Ex-ACLU staff attorney kicked off grand jury in St. Louis County

[pintobean]

Source: St. Louis Post-Dispatch

CLAYTON • A man who filed Ferguson-related lawsuits when he was an ACLU attorney has been removed from serving on a St. Louis County grand jury, apparently after Prosecuting Attorney Robert McCulloch complained about him.

Circuit Judge Steven Goldman removed the grand juror on Sept. 28, less than two weeks after the man began serving as jury foreman and considering dozens of cases.

According to a suit filed Friday morning, the man — using the pseudonym John Roe — wants St. Louis County to put him back on the grand jury. The suit was filed by the American Civil Liberties Union, where the unidentified man worked as a staff attorney until March.

“The grand juror didn’t do anything wrong,” said Jeffrey Mittman, executive director of the ACLU of Missouri.

A transcript of the meeting Goldman had with the grand juror was filed Friday under seal. However, portions of what was said are included in the ACLU’s suit. It claims Goldman called the grand juror into his office to say there “potentially” was a conflict and that he would be removed.

Read more: http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/ex-aclu-staff-attorney-kicked-off-grand-jury-in-st/article_4bf3f39c-5130-5d41-b05e-42a6bc58779c.html

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

1. The 'conflict' is that he understands the law too well. nt

[hobbit709]

3. Beat me to it.

[pintobean]

4. If he filed lawsuits against the county

it's definitely a conflict of interest.

[Shrike47]

10. I assume this is sarcasm. Filing civil suits makes him ineligible for criminal grand juries? No.

[pintobean]

11. No, it's not sarcasm

[Shrike47]

18. Not an attorney, I see. Grand juries are supposed to be random picks, not hand-chosen stamps.

[Tempest]

12. By your logic the prosecutor has a conflict of interest

After all, he's the one who decides which cases the grand jury hears and he or his office are the ones who prosecutes them.

The lawyer files lawsuits on behalf of his clients or company, not on his own behalf. This sets a bad precedence and looks a lot like jury stacking and tampering by the prosecutor.

[pintobean]

15. Tell it to the judge

who tossed the guy. I'm sure he just did it on a whim, and fails to see your clear logic.

[catrose]

5. Yep.

The prosecutors want to explain the law to the G J without conflicting views. There's a mechanism to recuse yourself from individual cases where you might have a conflict of interest. So they don't need to throw him off after he's been seated.

[Roy Rolling]

2. The Dumbing Down of America in Action

He was obviously too smart to believe the fiction the District Attorney was trying to peddle.

[hughee99]

6. I'm sure everyone would be equally cool with this if the guy was a lawyer for the

the Heritage Foundation, the Koch Brothers, or the NRA, right?

[pintobean]

7. or a prosecutor

I'm sure the ACLU would be cool with any of those serving on the grand jury, especially as foreman.

[hughee99]

8. Agreed. People only think having a lawyer on a jury is a good idea

when they believe it will be beneficial to the outcome they're hoping for.

[Travis_0004]

27. Agreed

I was excused from jury duty on a case that involed accounting fraud (I'm an accountant).

I don't think its that they want a dumb person, they want somebody who will listen to the facts presented, and rule on that.

As an accountant, if I was on the jury there would be times when I would want to raise my hand and ask my own questions, and during ruling there are laws and regulations that I would think about during deliberations, even if the judge didn't allow those arguments (for good reason)

[Tempest]

13. I would be

There's absolutely no reason to keep someone off a jury just because of who they work for.

If there's suspicions of wrongdoing by the person, then you investigate.


By your and others logic, it would be perfectly fine to prevent gun owners or NRA members from serving on city councils because local gun control laws may be considered.

[hughee99]

16. This does not follow, at all, from my logic...

My concern, as anyone else's concern should be, is that there will be someone in the private jury deliberations giving legal instructions and definitions other than those provided by the judge, and it may be someone predisposed to push one agenda or another.

City councils hearings are public record and there members are elected in public elections.

[Tempest]

20. "City councils hearings are public record"

You sure don't know much about city councils.

Do a Google search on the number of decisions city councils make behind closed doors and without revealing the deliberations on how the decisions are made.

A local city council in my area is currently being sued for a closed door decision on a zoning change they failed to record.

[hughee99]

21. In my town, they are televised on local access tv,

And held in a large facility open to the public. Anyone can attend in person or watch on tv if they want.

This is true of the towns around my area as well.

[Shrike47]

9. The man was discharged because the prosecutor didn't want him, contrary to the law.

The judge and the county were wrong, and will pay for their error. Good.

[Tempest]

14. The prosecutor lied to the judge

From the article:

The prosecutor also told Goldman, according to the suit, that the grand juror had been involved in a case challenging the way McCulloch handled grand jury proceedings in which a decision was made not to indict Ferguson police Officer Darren Wilson in the killing of Michael Brown. But the ACLU also said that neither it nor Roe was part of that case.


It sure looks like the judge failed in performing due diligence in investigating the prosecutor's claims against the juror. Once again showing that the St. Louis County criminal justice system is deeply flawed and corrupt.

[pintobean]

17. The ACLU is lying to a reporter

See how that works?

One side makes their claim to the judge, in court, with their identity known. The other side makes an anonymous claim to a reporter. You choose to believe the side that can't be penalized.

[Tempest]

19. Except the ACLU can prove it

There would be documents showing they were party to the lawsuit.

Documents the judge would be able to review. He didn't. He failed in performing due diligence.


Why are you so eager to defend a known corrupt prosecutor?

[hughee99]

22. So you'd be okay if this known corrupt

Prosecutor was sitting ON the jury then?

[Tempest]

24. Don't know what you're talking about

Are you saying the lawyer who was kicked off is known to be corrupt?

[hughee99]

32. You said above that having lawyers on your jury didn't bother you.

What would you think if the prosecutor in THIS case was on a jury?

[pintobean]

23. Lol

He's not a "known corrupt prosecutor", you think he's corrupt. Holder's DOJ report came to the same conclusions as McCulloch's grand jury.

[Tempest]

25. The National Bar Association seems to think his is

http://countercurrentnews.com/2014/11/national-bar-association-lawyers-release-statement-indicating-ferguson-prosecutor-corruption/#


And yet you still support him.

[pintobean]

26. Don't confuse them with the ABA

The NBA is an activist group.

Yes, I support him, along with the 95% of voters who re-elected him last November.

[justhanginon]

28. Agreed and living in the area it seems to me he tries to be,

given the law, pretty even handed.

[StoneCarver]

29. Attorney's almost never serve on a jury

Calm down people. He was just taken off the jury it the effort of fairness. He should have never been put on a jury. Attorney's know when they are called up most likely -they will NEVER EVER be put on a jury. Like it or not. I've sat on jury duty with attorney's who are pissed they are wasting their time -because they will never serve. It's just that simple. Spend your time on more important things.
Stonecarver

[Jack Rabbit]

30. Maybe he can run against and defeat McCulloch

I think replacing McCulloch with an ACLU attorney would be be a sweet manifestation of Karma.

[pintobean]

31. McCulloch wins in landslides

when he's opposed at all.

[whereisjustice]

33. Now you know where the expression "Fuck the Police" comes from. They deserve it. Police are not here

to serve and protect. They are here to get their shit on.

[pintobean]

34. Um..

This thread isn't about the police.

[blackspade]

35. Fucking shady