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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe historical context of the 2nd amendment
It is very clear from the way the founders used the term "well-regulated militia" in contexts other than the Constitution that they intended that such a militia was to be used for defense of the country INSTEAD OF a peacetime standing army. Given that guns were widely available and used for self-defense and getting dinner, all that was neccessary for a defense force was that citizens get together occasionally for drills. A navy to protect shipping was a different matter, to be handled separately.
What, sir, is the use of militia? It is to prevent the establishment of a standing army, the bane of liberty. . . Whenever Government means to invade the rights and liberties of the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order to raise a standing army upon its ruins.
Elbridge Gerry, of Massachusetts during a debate in U.S. House of Representatives, August 17, 1789
That a well-regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper, natural and safe defense of a free state; that standing armies, in time of peace, should be avoided as dangerous to liberty; and that, in all cases, the military should be under strict subordination to, and governed by, the civil power.
Virginia Declaration of Rights 13 (June 12, 1776), drafted by George Mason
Whenever people entrust the defense of their country to a regular, standing army, composed of mercenaries, the power of that country will remain under the direction of the most wealthy citizens.
A Framer, in the Independent Gazetteer, 1791
None but an armed nation can dispense with a standing army.
Thomas Jefferson
large and permanent military establishments which are forbidden by the principles of free government, and against the necessity of which the militia were meant to be a constitutional bulwark.
James Madison, Fourth Annual Message, November 4, 1812
A standing army is one of the greatest mischief that can possibly happen.
James Madison
Quotes from
http://polyticks.com/polyticks/beararms/fathers.htm
http://en.thinkexist.com/keyword/standing_army
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)...the current government will do too good a job of that without our helping them out.
eridani
(51,907 posts)Whenever people entrust the defense of their country to a regular, standing army, composed of mercenaries, the power of that country will remain under the direction of the most wealthy citizens.
A HERETIC I AM
(24,362 posts)Since you are talking historical context, I find it interesting the 3rd comes before being secure in your papers, etc, the right to a speedy trial, the right to due process, to a trial by jury etc, etc, etc.
I also find it amusing that most people who I have had second amendment arguments with have NO IDEA what the 3rd is.
eridani
(51,907 posts)NutmegYankee
(16,199 posts)It was passed to ban an activity that really outraged the colonists.
TreasonousBastard
(43,049 posts)which is the only one of the first eight to have fewer court fights on it than the second. And I didn't have to peek.
(The last two don't lend themselves to litigation)
Now, with all this yakking on about rights, the second amendment is the only one to invent a right that has no philosophical or legal antecedent. Yeah-- it's entirely made up due to some odd political bullshit going on at the time and really has no more relevance to modern times than the original articles on slavery or only men being able to vote.
If anyone who calls owning guns anything more than an invented US right and thinks it's a basic human right, please show me where in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, or any other discussion of rights, or any other industrialized country where unimpeded ownership of arms is considered a basic right.
safeinOhio
(32,641 posts)The Switzerland model fits it well.
eridani
(51,907 posts)Bookmarked--I never fail to learn something new every time I listen to him.
TreasonousBastard
(43,049 posts)idea worked. Back then it made a lot of sense, and probably could be argued it makes sense now. But, the problems with our standing army now, and arguments for it, are things they might never imagined back then.
Militias, otoh, don't really have much to say for themselves. As the Civil War proved, they don't work very well against a common enemy and in the modern world we can't imagine a defense based on state militias making more than a token defense against Hitler and Tojo. Or being a credible threat to a nuclear Soviet Union.
However, Scalia and his "original intent" minions once again ignored the original intent of the founders, so history doesn't count any more.
eridani
(51,907 posts)--for a modern army. They have a professional corps to manage the volunteers, but I have no idea of the ratios involved. Citizen soldiers keep some pretty high-powered weapons at home, but ammo is very stricttly regulated.
eliminerlesud
(18 posts)Article 1, Section 7 spells out how the Army gets it money
In theory we should not have a standing Army or Air Force for that matter
eridani
(51,907 posts)Getting about time to re-read the whole thing again.