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kadaholo

(304 posts)
Mon May 16, 2016, 12:45 PM May 2016

Navy Allowed to Kill/Injure Nearly 12 Million Whales, Dolphins, Other Marine Mammals in Pacific

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by mcar (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Truth-Out by Dahr Jamail

What if you were told the US Navy is legally permitted to harass, injure or kill nearly 12 million whales, dolphins, porpoises, sea lions and seals across the North Pacific Ocean over a five-year period? It is true, and over one-quarter of every tax dollar you pay is helping to fund it.

A multistate, international citizen watchdog group called the West Coast Action Alliance (WCAA), tabulated numbers that came straight from the Navy's Northwest Training and Testing EIS (environmental impact statement) and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's (NOAA) Letters of Authorization for incidental "takes" of marine mammals issued by NOAA's National Marine Fisheries Service. "It is outrageous to think that humans have quantified all of the impacts their actions cause to the marine environment."
A "take" is a form of harm to an animal that ranges from harassment, to injury, and sometimes to death. Many wildlife conservationists see even "takes" that only cause behavior changes as injurious, because chronic harassment of animals that are feeding or breeding can end up harming, or even contributing to their deaths if they are driven out of habitats critical to their survival.

Karen Sullivan, a spokesperson for the WCAA, is a former endangered species biologist and assistant regional director at the US Fish and Wildlife Service; she is now retired. "The numbers are staggering," she told Truthout, speaking about the number of marine mammals the Navy is permitted to take. "When you realize the same individual animals can be harassed over and over again as they migrate to different areas, there is no mitigation that can make up for these losses except limiting the use of sonar and explosives where these animals are trying to live."

Yet the aforementioned staggering numbers are still lower-end estimates, as they do not include dozens of other military projects in the same areas, such as construction using underwater pile driving, and they only apply to marine mammals, not other species. According to the WCAA, the numbers "do not include takes to endangered and threatened seabirds, fish, sea turtles or terrestrial species impacted by Navy activities, using sonar, explosives, underwater and surface drones, sonobuoys, ships, submarines, aircraft, or troops training on 68 beaches and state parks in western Washington..." "The oceans are delicate and finite; we know now that there is a limit to what the seas can provide," Stolarcyk said. "Oceans are not blue deserts [devoid of life] and should not be treated as such; we must tread carefully, for the footprint we leave will be a lasting one."


Read more: http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/36037-the-us-navy-s-mass-destruction-of-marine-life

41 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Navy Allowed to Kill/Injure Nearly 12 Million Whales, Dolphins, Other Marine Mammals in Pacific (Original Post) kadaholo May 2016 OP
Add this to Obama's Legacy yourpaljoey May 2016 #1
it has been going on for decades reddread May 2016 #4
Another broken promise. Once again, he didn't even try. yourpaljoey May 2016 #6
Now, now, did you really expect Obama to follow that carefully worded Democratic platform? fasttense May 2016 #10
And words are all he had, to take our hearts away! yourpaljoey May 2016 #11
double feature reddread May 2016 #27
I don't think he is an "animal" person. Peregrine Took May 2016 #28
WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IT. IS. NOT. PRESIDENT. OBAMA'S. FAULT. trueblue2007 May 2016 #13
Then we need to BLAME him for not.... ReRe May 2016 #15
Obama should have TRIED to stop it, instead he rubber-stamped it yourpaljoey May 2016 #17
President O has protected more land & water than ANY administration in history. Sunlei May 2016 #18
he stopped fracking? reddread May 2016 #29
yes on the protected lands. To stop it on your land, you have to stop taking the lease money from Sunlei May 2016 #37
he protected protected lands? reddread May 2016 #39
You can use search and find out for yourself. Sunlei May 2016 #40
I did once. Found out what Jerry Brown's dad did in his retirement years reddread May 2016 #41
Sickening felix_numinous May 2016 #2
It can't. yeoman6987 May 2016 #7
Not disband felix_numinous May 2016 #8
That is a good idea. yeoman6987 May 2016 #9
agree, Navy has to stop sonar 'blasts' It kills animals who use sonar & stresses other sea animals. Sunlei May 2016 #22
The Navy has to use sonars hack89 May 2016 #25
Todays sonar is a lot louder, reaches much longer distance then it used to be. Sunlei May 2016 #38
How can the Navy train if they can't use sonar, sonobouys and shoot weapons? hack89 May 2016 #24
Good question felix_numinous May 2016 #31
Like the Army did DashOneBravo May 2016 #36
They've been doing it for far longer than five years. nt ladjf May 2016 #3
+1, more like 50 harun May 2016 #14
I haven't actually researched this point. However, ladjf May 2016 #26
No words Faux pas May 2016 #5
I always thought the phrase "evil empire" was an accurate description of America's military. Gregorian May 2016 #12
I don't understand why the US doesn't use the same tactics and tech as the PersonNumber503602 May 2016 #16
USA! USA! chervilant May 2016 #19
We need to turn this ship around. yourpaljoey May 2016 #20
+ a gazillion!!! chervilant May 2016 #32
Well now the Submariners libodem May 2016 #21
Does anyone have this story from a reputable source? Kang Colby May 2016 #23
Try the INTERNET. There are numerous articles on the subject over ladjf May 2016 #30
Why would you attempt to pretend this is a bogus story?We've been reading similar stories for years. Judi Lynn May 2016 #33
Thank you, kadaholo. This information needs to be seen, not hidden. Good people need to know. n/t Judi Lynn May 2016 #34
This is outrageous. WHEN CRABS ROAR May 2016 #35

yourpaljoey

(2,166 posts)
1. Add this to Obama's Legacy
Mon May 16, 2016, 12:56 PM
May 2016

Obama backed this abomination. Was anyone surprised? Really?

 

reddread

(6,896 posts)
4. it has been going on for decades
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:05 PM
May 2016

laying this sort of Defense related animal cruelty at the foot of a given President might be mistaken for exonerating all the others. What the imperial complex wants is MUCH more important than the lives of miserable marine mammals.

just check in with the Family about Dominion.

its all good.

yourpaljoey

(2,166 posts)
6. Another broken promise. Once again, he didn't even try.
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:36 PM
May 2016

"During his campaign, President Obama promised America he would oppose the killing of these magnificent creatures. It’s time for you and me to hold him to that promise.

 

fasttense

(17,301 posts)
10. Now, now, did you really expect Obama to follow that carefully worded Democratic platform?
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:03 PM
May 2016

Yes, he saiddddddddd he would but it was only words.

He's great at talking and giving speeches. He certainly came off smarter and more sophisticated than any RepubliCON ever was. But alas it was all only words.

yourpaljoey

(2,166 posts)
11. And words are all he had, to take our hearts away!
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:08 PM
May 2016

It was almost like a song.
Sadly, the song is Cream's "What a Bringdown"

 

reddread

(6,896 posts)
27. double feature
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:24 PM
May 2016

Peregrine Took

(7,412 posts)
28. I don't think he is an "animal" person.
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:24 PM
May 2016

I feel sorry for those dogs.

As I recall his girls wanted a small dog - something small and cuddly

It was Ted Kennedy's idea for the water dogs. You never see them anymore. I bet they live in "crates" like so many dogs today do - except for videos or special events when they drag them around for show and tell.

The truth will come out some day.

trueblue2007

(17,202 posts)
13. WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IT. IS. NOT. PRESIDENT. OBAMA'S. FAULT.
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:16 PM
May 2016

are you thinking you're in a GOP place of comfort? Why blame President Obama when this horrible action has been going on for DECADES???

ReRe

(10,597 posts)
15. Then we need to BLAME him for not....
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:26 PM
May 2016

.... STOPPING the slaughter!

yourpaljoey

(2,166 posts)
17. Obama should have TRIED to stop it, instead he rubber-stamped it
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:34 PM
May 2016

This was a big deal among conservationists who were, believe
it or not, surprised and appalled at Obama's green light.
They would learn soon enough.

Pierce Brosnan led the Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC) in the fight:



https://www.yahoo.com/news/navy-training-testing-may-kill-whales-dolphins-082418197.html?ref=gs

http://madmikesamerica.com/2010/04/obama-administration-supports-hunting-killing-of-whales/

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
18. President O has protected more land & water than ANY administration in history.
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:36 PM
May 2016

You're just flat out wrong. Stop drinking your tap water.

 

reddread

(6,896 posts)
29. he stopped fracking?
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:27 PM
May 2016

I have got to start paying attention.

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
37. yes on the protected lands. To stop it on your land, you have to stop taking the lease money from
Mon May 16, 2016, 05:56 PM
May 2016

the Fracking Corps.

 

reddread

(6,896 posts)
39. he protected protected lands?
Mon May 16, 2016, 06:07 PM
May 2016

are we offshore fracking in marine sanctuaries yet?

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
40. You can use search and find out for yourself.
Mon May 16, 2016, 06:16 PM
May 2016
 

reddread

(6,896 posts)
41. I did once. Found out what Jerry Brown's dad did in his retirement years
Mon May 16, 2016, 06:47 PM
May 2016

Not as easy to relocate that search result these days,
but I sure wont forget that nugget.

felix_numinous

(5,198 posts)
2. Sickening
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:02 PM
May 2016

I feel sick reading this, how on Earth can it be stopped?

 

yeoman6987

(14,449 posts)
7. It can't.
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:50 PM
May 2016

There is no way the American people will want to disband our navy. I don't think we'd get 10 percent of a yes from the population of voters.

felix_numinous

(5,198 posts)
8. Not disband
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:54 PM
May 2016

the freaking Navy, just to stop these projects. For godsake I come from a Navy family.

A better project would be to clean up the dying oceans, because the Navy is going to be floating on a dead sea someday if we don't do something now about it. A dying ocean is a far greater danger than anything else right now.

 

yeoman6987

(14,449 posts)
9. That is a good idea.
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:00 PM
May 2016

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
22. agree, Navy has to stop sonar 'blasts' It kills animals who use sonar & stresses other sea animals.
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:53 PM
May 2016

hack89

(39,171 posts)
25. The Navy has to use sonars
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:20 PM
May 2016

it is a fundamental part of what they do.

Sunlei

(22,651 posts)
38. Todays sonar is a lot louder, reaches much longer distance then it used to be.
Mon May 16, 2016, 06:01 PM
May 2016

hack89

(39,171 posts)
24. How can the Navy train if they can't use sonar, sonobouys and shoot weapons?
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:19 PM
May 2016

if they can't do that then they might as well disband.

felix_numinous

(5,198 posts)
31. Good question
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:30 PM
May 2016

but I know if we can go to the Moon we can figure out how to protect ourselves while not causing so much death and destruction. It would simply be a shift in mission to view our ocean and planet as something to protect rather than allowing so much 'collateral damage'.

I think all that military money can go into Earth preservation, and we would INSTANTLY have the cooperation and respect of most of the civilized world-- who are just as alarmed at seeing Earth changes as we are. We have to change our mission to creating a sustainable future NOW, we can't just give up.

DashOneBravo

(2,679 posts)
36. Like the Army did
Mon May 16, 2016, 04:02 PM
May 2016

When the budgets were tight.

You guys can yell bang bang, make pinging noises while running around on the sand .

ladjf

(17,320 posts)
3. They've been doing it for far longer than five years. nt
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:03 PM
May 2016

harun

(11,348 posts)
14. +1, more like 50
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:19 PM
May 2016

ladjf

(17,320 posts)
26. I haven't actually researched this point. However,
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:21 PM
May 2016

I can remember reading in the news for at least 10 or 15 yrs. that the navy was renewing their
sonar test in the ocean. I just don't understand why they have the need to do this for decades.
Also, oil exploration is creating loud explosions underwater.

Faux pas

(14,657 posts)
5. No words
Mon May 16, 2016, 01:08 PM
May 2016

Gregorian

(23,867 posts)
12. I always thought the phrase "evil empire" was an accurate description of America's military.
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:11 PM
May 2016

Damn them to hell.

PersonNumber503602

(1,134 posts)
16. I don't understand why the US doesn't use the same tactics and tech as the
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:32 PM
May 2016

non harmful Russian or Chinese navies.

chervilant

(8,267 posts)
19. USA! USA!
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:36 PM
May 2016

I am so with Samuel Johnson:

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.



(When are the citizens of this nation going to rise up as one and demand an end to such abominations?!?)

yourpaljoey

(2,166 posts)
20. We need to turn this ship around.
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:39 PM
May 2016

We need Bernie now more than ever!

chervilant

(8,267 posts)
32. + a gazillion!!!
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:33 PM
May 2016

#NotMeUs

#DropOutHillary

libodem

(19,288 posts)
21. Well now the Submariners
Mon May 16, 2016, 02:50 PM
May 2016

All have cancer for all their trouble. Our planet is headed for distruction.



 

Kang Colby

(1,941 posts)
23. Does anyone have this story from a reputable source?
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:13 PM
May 2016

Last edited Mon May 16, 2016, 09:02 PM - Edit history (1)

Truth out is just a tabloid blog. I think that's the same blog that published the fake Karl Rove indictment story ten years ago.

ladjf

(17,320 posts)
30. Try the INTERNET. There are numerous articles on the subject over
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:29 PM
May 2016

several years time. Personally, I can recall articles on the subject at least as long as 15 years ago.

Judi Lynn

(160,515 posts)
33. Why would you attempt to pretend this is a bogus story?We've been reading similar stories for years.
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:37 PM
May 2016

Took it to google, without spending more than a second, found a similar one we all saw several years ago:

Navy raises sonar impact on dolphins, whales dramatically

Friday May 11, 2012 2:48 PM

New Navy estimates showing many more dolphins, whales and other marine mammals could be hurt by sonar off Hawaii and Southern California caused alarm among environmentalists on Friday. The Navy, for its part, emphasized those were worst-case estimates and that the numbers cover a much larger testing area than before.

The numbers are in the Navy's new draft environmental impact statement for exercises planned from 2014-2018. In it, the Navy says that, under its preferred alternative, sonar training and testing might unintentionally harm marine mammals 2.8 million times a year over five years.

"The numbers are staggering and there is absolutely no corresponding mitigation to account for this harm," Zak Smith, an attorney for the Natural Resources Defense Council, told msnbc.com.

That's up from about 150,000 instances a year in the Navy's impact statement for 2009-2013, Smith added.

More:
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/05/11/11659008-navy-raises-sonar-impact-on-dolphins-whales-dramatically

[center]~ ~ ~[/center]
Apparently the only sources you accept are corporate news sources, and the rest of us have learned to be skeptical of them in many situations.

DU'ers have trusted upon Truthout here for ages, without your approval. That's fine with us.

Judi Lynn

(160,515 posts)
34. Thank you, kadaholo. This information needs to be seen, not hidden. Good people need to know. n/t
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:39 PM
May 2016

WHEN CRABS ROAR

(3,813 posts)
35. This is outrageous.
Mon May 16, 2016, 03:58 PM
May 2016

As we enter a new era to save our precious environment, seems like one of our main enemies is our own county.

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