VA Secretary Robert McDonald Falsely Claimed He Served In Special Forces

[alp227]

Source: Huffington Post

WASHINGTON -- Robert McDonald, the secretary of veterans affairs, wrongly claimed in a videotaped comment earlier this year that he served in special operations forces, the most elite units in the armed forces, when his military service of five years was spent almost entirely with the 82nd Airborne Division during the late 1970s.

U.S. special operations forces (SOF) are composed of exhaustively trained and highly capable troops from each military service, including the Green Berets, Army Rangers, Delta Force and Navy SEALs -- but not the 82nd Airborne. They are certified to undertake the most dangerous and delicate missions, including, famously, the killing of Osama bin Laden in May 2011. Special operators are a close-knit community deeply hostile to outsiders who try to claim the coveted mantle of special operations.

McDonald, a retired corporate executive who took over the VA last June as the agency was sinking in scandal, made the claim in late January as he was touring a rundown Los Angeles neighborhood during a nationwide count of homeless veterans. He was accompanied by a CBS-TV news crew, which recorded an exchange between McDonald and a homeless man who told McDonald he had served in special forces.

“Special forces? What years? I was in special forces!” McDonald told the homeless man. That exchange was broadcast in a Jan. 30 CBS News story about the VA’s efforts to find and house homeless veterans.

Read more: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/23/robert-mcdonald-special-forces_n_6739184.html

---

I avoid visiting or posting from Huffpo because of the excess clickbait/celebrity gossip/pseudoscience on the site. This is an exception, since Huffpo broke this story.

[mopinko]

1. he should resign.

like, right now. his ability to do his job just went down the shitter.

[Fred Sanders]

10. Why? Because he attempted empathy with one down on his luck veteran...really?

[mopinko]

17. vets will have no respect for him.

nor should they. special forces go through some truly harrowing training, and it is a high honor. it's not like saying you were in nam when you were in california.

stolen valor it is called. stolen.
dont think vets wont see it that way. he has deeply insulted a lot of people with that remark.

[catnhatnh]

26. Small error...

...it is EXACTLY the same as saying you were in Vietnam when you were not.

[HubertHeaver]

37. Since you want to speak for vets, are you yourself a veteran?

If so, what branch, when, where, what did you do?

[former9thward]

55. I don't want to speak for vets or anybody.

But I agree with the poster you are challenging. The Secretary should resign. Oh, even though it does not matter, I served in the Air Force, 126th Air Refueling Wing, late 80s, doing, guess what? refueling aircraft.

[HubertHeaver]

70. My challenge is to the inclusive statement

&quot All) vets will have no respect for him. Nor should they."

There is no way the poster, veteran or not, can know what all veterans think or even should think.

[former9thward]

71. Well I agree with that.

Vets are good people, bad people, heroes, jerks, outstanding citizens, criminals. Nobody speaks for them all.

[mopinko]

56. nope i am not.

and usually i dont speak about the army to stick up for them.
but i have a nephew who has just retired after his whole adult life in the army, rising to the point where he was up for a general's star. he didnt get that, so instead he was given a one year post as obama's advisor on counter terrorism.
he went through every grueling army training program there is. he did 7 tours of the middle east.

i know exactly what he would think.
alright with you if i channel him?

[HubertHeaver]

73. You are accusing a man of "stolen valor"

yet you want to channel your nephew?

I won't accuse you of stealing valor. Borrowing valor perhaps. Stealing, no.

[mopinko]

74. did i say i wasnt speaking for myself as well?

i am greatly disturbed, not just by this guy, but by the taint of dishonor that all the services have brought upon themselves by lying in this instance and many others.
i channel my nephew because i believe him to be someone who actually lives the code of honor.
http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/careers/army/2015/02/19/-army-lying-distrust-ethics/23678429/

[GGJohn]

62. Mopinko speaks for this vet,

he should resign, he purposely lied about being in the SF, he knew darn well that he wasn't a former SF operator.

[CTyankee]

51. that was my first thought. We can't be hypocrites here, condemning one guy like

O'Reilly and saying McDonald is OK because he's helping vets. Can't he help vets without lying? He's being dishonest.

[CreekDog]

43. oh, he was telling that one for the veteran's benefit

wow.

that post was a bit outrageous.

[mopinko]

59. small error? more like big problem-

http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/careers/army/2015/02/19/-army-lying-distrust-ethics/23678429/

[Tom Ripley]

2. I was in the Praetorian Guard

[Adsos Letter]

3. Yeah, but you're old.

[Tom Ripley]

4. True

ancient

[Adsos Letter]

6. Ah...

I wish I'd thought of that word first.

Well played!

[rpannier]

12. I was a Terra Cotta Warrior

So Hah!
Beat that

[Enrique]

5. extremely minor

he's working to help homeless veterans, a homeless man says he was in Special Forces, and McDonald says "me too!"

And that's it. That's the whole story.

Maybe this will shine a light on the effort to help homeless vets. Maybe someone will look into how that homeless man is doing now.

[Tom Ripley]

7. I agree

[TwilightGardener]

9. How can an abject lie be minor? He was on camera claiming a history

he didn't have--and for the purpose of patronizing a fellow veteran, who was perhaps homeless, but didn't deserve to be fed a line of bullshit like he was a child.

[Fred Sanders]

11. He claimed no "history".... He was attempting to engage, not mislead anyone....he has an

exemplary and crystal clear service history...tempest in an over sensitive media teapot.

Not like he was repeatedly lying to the world about being in a war zone, or in a helicopter under fire and lied about it repeatedly over years in order to self promote and build up false trust...not even in the same ballpark...sorry, you are wrong.

[TwilightGardener]

13. Huh? Anyone honorable in the military knows you NEVER claim a service

record, education, or medals/honors you never earned. No, not even to some homeless guy for the purpose of "engaging" him. He could have said, truthfully, "I served in the 82nd Airborne". Why lie, and then keep going with it: "What years (were you in)?"

[Fred Sanders]

14. So...he should....resign?? There was no mention of medals/honours, education, etc.....Context.

[TwilightGardener]

15. Maybe he should. Is the truth flexible for him?

[mopinko]

20. least of all special forces ferchrisakes.

he should resign because this shows how STUPID he is.

i'm not usually that rah rah about such things. but i have a nephew who is just retiring after 30 years in the service, and he went through all that. it aint no sewing circle.

[TwilightGardener]

21. The defense seems to be "well, it was JUST a homeless vet." I mean, THOSE are

the guys you can bullshit, amirite? Even if the homeless man was himself bullshitting about being SF, a cabinet secretary shouldn't.

[Fred Sanders]

25. So it ends. With a strawman.

[TwilightGardener]

31. "He said this in passing to a homeless man? So minor..."

So in what other contexts is it OK for an important public official to make up a bullshit story? Does the truth depend on the importance or social status of the audience?

[elias49]

32. I agree Fred.

He was communicating with another human being. Empathizing.
More people should try it.
I DO get tired of the self-righteousness of some posters.
"He lied!!" - regardless of details, nuance.
"He broke a law" - despite a greater good.

Sanctimony

[jollyreaper2112]

38. Hmm

I, too was a young Somali girl who suffered through female castration and an arranged marriage to a much older man. Ok, not really but empathy, yo.

[Fred Sanders]

49. Some advice, not mine:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016115249

[Fred Sanders]

42. Outrage first, facts and logic afterwards. It is the way of the Internet.

[CreekDog]

44. Remember when you tried to shame a poster for flying the Rainbow Flag during the Olympics?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4463300

Don't lecture people when you yourself have posted pretty outrageous things.

[Fred Sanders]

45. I am honored to have you as yet another fan club member bearing ad hominem and strawman gifts.

I am a supporter of LGBT rights, you can go do some more searching of my posts if you like.

[CreekDog]

46. It's not ad hominem to bring up your own words

especially when you're lecturing people on how to behave and how to speak about something.

unless you're ashamed and embarrassed to have lectured him not to fly the Rainbow Flag, are you sorry you told him that, that he was doing a disservice to the Olympics?

no, there was no shame, no apology.

[Fred Sanders]

47. The shame should be in distorting the position of another on LGBT rights.

Strawman.

Black hat/white hat views of the world are not my style.

Who follows around another posters posts anyway, on unrelated matters especially?

[CreekDog]

48. if your behavior doesn't represent your position, that shame is on you

not me.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

66. You're calling for facts when defending a liar? That is novel.

[Enrique]

16. a good way to see how minor it is

compare it to Brian Williams, or Bill O'Reilly, or Chris Kyle. They all lied at length. They wove stories.

You have a point with the target of the lie, I really don't know whether this might matter from his point of view. Anyway, maybe someone will track him down and see if he has any thoughts on the matter. And while they're at it they can see if he's still homeless.

[TwilightGardener]

18. Williams, O'Reilly, and Kyle were not Cabinet members, public servants

who were sworn in to serve the American people. Edit to add: I supported McDonald, but this is troubling.

[jtuck004]

24. No, it's not. Veterans have been lied to enough. Don't need another liar. n/t

[mopinko]

60. except this

http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/careers/army/2015/02/19/-army-lying-distrust-ethics/23678429/

[Fred Sanders]

8. He said this in passing to a homeless man? .......so minor as to be laughable.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

23. Because it's totally ok to lie, as long as it's just a homeless person.

Right?

[Fred Sanders]

27. Strawman? Correct?

[arcane1]

28. To whom must he say it before it counts? Recorded by CBS news, to a homeless man, is ok?

[Fred Sanders]

30. Reasoned argument always loses out to firmly held outrage. Forgive me, you win.

[mopinko]

61. laugh at this

http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/careers/army/2015/02/19/-army-lying-distrust-ethics/23678429/

go ahead, i dare you.

[Fred Sanders]

63. Not possible since you are on Full Ignore.

[GGJohn]

64. Obviously not on Full Ignore

as you were able to see Mopinko's post and respond to it.
BTW, do you understand the concept of honour pertaining to Military Officers?

[Nuclear Unicorn]

67. Maybe he should have told the guy, "Oh, you're homeless? I'm homeless too!"

[DustyJoe]

19. Phony

With his 'simple LIE' as described by some, he has branded himself as a phony to those he supposedly serves. If he can lie about his service, he can lie about anything. Stolen valor is just that, stolen. As a previous poster already called it, he needs to step down, he's untrustworthy.

[iandhr]

22. What a moron.

[Jack Rabbit]

29. That can't even be the "least untruthful" approach

It's time for Mr. McDonald to spend more time with his family.

[Sgent]

33. I'm guessing

he meant he served in a special operations force.

The 82nd airborne along with Marine Corp Expeditionary Units and some other units are "Special Operations Capable". There is a distinction between that and special forces, but I'm not sure what he was trying to say.

[former9thward]

58. Everyone knows exactly what the term "special forces" means.

I saw the segment at the time it aired. Frankly given the way the homeless guy said it and the way McDonald said it I immediately thought they were both lying. McDonald knew there was a tv camera filming him and he knew exactly what the term would convey to the viewers.

[Kaleva]

34. A rather rinky dink comment caught on tape

If he has a history of embellishing his record, then I'd be concerned. This one incident is important to those who get a boner over all things military.

[jollyreaper2112]

39. Ah

So only the big lies count? There's little lies like I don't feel like going out tonight but really I don't want to spend time with you. There's telling your boss you're working on X when you forgot all about it but can still get it done in time. And then there's lying about important shit. No I did not have sex with that woman. No officer I wasn't drinking. Yes, those are my actual qualifications.

You can have some fun with a bar story like something happened and you thought of the funny thing to say to the people involved an hour later and you just include that line in the retelling. There's editing your story for clarity, exaggerating a yarn for comedic effect. But then there's just lying. Saying what happened when you and your buddies were drinking is one thing. If you're driving and come across a car accident and the story somehow becomes you pulled a family to safety from a burning wreck when it was actually the first responders, that is lying. The kind of person who makes shit like that up is not to be trusted. Yes, it matters. No, it's not a little fibbing. Fibbing is how big that fish you caught was.

[Kaleva]

40. Like I said, it matters to people who get a boner over stuff like this.

[Fred Sanders]

69. Like you said, getting a boner over all things military...all lies are equal is actually being said!

[progree]

35. At least he didn't claim to come under sniper fire and that he had to run with his head down into

waiting vehicles.

[HubertHeaver]

36. While accompanied by his daughter.

[Sienna86]

41. He needs to resign immediately. nt

[elias49]

50. Get a life.

And while you're at it, go find that homeless vet and tell him to get his s*** together and stop complaining.
Tell him to his face that his breath is bad (hey, if it's the truth...:shrug
Tell him, 'Meh, so you were special forces. Big woop'
Maybe tell him, 'Hey, you know I don't even know why i'm here. got better stuff to do''
cuz, hey, it's the truth.

Happy to offer this to all the tight-shorts folks in this thread.

[Renew Deal]

52. I don't know how people misremember such important information.

I think they eventually believe the lie.

[HereSince1628]

53. IIRC all special forces, rangers and airborne go to jump school

I think that selection to SF and Ranger training usually happens after completion of jump school

So, iirc-and I may not...I never wanted to jump out of aircraft or even be air-mobile... it' seems possible an airborne and a special forces person could share training experiences and possibly share a moment in personal history.

When vets realize their paths are similar one of the first questions is 'when were you there'.

I don't want to make excuses for the guy because he might be purposefully lying, but it's also possible it was a matter of misspeaking.

[mopinko]

57. nope. you have to go through sere training.

that is not something anyone would misremember.

[nil desperandum]

54. Lying about service from an officer...

“I have no excuse,” McDonald told The Huffington Post, when contacted to explain his claim. “I was not in special forces.”

THE HONOR CODE

A CADET WILL NOT LIE, CHEAT, STEAL, OR TOLERATE THOSE WHO DO.

http://www.west-point.org/users/usma1951/18250/whitepaper.htm

He knows he lied, he knows it was completely incorrect for a former officer to lie.

For the record, Ranger Tabbed is no more a ranger than the Basic Parachutist Badge makes you a paratrooper. The tab means nothing more than you are now qualified to serve with the Rangers, but you aren't a Ranger until you serve in the Battalions. The tab means he could have been a Ranger but chose not to be as he didn't serve in a Ranger Battalion and earn the scroll.

Same with Jump School, if you graduate jump school but are not serving in a paratrooper unit you are just another Ft. Benning five jump chump.

I served in support of SF unit operations, I was a regular jump qualified 11Bravo and while our service was alongside each other I would never claim to be SF because I wasn't. Serving alongside isn't serving within even if you still get shot at.

Honest soldiers and men of character know the truth.

Having said that, I'm not terribly surprised and the fact he apologized immediately means he knows he screwed up. I was truly hoping his business skills would make him the guy to put the VA right with the veterans who need that service. Here's hoping this apology puts him back on the path to righteousness and he can get back to work making the VA function properly.

I would not be surprised if this results in him losing this job however.

[Fred Sanders]

65. Update - so it ends with much ado about next to nothing, as predicted..............

"Rep. Mike Coffman, R-Colo., called the misstatement an error but said "it doesn't dim the fact that he served honorably."

He said: "We should all take him at his word and Washington shouldn't spend the next two weeks arguing about it. The Secretary has a job to do -- clean up the scandal-plagued VA. This latest controversy shouldn't shift one iota of focus away from that long overdue task."

The White House released a statement Monday evening saying that it had accepted McDonald's explanation.

"Secretary McDonald has apologized for the misstatement and noted that he never intended to misrepresent his military service," the statement said. "We take him at his word and expect that this will not impact the important work he’s doing to promote the health and well-being of our nation’s veterans.""

Shall we move on and back to actual consequential GOP lies?

[GGJohn]

68. Sorry, but that was no mis-statement, it was a false statement.

Anyone who was career military knows the difference between being an SF operator and not being an SF operator.
Not buying his explanation.

[CreekDog]

72. Yes, let's talk about Putin's lies too, are you on board with that?

[Fred Sanders]

75. Biggest strawman I have seen in weeks....on topic, too bad about no one asking anyone to resign.

[CreekDog]

78. I guess you don't read your own posts

[mopinko]

76. at least he admitted it and apologized.

i suspect that more such statements and dishonesties will bubble up, tho.

http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/careers/army/2015/02/19/-army-lying-distrust-ethics/23678429/

[GGJohn]

77. I have a hard time accepting his apology,

I was career Army, we knew what our MOS was, he darn well knew that he was never an SF operator, this was knowingly said by him and I agree with you, there's probably more false claims out there from him.

[Shoonra]

79. Missing the real point

Bob McDonald's real military record is published for everyone to see in his Senate confirmation hearings, so he wasn't trying to get something tangible in a one-on-one conversation with a homeless vet which CBS overheard. It turns out that McDonald did do some Army training with Special Forces although he was in the Airborne and not a member of the Green Berets. So he exaggerated that a tiny bit to try to get a conversation going with a homeless vet. BFD.

What nobody seems upset about is that here was a Green Beret veteran who was forced to live in a cardboard box on the street, in the middle of a brutal winter, with no home and no secure source of food or warmth. McDonald was sufficiently upset about that to try, desperately, to converse with that vet but the rest of us want to throw rocks at McDonald instead of showing concern for the homeless Green Beret.

[greatlaurel]

80. Insightful post. Thank you.

It seems extraordinarily strange to me that the news media makes a big stink over McDonald's exaggeration of his record while completely ignoring the scandal of a homeless Green Beret veteran living on the street in a cardboard box. Even the great Charlie Pierce got caught up with bashing McDonald instead of showing outrage for the lack of care for a veteran. Our news media has been captured by flimflam artists.

Thank you for saying this so well.