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Thu Nov 30, 2017, 09:28 AM

CNN reporting 5th accuser comes forward against Al Franken

Last edited Thu Nov 30, 2017, 01:52 PM - Edit history (1)

She says he grabbed her breast for 5 seconds during photo opp.

49 replies, 4761 views

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Reply CNN reporting 5th accuser comes forward against Al Franken (Original post)
dewsgirl Nov 2017 OP
forgotmylogin Nov 2017 #1
Lurks Often Nov 2017 #3
forgotmylogin Nov 2017 #4
Lurks Often Nov 2017 #6
Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #14
Lurks Often Nov 2017 #19
Denzil_DC Dec 2017 #25
Lurks Often Dec 2017 #30
Denzil_DC Dec 2017 #31
Lurks Often Dec 2017 #34
Denzil_DC Dec 2017 #35
Lurks Often Dec 2017 #37
Denzil_DC Dec 2017 #39
Lurks Often Dec 2017 #40
Denzil_DC Dec 2017 #45
Lurks Often Dec 2017 #46
Denzil_DC Dec 2017 #47
Cordy Dec 2017 #49
Ms. Toad Nov 2017 #10
DemocratSinceBirth Dec 2017 #33
forgotmylogin Dec 2017 #44
DemocratSinceBirth Dec 2017 #32
Glorfindel Nov 2017 #2
forgotmylogin Nov 2017 #5
dewsgirl Nov 2017 #11
Trumpocalypse Nov 2017 #7
Ms. Toad Nov 2017 #8
Egnever Nov 2017 #13
Ms. Toad Nov 2017 #20
Egnever Nov 2017 #21
Ms. Toad Dec 2017 #22
Egnever Dec 2017 #24
Ms. Toad Dec 2017 #28
Egnever Dec 2017 #29
BannonsLiver Nov 2017 #16
Denzil_DC Dec 2017 #48
Orrex Nov 2017 #9
gratuitous Nov 2017 #17
quickesst Dec 2017 #27
Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #12
OnDoutside Nov 2017 #18
Demsrule86 Dec 2017 #42
OnDoutside Dec 2017 #43
Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #15
Nevernose Dec 2017 #23
Demsrule86 Dec 2017 #41
AJT Dec 2017 #26
bdamomma Dec 2017 #36
dewsgirl Dec 2017 #38

Response to dewsgirl (Original post)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 09:40 AM

1. It seriously is a tragedy.

Franken is still being raked over the coals for being hands-y in public when a camera is around. He deserves to be yelled at for this, but it's minor in the scheme of things.

Matt Lauer had a special rape button installed in his office. Isn't that a bit more important?

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Response to forgotmylogin (Reply #1)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 09:50 AM

3. If the allegation is true, then it is sexual assault, not being "being hands-y in public"

 

The double standard here of it being wrong (and a crime) when a Republican, entertainer or media personality does it and excusable when a Democrat does is disgusting.

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Response to Lurks Often (Reply #3)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 09:55 AM

4. But there's also a false equivalency happening

That grabbing someone's boob for lulz during a picture is an equivalent crime to using your subordinate staff for actual sexual gratification, or attempting to undress a 14-year old in a car behind a restaurant.

IMO, there are different standards.

It's like saying The Benny Hill Show is equivalent to hardcore pornography.

Or if you're too young to get that reference, it's the difference between eating an occasional grape in the grocery store, and carjacking someone at a red light. Both are theft, but do we treat them the same?

I'm just saying I don't think it's fair to paint Franken with the same brush as you would Lauer or Moore.

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Response to forgotmylogin (Reply #4)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 10:17 AM

6. Of course there are different levels, but it is STILL sexual assault

 

and you seem to be making a specific effort to defend Franken because he is a Democrat.


Sexual assault is inexcusable regardless of WHO does it.

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Response to Lurks Often (Reply #6)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 01:41 PM

14. Not when it is a lie... consider the bullshit...they want Franken gone..the right wing don't

help them. No way he plays grab the boob in a photo.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #14)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 02:58 PM

19. The photo is not the allegation of sexual assault

 

The photo, if taken without permission, is certainly crude and inappropriate, but not a crime.

The allegations of sexual assault are for groping of breasts and ass as well as the allegation of an unwanted open mouth kiss with the his tongue in another person's mouth. That is sexual assault and is a crime in many, if not most, states.

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Response to Lurks Often (Reply #19)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 01:07 AM

25. Then if it's a crime, as you've jumped so quickly to convict on very bare evidence,

with repeated use of the term sexual assault - a very serious allegation indeed in most people's books, a lifechanger, a potential career-ender/marriage-ender - why haven't any of those making the allegations chosen to press charges?

If this post isn't getting more attention it's because, if people looked down a page or so on GD, we've had at least five or six long threads about today's allegations already in the last 12-18 hours, and some of us are about argued out to be going over old ground again and again and again.

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Response to Denzil_DC (Reply #25)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 08:48 AM

30. I have not convicted anyone, these are allegations

 

as to why "why haven't any of those making the allegations chosen to press charges?" can applied to many of the people currently being alleged to have committed sexual assault.

Many here are completely willing to believe allegations made against people they don't like or don't support and then turn around and deny any allegations against people they like and do support.

As I posted back on 11/16:
Lurks Often (5,294 posts)

The trickle of allegations became a stream and the stream became a flood

Sexual assault and sexual harassment is unacceptable no matter who it does it.

There are going to be more allegations in the future against people we hate and people we like. I suspect many of these allegations will be true, but how do we decide if the allegations are true or lies designed to destroy people's careers and damage their lives?



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Response to Lurks Often (Reply #30)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 09:33 AM

31. You'd be more convincing if you hadn't written above:

Of course there are different levels, but it is STILL sexual assault

and you seem to be making a specific effort to defend Franken because he is a Democrat.

Sexual assault is inexcusable regardless of WHO does it.


And yes, I tend to suspend judgment on allegations of private behavior until there's either been an outright confession, revelation of clear clinching evidence, or the resolution of a court case.

Hell, I'm having to wait for any of the above conditions to be fulfilled before I can consider Trump to have been without doubt guilty of certain sexual transgressions in his past, though some have been evidenced over the years.

Meanwhile, historic idiots like Kos are calling for Franken's head, not because Franken's been proven to have done anything, but because the electoral optics are bad. And I've seen the same argument on DU.

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Response to Denzil_DC (Reply #31)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 10:07 AM

34. I was responding to a poster attempting to minimize the allegations as just being

 

"being hands-y in public".

As I replied to another poster (Post 19):

The allegations of sexual assault are for groping of breasts and ass as well as the allegation of an unwanted open mouth kiss with the his tongue in another person's mouth. That is sexual assault and is a crime in many, if not most, states.

Is Franken guilty of these allegations? We don't know right now. It could be an attempt from the right to smear him or it could be true and his accusers are coming forward encouraged by the current wave of allegations against politicians, entertainers and other people involved in the entertainment and media industries and the support being given to the accusers.

Will people here accept definitive evidence of sexual assault by Franken IF SUCH EVIDENCE EXISTS or will they continue to deny even definitive evidence?

I stated in a different post on 11/16 that "the trickle of allegations became a stream and the stream became a flood and that sexual assault and sexual harassment is unacceptable no matter who it does it.

There are going to be more allegations in the future against people we hate and people we like. I suspect many of these allegations will be true, but how do we decide if the allegations are true or lies designed to destroy people's careers and damage their lives?"



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Response to Lurks Often (Reply #34)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 10:45 AM

35. By the same token, if you object to minimizing the allegations,

I object to discussing them as if they have been proven, as well as inflating their severity.

The alleged incidents occurred in different jurisdictions with different legal systems. As you stated yourself above, the legal definition of sexual assault varies. Indeed, the Ethics Committee, which reportedly is now beginning its examination of the Franken case, will work to its own rules and definitions, so we should avoid using the term loosely.

If you want to be fair to those who've made the allegations, Franken is entitled to the same consideration.

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Response to Denzil_DC (Reply #35)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 10:47 AM

37. Agreed and I've tried to be clear in stating these were allegations and nothing has been proven

 

A consideration not being given here to most of the others also being accused of sexual assault.

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Response to Lurks Often (Reply #37)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 11:02 AM

39. Well, the past few weeks have seen me beat back against the more extreme

reactions to the Tweeden incidents etc., at some cost to my Jury Rating (at the moment, it just means I get called less often, which is fine by me!).

Having reserved judgment and trusted Franken to deal with this as best he can, though, the timing and other aspects have raised my suspicions and there's evidence of a vendetta.

What I've noticed is that all the allegations so far are not of sufficient seriousness that they would inevitably attract the attention of law enforcement. Maybe that's something Franken's opponents have up their sleeves as a grand finale.

I suspect they realize that a more serious allegation would demand a greater burden of proof and probably lead to court, which may be why all there's been so far have been one tasteless picture and unprovable allegations, some anonymous, and some that are pure innuendo.

As for the others who've been accused of sexual assault, I'd like to see those cases tested in a formal environment. At the moment, Trump and Moore, for instance, are getting away without even facing that level of scrutiny for far more serious allegations that do seem to reveal a clear pattern of behavior.

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Response to Denzil_DC (Reply #39)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 11:41 AM

40. "unprovable allegations, some anonymous, and some that are pure innuendo."

 

Welcome to the new norm in politics. The 2018 elections should be interesting.

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Response to Lurks Often (Reply #40)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:32 PM

45. It's not so new, really!

I'm from the UK, and it's been rife for centuries, and I don't think the USA's ever been immune.

I think part of the problem is that many things are in stasis at the moment as people wait for this administration to either erupt into (perhaps even worldwide) horror or collapse in revolting hilarity.

Meanwhile, it serves certain interests if they can keep people squabbling and turning on their own. I'm hoping if Mueller stays on his current trajectory, we may see more of that among the hardline Republicans (the never-Trumpers have been at it for quite a while).

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Response to Denzil_DC (Reply #45)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:56 PM

46. No, not new, but the 24/7 news cycle and social media are making it much more visible

 

then in the past and that has both positives and negatives.

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Response to Lurks Often (Reply #46)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 02:14 PM

47. No argument here. n/t

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Response to Denzil_DC (Reply #31)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 03:33 PM

49. This!!!! Getting it right

D-DC hits it as to the conditions for the accusations.

"And yes, I tend to suspend judgment on allegations of private behavior until there's either been an outright confession, revelation of clear clinching evidence, or the resolution of a court case."

We need to rethink our society and how we treat these incidents.

We need to understand that inappropriate touching without consent is unacceptable and can lead to arrest and can be prosecuted for a sex crime. I don't see the national guidelines we should be following.

And women/men in our society must realize that this inappropriate touching is not acceptable, and they themselves should not allow it to occur. And IF it does occur they have to report it. And if it is a rape they have to report it, get the dna samples, etc. Not wait a day or week or year, etc.

Women/Men AS A WHOLE need to empower themselves to handle these situations. Society needs to stop stigmatizing women/men who come forward, and stop treating these cases in such a way as women/men feel shamed by the act.

We all have skin in this dirty affair and it is up to us to support a movement to correct our society through changes in our thinking and system.

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Response to forgotmylogin (Reply #4)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 10:46 AM

10. I don't see any comparison at all in the op, or the article

Let alone, an assertion that they are equivalent.

It is not creating an equivalency, false or otherwise, to report allegations as they are made.

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Response to forgotmylogin (Reply #4)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 09:45 AM

33. Without getting into Franken's guilt

Without getting into Franken's guilt would you like someone grabbing your mom's, sisters, wife's, et cetera breasts or buttocks without her permission ?

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Response to DemocratSinceBirth (Reply #33)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:30 PM

44. Of course not, but I don't classify a non-violent touch in public as "assault".

This is all IMHO, but circumstances and context are important.

In public, especially with witnesses, if someone touches you inappropriately and surreptitiously, you should immediately and loudly call it out so everyone can hear. "Bob, you need to move your hand off my ass right now." Witnesses should be supportive, and this should be the end of it. The recipient cannot let it go by without immediate acknowledgment or it's one person's word against the other. If everyone does this and Bob is getting called out repeatedly, people will stop posing for pictures with Bob. If this is at work and Bob doesn't stop, he will get fired because everyone knows it's happening.

If this happens in a workplace environment, a manager or HR should be notified and should deal with it per company policy. This is "harassment". It shouldn't require law enforcement of any kind except in extreme edge cases - if the mailman knocks on your door every day with trousers unzipped and his penis exposed.

"Assault" is a crime that leaves evidence - saliva or other body fluid, hair, torn clothing, scratches, bruises, injuries to one or either party, DNA, photographic evidence; anything that can be used in a court case to prove that it happened. I can even include touching someone in private as assault, especially if the victim is detained or verbally threatened. If Bob corners you in the broom closet and fondles your breasts with no witnesses, that's assault and a crime.





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Response to forgotmylogin (Reply #1)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 09:39 AM

32. Matt Lauer was fired.

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Response to dewsgirl (Original post)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 09:50 AM

2. Could we say "accuser" instead of "victim?" Or have we already convicted Senator Franken?

n/t

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Response to Glorfindel (Reply #2)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 09:56 AM

5. +1 (n/t)

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Response to Glorfindel (Reply #2)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 01:34 PM

11. Yes, that would have been better.

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Response to dewsgirl (Original post)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 10:33 AM

7. Yet in the photo his hand is no where near her breast

 

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Response to Trumpocalypse (Reply #7)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 10:42 AM

8. She said she turned to the side to move his hand off

Of her breast before the photo. The photo does have her at an odd angle, that would be how she would end up if she was rolling out of a breast grab.

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #8)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 01:40 PM

13. With a big grin on her face

 

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Response to Egnever (Reply #13)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 11:14 PM

20. I've spent more than a decade working with survivors of sexual abuse and rape.

Smiling is not necessarily a good indicator of whether everything is fine or not.

As I've pointed out before, I had nearly the same experience as the women who describe Franken grabbing their butts. Butt grabbed (and fondled) in a public setting (in full view of at least 100 people), by a staunch liberal.

Because of the circumstances (it was a friend, and we were among friends), and it caught me completely off guard (being in public, being at the hands of someone I trusted and respected) that I didn't have time to decide how to react until it was over - and until I decided whether I wanted to make a scene I did not give out any visual cues that anything was wrong.

To this day, only one person present knows specifically what happened - and who the fondler was - because I told them. In other words, in a very public place, when people had not only a snapshot view of my face - but had the opportunity to view it during the entire encounter - my smile convinced them that nothing was wrong.

You're free to believe the accusers or not.

BUT rolling your eyes and declaring that a smile is photographic that the accusations are false is offensive. It works to drive the #MeToo women who finally feel enough safety to start telling their stories back in the closet - because who knows what smiling pictures of them with their abusers might shoe up. It's after finally tasting freedome, we're being shoved back in the dark ages: Look at what she was wearing; don't trust her since she isn't willing to be more than a Jane Doe; she was asking for it by her behavior; if it was real she would have told years ago; if it was real she would have fought yelled bloody murder, etc.

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #20)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 11:46 PM

21. Well here is the flip side

 

when I was a much younger man I went out with a girl that was a little nuts. One night we got in an argument and she started hitting me as she liked to do when she was mad and so in my underwear I walked outside to get away from her. She slammed the door behind me and locked me out in the middle of winter. I banged on the door for 15 minutes and when she wouldn't let me in I proceeded to break down the door. Mostly because I was freezing in my underwear and it was my apartment.

After breaking down the door I went inside and sat on the bed. 5 minutes later the cops showed up. I was promptly handcuffed and taken to jail.

When I finally got to see a judge 4 days later he and the prosecutor wanted me to plead guilty to assault... they treated me like pond scum despite the fact they knew only her side. She told them she was pregnant, she was not. and that I had kicked her in the stomach. I most certainly had not. I never laid a finger on her despite her abuse.

They offered me time served if I just plead guilty to the assault charges. If I refused I would remain in jail till trial. This meant I would certainly lose my job and most likely my place to live. It was very tempting because jail sucks and I certainly could not afford to lose my job or my place to live. Despite that I could not bring myself to plead guilty to something I did not do just to get out of jail and save my job I also knew that charge would follow me the rest of my life if I did again even though I never laid a finger on her.

So I plead innocent and I sat in jail for three weeks waiting after the judge of course told me how disappointed he was in me wasting the tax payers time and money. Then one day they just released me. She apparently was not willing to testify.

When I got home she had stolen everything I owned and left with no trace. I never saw her or any of my stuff again.

Long story short every woman who claims abuse is not telling the truth. Most of them maybe but not all of them and in Frankens case I find the details highly unlikely given everything we know about Franken and all of the woman who have worked for him or with him over the years who stand up for him.

I am certainly sensitive to the fact that it is difficult for women to come forward especially in cases where the perpetrator holds power over them but that does not mean I am going to just give every single story a pass just because they are women.

I have direct experience with a woman who lied outright to the police because she was pissed off and sent me to jail for weeks behind #metoo BS and while I certainly hope women who face these things come forward and that they see justice the idea that we should automatically believe every one of them, as someone who was falsely accused, is ridiculous.

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Response to Egnever (Reply #21)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:17 AM

22. Thank you for offering an explanation other than equating the fact

that this woman is smiling, and rolly eyes to dismiss her claim.

I believe the women, largely because my own experience with that kind of contact is eerily simliar. All of the explanations for why it can't possibly be true - based on whether the woman showed visible shock or pulled away (i didn't), whether she complainied immediately (I told my spouse within days, but no one else for 18 months), that no man would ever do this in full view of the public (there were at least 100 people present in my case - and could have been closer to 1000, given that it occurred in a dining room through which all of the 1000 + people at the gathering were passing through), and even that he didn't understand it was not welcome (the person who fondled my butt truly didn't realize it was offensive).

The latter makes Franken's apology also ring true for me. The person who fondled me sent me an email to ask why I was avoiding him and explained that he must have done something wrong because my relationship with him changed, but that he didn't know what it was. That is very similar to the acknowledgement by Franken that he crossed the line for some women, and that he was reflecting on his behavior to understand how that might have happened (paraphrasing here).

I'm not calling for his head on a platter - I think his respose so far is appropriate. Having had this conversation with the friend who crossed the line with me, I can imagine how he might have believed that level of physical affection was welcome. That doesn't make it appropriate (unless the other person involved also considers butt grabbing appropriate in a casual relationship) - but it is on an entirely different level than exposing yourself, coercing sex, rape, being sexually involved with minors.

My problem is with people who are not following Franken's lead - and who are actively trying to disprove the allegations by engaging in the kind of character assassination against the accusers that was standard in the 60s and 70s.

(I have a little harder time accepting breast grabbing in the same overly friendly embrace category - but aside from responding to posts like yours that dismiss it outright based on a photograph of her smiling, I'm waiting to see on this last complaint.)

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #22)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:38 AM

24. Sounds like you are condemning him for his refusal to call women liars.

 

If it was more than a playboy bunny who there is video evidence of doing exactly the things she accused Franken of I might be more inclined to believe it.

If the rest of his accusers were more than anonymous sources from little known news sources, again I might be inclined to believe it.

If evidence of abuse is smiling pictures taken in public well i am going to take a pass. While I don't doubt your account for a second. I find it highly unlikely that he is fondling peoples breasts while their husband is standing there waiting to take a picture. Grabbing their ass maybe as that could be done without being seen by people standing in front of them.

That said the fact that numerous women who have worked with him for years have come out in defense of him even Randi roads who clearly does not get along with him leads me to believe it is nonsense.

In my experience the guys I have known that are complete creeps are complete creeps most of the time and anyone who spent time around them knows it. Certainly not every one but the vast majority of them.

Take Weinsteins case everyone apparently knew, hell it was written into his contracts. Because he did it all the time.

Same with conyers he settled cases with the ethics comitee his behavior was known and you don't see women standing up for him.

Moore the same thing everyone knew, hell he was expelled from the mall..

Sure it's possible that Franken is a serial groper but given his history and the defense from multiple women who worked with him
I find it highly dubious. Even more so when coupled with the fact that the only one who came out publicly is a right wing shill and immediately said she did not want an investigation when he asked for one.

It just does not pass the smell test even though I am inclined to give women that come forward the benefit of the doubt despite my past experiences.



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Response to Egnever (Reply #24)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 03:16 AM

28. He didn't grope everyone is another of those classic 60s-style attacks

on survivors of rape and sexual abuse: He seems so nice to me. He's never acted badly, therefore the woman is not believable.

It doesn't make one whit of difference if there is a single other person an abuser ever touches. Insisting that if it is only ohe voice it should be ignored is classic dismissive behavior that keeps women silent, because we know that if we are the lone voice we are in for hell.

As to Franken, I read the apology differently than you do.

He indicates that his memory of the interactions with the first accuser are different.
He acknowledged, flat out, that the photo represents behavior he is ashamed of (Nonetheless, even with his express admission, about half of DU is insisting the photos were fake, photo-shopped, a skit, or represent perfectly acceptable behavior)
As to the more recent accusations of butt grabbing, while not discussing the specifics - his apology acknowledged crossing the line with some women. Both the women's stories - and his apology which I read as an acknowledgement - ring true to me.

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #28)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 03:45 AM

29. Well I would say this statement erases any ambiguity.

 

"As Sen. Franken made clear this week, he takes thousands of photos and has met tens of thousands of people and he has never intentionally engaged in this kind of conduct. He remains fully committed to cooperating with the ethics investigation.”

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #8)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 01:45 PM

16. Trumpkins say a lot of things.

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #8)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 02:34 PM

48. So what's your argument?

Franken calculatedly "cupped her breast" in a room where others were present, meanwhile keeping an eye out for when the photograph would actually be taken, in which case, he'd have moved his hand?

Or, if he was for some reason happy to be captured in flagrente for posterity, he'd have left his hand right there unless the woman had shrugged him off?

This is without getting into the weeds of whether such a maneuver would have been physically possible.

Some Franken accusers here have been banging on about Occam's Razor. I'm invoking it.

Every woman - every person - who alleges maltreatment deserves a hearing. If they choose the kangaroo court of public opinion to air and perhaps settle the matter, then different standards of proof apply to those in a court of law. If they want a different forum with different rules, then that's their decision. But historic allegations like this are notoriously difficult to unravel after so much time has passed and without anything but firsthand accounts or hearsay as evidence.

Meanwhile, you and others are very vocal at great length in claiming Franken's measured response is some sort of proof of guilt.

Carry on, if all you want to see is future alleged abusers immediately denying any allegations outright and going on the offensive. Because Franken's chosen course of response, which refuses to engage in the usual expected counter-attacks, will never satisfy you or other accusers.

It's lose-lose, and in the long run, it's destructive, and may well result in some who are guilty of far worse never repenting or owning up to past transgressions, because what's the benefit of behaving honorably? - Under these ad hoc standards of proof, they're guilty as charged the moment an accusation is made.

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Response to Trumpocalypse (Reply #7)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 10:43 AM

9. Unless her body is actually facing to the left side of that pic...

and her head is turned 110° to her left.

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Response to Trumpocalypse (Reply #7)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 01:45 PM

17. Her story isn't possible

Try it yourself with another person. You can't be side-by-side with a person and reach your hand around their arm to get at their chest. If the other person lifts their arm, you can, but when their arm is in the way, your arm would have to bend at the wrist and somewhere between the wrist and the elbow to get your hand on their chest.

You might as well try to lick your own elbow.

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Response to Trumpocalypse (Reply #7)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 03:04 AM

27. I can guarantee you that unless she turned around....

.... faced the camera, and raised her arm up, there is no way that short-ass arm is going to reach around far enough to touch much less grab her breast. The rampant false equivalence and those who champion it remind me of the old poster: "KILL'EM ALL! LET GOD SORT'EM OUT!!!"........cause you know, raping a child or an adult woman is the same as putting a hand on a breast even when it has not been proven that it actually happened. With liberals like these, who needs republicans.

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Response to dewsgirl (Original post)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 01:39 PM

12. More bullshit.

And I saw the picture...total lies.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #12)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 02:03 PM

18. Get your picture with any public figure, in public, and make an accusation against them. It's

incredible stuff.

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Response to OnDoutside (Reply #18)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:12 PM

42. If I were a politician...I would refuse all pics from this day forward.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #42)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:14 PM

43. Or at least hands joined in front of them. It's a sad world.

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Response to dewsgirl (Original post)

Thu Nov 30, 2017, 01:43 PM

15. Welcome to DU...also...oh and they have another anonymous report who is supposedly elected

New England I think ...we shouldn't help the GOP take down an effective Senator with bullshit lies.

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #15)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:32 AM

23. He kissed her on the cheek

On stage, in front of still and video cameras, and his wife, and a thousand people.

He kissed her on the cheek, but SHE psychically knew that what he was going to do was force her into a full-on high school tongue kiss, so she turned her head.

I’m sure there’s no POSSIBLE other explanation for him giving her a peck on the cheek as she left the stage and he introduced the next guest. No, not at all: definitely a thwarted live-stage sexual assault.

Which she reported anonymously not to anyone reputable, but to a “feminist” Jezebel.com opinion blogger. A reporter with a reputation for defending false accusers during hoaxes, like UVA, ironically doing it by smearing the actual victims.

/sarcasm

But if anyone, anywhere asks questions, we’re suddenly conspiracy theorists or anti-woman or just like Roy Moore’s supporters. Every case, every time, has to be the same and despite the very glaring, bright, flashing warning signs, there is no reason to ever suspect something might be a little off in ONE of the twenty or so accused men.

Ok, NOW I’m going /sarcasm

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Response to Nevernose (Reply #23)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 12:02 PM

41. I am with you...these are right wing lies...and they just want to get rid of an effective Dem

Senator and if we let them...none of our elected will be safe from such lies.

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Response to dewsgirl (Original post)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 03:00 AM

26. So, let's say there is a sort-of celebrity(not a movie star)and you

get the opportunity to get a picture with him and he grabs your breast......would you just stay there? Seriously, this a stranger to you, wouldn't you kind of gasp and pull away? Who would stay there and just move their body? This person has no power over you, it's you posing with a comedian who you don't even know personally. I would shove him away and call him a jerk. He isn't your boss or in any way in a position of power. Who would still do a photo after they were assaulted?

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Response to dewsgirl (Original post)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 10:47 AM

36. such bs

Franken is being targeted.

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Response to bdamomma (Reply #36)

Fri Dec 1, 2017, 10:50 AM

38. Completely.

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