Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

TomCADem

(17,378 posts)
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:28 PM May 2016

Hillary Clinton Takes a Step to the Left on Health Care

Source: NY Times

“I’m also in favor of what’s called the public option, so that people can buy into Medicare at a certain age,” Mrs. Clinton said on Monday at a campaign event in Virginia.

* * *

She made the remarks as she continues to face a determined challenge on the left from Mr. Sanders, forcing her to essentially fight a two-front war as she seeks to turn her attention to Donald J. Trump and the general election. While Mr. Sanders trails by a substantial number of delegates, his effect continues to be felt in the race as he pressures Mrs. Clinton to adopt more progressive positions.

“Bernie Sanders’s campaign is having an effect on Hillary Clinton’s policies,” said Steve McMahon, a Democratic political consultant from Purple Strategies. “From a progressive point of view, that’s exactly what was hoped for and that is exactly what is happening.”

The idea of allowing people to buy in to Medicare has been discussed in policy circles and in Congress for decades. Mrs. Clinton’s husband, former President Bill Clinton, floated a similar proposal in 1998, including it in his State of the Union address that year. The strategy has been embraced by many advocates of single-payer health care as a way to move more Americans into the existing government system. An incremental expansion of Medicare was the hoped-for strategy of Medicare’s original authors.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/11/us/politics/hillary-clinton-health-care-public-option.html?_r=0



I guess I am somewhat confused by this announcement. First, I recall that back in 2009, Bernie Sanders and Sherrod Brown were supportive of the public option, but they could not get Lieberman and others to buy-in. Second, hasn't Hillary been pushing the innclusion of the public option since at least since February?
84 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Hillary Clinton Takes a Step to the Left on Health Care (Original Post) TomCADem May 2016 OP
Post removed Post removed May 2016 #1
Don't care what her reasoning, but Public Option is fastest way to single payer, at this point. Hoyt May 2016 #2
What a joke she is pangaia May 2016 #3
Damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. Chicago1980 May 2016 #17
She should of evolved on this when it was Hillarycare Omaha Steve May 2016 #21
Well, we HAVE seen her spin like a pinwheel on just about every issue. Maedhros May 2016 #25
so that people can buy into Medicare at a certain age erlewyne May 2016 #52
Quit the 'you people' shit. pangaia May 2016 #48
Like I said.... Chicago1980 May 2016 #50
and that's all you got... Javaman May 2016 #54
There should be an intelligence test for voting.. pangaia May 2016 #55
Listen up, you prick. RiverNoord May 2016 #70
Oh no. Duckfan May 2016 #4
Hasn't the Public Option Always Been Part of Her Proposals? TomCADem May 2016 #9
goggle It will never ever happen (said this year) Omaha Steve May 2016 #23
didn't answer his question. apnu May 2016 #71
Radical, lol. nt thereismore May 2016 #78
You can laugh but to most Americans it is radical. apnu May 2016 #80
The public option is not the medicare buy-in after age 50 JonLeibowitz May 2016 #5
There are a number of possible public options. This is one of them. n/t pnwmom May 2016 #7
"I support a Medicare buy-in for those over 59" --JonLeibowitz JonLeibowitz May 2016 #8
I Think Bernie Sanders and Sherrod Brown Were Very Rational TomCADem May 2016 #13
I support the public option as envisioned 6-8 years ago which Brown and Sanders supported JonLeibowitz May 2016 #14
What we DO need- To protect the RIGHT TO HAVE PUBLIC SERVICES-like healthcare Urgently needed- Baobab May 2016 #83
Good. We can convert the whole system to Medicare, one age group at a time. n/t pnwmom May 2016 #6
wets thumb, holds it up in the air, for but a day tomm2thumbs May 2016 #10
She said that just to get that headline, and then immediately backed off. She reversed. Cheese Sandwich May 2016 #11
She was so close... GummyBearz May 2016 #69
It's funny. So many justify Bernie's continued presence in the race by saying he needed to push her pnwmom May 2016 #12
+1 Chicago1980 May 2016 #18
What's funny is you implying that a move to the left is "progress." truebluegreen May 2016 #32
Yes. She moved. And she moved to the left. So that's progress. n/t pnwmom May 2016 #33
I Would Be Satisfied if I Could Trust Her McKim May 2016 #57
Key phrasing here is "buy in" Geronimoe May 2016 #15
It could be handled as it is with the ACA marketplace -- if there was the Congressional support. pnwmom May 2016 #27
Medicare is not being run by the government zalinda May 2016 #65
That is so believable. Skwmom May 2016 #16
If I had a dollar for every flip flop, I could Doctor_J May 2016 #19
Only because she was cornered by a voter AgingAmerican May 2016 #20
Hard to take a candidate seriously, when they've been on literally every side of an issue... AzDar May 2016 #22
A step? Or a jump to the left? AgerolanAmerican May 2016 #24
Bravo DebbieCDC May 2016 #26
LOLOL, huge thums up!!! AntiBank May 2016 #47
So glad I'm not the only one Liz_Estrada May 2016 #61
I think it depends on what the meaning of "is", is tularetom May 2016 #28
Thanks. Now I have "Let's Do the Time Warp Again" as an earworm... n/t TygrBright May 2016 #29
Four Sticks by the mighty Zeppelin! Glamrock May 2016 #43
Actually, the "no-fail" earworm dismissal technique I use... TygrBright May 2016 #44
That's freaking great! Glamrock May 2016 #45
You're a genius. beerandjesus May 2016 #67
Funny, the "public option" is not and never was truebluegreen May 2016 #30
This article from 2009 shows that an age-related Medicare buy-in has been discussed pnwmom May 2016 #34
UUUMMMM Omaha Steve May 2016 #36
Ummm . . . Bernie has a completely different single payer plan. nt pnwmom May 2016 #37
So Hillarycare from 1993 SUDDENLY changes and that is your retort? Omaha Steve May 2016 #38
1993 was 23 years ago. Doesn't seem sudden to me. n/t pnwmom May 2016 #39
Today after 23 years is sudden in my book Omaha Steve May 2016 #40
From your own quote: truebluegreen May 2016 #42
Seems she has backed off of this story already Omaha Steve May 2016 #72
And Hillarians wonder why we are unappreciative truebluegreen May 2016 #77
Oh, bullshit. The only thing that takes a step left is her rhetoric. If she becomes Gene Debs May 2016 #31
She should campaign hard for single payer, then we might GET the Public Option. yodermon May 2016 #35
Ughh. The time to get the Public Option or a Medicare Buy In was when the Democrats had a majority andym May 2016 #41
Don't panic; Hillary's fake leftward won't last past July. Vote2016 May 2016 #46
Medicare has to be fixed. There is no eye care and there is no dental care ... FIX IT. YOHABLO May 2016 #49
"... buy into Medicare at a certain age" area51 May 2016 #51
Medicare needs FlaGranny May 2016 #63
[cough] bullshit EdwardBernays May 2016 #53
And as always: she only takes it after all other steps have been tried and tested first Betty Karlson May 2016 #56
"Step to the Left...Step to the Right, drag your parnter all Around...!" Katashi_itto May 2016 #58
Oh, I believe her now! Kip Humphrey May 2016 #59
typical Hill and friends...she "says" something left of her previously stated position(s)... islandmkl May 2016 #60
projected cost: $600/month back in 2009 jman0war May 2016 #62
Why bother? Nobody believes her. fbc May 2016 #64
K&R. Glad to hear it. Overseas May 2016 #66
Colorado and Alberta Canada turbinetree May 2016 #68
Very Discouraging! Furbug May 2016 #73
This message was self-deleted by its author NRaleighLiberal May 2016 #74
AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service eggplant May 2016 #75
Jury Decision Furbug May 2016 #79
Very Encouraging! Furbug May 2016 #76
Clinton's positions continue to evolve left-of-center2012 May 2016 #81
Why would I have to buy in to something I have already paid for? Agony May 2016 #82
“Bernie Sanders’s campaign is having an effect on Hillary Clinton’s policies,” sendero May 2016 #84

Response to TomCADem (Original post)

pangaia

(24,324 posts)
3. What a joke she is
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:34 PM
May 2016

Lean to the left, lean to the right. Stand up, sit down, fight, fight, fight. God ...reminds me of my HS football cheer.

 

Maedhros

(10,007 posts)
25. Well, we HAVE seen her spin like a pinwheel on just about every issue.
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:25 PM
May 2016

There is no good reason to believe she actually means what she says.

erlewyne

(1,115 posts)
52. so that people can buy into Medicare at a certain age
Wed May 11, 2016, 03:56 AM
May 2016

but we all ain't going to live to be a hundred!

pangaia

(24,324 posts)
48. Quit the 'you people' shit.
Wed May 11, 2016, 01:06 AM
May 2016

This is my opinion.
She will say ANYTHING to get elected.. she has no shame!

 

RiverNoord

(1,150 posts)
70. Listen up, you prick.
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:41 AM
May 2016

'You people,' 'those people,' etc., have been standard racist references for decades.

I know you know that. I know that you're deliberately being as offensive as you can be toward other DUers by using such a phrase.

So I'm calling you out squarely - either you're a relatively decent human being, in general, who is a bit carried away, or you're flat-out rotten.

Which is it? It's one or the other - there isn't any other 'grey area' alternative.

If it's the first case, you'll apologize for your behavior - using a racist phrase in several statements which serve only one purpose - to be offensive.

If it's the second, you'll disappear or double-down on that crap.

I've only ever 'alerted' on one post over the years. I prefer a more... direct approach.

So it's your call - but if you take the second route, you will be called out harder and more aggressively every damn time you deliberately seek to offend DUers.

Duckfan

(1,268 posts)
4. Oh no.
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:34 PM
May 2016

Full moon tonight. Time to change positions again.

Just like her "always" being against SHAFTA the other day.

TomCADem

(17,378 posts)
9. Hasn't the Public Option Always Been Part of Her Proposals?
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:40 PM
May 2016

In other words, I remember her mentioning it in February. Is there something that she added that is causing a bunch of outlets to report it? Maybe she is proposing a different type of public option than Obama? Or, perhaps she is trying to adopt the public option that Bernie himself advocated back in 2009?

apnu

(8,722 posts)
71. didn't answer his question.
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:58 PM
May 2016

That's Hillary saying Sander's plan will never pass, not a Public Option. Big difference as Bernie's plan is radical and different from anything we've seen from Democrats before.

His question still stands, has the Public Option always been one of her proposals?

apnu

(8,722 posts)
80. You can laugh but to most Americans it is radical.
Wed May 11, 2016, 04:02 PM
May 2016

Note, I'm not stating what my opinion of it is. I'm all for a single payer system and removing the profit motive of medicine.

But that notion is a highly radical idea to most of this country and it would be difficult to pass Congress even if the Democrats controlled both houses and had a filibuster proof majority. Bernie might be on board with the idea, and Bernie supporters might be on board with the idea, but the rest of the nation, right now is not.

They don't understand what it really means and they're suspicious of its costs.

We've been down this road before, in 1994, and it died then for the same reasons. We tried again in 2008, it was on the table, and yet we wound up with the spotty ACA which is a wet kiss to the insurance and med-tech industry.

JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
5. The public option is not the medicare buy-in after age 50
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:35 PM
May 2016

Clinton is hoping to redefine what the public option means so that she can say she supports it, when voters think something else entirely is meant. It is a thoroughly Clintonesque tactic, which is one of the many reasons why I and everyone in my family will not be voting for her.

Also be very cautious about weasel words in her statements. A careful parsing of her statements almost always reveals she doesn't make a firm commitment on most policy issues.

JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
8. "I support a Medicare buy-in for those over 59" --JonLeibowitz
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:38 PM
May 2016

Do I really support the public option as envisioned in the health care talks of 6-8 years ago? A rational person would say no.

TomCADem

(17,378 posts)
13. I Think Bernie Sanders and Sherrod Brown Were Very Rational
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:42 PM
May 2016

They were the ones who were most vocal in their support of a "public option as envisioned in the health care talks of 6-8 years ago." However, they were a few votes short, so it did not go anywhere. The interesting thing is that many Bernie supporters today dismiss the public option, but Bernie and Brown were the two who were holding out for the "public option as envisioned in the health care talks of 6-8 years ago."

JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
14. I support the public option as envisioned 6-8 years ago which Brown and Sanders supported
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:44 PM
May 2016

I am saying that limiting the public option to those above X years of age is not really a public option as then-envisioned. It's that simple.

Baobab

(4,667 posts)
83. What we DO need- To protect the RIGHT TO HAVE PUBLIC SERVICES-like healthcare Urgently needed-
Wed May 11, 2016, 07:11 PM
May 2016

We need a carve out, an explicit carve out to allow single payer and all public services like education and health care and food progras and banking regulation to BE EXCLUDED FROM ALL US TRADE DEALS- and people should be aware that the US is vigorously opposing such proposals by Europeans from our trade deals- We have been fighting a 20 year long war on public healthcare, education, public health insurance, food programs, finacial regulations for small investors and not banks, for deregulation of banking practices-

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getDoc.do?pubRef=-//EP//NONSGML+AMD+A8-2016-0009+002-008+DOC+WORD+V0//EN

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getDoc.do?pubRef=-//EP//NONSGML+COMPARL+PE-567.814+01+DOC+PDF+V0//EN

 

Cheese Sandwich

(9,086 posts)
11. She said that just to get that headline, and then immediately backed off. She reversed.
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:42 PM
May 2016

Hillary might be looking into a public health insurance option for people 55 and up... She would like to get behind it, but there's just no data to support it, but if there were, heck it could be a good idea, she's considering it.

um....I'm also in favor of what's called the public option, so that people can buy into, ya know, Medicare above a certain age, which will then take a lot of the pressure off the cost because the argument is that costs go up because real world experience means that people are getting sicker or the costs have to be spread. I want to get behind that because I don't yet see the data to support that but if you were able to move people 55 or 50 and up who are the biggest users of health care into the Medicare program they would have to buy in but they would be buying in to such a big program that the costs would be, ya know, more distributed, so there's a lot of things I'm looking at to try to deal with exactly the problem you're talking about.




She did it for the headline.
 

GummyBearz

(2,931 posts)
69. She was so close...
Wed May 11, 2016, 11:17 AM
May 2016

to being in touch with the middle class. Then she threw in the qualifier of being 50-55+ to get to buy into the single payer option (not like I can even believe her on that anyway).

Hi Hillary, I'm 34, I haven't had any health problems in the last decade. Somehow in the last 2 years my health insurance benefits have gotten worse, yet the monthly payment has gone up 10% per year. I don't get a 10% raise per year. Can you see how this is gonna be a problem?

pnwmom

(108,925 posts)
12. It's funny. So many justify Bernie's continued presence in the race by saying he needed to push her
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:42 PM
May 2016

to the left, but when she does move, they can't stand their success.

They'd rather complain than make progress.

But as to your question, the article mentions that Hillary has been talking about it since February. And that Bill first suggested it in 1998.

In February, she began discussing the possibility of a “public option,” a government-run insurance plan available to people shopping on the existing marketplaces. That idea was considered when the Affordable Care Act was being debated in Congress, but it was ultimately removed from the law.



You are also right that Obama wasn't able to get the public option through because of Lieberman, among others. This is what happened. When Kennedy died they had already passed the more conservative version in the Senate -- with his vote -- and they had been working on getting a version with the public option through the House. Then the plan was to reconcile the two bills by keeping the public option from the House in the final bill. But when Kennedy died, they lost their slender super-majority, and the only thing they could do was take the bill that had already passed in the Senate, and have it voted on in the House -- as is. So that's why they ended up with the Senate's more conservative ACA, without a public option.

McKim

(2,412 posts)
57. I Would Be Satisfied if I Could Trust Her
Wed May 11, 2016, 08:26 AM
May 2016

I would be satisfied if I could believe that she will do what she says she will do. But I can't. She is working for the top 2% and that I DO believe.

 

Geronimoe

(1,539 posts)
15. Key phrasing here is "buy in"
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:46 PM
May 2016

What happens to those that can't afford to buy in? Hillary's corporate sponsors never accept that healthcare as a human right.

pnwmom

(108,925 posts)
27. It could be handled as it is with the ACA marketplace -- if there was the Congressional support.
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:26 PM
May 2016

zalinda

(5,621 posts)
65. Medicare is not being run by the government
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:17 AM
May 2016

it is being run by insurance companies that the government pays. That is a huge difference between what Bernie wants and Hillary now suggests.

Z

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
19. If I had a dollar for every flip flop, I could
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:03 PM
May 2016

get into one of her fundraisers.

She is probably safe on this, since we know after 2009 that we need about 85 democratic senators to actually do anything progressive. So she can pretend to support healthcare without putting her donors' profits at risk

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
20. Only because she was cornered by a voter
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:04 PM
May 2016

Her 'position' changes depending on whom is directly in front of her at any given moment.

tularetom

(23,664 posts)
28. I think it depends on what the meaning of "is", is
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:29 PM
May 2016

I also think we'll discover that a hell of a lot depends on that.

Glamrock

(11,781 posts)
43. Four Sticks by the mighty Zeppelin!
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:20 AM
May 2016

All I gotta do is hum it for 5 seconds and it kills that nasty ole earworm! Of course, Four Sticks usually takes up residence for awhile, but I'm okay with that. I found out this trick at a casino gig. They had Lady Gaga's Poker face on a friggin loop. I was ready to open my wrists. My drummer was playing Four Sticks on his legs and...no more GaGa!

TygrBright

(20,733 posts)
44. Actually, the "no-fail" earworm dismissal technique I use...
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:22 AM
May 2016

...is to imagine whatever song I'm hearing as being sung by Bob Dylan.

I don't know why this works, but it does, for me.

Although it sometimes makes for inappropriate timing on snickers.

appreciatively,
Bright

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
30. Funny, the "public option" is not and never was
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:38 PM
May 2016

the equivalent of a Medicare-buy-in-above-a-certain-age. But nice try at muddying the waters Hillary! It will probably work on some people.

pnwmom

(108,925 posts)
34. This article from 2009 shows that an age-related Medicare buy-in has been discussed
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:53 PM
May 2016

since at least 2009 as a way to get a public option. The idea is to start with an older age group and then expand the program to younger people if there is interest.

http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2009/10/20/hiding-in-plain-sight-using-medicare-to-solve-the-public-option-conundrum/

Hiding In Plain Sight: Using Medicare To Solve The ‘Public Option’ Conundrum

Jeff Goldsmith

October 20, 2009

The solution to the public option conundrum is so obvious that it’s striking how little discussion there is of it: encourage voluntary early enrollment in Medicare. Unlike the public option, voluntary Medicare buy-in has a significant health policy history. John Kerry included it in his health reform proposals in 2004. Bill Clinton had a more modest proposal (voluntary buy-in after age 62) in his first three budgets. Medicare analysts Marilyn Moon and Christine Cassel have long advocated this approach.

If one is thinking strategically, the most worrisome segment of the uninsured is the 11.3 million aged 45-64, who were the fastest growing age cohort of uncovered folk from 2007-2008. It is one thing to be 22 and immortal and uncovered; it is quite another to be a 52 year old diabetic widow with hypertension, not disabled but thirteen years shy of Medicare and uncovered. The health system and society’s biggest risks among the uncovered are its oldest members. It is these older uninsured people who generate the largest hospital bills, contributing disproportionately to hospitals’ uncompensated care burden.

How It Would Work

We already have a public plan for older Americans. Let’s simply lower the Medicare eligibility age, and encourage the sickest baby boomers voluntarily to join Medicare earlier than age 65. We should waive the two-year wait to enroll in Medicare after obtaining Social Security disability coverage. At the same time, we should let the non-disabled enroll in Medicare after 55 at the program’s estimated actuarial cost.

Employers could fund the premiums at Medicare’s cost for their 55-plus employees. This would have the benefit of lowering the average age and morbidity burden of their remaining privately insured group, and reduce their overall health insurance costs. Individuals with resources could pay their own premiums, which would be substantially cheaper than the individual and small group rates for their age. Those without the means could receive Medicare subsidy help on a sliding scale based on income. Not all of the newly enrolled will leave private markets; they will have the same choice of traditional vs. Medicare Advantage plans that present beneficiaries do.

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
42. From your own quote:
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:18 AM
May 2016

"...encourage voluntary early enrollment in Medicare. Unlike the public option...."

See? Two different things.

 

Gene Debs

(582 posts)
31. Oh, bullshit. The only thing that takes a step left is her rhetoric. If she becomes
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:40 PM
May 2016

the nominee, the day after the convention she'll snap back so hard it'll make your head spin.

yodermon

(6,143 posts)
35. She should campaign hard for single payer, then we might GET the Public Option.
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:58 PM
May 2016

Obama already campaigned on the public option, and at least we got the ACA passed. The PO became the bargaining chip.

Campaign on your ideals, then compromise to get something passed.

Don't make your compromise position your campaign platform... then *that* will be the start of the negotiation and you'll lose it as well.

You don't START bargaining at the price you're willing to sell.

andym

(5,441 posts)
41. Ughh. The time to get the Public Option or a Medicare Buy In was when the Democrats had a majority
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:17 AM
May 2016

-- a supermajority in the Senate and held the House. And at the last minute the Medicare buy-in was removed due to one vote-- Joe Lieberman. 59 Democrats were for it and 1 was against. He actually had supported it as late as September of that year... Of course he and Nelson were against the full public option too. His vote was only needed to break a GOP filibuster.

Unless dislike of Trump miraculously allows the Democrats to take back the House against the gerrymandering that makes it almost impossible until 2020 and allows the Democrats to gain 60 seats in the Senate (would require a gain of 16 seats!) and all of those Senators agree, we won't be seeing even Medicare buy-ins, forget about the public option or single payer, no matter who is President.

 

YOHABLO

(7,358 posts)
49. Medicare has to be fixed. There is no eye care and there is no dental care ... FIX IT.
Wed May 11, 2016, 01:32 AM
May 2016

They also take $100 bucks out of your SS check for Medicare Part B. folks. FIX THAT TOO.

area51

(11,868 posts)
51. "... buy into Medicare at a certain age"
Wed May 11, 2016, 03:22 AM
May 2016

F that. Start lowering the age when you qualify, & keep lowering it until you get to 0.

And as another poster brought up, fix Medicare so that it covers more, and bring the pharma cos. to heel w/bargaining drug prices down.

FlaGranny

(8,361 posts)
63. Medicare needs
Wed May 11, 2016, 08:56 AM
May 2016

almost as much fixing as private insurance. You can still go bankrupt with Medicare. A catastrophic illness would wipe you out financially because, in addition to having co-pays, Medicare has NO maximum out of pocket. 20% of $100,000 (a not unusual hospital bill) is a lot of money. That's why so many have opted for the Medicare Advantage plans. Most have out of pocket limits of $3000 to $7000. If you're living on Social Security there is no way to even pay the MA maximum out of pocket. No insurance plan is any good. They all fall short. Health care needs to eliminate health insurance companies entirely and fund the entire system through taxes and cover EVERYONE. PERIOD. The United States CAN do it. We can cover everyone with no co-pays or minimums for everything except vanity surgery. The bottom of the heap is HMOs. They can really make you work to get care.

P.S. In case anyone is going to ask how to pay for it, it's very simple - military spending and making sure those that now hide their income pay their full share of taxes.

 

Betty Karlson

(7,231 posts)
56. And as always: she only takes it after all other steps have been tried and tested first
Wed May 11, 2016, 08:19 AM
May 2016

and even then: onlyu when polls and focus groups tell her it is absolutely imperative for her to do so, and then still reluctantly does she do so. See also: TPP, gay rights. Can we please nominate someone who gets things right at once? Someone like Bernie?

islandmkl

(5,275 posts)
60. typical Hill and friends...she "says" something left of her previously stated position(s)...
Wed May 11, 2016, 08:40 AM
May 2016

and suddenly that is a "MOVE"...

if you keep track of all these " position statements" you will merely find what could be best described as "dance steps'...

the only plan HRC has for moving any direction is moving into the White House...

 

jman0war

(35 posts)
62. projected cost: $600/month back in 2009
Wed May 11, 2016, 08:52 AM
May 2016

Would probably have to at least double that today.
Who can afford that if you're not earning?

This was designed to allow people buy-in when they are like 50-65 or something, before they can qualify via age.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
64. Why bother? Nobody believes her.
Wed May 11, 2016, 09:00 AM
May 2016

I think even most of her supporters would acknowledge that this is a just a line of BS meant to entice Bernie supporters and she has no real intention on following through with any of these new progressive positions.

turbinetree

(24,632 posts)
68. Colorado and Alberta Canada
Wed May 11, 2016, 10:48 AM
May 2016

Right now Colorado has a a ballot initiative (#20) which in November 2016 election, which is asking the people of the state for a single payer system to compete against the "for-profit" insuarnce industry.

This measure should be supportive by everyone in this country and in the state on and for many reasons, if one state such as this can get this done, and the population see and hears that it is working, the "industry" supporters of the insurance hypocrites will not have a leg to stand on, the ballot initiative is called #20, see below


http://www.sos.state.co.us/pubs/elections/Initiatives/titleBoard/index.html

Colorado health care costs for a 40 year old non-smoker

http://www.ncsl.org/research/health/health-insurance-premiums.aspx


?la=en


Alberta Canada, did the same thing back in the day, the entire province voted in to have single payer to see if the costs could be controlled and to let the population of the province have a say , eventually the entire country adopted this model, and now they have a means to negotiate there health care costs and drug costs

Canadian health care costs:

https://www.cihi.ca/en/nhex_2014_report_en.pdf


Honk---------------------for a political revolution Bernie 2016


Furbug

(3 posts)
73. Very Discouraging!
Wed May 11, 2016, 02:23 PM
May 2016

The vitriol directed at Hillary Clinton from some Bernie Sanders supporters is very discouraging to me, and I fear that in a Clinton-versus-Trump campaign, it might result in a Trump victory. Is that really what Democrats would prefer?! I'm not suggesting that Hillary's critics muzzle themselves; only that they stick to facts, not invective and exaggerations of her positions, or insults directed at those who support her over Bernie. It's all well and good to never budge because you feel that you occupy the high moral ground, as Bernie does, but little if anything is accomplished that way in a representative democracy. You have to be able to reach compromises with those who strongly disagree with you, and the Republican race for the nomination shows that there are many of them out there. Consequently, the resulting progress almost always is incremental, rather than transformative.

The Clintons--and she played a major role--attempted, clumsily and unsuccessfully, to advance a single-payer health care solution more than 20 years ago, so to charge her with "suddenly" changing her position is inaccurate. Similarly, analyses of her actual voting in the Senate have shown no basis for accusations of her of being in the pocket of "Wall Street".

So let's get realistic. Bernie is not going to get the nomination, but he can influence the party platform, and he's already doing it. Hillary has demonstrated long-standing support for most of the ideals that Bernie has expressed, and, as President, I believe that she would work toward achieving such success as is possible, given that she may well have to deal with a Republican House and perhaps a Republican Senate, too. She would accomplish a lot more if, after the convention at least, Democrats would enthusiastically support her and the down-ballot races so that she'd have Congress behind her, instead of opposing her, as they've opposed President Obama for the last six years.

So, please, let's not remain so focused on the "perfect" that we are unable to achieve the "good".

Response to Furbug (Reply #73)

eggplant

(3,893 posts)
75. AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service
Wed May 11, 2016, 03:21 PM
May 2016
A 7-0 Leave It result on your first post! Well done! Oh, and welcome to DU!

On Wed May 11, 2016, 03:07 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

Very Discouraging!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=1446160

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

SOP violation

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Wed May 11, 2016, 03:19 PM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: As much as I disagree with the sentiment of this post, for the life of me, I can't imagine how this qualifies as an SOP violation. If the alerter can't be bothered to explain *why* it is an SOP violation, why should I hide it?
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: How on earth is this a Statement of Purpose violation? This alert is just wrong.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I don't see anything wrong with that post. And I support Bernie.
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

Furbug

(3 posts)
79. Jury Decision
Wed May 11, 2016, 03:56 PM
May 2016

Thanks to those who served on this jury. If the results had been otherwise, I really would have questioned whether a real dialogue is permitted on this site, especially in the context of other messages in this thread that seem to me to be much more . . . "disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate." My belief in the basic fairness of most folks has been affirmed.

sendero

(28,552 posts)
84. “Bernie Sanders’s campaign is having an effect on Hillary Clinton’s policies,”
Thu May 12, 2016, 07:46 AM
May 2016

.... no, it is having an effect on her campaign rhetoric.

Latest Discussions»Latest Breaking News»Hillary Clinton Takes a S...