01/dispel-center-right-lie/
Progressives must change the Democratic Party from within and without
https://egbertowillies.com/2017/11/02/progressives-change-democratic-party/
Elizabeth Warren proves factually that most Americans are Progressives (VIDEO)
https://egbertowillies.com/2015/08/03/elizabeth-warren-proves-factually-that-most-americans-are-progressives-video/
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)
The Wielding Truth
(11,415 posts)
The Polack MSgt
(13,191 posts)Last night showed the power of an activated base pushing the party forward.
If Democrats GOTV, Republicans GTFO
brer cat
(24,590 posts)K&R
JCanete
(5,272 posts)I'm happy that we took these races...so fucking relieved that there's a little bit of light shining through the gloom, but you can't seriously think this in itself is a statement that we've been doing everything right? This doesn't move us into the majority, nor does it compensate for the 1000 seats we've lost in the last 30 years.
Now to be fair, Democrats have a far tougher job than the GOP does. The GOP gets most of the money from big industry and other rich entities, AND they have the airwaves and the cable news and plenty of influence on the newspapers and I"m sure this extends to social media, youtube, etc. as well. For democrats to get some of that pie and not have it all used to destroy them, they have been walking a delicate tightrope of a message. I get the strategy. I've even been sympathetic to it...but the results over time show pretty clearly that it hasn't worked(to hold the line or move us left, maybe it has worked if slow attrition versus cascading loss of liberalism is the metric). That doesn't mean we've been shittier in any way to the GOP in terms of messaging and vote getting. Again, our job is so much harder. When we gaff, it gets reported and amplified, when they gaff it gets hidden or spun. Same with when our politicians do wrong. The little things become big for the democrats, and the big things get written off for Republicans.
And then there's the voter suppression and gerrymandering and voting machines...
All in the service of rigging this game that the democrats keep playing as if all is fair.
So from one perspective, they've had no choice but to play the game this way. From another, we have no choice but to change the way we play the game, and this little upswing, and presumably, the following one in 2018(one can hope), are not compelling evidence to the contrary.
Ken Burch
(50,254 posts)But it was a win ALL wings of the party deserve credit for, and it doesn't mean we can count on winning by maintaining the status quo.
What are you so angry about, who are you so angry AT and what changes do you so fear?
Skittles
(153,174 posts)the number one factor driving the successes right now is utter fucking disgust with TRUMP
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)I don't doubt the disgust is there, but that doesn't mean people are going to translate that into action.
Skittles
(153,174 posts)VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Skittles
(153,174 posts)
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)Hope that it will make a difference.
Raster
(20,998 posts)...followed closely by health care concerns.
Eyeball_Kid
(7,433 posts)Dems could win with a steaming shit show. Yes, change is sorely needed: less corporate influence, more positive messaging, more aggressive criticism of Trump/GOP.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)so we have to keep them honest at the polls, get rid of gerrymandered districts, superdelegates and the electoral college. That's all.
George II
(67,782 posts)
robertpaulsen
(8,632 posts)And that's the message Democrats better get on board with: Fuck white people. That doesn't mean white people shouldn't run as Democrats. Hell, Ralph Northam and Phil Murphy did just fine (even if Northam was starting to cave to white people fears towards the end of the race). Listen: The only way to help the white working class is to abandon the white working class when it comes to trying to get votes. The future of the Democratic Party is to appeal to the diversity and inclusiveness that so many of us of all races want to be part of. A whole lot of whites will join in that effort because we know that the only way to get a progressive agenda passed is to get into office on a progressive agenda. And people who love Trump just because he hates non-white people are never going to vote for the Democrats at this point. So fuck 'em. And then get the votes to get 'em the health care and jobs programs they need.
http://rudepundit.blogspot.com/2017/11/random-observations-on-first-good-night.html
tavalon
(27,985 posts)Nancy Pelosi is out of touch. She got lucky because we're angry.
Tom Perez is centrist and lackluster. Ellison was a better choice.
After 2018, we progressives are going to demand change. It's a somewhat sysyphean but it has been decades in the coming. I hope we can change this party from the inside. Sure, you wish the liberal wing to STFU, but we're here and we are going to force changes. And spoiler alert, the are more liberals than chickenshit establishment Dems.
We won yesterday. The party is changing. I hope enough to be viable.
And really, how many times do we need to tell you? 10, 20, 100 times. Goodness knows, we've told you over and over again. We, the liberals are going to take this party back from the centrists.
So, Kev, have a seat and watch how it's done because I'm not sure you really know what and why that happened yesterday.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)I don't believe gun manufacturers need special protections in court and I don't endorse candidates who compromise on choice. I don't vote for candidates who do not release their tax forms. I think that makes me pretty liberal, but YMMV.
Also, I spent yesterday in a polling place making sure people got to vote. So I didn't just watch how it's done, I made sure it got done. I also show up at my local Party meetups. If you plan on dropping by, I'll introduce you around and I won't tell you to take a seat, I'm going to expect you to get off your ass and do.
tavalon
(27,985 posts)I have plenty of my own here in Washington and as we are getting ready for GOTV, I've been arguing for voter registration drives.
My State has mail in voting, so other than monitoring drop boxes, we don't have walk in voting areas that have to be staffed.
Don't patronize me, Kevin. You suck at mansplaining politics. Next time, perhaps you should play this game with a less informed voter.
Or not.
DarthDem
(5,256 posts). . . doing any "mansplaining," regardless of your gender (and dog, am I tired of that stupid term), is you.
VermontKevin
(1,473 posts)all you need.
And the next time you tell someone to "take a seat," make sure they haven't spent all of the previous damn day on their feet making sure voters got to vote.
Best of luck with your GOTV efforts.
tavalon
(27,985 posts)That said, for the first time in the last ten years, I was able to flip my schedule without destroying my gut and getting sick. So, if I can recreate this, I for damn sure will be doing exactly that and I have the ideal place in mind.
Ukapau
(78 posts)
Nevernose
(13,081 posts)But not for a few more days. I’d like to bask in the vicarious victories for a while. We got the BLM protestor made famous by a picture of him confronting the police elected; we got a trans woman beating the guy who wrote his state’s anti-trans legislation; we got an openly socialist newcomer beating the GOP whip; we got a Liberian refugee elected Mayor in super conservative Montana; we got a centrist elected governor in one state and a Goldman Sachs banker elected in another.
We brought our very diverse A game and the polls reflected that. Warm glows all around.
But we clearly still have to change. You know what they call a political party that doesn’t change? Conservatives. But that, thanks to thousands of people’s blood, sweat, and tears, is thankfully a conversation for a later date.
rpannier
(24,331 posts)But let's be real as well
2017 was Virginia, New Jersey and a smattering of other races. There were no major cross the board races in states more favorable to Republicans.
Positives (outside of NJ and VA): Montana Mayor, Maine expansion of ACA and Washington State Legislative election
2018 features:
Every congressional district. The retirements help. As do the sagging fortunes of people like Issa.
That doesn't change 241-194. That's still a lot of seats to turn
In the Senate the republikkans are only defending 8 seats. 2 are retiring which helps. But, odds still say Tennessee remains in their hands no matter which asylum lunatic they run.
Outside of Nevada (and possibly Arizona) do you wish to point out which of the other states we will likely turn? Utah? Texas? Nebraska? Wyoming? Mississippi? Maine?
We're defending in North Dakota, Montana, West Virginia, Ohio and Florida.
There are always two schools on something like those; the first school says the power of incumbency is great. Manchin won by a fairly sizable margin four years ago. He isn't popular, but nor is he unpopular as far as I can tell. The other school of thought looks at how their House delegation looks and for three of those states it's all republikkan (ND, MT and West Virginia), though two of those states have only one rep. Florida cuts 16-11, Ohio 12-4.
While you can blame gerrymandering on those numbers looking like they do, it does not change that two years ago both states held senate races that were won by the republikkans with sizable majorities. Power of Incumbency vs Voting Trends.
And you can bring up voter suppression all you want, but all you've done is strengthen the case that we're in trouble in both states.
You're looking at one likely pick up, one possible pick up, 6 almost no chance in hell (though Cruz seems to be trying to screw himself over). While we have two in the very iffy column
As to change? Who knows. Depends on what you mean by change. Last night was great and it should be enjoyed. I check every few hours in hopes that one or more of the five open races for the HoD are called for us.
2018 is light years away (in political terms). Dead in the water politicians have risen and sure things have sunk.
Good for you keeping the polls open. But let's keep some perspective on reaching voters in less favorable areas.
joet67
(624 posts)If I answer the question you posedI would violate 15 terms of service
Magoo48
(4,717 posts)Democrats must change their cozy, corporate relationships...for the good of the party, but, more importantly, for our common welfare as a nation. Now is the time to push the common sense of single payer, not resist it.
Dustlawyer
(10,497 posts)Republican agenda.
Having said that, the 2016 election was a growing frustration of Big Donor politics on both sides. We must keep that in mind!
saidsimplesimon
(7,888 posts)Winning elections for democrats is what I am all about. The rest is prologue.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Evolution works much better than revolution. And its much less painful and bloody to its victims.
But I get their desire for bumper stickers over policy... it's so much more convenient for a simple mind.
A good series of wins for the Democrats bodes well for next year.
Response to VermontKevin (Original post)
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Orange Free State
(611 posts)...is some of what needs to be done.
1) Voter registration. Go to the Universities, to the inner cities, wherever we can register new voters. I CHALLEMGE EVERY PERSON ON DU TO REGISTER ONE VOTER.
2) Nominate a palatable candidate this time. I live in deepest Appalachia, and you can not believe the hatred of Hilary Clinton. Oddly, a lot of Trump voters have a high opinion of Bernie Sanders.
3) Voter outreach to Puerto Ricans who live in the continental US. Point out how pathetically the Trump administration has responded to Puerto Rico in the aftermath of the hurricane. Spanish language videos on radio and the net would work. Tell them to register, and how and where to register. Go to the churches. In Pennsylvania Trump won by 0.76%. A small number of voters could swing the election next time.
4) No more internal shenanigans on the national level. Yesterday was the first time in 40 years that I did not vote or work for the party. I may come back but I don’t know yet.
5) I am ducking already, but please, transgender people, keep a low profile. Work behind the scenes but don’t run. I believe in the rights and safety of everyone, but this pisses many voters off, and pissed off people show up at the polls. We don’t want anything to motivate the other side. Yes I know a TG person won in Va.
6) Sponsor Election Day reruns of BJ and The Bear, maybe the other side will stay home to watch and won’t vote. OK, just kidding.
7)Admit that we do overregulate things and roll back some of it.
8) Be aggressive towards the Repukes. They have run against abortion for 40 years, but now that they have the Senate, House, Presidency, and are stacking the Judiciary, not a peep is heard about it. Troll their websites, make it a subject of discussion, goad the Repukes in Congress into taking steps to make abortion illegal. This will motivate women to vote against them.
I could go on and on.....
