Kim Davis, Kentucky County Clerk, Met Pope Francis

[Richard D]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by TexasTowelie (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: New York Times

Pope Francis met privately in Washington last week with Kim Davis, the county clerk in Kentucky who defied a court order to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples, a Vatican spokesman confirmed on Wednesday.

Ms. Davis, the clerk in Rowan County, has been at the center of a nationwide controversy over whether government employees and private businesses have a legal right to refuse to serve same-sex couples. She spent five days in jail for disobeying a federal court order to issue the licenses.

On Tuesday night, her lawyer, Mathew D. Staver, said in a telephone interview that Ms. Davis and her husband, Joe, were sneaked into the Vatican Embassy by car on Thursday afternoon. Francis gave her rosaries and told her to “stay strong,” the lawyer said. The couple met for about 15 minutes with the pope, who was accompanied by security guards, aides and photographers. Mr. Staver said he expected to receive photographs of the meeting from the Vatican soon.
Continue reading the main story
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On Wednesday, the Vatican spokesman, the Rev. Federico Lombardi, confirmed that the meeting took place, but he declined to elaborate. “I do not deny that the meeting took place, but I have no other comments to add,” he said.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/30/us/county-clerk-kim-davis-who-denied-gay-couples-visited-pope.html?smid=tw-share

[packman]

1. Perhaps the Pope explained to her what Christ was all about

That's my positive spin on it and I'll stick to that (but, I am disappointed if the Pope and her met).

[katmondoo]

4. It has put a damper on my enthusiasm for the Pope

It was a very happy 5 days, now not so much. I feel betrayed.

[dorkzilla]

15. Its completely evaporated mine.

Not that I was ever going to go back to belief in a god of any kind, but I would happily give my support to someone fighting for equal rights for EVERYONE.

Fuck them and their stupid religion. ALL of their stupid religions.

[Arugula Latte]

39. A lot of us have been trying to tell you guys it's all a PR job.

The Pope and the RCC remain stalwart in their utter contempt for the rights of women and gays.

[WestSeattle2]

35. For all the smarmy genuflecting before this Pope, he

is still the leader of the Catholic religion. Enough said in my book.

Interesting how they kept this meeting under wraps until he was out of the country. What was he afraid of? Why the secrecy?

[Goblinmonger]

63. Well, given his stance on gays and gay marriage,

they were probably in agreement about that.

[yuiyoshida]

2. Since she has jumped from the Democratic Party to the Republican pary

Maybe his Holiness thought he could convert her to become a Catholic as well. I am betting she would say, "no chance".

[Cal33]

38. She already is a Catholic. To you and all DUers, how about practicing "live and let live?" -

regardless of what other people do?

[Arugula Latte]

41. "Live and let live" -- guess that doesn't apply to the Catholic Church, huh?

This evil institution, with a blood-soaked history going back centuries, is poking its corrupt nose into our legislation once again.

[yuiyoshida]

45. Are you sure? Could have sworn I read on

DU that she was a baptist, or that she is an Adventists .. and as for Live and Let Live? To a Bigot? No Chance. That's like giving a Racist a pass for calling Asians "Chinks".

[Lordquinton]

60. Lemme know when they start practicing that

Then we can talk.

[NoMoreRepugs]

3. Is she the new "Joe the Plumber?"...

the EVERYMAN/(WOMAN) hero of the ignorant masses that make up the GOP voting bloc??

[louis-t]

5. She says he told her "thanks for your courage."

I'm having trouble believing any of this.

[Beartracks]

36. Oh - SHE says the Pope is on her side?

And for that reason, people here are willing to abandon all respect for the guy?

===============

[Goblinmonger]

65. He thinks gay marriage is from Satan.

Were you thinking he would not like someone that is sticking up for the "sanctity of marriage"?

[Sophiegirl]

6. No confirmation or denial

From the Vatican or church officials. In fact, seems there is a very emphatic "No comment." Why would that be?

[NYC Liberal]

8. Vatican spokesperson confirmed the meeting took place and had no other comment.

The meeting happened.

[Tarc]

9. Confirmed

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/09/30/vatican-quiet-claim-pope-met-kim-davis/73078774/

[Sophiegirl]

12. Disappointing

I'm an atheist, but I was liking a lot about this Pope. Now, I've lost any respect I had gained.

[NYC Liberal]

7. Why people continue to make excuses for this guy, I do not understand.

He believes fighting same-sex marriage is a holy war against evil.

[Hugin]

10. So, it looks as if some money changed hands and someone got an audience.

I doubt the Pope knew anything about her and just handed out a rosary and said a few platitudes... NEXT!

[Richard D]

14. Good point

It's significant that there are no photos or videos.

[muriel_volestrangler]

21. Are you saying that if the pope had accepted more money, he would have allowed photos?

I'm amazed you accept the accusation that the pope accepted money for the meeting. Is there any other significance you read into the lack of photos and videos?

[Hugin]

25. I didn't say the Pope accepted the money or even knew about it...

However, somewhere someone sought access and somehow an audience was granted. There is a long history of pay-for-play in things happening.

It was the part about "sneaking them into the Vatican Embassy"... That's the part which really makes me wonder.

[muriel_volestrangler]

30. But that's just your supposition. The lawyer (admittedly a known liar) says it was the RC church

who came up with the idea. There's also a long history of the pope, and the Roman Catholic church, being against same-sex marriage, and paying to try to stop it (see: Proposition 8).

I find it hard to believe that the pope didn't know about a major religion and same-sex marriage story in a country he was about to make a high profile visit to. He doesn't live in an ivory tower, and he has a staff who keep track of world news, as well.

The Vatican wouldn't have wanted the headlines about Davis taking up the space they could have been talking about the pope. So they did it without letting the media know.

[Hugin]

32. I never claimed it was other than my opinion.

I'm surprised he didn't bring up her serial marriage or bastard children. He's big on those things, too.

[Lordquinton]

61. God has forgiven her for all that

so why would the Pope bring it up?

[LannyDeVaney]

26. I find it very hard to believe ...

that this attention seeking nut job got rosary beads from the Pope and hasn't plastered pictures of them all over the place.

Maybe she's anti-Catholic?

[muriel_volestrangler]

27. They have given out the photos:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/exclusive-kim-davis-recounts-secret-meeting-pope-francis/story?id=34143874

[bluestateguy]

11. This still just strikes me as a rumor

Her Liberty Council lawyer is not credible.

[skepticscott]

18. And is the Vatican also lying

And all of the newspapers? Are all of the specific details about the meeting just being invented out of thin air?

[restorefreedom]

13. i have tried repeatedly to defend this pope

because i repected his attitudes towards capitalism, the poor, and inclusiveness towards people of other faiths.

i have defended him on a number of occasions.

i am now retiring.

[katmondoo]

16. If she had quit I would have called her Honorable

Jesus said render unto Caesar what is Caesars and unto God what Is Gods' The Federal Government in this case is Caesar

[restorefreedom]

17. yes, she should have quit

but right wingers want all of us to bend to their will

maybe they should spend more time in bible study and less time making names for themselves.

[classof56]

19. If this meeting turns out to be true, then sadly, I'm with you.

[restorefreedom]

20. what makes me sick

is it the right wing Fundy bigots don't even consider Catholicism part of Christianity, and yet they have no problem using this pope as a prop to forward their bigoted agenda. And after this visit, they won't have any problem tearing down this pope because he supports efforts to fight climate change or because he says that we should include people of all faiths in our discussions. Typical fundamental hypocrisy. They may say they're Christians, but in my view they're not.

[dorkzilla]

22. Sorry, I didn’t see your post before I posted my Pope post post haste

Poopie on this pope.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027215267

[C Moon]

23. Is this serious? She's self-centered hateful person. Why the hell would he meet with her?

Is it any wonder why I stopped believing in god?

[Goblinmonger]

66. Because their views on gay marriage are completely in line.

I mean, there's that.

[Geronimoe]

24. Disappointment

The Pope met with prisoners in PA. That he met with only one, Kim Davis is sad. Adventists don't even recognize the Pope. Not a big deal, much worse is canonizing Junipero Serra and the Vatican saying they will not divest from fossil fuel investments.

The Pope is not impressive so far.

[progree]

28. Pope wades into U.S. gay marriage debate after historic visit - Reuters

Pope wades into U.S. gay marriage debate after historic visit, Reuters, 9/29/15

http://news.yahoo.com/pope-wades-u-gay-marriage-debate-historic-visit-192049390.html

Pope Francis waited until his historic U.S. visit was over to make his most direct comments on the nation's debate over gay marriage, saying government officials should have the right to refrain from actions that violate their religious beliefs.

That statement came in response to a reporter's question on the papal plane about Kim Davis

"Conscientious objection must enter into every juridical structure because it is a right," Francis told reporters, speaking in Italian. "If someone does not allow others to be a conscientious objector, he denies a right."

Francis alluded to the Roman Catholic Church's objections to gay marriage during some of his U.S. talks, citing concerns about "juridical" changes to the definition of the family. Still, he largely avoided the issue, the subject of intense debate.

[progree]

29. Pope supports nuns involved in lawsuit against ACA's contraception coverage mandate

Pope visits U.S. nuns involved in Obamacare contraception lawsuit, Reuters, 9/24/15

http://news.yahoo.com/pope-visits-u-nuns-involved-obamacare-contraception-lawsuit-021905130.html

Pope Francis on Wednesday made an unscheduled stop to a convent of nuns to show his support for their lawsuit against U.S. President Barack Obama's healthcare law.

Vatican spokesman Father Federico Lombardi said the visit to the convent of the Little Sisters of the Poor for what he called a "brief but symbolic visit."

Last August, a federal appeals court in Denver put on hold its ruling that the order of Roman Catholic nuns must comply with a contraception mandate in the law, giving the group time to petition the U.S. Supreme Court.

.. The Sisters argued that the law forces them to provide insurance coverage for their employees to support contraception and sterilization services in violation of their religious beliefs, or face steep fines.

(the Sisters don't have to pay for the insurance, all they have to do is notify the federal government that they are opting out of the requirement, and then a 3rd party or their insurer pays for it. But the Sisters argue that even providing an opt-out notification makes them complicit in providing sterilization and contraceptive coverage)

If the lawsuit succeeds, female employees of these religious organizations will be forced to pay the full bill for their contraception. Or to abstain from (regular PIV) sex, given that the "natural" methods the Catholic Church approves of (or begrudgingly accepts) have a lousy track record in preventing pregnancy.

[underpants]

31. I heard this at lunch from someone who is a Fox News believer

I hadn't been on DU or checked the news today so I said "No way". Apparently she did meet with the Pope. Amazing.

[Hulk]

33. Just took him down to "hypocrite human status" in my book.

What a shame. I had higher hopes for this pontiff. Guess I was fooled again. Shame on me for thinking he was more than what he settled for.

[dbackjon]

34. FUCK THE POPE. BIGOTED, MYSOGYNIST FUCKING ASSHOLE

[Arugula Latte]

37. Where are the Slobbering DU Pope Devotees now?

[Darb]

42. Not a devotee, but most certainly not a knee-jerk asshole either.

I am right here and I will say it again. Calling the Pope names and saying hateful shit about him is a bad, bad, bad idea. It hurts your cause, whatever that cause may be.

[Arugula Latte]

46. My cause is progressivism -- including equal rights for all.

The Pope has spoken out against gay adoption, gay marriage, and the rights of women to control their bodies. Are you not offended by THAT "hateful shit"? Why are you so eager to shush those calling out a misogynistic, homophobic figurehead?

[beam me up scottie]

50. Yep. Some of the apologists need to check their privilege.

Sick of the double standard here.

It's okay to excoriate Republican right wing religious bigots but the pope is off limits because ... he seems nice.

[Darb]

55. You missed my point too.

Nicely done. Please proceed in hurting your cause, or causes, or whatever you are doing.

[beam me up scottie]

57. My "cause" is calling out bigotry and if you're not doing the same you're part of the problem.

It's my life that's on the line thanks to the Vatican's obsession with preventing women from accessing birth control and abortions.

It's lgbt lives that are at risk because of the bigotry preached by this pope and all of his minions.

But keep telling me that what I should and shouldn't do to protest.

[Darb]

54. Go right ahead.

I will not get in your way.

[Lordquinton]

62. Calling him a Bigot and misogynist isn't calling him names

it's calling him out for what he is. Some people are venting about it in a safe space, and I'm sure they would appreciate it if you didn't come and tone police them. (Tone policing, after all, is another tool of oppression, used to invalidate anger and outrage, and forcing people into silence because they "Aren't speaking nicely&quot

What are your thoughts on this historic visit between two bigots?

[Goblinmonger]

68. Did you say that when people said things about George Bush?

Probably not. Calling a bigoted asshole a bigoted asshole is nothing but the truth.

[geek tragedy]

40. the pope is a homophobic asshole.

meet the new gay-hating boss, same as every other gay-hating boss in that institution's history.

[Darb]

43. All of ya'll saying outlandish shit about the Pope,

You're not too bright.

Pick your battles better.

[geek tragedy]

47. pick the homophobic assholes you choose to defend better nt

[Darb]

52. Not defending him, just trying to protect ya'll

from yourselves.

[geek tragedy]

53. I do not believe God will send lightning bolts through the Internet

to those who hurt the fee-fees of the pope and his admirers

[Darb]

56. Nor do I, we agree on that, lightening bolts.

You don't hurt my feelings in any way. I am not a fan of the Catholic Church or any other for that matter. I do know when to breast my cards and pick my battles. We probably agree on everything, what I am commenting on is strategy.

[Arugula Latte]

48. Oh, stop shushing us. You're complicit in defending a powerful rightwing figure

who is working to deny rights to others. Shame on you.

[Darb]

49. Please proceed.

Genius.

[Arugula Latte]

51. Yeah, I will.

And I don't need your permission.

[Darb]

58. You do not need anyone's permission

to implode your cause.

[Arugula Latte]

59. LOL!

Riiiight. I'm imploding a cause.

Oh, that's a good one. Thanks for the laugh!

[dembotoz]

44. maybe he mistook her for someone who has severe physical and mental challenges

he goes out of his way to hug and kiss those folks

[Geronimoe]

64. The Catholic Church has been historically big on persecution

The Pope canonization of Junipero Serra is sad.

I couldn't care the least whether he meets with Kim or the Easter Bunny.

[TexasTowelie]

69. Locking thread.

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