Trump 41%, Clinton 39%
Source: Rasmussen Reports
Last week, Rasmussen Reports gave voters the option of staying home on Election Day if Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump are the big party nominees, and six percent (6%) said that’s what they intend to do for now. Clinton and Trump were tied with 38% support each; 16% said they would vote for some other candidate, and two percent (2%) were undecided.
But Trump edges slightly ahead if the stay-at-home option is removed. Trump also now does twice as well among Democrats as Clinton does among Republicans.
A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey of Likely U.S. Voters finds Trump with 41% support to Clinton’s 39%. Fifteen percent (15%) prefer some other candidate, and five percent (5%) are undecided. (To see survey question wording, click here.)
This is the first time Trump has led the matchup since last October. Clinton held a 41% to 36% advantage in early March.
Read more: http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2016/trump_41_clinton_39
This will not be a shoo-in for H. Clinton, as many believe.
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SusanLarson
(284 posts)I will and many others will not vote for Clinton, your only hope to avoid President Trump is to nominate someone else, preferably Bernie Sanders.
LannyDeVaney
(1,033 posts)check the primary totals, and that is with Sanders in the race.
The General Election will not be close, and not #BernieOrBust movement is going to convince me otherwise. In November, Clinton will overwhelmingly win the election and be the next POTUS.
SusanLarson
(284 posts)Get real.
Clinton has been winning in states that the Democratic party has not and will not carry in the general election.
Gallup polling in 2010 that found that 31% of Americans identified as Democrats (tying a 22-year low), 29% as Republicans, and 38% as independents. Nevertheless, more American independents leaned to the Republican Party when compared to the Democratic Party.
Take out 20-40% of the Democrats who stay home or write in someone other than the parties nonminee, take out the millennials and independents who oppose Clinton and all she represents with a passion, what do you get President Trump.
blm
(113,061 posts)passion?
Those of us who live in swing states taken over in recent years by GOP have a different view - we HATE everything the GOP represents with a passion - restricted voting rights that legalized their vote suppression tactics, legalized bigotry against gays and minorities and workers, privatization of our roadways and waterways.
No big deal, I suppose, if you don't live in a state named NORTH CAROLINA where every vote matters because every ruling made by the Supreme Court makes or breaks states like ours.
Response to blm (Reply #39)
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libdem4life
(13,877 posts)blm
(113,061 posts)And why does she matter?
liberalnarb
(4,532 posts)Maybe you should do some more research if you're serious.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)liberalnarb
(4,532 posts)
blm
(113,061 posts)so my replies won't make sense.
liberalnarb
(4,532 posts)B Calm
(28,762 posts)On Mon May 2, 2016, 07:05 PM an alert was sent on the following post:
Must be a millineal for Bernie who has not done any research. n/t
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=1434920
REASON FOR ALERT
This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.
ALERTER'S COMMENTS
Attacks Millennials as a group
You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Mon May 2, 2016, 07:49 PM, and the Jury voted 3-4 to LEAVE IT.
Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Stupid post discriminating against one age group has no place on du.
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Pointless, attacking, sarcasm. Stop ruining the Internet.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Don't be so sensitive.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No broken rules, just a moronic comment..
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: If we're going to start hiding based on if any member of any group could theoretically be considered to be 'attacked', there will be no posts left on DU (especially on such a flimsy 'attack'). I cannot in good faith hide this.
Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)that they do not agree with. This place is going nuts!
blm
(113,061 posts)enough mistake since the earlier poster was outed as a troll.
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
I live in NC and I assure you my vote doesn't matter.
I was told my primary vote don't matter by Hillary supporters.
blm
(113,061 posts)has too much on the line to let another Republican WH control the Supreme Court.
And….I personally don't think that what has been happening in this state thanks to conservative Supreme Court rulings is anything to laugh about.
I work hard at GOTV efforts here in NC, and the stupid, short-sightedness of HRC supporters constantly belittling Sanders supporters here doesn't make my job any easier. Neither do the BorBusters.
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)They have no controller my vote either.... and it still doesn't matter. No one in this state cares what I think, that's obvious.
blm
(113,061 posts)I grew up in a family of 12 kids, and, as the 9th child wasn't exactly a prominent figure. I had to make my own path remaining mindful that there were always individual actions one could take that would still serve the greater good of all.
Big_K
(237 posts)I'm living in a Scott Walker hellscape, and am living what the Republicans do. I'm a Bernie supporter, and voter, and any Democrat would get my vote over any of the Republicans trying for the nomination. If you sit out this election because you don't like Hillary, you're going to deserve what you're going to get from a Trump administration.
Victor_c3
(3,557 posts)More war and more corporate favoritism at the expense of the middle class.
No thank you.
I'm sick of voting for the lesser of two evils.
blm
(113,061 posts)policy.
Thor_MN
(11,843 posts)instead of knowing that you helped elect him. President Sanders would have been good, but it doesn't look that is going to be an option.
When (if) it comes to that, are people going to say "F all of us, I didn't get my first choice" or are they going to help usher in President Trum?
Victor_c3
(3,557 posts)I've seen the impacts of the policies she supports first hand. What in her past performances in an elected office indicate that she is on our side?
I'll stand by my previous statement that I'm sick of voting for the lesser of two evils.
The only argument that a Hillary Clinton supporter can throw at me as to why I should vote for her is that she won't be as bad as trump or Cruz.
Thor_MN
(11,843 posts)Victor_c3
(3,557 posts)I voted for a dirt bag in the 2000 election and I paid for it. I was stupid and ignorant kid who grew up in a center-right household and I voted that way. I learned my lesson and I paid for it with my own life that was ruined by the war on Iraq (I'm a totally disabled veteran that was produced by that war). I'm not going to vote for another dirt bag again - even if those are the two choices I have. I'll vote democrat downstream, but it won't be Hillary I vote for if she is the presidential candidate.
The only way that I'll change my mind is if she can show me that she is genuinely sorry for the war that she was a part of. She has never had to deal with any of the consequences of the war that she voted for and supported. She never stuffed a body bag of a fellow soldier and she never had to stuff a body bag of someone she murdered in combat. She never has been riddled by the memories that haunt her of the war, she certainly has never lost everything she has in her life as a result of her participation in that war.
I was in Iraq from Feb 2004 through March 2005. I served as an Infantry Platoon Leader where I led 44 Soldiers through daily combat patrols in and around a sector just north of Baghdad, in Baqubah, Iraq. I was a dumb 24 year old kid at the time who should have never been in charge in the situations that I was presented with. In the course of the year that I was in Iraq my platoon killed at least 46 people that we found the bodies of, wounded about 100, and we lost 5 of our platoon's members. It's one thing to read accounts of and hear the numbers regarding combat action but it is another thing altogether to actually experience it. You don't forget or unsee those things.
The war was much more intense and much more violent than anyone back home is aware of. I wil not have anything to do with supporting someone who voted for that war and then took more than a decade to realize it was a mistake.
Thor_MN
(11,843 posts)Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)
reACTIONary
(5,770 posts).... a LOT better than a president sanders. That's why I'm voting for her. And that's why she's up 3 million plus votes over Sanders .
Victor_c3
(3,557 posts)reACTIONary
(5,770 posts)
eridani
(51,907 posts)reACTIONary
(5,770 posts).... one of our nation's greatest strengths and assets. Without it we wouldn't be anywhere near as prosperous and well off as we are. No-nothing resentment and mindlesss demogougary is self destructive and contra-progressive. You can easily see where that leads.... just take a look at Venezuela.
eridani
(51,907 posts)They are the motherfuckers who crashed our economy in 2008, and incomes for the 99% have still not recovered. And never will if Clinton gets her way.
reACTIONary
(5,770 posts)..... that's the reality , like it or not. And that's why they aren't going to be shut down or broken up, like it or not.
eridani
(51,907 posts)--actual economy? Not bloody likely.
reACTIONary
(5,770 posts).... no-nothing resentment and mindless demagoguery . Don't make me do it again.
OwlinAZ
(410 posts)Unbridled Capitalism boots money to the top and preys on the powerless and poor.
We don't have to be like this. Other countries do much better for the broad swath of their citizens.
reACTIONary
(5,770 posts)... exactly does unbridled capitalism exist? And who do you believe advocates it?
And what's so good about small towns? Are you sugesting small towns get some sort of preferential treatment over the vast majority of Americans? Why?
blm
(113,061 posts)Yes, it IS hellish to be a predominantly Dem state known for its progressiveness that is now under complete control of ALEC Republicans.
Ash_F
(5,861 posts)That is going to get him some votes among younger people. 
videohead5
(2,172 posts)Trump saying wages are too high will pretty much screw him up with younger people and do they really want that wall?..he was more wishy washy on Iraq.did not really say anything against the war until after it had done started.
Ash_F
(5,861 posts)Just trying to make sense of it.
blm
(113,061 posts)Iraq war, he's boasting now how he'd be the fiercest and most ruthless military leader, and he hasn't been fully exposed on all his anti-worker dealings.
What idiot would even fall for Trump's rhetoric on these issues?
Ash_F
(5,861 posts)blm
(113,061 posts)I think it is only proTrump trolls pushing the claim that many Sanders voters will vote for him.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)Since when are IL, FL, VA, NY, OH, NV, MA and IA states the Democrat doesn't win in general elections? And you have the nerve to whine to anyone about FACTS. Just fucking stop it already. You want to help donnie replace Scalia, knock yourself out but STOP LYING.
Geronimoe
(1,539 posts)doesn't bring home the bacon.
Chico Man
(3,001 posts)And by all indications will take CA.
Smells like Bacon to me.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)between dominating in a southern state against a fellow dem in the primary, and against a republican in the general.
The evangelica, anti-abortion fuckwittery is going to be a problem. States like texas are purple now, but won't be blue in time for this election.
dlwickham
(3,316 posts)
Stardust
(3,894 posts)Just curious, not trying to pick a fight. Are there polls to support your assertion?
•APR. 27-30
SurveyUSA
826 LV
Clinton +19
CLINTON 57%
SANDERS 38%
APR. 18-21
Fox News
623 LV
Clinton +2
CLINTON 48%
SANDERS 46%
APR. 13-15
YouGov
1,123 LV
Clinton +12
CLINTON 52%
SANDERS 40%
MAR. 24-APR. 4
Field Poll
584 LV
Clinton +6
CLINTON 47%
SANDERS 41%
APR. 7-10
Gravis Marketing
846 LV
Clinton +6
CLINTON 47%
SANDERS 41%
MAR. 30-APR. 3
SurveyUSA
767 LV
Clinton +14
CLINTON 53%
SANDERS 39%
MAR. 16-23
USC Dornsife
363 LV
Clinton +11
CLINTON 47%
SANDERS 36%
MAR. 6-15
PPIC
524 LV
Clinton +7
CLINTON 48%
SANDERS 41%
DEC. 16-JAN. 3
Field Poll
329 LV
Clinton +11
CLINTON 46%
SANDERS 35%
OCT. 29-NOV. 3
SurveyMonkey
1,022 RV
Clinton +16
CLINTON 48%
SANDERS 32%
SEP. 17-OCT. 4
Field Poll
391 LV
Clinton +12
CLINTON 47%
SANDERS 35%
AUG. 29-SEP. 8
Los Angeles Times/USC
819 RV
Clinton +16
CLINTON 39%
SANDERS 23%
APR. 23-MAY 16
Field Poll
356 LV
Clinton +40*
CLINTON 53%
SANDERS 5%
APR. 2-8
Emerson College
487 RV
Clinton +45*
CLINTON 56%
SANDERS 3%
JAN. 26-FEB. 16
Field Poll
425 LV
Clinton +42*
CLINTON 59%
SANDERS 6%
http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/election-2016/primary-forecast/california-democratic/
Stardust
(3,894 posts)pinebox
(5,761 posts)
emulatorloo
(44,124 posts)Just like they voted for Sarah Palin in '08.
Btw, <sarcasm>
FWIW, Rasmussen 2012 said Romney was gonna win, all the way up to Election Day. They don't have a very good track record.
Miles Archer
(18,837 posts)...comes out to 47.1% Clinton, 40% Trump.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_clinton-5491.html
Rasmussen is the only poll in which Trump is ahead.
I'm not familiar with the track records of the other polls they used...you can go to the link and if you see one that's reliable, those would be the numbers to consider.
radical noodle
(8,000 posts)Uh-huh...
Amimnoch
(4,558 posts)
Proud Liberal Dem
(24,412 posts)She will win the states that Democrats are expected to win generally. Do you see Trump taking any Blue states that Republicans normally lose? And if scores of Bernie supporters decide to NOT vote for Clinton under any circumstances then, well, hello President Republican. Is that what Bernie supporters really want (I would assume/hope not)? Is having a Republican President for the next 4-8 years *really* going to be better for the country than 4-8 years of President Hillary Clinton? I mean, c'mon. Really? Hillary may not be a "progressive icon" like Sanders in but anybody thinking rationally will have to concede that they will be happier and less miserable under President Hillary Clinton than they will under President Donald Trump or Ted Cruz. No, she isn't going to rip apart "the establishment" root and branch and replace it with a progressive utopia (and neither would Sanders accomplish this BTW) but she will get to pick the next one or more SCOTUS Justices, scores of Federal Judges, run federal agencies, and conduct foreign policy. Do we want her doing these things or Donald Trump? How did the whole Nader debacle help things back in 2000? Were progressives really happier that we got 8 years of Bush in the WH instead of Al Gore? And are Bernie supporters ready to go down that path again on the heels of another successful Democratic Presidency? I certainly hope not. Some people need to seriously calm down and get a grip about Hillary Clinton.
RiverNoord
(1,150 posts)responses by hardcore HRC supporters, who won't examine what is happening with careful scrutiny. I think I've seen at least 50 posts on the variation of 'does anyone really believe that Hillary can't beat Trump?' (Or Cruz - he made appearances in that line a few times over the past couple of months)
That's not an argument, it's mystified disbelief. Someone making that statement absolutely cannot tolerate the very concept of Donald Trump defeating Hillary Clinton in a presidential election. If you can't tolerate the concept sufficiently t even consider any evidence suggesting it could be developing into a real possibility, then all you can do is lash out at the bearers of bad news and question their motives.
Sadly, The writing's been on the wall since Trump broke out of the Republican clown car into his own private clown limo.
This entire election may turn out to be a fiasco of monumental proportions.
The DNC has been developing the structure of Hillary Clinton's 2016 nomination for years. She is backed by very, very big money. This is her second run. What her supporters just can't seem to wrap their minds around is that not enough voters like her. And the nature of this dislike for Clinton is different than the dislike of Trump. He's a damned pop star, and, obviously, lots of people 'love to hate' him. He had a successful television show that was based almost entirely on the eagerness viewers had to hear him say 'you're fired.' His candidacy doesn't fit into any sort of framework of prior experience in modern politics, and Clinton won't be able to take a convincingly 'high road' position, because he's an aggressive prick who won't hesitate to counter Clinton's attacks by pointing out her own hypocrisy. She can't win that game.
When two extremely disliked people get into a fight, people treat it as entertainment. The one who wins the crowd is usually the one who provides the best entertainment. That's what we're descending into, and it may be too late to change course. The fact that Bernie Sanders has performed as well as he has should have alerted the party that, maybe, it was time to calmly consider the possibility that Clinton wasn't going to quite cut it.
The 2016 United States Presidential Election is going to get horribly ugly, and we may be faced with an extraordinarily horrible person becoming President of the United States. We've had horrible people before in the office, of course - as a country, we seem to send horrible people to the office far more often than relatively decent people. But this... ugh.
chwaliszewski
(1,514 posts)I agree with you to a T. I respect the enthusiasm and confidence of HRC supporters. It's her time, she's earned this, etc. The part that I don't think they're getting is that there are a LOT of voters that don't like her and would either write in Bernie on the ballot (like me), vote for Trump (even if they don't like him either), or just not vote. All of this talk about "Hillary has more votes than all of them combined" is a load of cat crap. Some of her victories have been in closed primaries (like NY) which of course has shutout a lot of Bernie supporters. That's not even counting all of the shenanigans that was going on with the voter registration switching and what not. If all registered voters had a chance to vote, the outcome would be totally different. Also keep in mind, the Dem-nom was Hillary's to lose from the beginning. If she is so great, how come she hasn't won enough pledged delegates by now to end this thing?
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Yeah we certainly won't get those in the GE.
jmowreader
(50,557 posts)
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Right?
I'm voting for Hillary, just as I would vote for Bernie if he were the nominee.
Sorry.
Response to LannyDeVaney (Reply #8)
Name removed Message auto-removed
blm
(113,061 posts)part of it? In my party, every voting demographic IS important. I don't know ANY of my true fellow Sanders supporters who would vigorously claim that minorities and elderly vote is less important.
Excuse me if I don't believe you are a real Sanders supporter.
Response to blm (Reply #82)
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johnp3907
(3,731 posts)
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Despite the fact that she has adopted many of those policies.
I've met some of her supporters and they consider Bernie to be a bigger enemy than Trump to the point where if she loses they'd rather vote for Trump than Bernie.
MariaThinks
(2,495 posts)not helping him.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)MariaThinks
(2,495 posts)Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Furthermore, why is returning to a pre-Reagan America considered to be kinda nutty?
raindaddy
(1,370 posts)Outside of the shrinking Democratic bubble Hillary is neither trusted or well liked. Even if she does get by Trump she'll enter the White House with a negative rating and not a whole lot of capital.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)and yet Trump and the GOP are having record turnouts...
Clinton will lose and lose badly to Trump...
radical noodle
(8,000 posts)Using that logic, it would mean Sanders will lose in a landslide to Trump.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)That Sanders:
Isn't seen as dishonest
Attracts independents
Hasn't pissed off a huge number of Democrats
. . And progressives
. . And moderate Republicans
Doesn't drive Republican to vote out of spite
And a huge chunk number of the contests to decide the nominee don't allow the largest voter block to vote: independents. In open caucuses and primaries Sanders DID bring lots of new people into the system. People Hillary has almost no chance of reaching in a GE.
And of course Trump can run to the right AND left of Hillary, and Hillary is like Trump - a 1%er with low trust ratings.
Sanders is the opposite. A person the majority of voters think is for them, and is seen as trustworthy and honest.
radical noodle
(8,000 posts)Last edited Mon May 2, 2016, 06:26 PM - Edit history (1)
If he tries to steal the nomination, my guess is he will piss off a huge number of Democrats.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)People have been calling him a communist for months and the Mai outcome is that socialism is more popular than ever.
The vast majority of the Democratic elite are beholden to big money and have long given up on fighting for the working class. People know this.
Give them a champion and see what happens...
radical noodle
(8,000 posts)The only way for Dems to do what needs to be done is for Democratic voters to get off their asses and vote in the off years. Without that, no one will make any headway.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)And you know it.
They have a sum total of: communist.
Oh and taxes. Lol.
And of course Dems have to be inspired to come out on midterms. Geee... I wonder if a candidate that can't even get a few hundred people to show up her rallies and isn't even trusted by endless numbers of Dems is the person to get that done.
Response to EdwardBernays (Reply #220)
DUbeornot2be This message was self-deleted by its author.
erpowers
(9,350 posts)Either the numbers I saw were wrong, Donald Trump is not bringing in as many voters as the media is claiming, or Hillary Clinton is not losing the large amounts of voters some are claiming she is losing. According to the numbers I saw Hillary Clinton has received millions more votes than Donald Trump. Trump has claimed that her lead over him is because she only has one opponent while he currently has three opponents and had more opponents in previous months. However, Hillary Clinton has more votes than Bernie Sanders and Sanders has more votes than both Ted Cruz and John Kasich combined.
So, I am not sure Donald Trump is bringing in as many new voters as some think. If he is, Hillary Clinton seems to be bringing in more new voters.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)The internet is there for you to use.
Ohio 2008:
Hillary - 1,259,620
Ohio 2016
Hillary - 679,266
Total Ohio Dem voters in 2016: 1,192,815
Trump Ohio 2016: 727,585
And he came in SECOND.
Total GOP votes in Ohio in 2016: 2,011,357
So maybe that's a fluke, how about Pennsylvania?
Hillary 2016: 918,689
Hillary 2008: 1,273,764
Total Dem voters in 2016: 1,638,644
Total Dem voters in 2008: 2,333,462
Trump in Pennsylvania: 892,702
Total GOP in 2016: 1,943,437
Those are just two states... you have google - use it and decide for yourself what's actually happening.
erpowers
(9,350 posts)Hillary Clinton still has more overall votes than Donald Trump. Even with the fewer votes in Pennsylvania she still ended up with more than 20,000 more votes than Trump.
EdwardBernays
(3,343 posts)You have to triangulate.
Which party has gotten more votes in 2016?
Has Clinton been getting fewer votes - sometimes massively fewer - then she did eight years ago?
The GOP is getting more people to the polls, and Clinton is underperforming compared to 2008. And more Dems say in polls that they'd vote for Trump over Clinton than GOPers would vote for Hillary.
It's all there, but you have to look.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)Independents do not like Hilliary one bit, and will probably stay home. If Bernie was running we would actually have a Democrat in the White House. I do not see winning them over. They are tired of Clinton. ANY Clinton.
B Calm
(28,762 posts)
c588415
(285 posts)
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)This seems to be a constant struggle for Clinton People to understand.
skylucy
(3,739 posts)tabasco
(22,974 posts)Even Bernie Sanders says that Clinton is "infinitely better" than any republican.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bernie-sanders-hillary-clinton_us_563f6c93e4b0b24aee4aa19a
SusanLarson
(284 posts)The democratic party have always counted on progressives to jump into line as they support DINO's, conservative and corporate Democrats, as the lesser of two evils and we are tired of it. America had the chance to support someone who was not for once the lesser of two evils, and through the corruption of the party and the support of the corporate media they chose not to. A just punishment is coming.
A Simple Game
(9,214 posts)and without that pay they will not support the Democratic party.
If Hillary wins the nomination she will then go on to lose the general election and ultimately destroy the Democratic party.
But never fear, it won't be the candidates fault(again), it will be the fault of the people that didn't vote for her. And when the Democratic party has a major exodus of members, no one should take any responsibility, that will be Bernie's fault.
Does anyone want to talk about her lack of coattails?
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)
Gman
(24,780 posts)Bad things happen. Nader in 2000 led to tens of thousands dying in Iraq. No single payer in the ACA so they bitched and complained and sat out 2010, a redistricting year which led to GOP gerrymandering. Even McGovern in 72 got Nixon reelected. This year the SCOTUS is on the line. And progressives want to sit out because they didn't get their way? I think they need to get over it.
The Green Manalishi
(1,054 posts)Changing diapers, unclogging plumbing, voting for someone with a 'D' after their name who stands for nearly as many things you dislike as things you believe in.
The damage done by President Trump's Supreme Court justices will be on the heads of those who don't pull the lever for Hillary.
I proudly support Bernie. I like his personality, his ethics and his policies MUCH better.
But, while I respect the fervor and passion of others who also support Bernie, the FACT is that "Politics is the art of the possible". Sometimes you get 51 percent of what you want; if you throw a fit about that then you get 0%. We got 0% in 2000.
I'm still hoping that somehow Bernie gets the nomination. But if it's Hillary and you don't vote for her you ARE voting for trump
this is not a godamned role-playing game. Real adults, citizens who actually care about humanity and their country know sometimes you suck it up and go with the lesser or two evils.
Gman
(24,780 posts)I think Sanders is a (hopefully not "was a"
good man with the right ideas for working people. And he has accomplished his stated goal from 2 years ago of pushing the party toward his issues. Everyone benefits from that and I am grateful to him for that.
But I like HRC because Bill's admin gave us the best economy for working people in my lifetime. I'm hoping for more of the same from her. I feel with the emphasis on populism economics she'll do even better than Bill.
OwlinAZ
(410 posts)pugetres
(507 posts)needs to get over it and realize that it has to get back on track and stop pushing party members to the side in its attempt to find a "third way"? No more of the GOP Lite BS.
I'm not willing to be a fall guy for the Party's failings.
Gman
(24,780 posts)Is that what you want to prove a point? Are you ready and willing to take responsibility for the wars and economic depression, and countless deaths from a Republican administration?
pugetres
(507 posts)I will say this- If Clinton makes it past the end of July and then loses the GE, I'm not responsible for that.
If the Party membership continues to decline, I'm not responsible for that.
Gman
(24,780 posts)You contributed to the GOP winning by not supporting HRC as the nominee. Nader supporters to this day deny their responsibility in all Bush did.
pugetres
(507 posts)If that is the case then HRC needs to get her game on and EARN those votes.
Gman
(24,780 posts)And everyone needs to vote.
Response to Gman (Reply #210)
DUbeornot2be This message was self-deleted by its author.
The Green Manalishi
(1,054 posts)just try telling any Nader voter that the blood of those soldiers and Iraqis is on *THEIR* head and you get the same sanctimonious load of 'well the party didn't nominate my choice' and/or 'so you want me to vote for the lesser or two evils'. 16 years later and the denial is still as deep, so no, if we end up with President Trump there will be 'Bernie or Bust' voters saying 'don't blame me'
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)That will do wonders for turnout ( if Hill gets the nomination). 
Gman
(24,780 posts)For death, destruction and economic depression from a Trump or Cruz presidency?
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)for the death, destruction and economic depression from a Trump or Cruz presidency?
Because your attitude will make President Trump a reality.
Gman
(24,780 posts)I can only assume you have none.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Response to Gman (Reply #176)
DUbeornot2be This message was self-deleted by its author.
Victor_c3
(3,557 posts)Don't forget she voted for that war and proudly stood by vote for more than a decade before noticing that maybe it was a mistake. And then when she did she issued a halfassed apology.
I'm a totally disabled vet produced by that war. I take things like that very personally. Out of good conscience I can not bring myself to vote for Hillary Clinton. I know people personally who have been maimed and killed by that war. While her daughter was off enjoying the good life and marrying trust fund managers I was stuffing body bags and garbage bags with the remains of people that I murdered on politicians like Hillary Clinton's behalf.
I was an infantry platoon leader in Iraq from February 2004 through March 2005. Although Hillary Clinton and the rest of America seem to have moved on from that horrible mistake of a war I haven't and I can't. Even though it has been more than a decade since I was there it is very alive and present in my head.
Gman
(24,780 posts)In a Trump or Cruz presidency? Is it worth that?
Victor_c3
(3,557 posts)As Secratary of State she was instrumental in swaying Obama to use military force in the Middle East. It's not like it is at all evident that she has actually learned any lessons. The only pain she has had to endure from Iraq has been the impact on her political career.
She has no concept of what the wars she sends other people to fight in are like. If she did, she'd be just as devastated by it as those who have returned from combat are.
democrank
(11,094 posts)I`m so, so sorry for all you`ve been through and want you to know there ARE people on this site and elsewhere who understand how difficult it is (and in some cases impossible) to get past that vote in favor of the Iraq War.
Some folks here way too casually state that Hillary already apologized for her vote and that`s that. End of story.Time to move on. To me, it`s a shallow response which lacks any meaningful understanding of the dreadful, heartbreaking, ongoing consequences of that vote.
Please know there are many who care deeply about your sacrifice. I wish you the best.
In peace~
Victor_c3
(3,557 posts)I too often get wrapped up and incensed about anything regarding that war. I will not let something like that happen to people like me again.
I joined the army as a stupid 17 year old kid in 1997. My parents had to sign a waiver to let me join before I was 18. I honestly wanted to make the world a better place and I ate up the propaganda that the U.S. Army was a force for good. In 1997 we were heavily involved in the Balkans and I believed that we had learned our lessons from our previous conflicts. instead I found myself in a war I never thought could happen or believed in. I was totally taken advantage by and betrayed by politicians like Hillary Clinton.
I won't let it happen again.
The idea that I have to vote for Hillary Clinton if I don't want something like Iraq to happen again is insulting and rediculous.
aggiesal
(8,914 posts)That's what the Tea Party did to the Republican party, so you
can't say, it can't be done.
Did you actually do anything within the Democratic party to change
their "corruption"? Or, are you just complaining from the sidelines?
Many Bernie-backers are starting to run for the lower offices and
in due time the Democratic Party will look more like what FDR had.
I'm supporting Bernie in the primary, but if Hillary is nominated,
even I'm not stupid enough to allow a republican to control the
White House with all the Supreme getting up in age.
And when Hillary becomes President, I will continue to push her
to the left. We need to make a presence throughout her term to
force her to see things as a progressive.
labor leaders, many of them active Socialists with whom he had
worked over the past decade or more. Hillman and his allies arrived
with plans they wanted the new President to implement.
Roosevelt told them: "I agree with you, I want to do it, now make me do it."
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)
TIME TO PANIC
(1,894 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts) chwaliszewski
(1,514 posts)in the eyes of many Indys and Berniacs. You may not agree but do you understand? I think Cruz is the only real wacko out there. Trump and Clinton? They look the same to me.
coyote
(1,561 posts)Before you tell the establishment to fuck off.
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)SusanLarson
(284 posts)No, you didn't lift a finger to stop him. We have been warning you since the beginning of the primary and you and others like you chose not to listen.
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)That's the only way to stop him.
SusanLarson
(284 posts)Nah I will be right here. This country survived 8 years of Bush, 8 years of Clinton, 4 years of papa Bush, and 8 years of Reagan. We can survive Trump. But the Democratic party cannot. They threw in their lot with Clinton 100%, and 4-8 years of Trump will make sure that Americans will always remember that. You can expect Bernie's supporters to be right there shouting it out as loudly as we can.
brush
(53,778 posts)The Obama coalition will elect Clinton just as it did Obama twice.
Trump will lose spectacularly.
Latinos, blacks, Asians, gays, women, Native Americans ans sensible progressive whites who don't want a repug appointing the next 3 Supreme Court justices will see to that.
132 post count, huh?
Guess you don't know we outnumber the repugs.
SusanLarson
(284 posts)132 posts on this account. On my pre-transition account I have been here since 2006 and had a lot more posts. I tried to get skinner to rename the old account but never got a response. So don't judge someone by post count
Kingofalldems
(38,458 posts)SusanLarson
(284 posts)None of your business, that person is dead.
Kingofalldems
(38,458 posts)More interested in your answer to my other post I made to you.
chwaliszewski
(1,514 posts)greymouse
(872 posts)Not Ms Goldwater Girl.
No more the lesser of two evils.
The polls for the general say, Bernie smashes Trump, Hillary vs. Trump is within the margin of error or Hillary loses.
The Green Manalishi
(1,054 posts)I'm voting Bernie in the Primaries. I've supported him with $$ and many an argument. I would *MUCH* prefer him.
I'm voting the nominee in the general, be it Secretary Clinton, VP Biden or Senator Sanders.
It's not wars, however bad they are that *REALLY* worry me- it's who Trump would nominate to the Supreme Court. Not that wars are good, but we have a non zero chance of actually winning one or at least killing SOME bad guys; a Trump 'Justice' however will be 100 percent bad and be screwing up this country for decades.
Shadowflash
(1,536 posts)I voted for Bernie in the primary.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)Bring me a link with Trump beating Bernie in the polls. Anywhere even here on DU. All we get is the Trump Fear Factor...which is FALSE.
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)who makes it to the General, even if that person isn't your first choice.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)There is only only one way Bernie doesn't make it to the General to take out Trump.
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)faced a national attack by the Rethugs. If he ever gets to that point he won't know what hit him.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)Nor do we really know that Trump is in the lead. Why come November it will just be helter-skelter...who knew? Maybe Jeb Bush will be running against Jill Stein. And Bernie's rise from 4% to near the 50% mark is just so much fiddle faddle. And the opposite on the other hand...just projection.
Just no way to know because...well, you know.
ETA: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_sanders-5565.html
Real Clear Politics
Poll Date Sample MoE
Sanders (D)
Trump (R)
Spread
RCP Average 4/8 - 4/28 -- -- 51.6 38.0 Sanders +13.6
IBD/TIPP 4/22 - 4/28 814 RV 3.5 50 38 Sanders +12
USA Today/Suffolk 4/20 - 4/24 1000 LV 3.0 52 37 Sanders +15
GWU/Battleground 4/17 - 4/20 1000 LV 3.1 50 40 Sanders +10
FOX News 4/11 - 4/13 1021 RV 3.0 53 39 Sanders +14
CBS News 4/8 - 4/12 1098 RV 3.0 53 36 Sanders +17
Any questions?
Response to pnwmom (Reply #15)
Name removed Message auto-removed
donnasgirl
(656 posts)Many on this site who can not understand why people do not like or will not back Hillary. Sanders or Bust for us
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)donnie the chance to replace scalia. Hope your petulant hissy fit is worth it.
SusanLarson
(284 posts)You have been warned, it's not too late to stop it.
Response to SusanLarson (Reply #60)
Post removed
donnasgirl
(656 posts)We have standards by which we pick and choose our choice of a Candidates, we have pounded the pavement for Bernie in upstate NY and you will not like what we are hearing about how people are feeling about Hillary, there are many who will stay home and just as many who are now willing to write in his name. We have a good friend in PA who is telling us that over 60 thousand Democrats have now left the party and will not be coming back anytime soon so my feelings are my family is not alone in our feelings.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)Bernie won Upstate NY. He won my county by nearly 25%!
If you think that Clinton will even take NY, you don't know New Yorkers. They voted for the guy who the Cons put up because John Wayne was dead. They will vote for Drumpf.
donnasgirl
(656 posts)Clinton will not take NY in my opinion, your right Drumpf will win it if Clinton is the Candidate and the same will come true in PA.
Response to leftynyc (Reply #42)
Name removed Message auto-removed
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)Blackjackdavey
(178 posts)and am not a big fan of Hillary for a few reasons but what you propose is a very poor approach. In fact, it is dumb and not at all what I believe Bernie would suggest.
Gman
(24,780 posts)As GOP moderates and indies flock to HRC in November. In other words we don't need the Bernie or bust folks. Makes their entire meme useless.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Gman
(24,780 posts)The GOP moderates will follow very shortly.
sharp_stick
(14,400 posts)fit people who foment this bernieorbust bullshit. Unfortunately most of them aren't all that polite so I'll simply invite you and yours to kindly kiss my ass.
I'm sick to death of the I've just started posting to be a pain in the ass crowd.
dbackjon
(6,578 posts)Appoints SCOTUS members that take away my civil rights, will you be around?
People like you are selfish, and really have no business on DU.
You make my blood boil.
Jackie Wilson Said
(4,176 posts)Kingofalldems
(38,458 posts)
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)but didn't start posting until this year?
you know what I mean?
Kingofalldems
(38,458 posts)Canoe52
(2,948 posts)We did that a few elections ago with Bush and Gore and look how well that turned out!
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)I know you joined in 2006, but since you only started posting recently, a welcome seems in order.
obamanut2012
(26,076 posts)
eissa
(4,238 posts)I don't see how a candidate as underwater with women and minorities as Trump is could pull this off. Let's remember that we haven't even begun to campaign against him, and the treasure trove of material that can be used against him in the general hasn't even aired yet. This is our election to lose.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,318 posts)That would be an earth-shaking electoral event. Because it's unlikely any major candidate will stand against those 2.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,190 posts)Of course, unless you're in a swing state, what does it really matter. I'm in TX, so the only vote that counted was the primary. That being said, the worst thing is if people just stay home. That would be very bad for down ticket races.
modestybl
(458 posts)I was phone banking and canvassing from Dem lists in Iowa, Illinois, Wisconsin and Indiana, and was surprised by the number of people who said they were voting for Trump. They are hurting, they have been losing economically for years, they see the Dem party leaders as elitists, wanting to promote a rainbow coalition of Ivy league overachievers, and ignoring them completely. Their only hope as they see it is to have this system shaken to the core.
They like Bernie, but think Trump has a better chance. HRC appears oblivious to the anger and despair.
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)I know they exist, I recently spoke with one. He was a fucking idiot.
Fucking idiots are irrelevant. No one cares.
Because they're fucking idiots.
SammyWinstonJack
(44,130 posts)Bernie supporters.
LW1977
(1,234 posts)modestybl
(458 posts)... but if all you have to offer is "they are f**king idiots" without telling them how an HRC as POTUS will help them, personally, get a living wage, and getter circumstances, you are as clueless and out-of-touch as HRC.
OilemFirchen
(7,143 posts)They're actually clueless fucks.
I think that's an important distinction.
chwaliszewski
(1,514 posts)How coincidental! I was thinking the exact same thing. I guess you and I are f'ing idiots.
What a small world.
elljay
(1,178 posts)Minorities and young people traditionally have some "issues" in getting to the polls. Obama motivated both groups to show up and stand on line for hours to make sure they voted because they liked him. Hillary's support is fairly strong among minorities though not as strong as Obama's, and is incredibly weak among young people and Independents. In this election, the Democrats will need not only to bring out the majority of the one-third of Americans who are registered Democrats, but also the majority of the one-third who are Independent. Instead of having a candidate like Obama whom they very much liked, we have a candidate that young people, Independents, and a large minority of Democrats generally do not like or support. The motivation to get these groups to show up at the polls and vote for Hillary seems to be that they must vote for her because Trump is worse. The question to be answered is whether this will be sufficient to draw people to the polls.
jtuck004
(15,882 posts)Yeah, neither have the rest of us. Our behavior is killing us. It is the easiest, to sit on our asses, keep the thermostats up, watch lots of cable and piss away electricity, live in too big houses, don't make anything and pretend we have value...
It's like learning how to cook by sitting on the couch eating Oreos. Not the most challenging route to learning.
"I don't see how..." The behaviors the real estate swindler is calling for, preaching, are the easy ones, Hate people, pretend your lack of effort is someone else's problem, do things and don't pay your bills, etc. The fact that people will vote enthusiastically for the least moral and costly (to themselves in the short run), least energetic behavior they can evince shouldn't come as a surprise.
It's pretty widespread outside of his circles too.
Lots of us don't make sense sometimes.
TeamPooka
(24,226 posts)Their polling had Mitt Romney winning the White House in 2012.
#Losers
LannyDeVaney
(1,033 posts)A blowout of epic proportions.
Everybody in my extended family will be voting for Hillary if she's the nominee, two more this time around due to those now eligible to vote.
HRC and the democrats are set to run the tables on any GOP nominee!
SusanLarson
(284 posts)Based on? Millions of Democratic voters have said we will either write in Bernie Sanders or stay home. Clinton has been losing in every poll to every single republican hopeful even those who have dropped out. You have willfully blinded yourself to the apathy America has for Clinton.
The Democratic Party cannot win this election without Sanders supporters, independents, and millennials who will not vote for Clinton. I just hope you come to your senses in time. We will not bend even with the threat of a President Trump.
LannyDeVaney
(1,033 posts)The next president will be Hillary Clinton, and the election won't be close, and my senses are just fine thank you very much.
"Millions of Democratic voters have said we will either write in Bernie Sanders or stay home."
Got any evidence to back that statement up?
"Clinton has been losing in every poll to every single republican hopeful even those who have dropped out. "
Got any evidence to back that statement up?
Vogon_Glory
(9,118 posts)Even some Republicans are scared enough of a Trump presidency to vote for former Secretary of State Clinton.
=====
A word to the posters spamming here on Roger Stone's tab: I think Hillary's going to get the Democratic nomination.
radical noodle
(8,000 posts)You seriously think that even though Hillary has about 3M more votes and about 300 more pledged delegates, that Sanders can steal the nomination? And that it will endear her voters to Sanders? Think again.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)Then we talk reality.
LannyDeVaney
(1,033 posts)latest poll shows Clinton beating Trump in Ohio, and history indicates Ohio is the keyset of the key states.
Next question?
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)NY: Clinton votes:1,054,083
Trump votes: 534,932
Fl: Clinton: 1,097,400
Trump: 1,077,221
PA: Clinton: 918,669
Trump: 892,702
California hasn't voted yet, but you're smoking the good stuff if you think Cali is even going to be close
Clinton will win almost all of what Obama won and will even pick up a couple of red states
It won't even be close.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)LOL
I thought you were the person making their own reality who thinks Trump has any chance of winning NY or CA (or even any of the northeastern states he just clobbered Cruz in.)
No worries.
LannyDeVaney
(1,033 posts)Blowout victory. I'm not worried, and no #BernieOrBust movement is going to change a damn thing.
[link:http://www.270towin.com/maps/crystal-ball-2016-electoral-college-ratings|
ffr
(22,670 posts)Come on democrats! Let's take Georgia and Texas too!!
I only wish we could sweep all 50 states.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)National popular vote polls mean even less. That's not how the election is decided.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)beating Trump by larger margins thatn Hillary and cite said polls as a reason to vote for Sanders are the same people who miss the fact that Clinton had a huge lead in the polls over Sanders back in Nov. Sanders always points this out, but he also doesn't get that the same observation he's making about last Nov's polls can be applied to any poll taken today concerning the GE - ie: polls taken months in advance of any event seldom mean anything.
SoapBox
(18,791 posts)But the Elites will still sit fat, sassy AND rich.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)the Elites will sit fat, sassy and rich more easily if the boat doesn't get rocked too much, and Hillary the Incrementalist is definitely not a boat-rocker. They'll find a way for her to "win."
forest444
(5,902 posts)I love that line. It really illustrates their mindset in general.
rtracey
(2,062 posts)Too bad. If Bernie does not get the nomination, looks like president Trump to the rescue.... there's always 2020. OR some who claim they will be Bernie or bust, or whatever, decide to put party first, well this might change.... Party or Bust / Party or Trump.
Plucketeer
(12,882 posts)we had an alternative who appealed to independents and moderate GOPers to turn to. Someone who didn't look like a weathervane in a tornado. Someone who knew the difference between sniper fire and a bouquet of flowers. Just imagine.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)Mustellus
(328 posts).. is only survey people with land line telephones. Hardly anyone under 60 has one anymore.....
And if that isn't enough, yes, they've been known to lie.
SusanLarson
(284 posts)So, you mean they surveyed Hillary supporters. And she still loses... LOL
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)RIGHT WING RASSMUSSEN to try prove a point tells everyone all they need to know.
PeteSelman
(1,508 posts)Because Rassmussen does tend to lean Republican.
I doubt there will ever again be an election that isn't 51-49 or 52-48.
Everyone goes home for the general election and the country is sharply divided.
This isn't going to be easy. At all.
fbc
(1,668 posts)Her goose is cooked.
Just how exactly does Clinton expect to get people excited about her candidacy? It doesn't sound like "The other guy stinks!" is going to work.
emulatorloo
(44,124 posts)Additionally he certainly has no appeal for minority voters.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)He wants massive tax cuts for the rich/corporations and he doesn't want to raise the minimum wage. Don't believe the right wing propaganda.
Trump has not been attacked with Democratic negative ads. He has been attacked from the right as being too liberal and not a "true conservative," which of course is a lie. When his economic positions get exposed in the GE, he will lose the Reagan Democrats.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,318 posts)Haven't you seen his tax plan? He's entire pro-oligarch.
These findings are based on an examination of the estimates that the respected Urban-Brookings Tax Policy Center (TPC) has produced of both the cost of the Trump and Cruz tax plans and how those plans would affect households at different income levels. (“Millionaires,” as used here, refers to households with annual incomes over $1 million, rather than to the amount of assets that households may hold.) This analysis is a companion piece to an earlier CBPP analysis on the effects these tax-cut plans would have on the nation’s revenue base; the earlier analysis found that both the Trump and Cruz plans would effectively shrink government revenues (as a share of GDP) to their levels back in the Truman era. Like that analysis, this one does not examine John Kasich’s tax proposal because TPC has not assessed it, and doesn’t assess the proposals of Democratic candidates Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders, as their proposals would increase taxes on millionaires, not reduce them.
...
TPC estimates that millionaires would receive tax cuts averaging about $380,000 (Trump) or $460,000 (Cruz) in 2025, the last year for which TPC has estimated the distribution of the tax cuts. (All average tax-cut figures in this report are adjusted for inflation and expressed in 2016 dollars.) The after-tax incomes of millionaires would increase by 17.9 percent under Trump and 21.6 percent under Cruz.
The tax cuts for the rest of the population would be far smaller. The middle fifth of households would receive tax cuts in 2025 that average $2,900 under Trump and $1,400 under Cruz, raising these households’ after-tax incomes by 4.9 percent and 2.4 percent, respectively.
Although millionaires represent less than 1 percent of the population, in 2025 they would receive 38 percent of the Trump tax cuts and nearly half — 47 percent — of the Cruz tax cuts. In contrast, the bottom 80 percent of the population would receive just 32 percent of the Trump cuts and 19 percent of Cruz’s. Thus, in aggregate, millionaires would gain more than the bottom 80 percent of households combined under Trump’s plan and more than twice as much as the bottom 80 percent of households combined under Senator Cruz’s plan.
Multi-millionaires would fare best of all. The TPC data indicate that in 2025, the richest 0.1 percent of the population — those with incomes of more than $5.2 million — would receive a larger share of the tax cuts than more than 60 percent of the U.S. population under Trump and more than 80 percent of the population under Cruz.
http://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-tax/millionaires-would-gain-trillions-under-trump-and-cruz-tax-plans
SammyWinstonJack
(44,130 posts)from trump....idiots! They're too busy hating....
emulatorloo
(44,124 posts)Response to tabasco (Original post)
Post removed
fred v
(271 posts) 
underpants
(182,806 posts)The lets-be-like-everyone-else masses follow.
puffy socks
(1,473 posts)Spread
RCP Average 4/8 - 4/28 -- -- 47.1 40.4 Clinton +6.7
Rasmussen Reports 4/27 - 4/28 1000 LV 3.0 39 41 Trump +2
IBD/TIPP 4/22 - 4/28 814 RV 3.5 47 40 Clinton +7
USA Today/Suffolk 4/20 - 4/24 1000 LV 3.0 50 39 Clinton +11
GWU/Battleground 4/17 - 4/20 1000 LV 3.1 46 43 Clinton +3
FOX News 4/11 - 4/13 1021 RV 3.0 48 41 Clinton +7
NBC News/Wall St. Jrnl 4/10 - 4/14 1000 RV 3.1 50 39 Clinton +11
CBS News 4/8 - 4/12 1098 RV 3.0 50 40 Clinton +10
All General Election: Trump vs. Clinton Polling Data
pnwmom
(108,978 posts)And that poll, unlike Rasmussen, was conducted with both land lines and cell phones -- and real interviewers.
(Rassmussen used a combination of automated calls and online polling.)
http://www.investors.com/politics/trump-gains-ground-on-clinton-but-both-have-sky-high-negatives/
At the same time, Hillary’s lead over Trump is now just seven points (47% to 40%), down from 12 points last month.
anigbrowl
(13,889 posts)And this isn't compliant with the LBN rules either, as you are probably aware.
RATM435
(392 posts)Hillary is a flawed candidate.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)I'll blame anyone throwing away their vote having a petulant hissy fit.
Dawgs
(14,755 posts)Response to leftynyc (Reply #49)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Blue_Adept
(6,399 posts)SO reliable.
dembotoz
(16,805 posts)wish picking lottery tickets was this easy to forcast
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)Laser102
(816 posts)jb5150
(1,178 posts)But if she's the nominee I will vote for her. Clinton (however flawed she might be) is 100 times better than any of the dangerous idiots on the other side. Republican-lite is better than Republican-crazy.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)I am a Bernie supporter but there is NO WAY I will throw away my vote and give the republicans a chance to take the White House. I'm not crazy about Hillary, but she's a hell of a lot better than Trump or Cruz.
Gothmog
(145,252 posts)We do not have to go to the free republic now to get the latest CT from the RWNJs
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)pathetic site.
Gothmog
(145,252 posts)rockfordfile
(8,704 posts)
pansypoo53219
(20,977 posts)i saw one of her winning speeches. kerry won to didn't he. BAH
sharp_stick
(14,400 posts)constructs better sentences than this.
Your subject line shows that you know where the caps lock key is at least. Maybe at some point in the future you could try learning about the SHIFT key and perhaps a little bit about grammar and sentence structure.
Gman
(24,780 posts)In fact he is the only candidate that can lose in November. He's totally and completely unvetted. He has never been seriously attacked and would crumple like tissue paper at the first GOP attack ad.
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)it's the "Democrats" who will vote trump, just as they Voted Bush and Reagan back in the day.
wolfie001
(2,240 posts)Bastards!!!
d_legendary1
(2,586 posts)But it won't take away the fact that independents will not vote for her in the general election.
longship
(40,416 posts)
rock
(13,218 posts)Nice straw man. Gives you something to do.
longship
(40,416 posts)That is, to make sure that the GOP does not win in November in any way.
You can choose to divide the party anyway you want. I do not recommend that.
rock
(13,218 posts)Is what is best? 
What's particularly snide about your remark is its an opinion with NO grounding in the real world. How would we know that Hillary thinks it's her turn? Or expressed another way, how could you possibly prove that in court?
Attorney in Texas
(3,373 posts)those who feel hopelessly left out of the current rigged economy, this is the only issue (not SCOTUS appointments, not the gender of the next president, not who's going to propose DOA gun regulation).
Trump will come out to the left of Clinton on (1) job exporting trade deals, (2) spending capital on overseas military bases, (3) foreign nation building, and (4) campaign finance regulation.
He will win more Democrats than Hillary will win Republicans. I don't know where the independents will go, but I know they hate Hillary with a white hot passion.
captainarizona
(363 posts)and good clinton is no clinton! I have never voted for a clinton and I never will! bernie or green party. Her iraq war vote was to clever by half as the english say.
jmowreader
(50,557 posts)cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)I'm not saying this is my opinion of her, just that that's the 800lb gorilla no one wants to acknowledge.
abelenkpe
(9,933 posts)
chknltl
(10,558 posts)
LiberalLovinLug
(14,173 posts)No matter her hawkish MIC support, even criticizing Obama for not using them enough
No matter her secretive email accounts
No matter her temporary flipflop having "issues" with the TPP
No matter her non released $200,000 speeches to Wall Street criminals
No matter her vacationing with her good friends the Kissingers
No matter her lobbying for fracking in other countries as SoS
No matter her non support for legalization of marijuana and the crippling incarceration rate that fosters
No matter her rejection of single payer, the cheapest fairest system adopted by every other modern nation on Earth
Now it doesn't even matter if the Democrats lose and we have a meglomaniac clown as President, as long as for at least one day in their lives they get to vote for a woman for President! Awesome.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)
shawn703
(2,702 posts)lancer78
(1,495 posts)if HRC loses then we will never have another Clinton darken our doorways ever again.
I am sorry, but something about the whole family is off-putting. Maybe it is the entitlement and hubris they exude. Maybe I have no respect for a woman who stays with a serial cheater instead of kicking him to the curb?
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)isn't too painful.
lancer78
(1,495 posts)I have NEVER cheated on any woman I have ever been in a relationship with.
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)
Cary
(11,746 posts)After the 2010 midterm elections, Silver concluded that Rasmussen's polls were the least accurate of the major pollsters in 2010, having an average error of 5.8 points and a pro-Republican bias of 3.9 points according to Silver's model.
Why on earth would you bring that here to DU?
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)tabasco
(22,974 posts)
Turbineguy
(37,331 posts)gerrymandering, voter suppression and vote switching software? There's a good 15% right there.
TheFarseer
(9,323 posts)He can simultaneously run to the left and right of Hillary. It's not going to be nearly as easy as Hillary supporters want to think. I still think this is a 50/50 proposition.
thebeautifulstruggle
(95 posts)Bernie was about the nicest candidate you could ever face in a primary...
There's a large swath of voters on both sides and independents who just don't think the establishment is working for them
There will be Dems who sit out, there will be Independents who either sit out or will vote Trump, young folks aren't jumping to vote for Hillary, minorities won't vote with the same enthusiasm as when Obama was a candidate, and Republicans have been dying to get back in power
MisterP
(23,730 posts)note how every advance is completely blindsiding them--Sanders was to Kucinich's left, thus and therefore he'd get 2% to the Kooch's 4%
when they said she'd win VT they weren't saying it to piss off Sandersonians
they've lost 11 Governors, 13 Senators, and 69 Reps with their disconnection from reality
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts) Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)and for goodness' sake nominate anyone but her! Preferably Bernie, but I'll settle for anyone willing to forgo a DINO-Debbie-style campaign.
Maeve
(42,282 posts)Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)... but the Berners are conveniently ignoring those. Go figure.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)if you are unable to do so.
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)tabasco
(22,974 posts)Why are you a liar?
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)I won't do it for you.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)So I have hope, but yeah, keep your powder dry, and eyes on the prize, we're going to need it.
Bernardo de La Paz
(49,002 posts)If we get out the vote, we stand a very good chance of winning the Senate as well as the Presidency. It can even make Paul Ryan sweat for his House.
Geronimoe
(1,539 posts)that she has the support of the Koch Bros, Cheney, Bibi, and the Neocons.
rurallib
(62,416 posts)WTF is anyone citing Rasmussen here?
n/t
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)Polls very much to the right of center, and it's chief pollster and owner of the polling company, Scott Rasmussen is a polarizing pollster.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2012/09/17/rasmussen-the-gops-cure-for-the-common-poll/
Also, Nate Silver gives Rasmussen a C rating: C=average. In fact, going back to 2010, Silver identified Rasmussen as a pollster who is very biased, and usually in favor of Republicans because of the way and because of the timing of their polling questions and because of what type of methodology/and the way they conduct their polling which is USUALLY in favor of Republicans.
Mean-reverted bias: A pollster’s historical average statistical bias toward Democratic or Republican candidates, reverted to a mean of zero based on the number of polls in the database.
R+2.3 In favor of the GOP candidate(s).
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/is-rasmussen-reports-biased/
SansACause
(520 posts)Given how far to the right Rasmussen leans, this means she has a 1-2% lead over Trump in the real world.
Helen Borg
(3,963 posts)
wolfie001
(2,240 posts)....this poll is total bullshit!!!
dlwickham
(3,316 posts)of course the polls are going to skew towards the republican
tavernier
(12,388 posts)I will bet that incredibly strange events will occur between now and November, and we are nowhere near predicting the winner.
SmittynMo
(3,544 posts)One would then think, that this is a no brainer. Right? Yet, there are millions of people that do not realize what corporate America is about to pull.
broadcaster75201
(387 posts)a USA poll has Hillary up by 11 points.
This poll is bizarre and a push. I am a big Bernie supporter and I know this is BS.
Grow up and vote Dem. Period.
IronLionZion
(45,442 posts)consequences be damned I guess.
A lot of people are very certain that any negative consequences are going to happen to someone else. So they're willing to take the risk. It bothers me that Trump is polling so well for a racist asshole who puts no thought at all into his idiotic policy positions.
DamnYankeeInHouston
(1,365 posts)Trump is the Clintons' buddy who they got to run in order to make Hillary look good and he is beating her. It's either Trump or Bernie. Go Bernie.
kimbutgar
(21,150 posts)Just to vote against trump the entertainer? I don't think so. This poll is bogus.
RandySF
(58,835 posts)
PatrickforO
(14,574 posts)can genuinely get behind and be excited about. I guess I'm little more than a moronic, idealistic unicorn, but it seems to me that if our politicians actually put things in place that benefit the American people instead of Wall St. and the MIC, this nation would be a hell of a lot better off. I know that if Bernie's platform was in place, I would sure as hell be better off, as would my family.
The thing about Bernie is that if he was 20 years younger, he'd have sewn up the nomination by now. But he is not. He is an aging Baby Boomer who still has the ideals that reflected the very best of our generation, and who never sold out.
Clinton is NOT the best candidate to field against Trump. While I cannot imagine how anyone could vote Trump, just because of the snake oil, I can easily imagine people not being excited
at all
about a Clinton candidacy.
The problem, of course, is as left as she's gone in this primary, if we actually look at her past record and pronouncements, the only conclusion we can come to is that she's not being truthful and will pivot hard right AS SOON AS SHE'S THE NOMINEE.
This is why I'm supporting Bernie to the end and am glad he's going to stay in it until the convention and contest the nomination.
THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY HAS HAD A RECTAL-CRANIAL INSERTION PROBLEM SINCE IT BECAME THIRD WAY AND IT NEEDS TO GET BACK TO THE NEW DEAL 'FOR THE PEOPLE' IDEALS IT ONCE HAD. OR ELSE IT WILL DIE.
Locrian
(4,522 posts)
Egnever
(21,506 posts)But go trump?
tavernier
(12,388 posts)WhoWoodaKnew
(847 posts)reACTIONary
(5,770 posts)tabasco
(22,974 posts)WhoWoodaKnew
(847 posts)
hoffmanfiles
(7 posts)My take on candidate Trump in the Albany Times Union.
TexasTowelie
(112,204 posts)I'll have to pay more attention to your columns when I read the Albany Times Union.
Rhiannon12866
(205,405 posts)My parents always subscribed to the TU since my Dad was from Menands, live just an hour north of there now.
dubyadiprecession
(5,711 posts)November is 6 months away.
Zambero
(8,964 posts)This poll has a history of being heavily skewed toward GOP candidates, and had Romney winning last time around. Other matchup polls portray different results than this one.
UMTerp01
(1,048 posts)First of all, I don't know why national polls this far out are being given ANY attention!!! Even the ones that look good for Hillary now should only be taken with a grain of salt. We aren't down to two, there haven't been any debates, and there are things that happen between August and November that could tilt things one way other the other. Now I still say that Hillary will beat Trump rather easily because of the Black vote, Latino vote, and women vote. There aren't enough whites and he's not pulling enough minorities to help him win. Again, this is an electoral college thing we must be looking at, NOT NATIONAL POLLS!!! This scare tactic is not going to work. The Democratic Party is NOT going to give Bernie Sanders the nomination no matter how many polls and articles that show Sanders beating Trump by a wider margin than Clinton or any poll like this.
whereisjustice
(2,941 posts)and it it matters far less who wins. It's win-win for the 1%, lose-lose for the rest of us.
ViseGrip
(3,133 posts)billhicks76
(5,082 posts)Last edited Tue May 3, 2016, 06:21 AM - Edit history (1)
They will probably even take a devil like Trump over the same old thing. People here are so stupid and blind it's mind boggling.
LenaBaby61
(6,974 posts)Hillary Clinton has made it much further than Jeb Bush, whose candidacy was DOA, as many of us knew it would be.
Hillary's candidacy is nowhere near the same stage as Jeb's was. She's seemingly onto the big dance come this fall. Jeb never was even asked for a dance, in fact Jeb couldn't give dances away. And I believe he spent about $130-$150 million dollars to finish near the bottom of the GOP heap in the primaries before bowing out with a whimper.
We'll see in the fall what happens with Hillary Clinton vs Donald Trump.
It was never going to be Jeb Bush. Remember, Jeb couldn't even "dance."
Darb
(2,807 posts)Hillary is a Rodham, married to a man named Clinton, who was adopted. Bush is a Bush is a Bush, the same stupid bloodline.
Got it?
Now stow it.
billhicks76
(5,082 posts)It's nepotism plain and simple. Even worse the Bushes and Clintons are each other's cronies. They are two families joined at the hip that have been scratching each other's backs for decades. They refer to each other as intimate family friends. It's beyond disgusting in a democracy. Especially given how nefarious Bush Sr has been over the decades. Your ability to rationalize deals with the devil just proves to me the faliablity of human nature and that some of those who like to identify as Democrats are just as much living in a bubble as many Republicans.
Darb
(2,807 posts)First families know each other and are friendly. You, of course, know the inner feelings of everyone involved because you are some sort of fucking swami. No, they don't refer to each other as intimate family friends, oh great swami, and if they are friendly, or even more, people do that. They make friends with people from the same circles. You, of course again, have a tin foil hat on so tight it is a fucking joke. Now why don't you connect them via Mena, or tell me about Clinton's Body count.
Did you throw your nose away after you cut it off, genius? They could have re-attached it unless you tossed it into the ocean or the garbage. But I bet you did.
Fucking pathetic.
There are numerous quotes where they directly say they are regarded as members of each other's families. Mostly the Bushes saying this not the Clintons and the Clintons never deny. I have to post the links again? Bill has been photographed at the Bush family retreat in Maine as far back as 1982. He wasn't president then as you know. George Wallace is also in that infamous photo. Jimmy Carter doesn't pal around with the Bushes. Bill acted like he barely knew Bush Sr in the 92 election which was false. A lot of what Bill says is false unfortunately.
Cobalt Violet
(9,905 posts)You can thank Clinton supporters for a President Trump but they'll blame it on Bernie and his supporters.
billhicks76
(5,082 posts)She's too tainted by the past.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)I was just on RCP and the RCP average is that Hillary is +6.2 as of this week.
You can't just post one poll and go, "Aha!" it doesn't work that way.
Attorney in Texas
(3,373 posts)justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)has over the past 20+ years, you're deluding yourself. Then there's the helping hand of some within the Democratic Party itself. What a smart Republican candidate will do is use the #BernieorBust folks against Hillary. Why spend their own time and money when they can use content from Sanders supporters to do so--oh wait, I suspect they're already doing that.
Attorney in Texas
(3,373 posts)Bradical79
(4,490 posts)At least as any indication of how things will go down in the GE. I just don't see an election against Trump where she gets less than half the women vote, and less than 90% of the non-white vote, and I don't see how she could lose with those kind of numbers with today's demographics. And while there may be more Democrats jumping ship to Republican than vice versa, that makes even less of a difference than ever before given how much both parties have shrunk.
jamzrockz
(1,333 posts)But if Trump wins the republican nomination, I voting for whoever is the democratic candidate. So republican, just nominate Trump and you get see the biggest presidential election defeat since Goldwater.
