Fri Mar 6, 2015, 09:21 AM

7962 (11,841 posts)

In U.C.L.A. Debate Over Jewish Student, Echoes on Campus of Old Biases

Source: New York Times

LOS ANGELES — It seemed like routine business for the student council at the University of California, Los Angeles: confirming the nomination of Rachel Beyda, a second-year economics major who wants to be a lawyer someday, to the council’s Judicial Board.

Until it came time for questions.

“Given that you are a Jewish student and very active in the Jewish community,” Fabienne Roth, a member of the Undergraduate Students Association Council, began, looking at Ms. Beyda at the other end of the room, “how do you see yourself being able to maintain an unbiased view?”

For the next 40 minutes, after Ms. Beyda was dispatched from the room, the council tangled in a debate about whether her faith and affiliation with Jewish organizations, including her sorority and Hillel, a popular student group, meant she would be biased in dealing with sensitive governance questions that come before the board, which is the campus equivalent of the Supreme Court.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/06/us/debate-on-a-jewish-student-at-ucla.html

Absolutely disgusting behavior. Can you imagine if the same questions were asked of a black student? A Hispanic one?
ETA: Faculty leader says this is a "teaching moment"? Good lord.

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91 replies	Author	Time	Post
In U.C.L.A. Debate Over Jewish Student, Echoes on Campus of Old Biases (Original post)	7962	Mar 2015	OP
She was unanimously elected to the board shortly afterwards...so...another tempest in a teapot.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#1
The fact she was questioned AT ALL is silly. So since they changed their mind, nothing to see here?	7962	Mar 2015	#3
The fact that her religion was brought into the questioning is what is disturbing?	still_one	Mar 2015	#18
care to explain the distinction you see	onenote	Mar 2015	#6
she was ONLY elected because the faculty advisor told the little cadre of bigots that	cali	Mar 2015	#8
how interesting that you launch into how awful it is for Muslim students and belittle this bigotry.	cali	Mar 2015	#9
She shouldn't have been asked at all	Blue_Tires	Mar 2015	#33
What's the point in minimizing sntisemitic incidents?	King_David	Mar 2015	#78
There is no justification, ever, for anti-Semitism.	NaturalHigh	Mar 2015	#84
Of course not. Any form of racism. Whatever term one prefers for the same thing. Your judgment is free to have of me.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#89
This message was self-deleted by its author	Kurska	Mar 2015	#91
A friend sent me this article	leftynyc	Mar 2015	#2
lol an unbiased view...like theirs?	elehhhhna	Mar 2015	#76
Ain't it interesting how more than a few go out of their way to "excuse" this behavior?	Behind the Aegis	Mar 2015	#82
We see it far too often.	NaturalHigh	Mar 2015	#83
Disgusting (nt)	Nye Bevan	Mar 2015	#4
I'll keep this incident in mind.....	Paladin	Mar 2015	#5
Ha!	7962	Mar 2015	#45
Same here from the Sooner State.	NaturalHigh	Mar 2015	#85
Isn't Roth a Jewish name too? I think questions of bias are normal in courtroom situations.	DesertDiamond	Mar 2015	#7
"A Jewish name."	DemocratSinceBirth	Mar 2015	#11
Somewhat.	alp227	Mar 2015	#24
Yeah, I kind of get that, but my remark was also to its relevance.	DemocratSinceBirth	Mar 2015	#25
A Jewish name?	leftynyc	Mar 2015	#13
She's from Switzerland	mwrguy	Mar 2015	#14
this is a student council, not a courtroom! Besides,	wordpix	Mar 2015	#22
What an awful question	treestar	Mar 2015	#10
I'm also very sorry	leftynyc	Mar 2015	#12
Thank you, lefty!	7962	Mar 2015	#47
It's disgusting but tragically common.	NaturalHigh	Mar 2015	#86
This is becoming an alarming trend	romanic	Mar 2015	#15
Far too many	leftynyc	Mar 2015	#16
Some members have issued a non-apology	csziggy	Mar 2015	#17
It is an excellent apology, read in entirety, by the entire student board - compare with Ben Carson.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#19
It's a bullshit apology	leftynyc	Mar 2015	#20
The one asking “how do you see yourself being able to maintain an unbiased view?” needs a MIRROR!	freshwest	Mar 2015	#27
That there are those	leftynyc	Mar 2015	#28
And now that she's been 'accepted' she's likely to 'keep her place' to suit them.	freshwest	Mar 2015	#29
Oh - I don't know about that	leftynyc	Mar 2015	#30
I hope that does change the behavior on the campus. We need to get back to some sense of neutrality.	freshwest	Mar 2015	#35
why would the entire student association apologize for one girl asking a question?	Doctor_J	Mar 2015	#64
It was NOT one girl asking a question, it was several members	cali	Mar 2015	#65
Giving an apology that was half as bad as Carson's would still be a bad apology	onenote	Mar 2015	#26
Their intentions seem pretty clear, to control the deck of the group's opinion and the price	Jefferson23	Mar 2015	#34
It truly is a non-apology	romanic	Mar 2015	#21
Yes, what is what it is...way too many big words....?? Nazi interrogators.....yeah..same thing....	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#46
Here's another non-apology; regretting how the question was "phrased".	7962	Mar 2015	#49
Muslim KILLED in public shooting in Dallas...comments...comparisons of the harm done?	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#51
And this has what to do with THIS story? Nothing.	7962	Mar 2015	#55
I guess police and other folks should just read Internet comment board investigative reports and close the books...	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#56
man, you really can't help yourself	cali	Mar 2015	#66
Of course, using vulgar, gratuitous language always makes for a better argument, we can agree on that?	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#68
So you think the rude pundit's arguments are diminished by his language? then we	cali	Mar 2015	#72
You can write without cursing, AND writing well, but you prefer not to? Good to know....	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#74
Can you explain what that has to do with this thread?	NaturalHigh	Mar 2015	#87
Message auto-removed	Name removed	Mar 2015	#23
Generalizing much?	BillZBubb	Mar 2015	#40
Their adviser tells them the law, and they ignore it? Sounds as if they did not care, and they	Jefferson23	Mar 2015	#31
Beyda seems to be satisfied with the apology and the result, shouldn't she be the judge?	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#36
Of course that is up to her, and I believe it is fair to suggest they have placed her	Jefferson23	Mar 2015	#37
I totally agree the original vote was ridiculous...but it was fixed completely, apology made...sometimes	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#53
Those students need to self examine themselves much further, Fred. I question if they	Jefferson23	Mar 2015	#57
They do seem to have a good mentor overseeing the Board. Righting wrongs is a good thing.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#58
Yep, I hope they do. n/t	Jefferson23	Mar 2015	#59
Roth is one of bigots who apologized, fred	cali	Mar 2015	#38
No problem, edit made. It is up to the victim to decide what is just for them? No? Lay your strawmen to rest.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#42
you clearly are clueless as to what a strawman is, fred.	cali	Mar 2015	#67
"Clueless"? - now that there is an interesting choice of words...	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#69
So you think that if the person who offends is satisfied with the apology they give then it's okay?	onenote	Mar 2015	#39
Obvious biases are apparent all over. As are fertile fields of strawmen.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#43
poor attempt to deflect, especially since you still haven't gotten her name right	onenote	Mar 2015	#48
What is in a name? - Makes no difference to my point.....she is apparently satisfied..why are some who	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#50
Oh, it makes a difference. You just can't or won't acknowledge it.	onenote	Mar 2015	#77
I would have expected better from UCLA	azmom	Mar 2015	#32
Earlier article in the campus paper	Mosby	Mar 2015	#41
Not good enough for the Black hat/White Hat folks...that the students revoted and humbly apologized should be applauded.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#44
Yes, apologized after they were told they'd BETTER apologize!	7962	Mar 2015	#52
I condemn the original action - and commend the Justice done. I do not like wearing hats.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#54
Agreed	7962	Mar 2015	#62
I realize this happened at an academic	sadoldgirl	Mar 2015	#60
+1	7962	Mar 2015	#61
It is a fact...bigotry and racism is a wide spectrum disease...and being such an evil fact means it has to be fought.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#63
I love unintentional irony. n/t	cali	Mar 2015	#70
Isn't that special...I love how my posts draw certain...attention. I hope folks take note.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#71
oh, I think folks have taken notice, fred. But not necessarily in the way YOU wish.	cali	Mar 2015	#73
What I know is you are on Full Ignore...28.	Fred Sanders	Mar 2015	#75
Hey Cali, looks like I'm #29!	7962	Mar 2015	#90
A self-reflective person might stop to consider...	NaturalHigh	Mar 2015	#88
What if this were about a Catholic instead of a Jew?	candelista	Mar 2015	#79
Very sad but the group that opposed her was interesting	ripcord	Mar 2015	#80
Interesting in another way, too.	candelista	Mar 2015	#81

Response to 7962 (Original post)

Fri Mar 6, 2015, 09:34 AM

Fred Sanders (23,946 posts)

1. She was unanimously elected to the board shortly afterwards...so...another tempest in a teapot.

"The council, in a meeting that took place on Feb. 10, voted first to reject Ms. Beyda’s nomination, with four members against her. Then, at the prodding of a faculty adviser there who pointed out that belonging to Jewish organizations was not a conflict of interest, the students revisited the question and unanimously put her on the board."

It gets reported in the N.Y.T......a month later.....with a hair on fire headline...

Can you imagine what Muslim students must be going through as the media fearmongers over Islam?

And, good Lord, it was a teaching moment, 4 students learned something, the ones that changed their votes.....

P.S. "Black" and "Hispanic" are not religions. Good Lord.

In U.C.L.A. Debate Over Jewish Student, Echoes on Campus of Old Biases

1. She was unanimously elected to the board shortly afterwards...so...another tempest in a teapot.

3. The fact she was questioned AT ALL is silly. So since they changed their mind, nothing to see here?

18. The fact that her religion was brought into the questioning is what is disturbing?

6. care to explain the distinction you see

8. she was ONLY elected because the faculty advisor told the little cadre of bigots that

9. how interesting that you launch into how awful it is for Muslim students and belittle this bigotry.

33. She shouldn't have been asked at all

78. What's the point in minimizing sntisemitic incidents?

84. There is no justification, ever, for anti-Semitism.

89. Of course not. Any form of racism. Whatever term one prefers for the same thing. Your judgment is free to have of me.

2. A friend sent me this article

76. lol an unbiased view...like theirs?

82. Ain't it interesting how more than a few go out of their way to "excuse" this behavior?

83. We see it far too often.

4. Disgusting (nt)

5. I'll keep this incident in mind.....

45. Ha!

85. Same here from the Sooner State.

7. Isn't Roth a Jewish name too? I think questions of bias are normal in courtroom situations.

11. "A Jewish name."

24. Somewhat.

25. Yeah, I kind of get that, but my remark was also to its relevance.

13. A Jewish name?

14. She's from Switzerland

22. this is a student council, not a courtroom! Besides,

10. What an awful question

12. I'm also very sorry

47. Thank you, lefty!

86. It's disgusting but tragically common.

15. This is becoming an alarming trend

16. Far too many

17. Some members have issued a non-apology

19. It is an excellent apology, read in entirety, by the entire student board - compare with Ben Carson.

20. It's a bullshit apology

27. The one asking “how do you see yourself being able to maintain an unbiased view?” needs a MIRROR!

28. That there are those

29. And now that she's been 'accepted' she's likely to 'keep her place' to suit them.

30. Oh - I don't know about that

35. I hope that does change the behavior on the campus. We need to get back to some sense of neutrality.

64. why would the entire student association apologize for one girl asking a question?

65. It was NOT one girl asking a question, it was several members

26. Giving an apology that was half as bad as Carson's would still be a bad apology

34. Their intentions seem pretty clear, to control the deck of the group's opinion and the price

21. It truly is a non-apology

46. Yes, what is what it is...way too many big words....?? Nazi interrogators.....yeah..same thing....

49. Here's another non-apology; regretting how the question was "phrased".

51. Muslim KILLED in public shooting in Dallas...comments...comparisons of the harm done?

55. And this has what to do with THIS story? Nothing.

56. I guess police and other folks should just read Internet comment board investigative reports and close the books...

66. man, you really can't help yourself

68. Of course, using vulgar, gratuitous language always makes for a better argument, we can agree on that?

72. So you think the rude pundit's arguments are diminished by his language? then we

74. You can write without cursing, AND writing well, but you prefer not to? Good to know....

87. Can you explain what that has to do with this thread?

40. Generalizing much?

31. Their adviser tells them the law, and they ignore it? Sounds as if they did not care, and they

36. Beyda seems to be satisfied with the apology and the result, shouldn't she be the judge?

37. Of course that is up to her, and I believe it is fair to suggest they have placed her

53. I totally agree the original vote was ridiculous...but it was fixed completely, apology made...sometimes

57. Those students need to self examine themselves much further, Fred. I question if they

58. They do seem to have a good mentor overseeing the Board. Righting wrongs is a good thing.

59. Yep, I hope they do. n/t

38. Roth is one of bigots who apologized, fred

42. No problem, edit made. It is up to the victim to decide what is just for them? No? Lay your strawmen to rest.

67. you clearly are clueless as to what a strawman is, fred.

69. "Clueless"? - now that there is an interesting choice of words...

39. So you think that if the person who offends is satisfied with the apology they give then it's okay?

43. Obvious biases are apparent all over. As are fertile fields of strawmen.

48. poor attempt to deflect, especially since you still haven't gotten her name right

50. What is in a name? - Makes no difference to my point.....she is apparently satisfied..why are some who

77. Oh, it makes a difference. You just can't or won't acknowledge it.

32. I would have expected better from UCLA

41. Earlier article in the campus paper

44. Not good enough for the Black hat/White Hat folks...that the students revoted and humbly apologized should be applauded.

52. Yes, apologized after they were told they'd BETTER apologize!

54. I condemn the original action - and commend the Justice done. I do not like wearing hats.

62. Agreed

60. I realize this happened at an academic

61. +1