The rash of sexual assault and harassment is our own fault.

[dpd3672]

Face it, we minimize or justify it when it's one of ours...and I don't just mean politicians. Athletes, movie stars, etc, going back to their formative years.

The starting quarterback in a HS team gets caught drunk driving, the cop and the judge work out a deal. The college BMoC gets into a fight, or date rapes a girl, and we "Fix" it for them.

We create the environment where "connected" people have a different set of rules, and victims who rock the boat get punished or ostracized, then we wonder why, decades later, the compass still points North.

Dysfunctional behavior doesn't stop absent negative consequences. As long as we keep denying, covering up, minimizing, or justifying, it's never going to stop.

[Irish_Dem]

1. I agree and that is why it is good that the shit is now hitting the fan.

It will be an ugly picture for awhile, but in the end, will move us forward.

The truth will set us free, but first hurt like hell.

[DURHAM D]

2. Who is "we"?

You got fleas?

You are NOT speaking for me.

[eShirl]

3. our society

[Squinch]

4. First, it's not a rash. It has always been there. It's just that now people are coming forward.

Second, no one is minimizing or justifying because it's one of ours. Franken himself is calling for an official inquiry, which is exactly what should happen in a case where he says one thing and she says something else.

Franken, who I consider one of my "own" is providing an example of how an accused man can learn that his "joke" was creepy and inappropriate and take responsibility for his harassing behavior, and how an accused man can have his say while being respectful to his accuser and providing an arena where she, too, can have her full say.

I've never been involved with fixing anything for a rapist or drunk driver and I doubt anyone here has been either.

[dpd3672]

5. I'm not talking specifically about Franken...or Moore...or Bill Clinton

I'm saying in our society as a whole, we willfully turn a blind eye to things we don't care to see, for whatever reason. Because we want our candidate to win, our team to go to the championship, etc.

We cover up the small stuff, and the small stuff gets bigger and bigger, over the years, until it's too big to ignore. And then we wonder how a well liked actor could attempt to rape a young boy...or a producer could rape pretty much every female in Hollywood...or a NFL star could murder a pregnant girlfriend.

They don't start out with a bang, they get there over time, little by little. The way you boil a frog.

[Squinch]

6. I don't. I don't think many here do. This Franken issue is an example that shows how we don't.

The accused himself immediately went to defcon 4 and said, "No covering up anything, bring on the inquiry."

[dpd3672]

7. I would argue that the "Clinton issue" is an example that shows how we do.

And look at the threads. For everyone that seems to be trying for objectivity, there's as many trying to spin it, defend it, or attack the accuser.

I'm not pointing fingers, believe me. I think it's in the nature of some personality types to take advantage of power and authority, and it's in the nature of most of us to deny what we don't want to be true. I just think it's a dangerous combination when all the pieces fall into place.

And regarding Clinton, specifically, I'm not even saying he's guilty. I'm saying that the rush was to defend him and attack the accusers, which now seems to be falling out of favor.

Not sure what the solution is. Like I said, it's human nature for some to abuse authority, and human nature for most to avoid the unpleasant. Not sure how to overcome human nature.

[Squinch]

13. Thirty years ago. Your concern is noted.

And the "Franken issue" is an example that shows we don't.

[dpd3672]

9. I'm not saying "Our" meaning this forum.

Although there are more than a few who I would include.

I mean "our" as a society and culture. I doubt a significant number of DU regulars covered up for Harvey Weinstein, but there's no denying that it happened.

[Kaleva]

24. I see your point and apologise for the tone of my response

I'll delete my post.

[Squinch]

14. Yes, but thirty years ago someone wasn't harsh enough to Clinton.

[HughBeaumont]

10. "minimize or justify it when it's one of ours" . . . NO, we don't.

On our side, the perpetrators get investigated, impeached, forced to resign, disgraced, fired or jailed.

On their side, they get elected President, or to Congress, or possibly to the Senate.

COME on with this.

[treestar]

11. I get what you are saying

The denials here are not getting it or pretending not to.

We have to stop having different rules, as a society, for people who make themselves stars. That is how the Orange Bloviator felt - he said, "you're a star, they let you do it." He was saying he had their consent, because he was a "star."

That's a societal thing, not an individual thing. No one wants a girl accusing the star quarterback of something like that, because they only care that the team win the game.

[dpd3672]

12. Yes, thank you.

I saw a picture recently of a couple scantily clad women posing with OJ Simpson, shortly after his release from prison.

He's no longer attractive, old, close to broke, and a convicted violent felon, guilty of at least a violent robbery, and very likely murder of his wife (and prior Domestic Violence). Yet they were on him like flies on shit. Because he's famous, and they wanted to be close to that fame, for whatever reasons of their own.

A robber, wife beater, and very probably a murderer. This is someone who should be a social pariah...but we suck up to him because he's famous.

THESE are the women I believe Trump was referring to. The ones who will forgive you acting like a pig, because we have different rules for famous people.

Until that stops, this problem won't get any better.

[Squinch]

15. Ahhhh! So it's the women's fault! I knew we'd get there!

And two of them were scantily clad!!!

[FSogol]

17. LOL. n/t

[dpd3672]

18. Not blaming "women" in general

But to pretend that there aren't women who sell sex for opportunity is naive. And they're part of the problem, because they reinforce the bad behavior in predatory males.

[Squinch]

20. So relieved you aren't blaming women in general. Imagine my relief.

[FSogol]

16. The rash of scolding people on DU is our own fault.

[Demsrule86]

21. I lurked for years afraid to post anything, much less chide DU'ers, but here we have a new

person who feels the need to chide us for not destroying our own based on a rightie coming forward with Stone and Hannity knowing a about it in advance...hmmm. An adult woman...and by all accounts, it was a joke...but this is not comparable to Pedo Moore. Franken has apologized and that is that.

[Demsrule86]

19. Welcome to DU and no we don't. So please stop... It was a gag...and she is a rightie too...

There is no evidence he laid a hand on her either...I looked at the picture...so don't compare Franken with Pedo Moore or rapist Trump. We will not help you all destroy Democrats.

[GeorgeGist]

22. Bye

[Oneironaut]

23. Nobody is going to listen and will just post sarcastic responses, but you're absolutely right.

This happens in every town everywhere in the US. Rapists, sexual assaulters, and sexual harassers are always stereotyped as creepy outcasts. It isn't so. Many of them are highly respected in their communities, and "would never do such a thing!" They're in positions of power, pillars of the community, etc.

They live by a different set of rules. They use their power and positions to continue victimizing. They make problems that they create go away. Then, when they finally bite off more than they can chew, everybody whines how the victim is "ruining the perpetrator's life!!1!," and "why doesn't the victim just shut up? They were probably asking for it anyways!"

We live in a rape culture. Our society is openly hostile towards women who dare to speak out against some mens' poor behavior. The idea is constantly reinforced that men are entitled to womens' attention and bodies.

If you point out this fact, responses usually range from sarcastic to downright angry. Changing society always creates growing pains, but we're getting there. We aren't close yet, but #metoo shows that we have the will to change.