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Wed May 25, 2016, 11:18 AM

Saudi Arabia: Legal expert says U.S. Government blew up Twin Towers on 9/11.

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by mcar (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Inquisitr

Saudi Arabia is livid over the recent passage of a bill in the U.S. Senate that would allow 9/11 victims’ families to sue the Middle Eastern nation. The bill was recently passed by a unanimous vote, and while President Obama has vowed to veto it, that hasn’t stopped the Saudi Arabian media from coming out swinging against the U.S. government.

An article written by Katib al-Shammari, a Saudi legal expert, is now claiming that the U.S. planned and carried out the 9/11 attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon to create the war on terror. It calls out the United States for its recent threats to “expose documents” proving that Saudi Arabia funded the 9/11 attacks, as well as detailing the involvement of Saudi Arabia in the worst terrorist attack in history on U.S. soil. According to the piece, these threats fall in line with a United States policy he calls “victory by means of archives.” The article was published in Al-Hayat, which is based in London.

According to the author, the intent of the 9/11 attacks, which he says were perpetuated by the U.S. government against its own citizens and not by Saudi Arabia, was two-fold. First, it allowed the U.S. government to create a shadow enemy – terrorism. It then allowed the U.S. government to blame terrorism for “all their mistakes” and to use the “phantom” terrorist threat as an excuse for military operations and covert secret wars the world over.

The U.S., according to Al-Shammari, often plays a game of withholding information only to use it as a later date. He cited the invasion of Iraq in 1991. The Saudi claims that the U.S. opted to keep Hussein alive and in power so he could be used as a “bargaining chip” against other nations in the region. Ultimately, according to al-Shammari, the U.S. chose to get rid of Saddam Hussein only after Shi’ism began to permeate the Middle East and Saddam became more of a liability than an “ace up their sleeve.”

Al-Shammari says that the 9/11 attacks have been used in much the same way and have allowed the United States to lay the blame for September 11 directly on the shoulders of whoever is most convenient at any given time. Initially, according to the Saudi Arabian expert, the U.S. blamed the radical Islamic groups Al-Qaeda and the Taliban, then Saddam, and now Saudi Arabia.

Read more: http://www.inquisitr.com/3130396/saudi-arabia-legal-expert-says-that-u-s-government-blew-up-the-twin-towers-on-911/



That would still make the Saudis accomplices though.

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Reply Saudi Arabia: Legal expert says U.S. Government blew up Twin Towers on 9/11. (Original post)
forest444 May 2016 OP
jwirr May 2016 #1
forest444 May 2016 #2
AtheistCrusader May 2016 #23
greiner3 May 2016 #76
Lodestar May 2016 #83
yurbud May 2016 #101
Fawke Em May 2016 #104
Agnosticsherbet May 2016 #3
forest444 May 2016 #8
Agnosticsherbet May 2016 #13
forest444 May 2016 #16
Agnosticsherbet May 2016 #22
olddad56 May 2016 #32
Agnosticsherbet May 2016 #40
pauldp May 2016 #50
Agnosticsherbet May 2016 #82
Enthusiast May 2016 #70
metalbot May 2016 #147
olddad56 May 2016 #81
hack89 May 2016 #85
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #108
hack89 May 2016 #110
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #111
hack89 May 2016 #112
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #113
hack89 May 2016 #115
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #117
hack89 May 2016 #120
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #122
hack89 May 2016 #124
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #125
hack89 May 2016 #128
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #129
hack89 May 2016 #131
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #134
Marthe48 May 2016 #114
hack89 May 2016 #116
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #121
merrifield May 2016 #138
hack89 May 2016 #139
13Dogs May 2016 #123
hack89 May 2016 #126
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #130
hack89 May 2016 #132
ChisolmTrailDem May 2016 #127
zeemike May 2016 #91
13Dogs May 2016 #118
OnyxCollie May 2016 #38
Agnosticsherbet May 2016 #39
olddad56 May 2016 #41
OnyxCollie May 2016 #46
Enthusiast May 2016 #73
pauldp May 2016 #55
13Dogs May 2016 #136
Agnosticsherbet May 2016 #141
merrifield May 2016 #54
LiberalLovinLug May 2016 #56
greiner3 May 2016 #80
felix_numinous May 2016 #93
Akamai May 2016 #59
billhicks76 May 2016 #72
LanternWaste May 2016 #86
dbackjon May 2016 #96
ChiciB1 May 2016 #75
druidity33 May 2016 #148
passiveporcupine May 2016 #103
NoMoreRepugs May 2016 #4
jalan48 May 2016 #7
forest444 May 2016 #9
EdwardBernays May 2016 #15
LiberalArkie May 2016 #10
Douseeme May 2016 #5
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LiberalArkie May 2016 #11
forest444 May 2016 #14
leftynyc May 2016 #18
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leftynyc May 2016 #25
forest444 May 2016 #29
cpwm17 May 2016 #52
forest444 May 2016 #12
thesquanderer May 2016 #17
forest444 May 2016 #24
EdwardBernays May 2016 #19
emulatorloo May 2016 #28
asiliveandbreathe May 2016 #21
forest444 May 2016 #27
RufusTFirefly May 2016 #35
forest444 May 2016 #37
RufusTFirefly May 2016 #42
MidwestTech May 2016 #88
valerief May 2016 #47
shanti May 2016 #79
Duval May 2016 #106
oberliner May 2016 #26
LanternWaste May 2016 #90
oberliner May 2016 #107
PeteSelman May 2016 #30
forest444 May 2016 #36
valerief May 2016 #48
Scientific May 2016 #31
forest444 May 2016 #34
Scientific May 2016 #58
SpankMe May 2016 #33
Enthusiast May 2016 #97
Scuba May 2016 #109
riderinthestorm May 2016 #43
RufusTFirefly May 2016 #49
Enthusiast May 2016 #98
cpwm17 May 2016 #144
GoneFishin May 2016 #44
valerief May 2016 #45
left-of-center2012 May 2016 #51
GreatGazoo May 2016 #53
99th_Monkey May 2016 #57
silvershadow May 2016 #60
Gore1FL May 2016 #61
merrifield May 2016 #64
Gore1FL May 2016 #67
silvershadow May 2016 #69
Gore1FL May 2016 #87
silvershadow May 2016 #89
vkkv May 2016 #62
Botany May 2016 #63
Enthusiast May 2016 #65
packman May 2016 #66
marble falls May 2016 #68
d_legendary1 May 2016 #71
RussBLib May 2016 #94
d_legendary1 May 2016 #102
JDPriestly May 2016 #74
merrifield May 2016 #84
JDPriestly May 2016 #100
LiberalFighter May 2016 #77
shanti May 2016 #78
RussBLib May 2016 #92
Festivito May 2016 #95
polly7 May 2016 #99
Duval May 2016 #105
Enthusiast May 2016 #119
libodem May 2016 #133
silvershadow May 2016 #135
rladdi May 2016 #137
13Dogs May 2016 #140
hack89 May 2016 #142
OregonBlue May 2016 #143
forest444 May 2016 #145
turbinetree May 2016 #146

Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:22 AM

1. Partners in crime having a falling out - are they?

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Response to jwirr (Reply #1)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:22 AM

2. Looks that way.

I always expected the truth to come out somehow; but never really expected to be like this.

Let the games begin.

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Response to forest444 (Reply #2)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:45 AM

23. Ugh.

Seriously?

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #23)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:10 PM

76. Please explain your disgust

 

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Response to jwirr (Reply #1)

Wed May 25, 2016, 03:28 PM

101. I wonder what's going on behind the scenes that prompted this...

This is a pretty big card to play on the country responsible for your security.

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Response to yurbud (Reply #101)

Wed May 25, 2016, 03:43 PM

104. Hillary's emails?

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:23 AM

3. The Saudi's, just making shit up to cover what will appear on those redacted pages.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #3)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:28 AM

8. It's possible.

Frankly, not too many people outside the U.S. doubt this anymore. Nevertheless, when it comes to something this serious, the Saudis should probably put up or shut up.

My guess is that they won't present any real evidence because it would also show that they were the principal accomplices.

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Response to forest444 (Reply #8)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:34 AM

13. It is a sad day when conspiracy theories and tin foil hat declarations ends up in LBN

But the Saudi's have to defend their actions, somehow.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #13)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:37 AM

16. People conspire.

If you really think otherwise, I'd invite you to dust off your World History 101 textbooks.

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Response to forest444 (Reply #16)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:44 AM

22. People invent conspiracy theories out of moonbeams, dust bunnies, rumor, and fear.

A "conspiracy" to pull off 9/11 would have required thousands o f people to be involved. Way to big to keep secret.
Saudi's are using low information people to try and hide the fact that some members of their government conspired with the 9'11 hijackers.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #22)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:08 PM

32. people invent conspiracy theories. People like the Bush Crime Family.

Anyone when would believe the US governments official conspiracy theory has to be very naive. All you have to do is watch the way the buildings collapsed to know that they were taken down.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #32)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:36 PM

40. That the buildings were taken down by planned explosions is anti-science

on the level of Climate change denial.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #40)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:56 PM

50. How about the 28 redacted pages - is that "anti science" ?

If anyone in our government was covering for Saudi funding of 911 that would be a conspiracy - and nothing to do with science.

Or the fact that India says it intercepted phone calls from the head of the ISI ordering
money sent to Mohammed Atta - by Omar Saeed Sheikh (Al Qaueda paymaster and "former" ISI asset).

Oh and then there is fact that the 911 Commission's Executive director was a Bush Whitehouse insider and withheld information about Able Danger and many other pertinent lines of inquiry.

and the list goes on - but apparently wanting to know the truth is anti science?

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Response to pauldp (Reply #50)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:23 PM

82. The redacted will cover Saudi's who were involved.

Accusations that the buildings were brought down by anything but aircraft, is anti-science.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #40)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:54 PM

70. The official enforced narrative is that planned explosives are anti-science.

The establishment will trot out expert after expert. But curiously enough these experts never quite have the right credible answers. No one has explained Building Seven to my satisfaction.

They went to great lengths to explain how intense heat weakened structural steel elements in the other buildings but there were no such intense fires in Building Seven.

9/11 probably looked like a false flag operation because it was one.

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Response to Enthusiast (Reply #70)

Wed May 25, 2016, 07:21 PM

147. The issue I have with the false flag narrative...

...is that the narrative just doesn't make any sense.

Let's assume that the government was behind 9/11 and wanted to use it as a false flag excuse to invade Iraq. Let's further assume that our government that was sophisticated enough to not only blow up buildings and hijack planes, but was also able to convince a LOT of "patriots" to kill thousands of Americans in order to pull this off (because coordinating this attack would have taken hundreds of people and they all need to keep their mouths shut).

Why then would they officially blame 15 Saudis, a couple of Emirates, an Egyptian, and a Lebanese guy for the hijacking?

If you wanted to use this as an excuse to take Iraq, you could have put a couple of Republican Guards on the plane, had direct evidence of financial support for the terrorists by Saddam Hussein, and created clear evidence that it was all an Iraqi/Al Qaeda plot. There would have been no need for the WMD nonsense that was used to beat the war drums. I'd further posit that a government that could pull off such a false flag attack would have been capable of planting sufficient WMD's for us to "find" in Iraq that would have completely justified our invasion. You could have staged an amazing special forces raid on an Iraqi facility and "recovered" former Soviet nuclear material and a near working bomb.

The only way that I can tie that to a false flag narrative is to argue that the government decided "tying Saddam directly to 9/11 would be just too damn obvious, so while we're going to use 9/11 as an excuse to start a war in Iraq, we're going to make up a flimsy argument about WMD's that a child could see through so that people will see how incompetent we are, and then they'll never believe we were sophisticated enough to pull off this attack".

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #40)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:20 PM

81. yeah, because building always collapse from the baement first when they are hit at near the top..

especially the one that fell the next day, and wasn't hit by anything.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #81)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:29 PM

85. Both towers collapsed from the point of impact not the basement.

WTC 7 collapsed because a shit ton of falling debris fell on it, gouging a 20 story hole in one side and causing multiple fire that went unfought for hours.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #85)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:35 PM

108. Yea yea, go sell your baloney somewhere else.

 

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #108)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:38 PM

110. Simple challenge. Show me a video with the towers collapsing from the bottom.

there is plenty of video available - should be easy as hell for you.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #110)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:39 PM

111. Blah, blah, blah-de-blah-blah-blaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh!

 

Poster trusts shrubcheneypnac and co.

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #111)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:40 PM

112. So all the video on the internet is faked? Holograms perhaps? nt

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Response to hack89 (Reply #112)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:47 PM

113. shrubcheneypnac & Co. are innocent! A-hurr-huuuurrrrrrrrr!

 



He thinks it weerrrreeesss hoolllllerrrrrrrgraaaammmmmmms!! A-hurrrrrrr!

EHRMERGERD! HOLLERGRAMSSS!

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #113)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:52 PM

115. You are the one that says there is no video of the WTC collapse that is accurate.

right? They all show the towers collapsing from the point of impact. How is that possible?

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Response to hack89 (Reply #115)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:09 PM

117. Stop sayin' I say-id sheeeit thet din't happen...guh...

 



It weres alieeee-uns wut done it!

Maw, dishere dude thanks nine elevern weres hollerrgrammmms!

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #117)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:11 PM

120. My bad. Should have picked up on that sooner. Sorry. nt

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Response to hack89 (Reply #120)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:13 PM

122. Nine elervern hollergram splosives blew dishere nanner all over my head! Derp!

 

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #122)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:15 PM

124. You forgot mini-nukes and space weapons

the old 911 forum was a great place.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #124)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:16 PM

125. Haha, this guy thinks there was nukes and space weapons involved in 9/11. Damn dude...

 

...you need special attention.

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #125)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:18 PM

128. Well - it gets complicated trying to make all the evidence fit. nt

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Response to hack89 (Reply #128)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:19 PM

129. I'm sure it does, honey. But you'll figure it all out in time. Maybe. A-hurrr-hurrrrrr!

 

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #129)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:20 PM

131. I know exactly what happened

fully loaded 767 at 500 knots + large fires + gravity. Not complicated.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #131)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:22 PM

134. Derp!

 

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Response to hack89 (Reply #112)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:51 PM

114. I bought a DVD back then

Plane Truth or Plane Sight, titled something like that. I never watched it, just wanted wanted it in case. Because, and I'm sorry I can't accept what was said, I never believed what they said happened. And nothing said since has moved me away from it was LIHOP or MIHOP.

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Response to Marthe48 (Reply #114)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:53 PM

116. We are talking about a single, easy to verify fact.

did the towers collapse from the basement or from the point of impact.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #116)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:11 PM

121. Duh-huh-huuhhhhhh...

 



george w bush and cheney are innocent!

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Response to hack89 (Reply #116)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:41 PM

138. Why not go to the experts?

There are peer reviewed journal articles, plenty of expert testimony and evidence including videos at ae911truth.org. These are architects, engineers, demolition experts, pilots, security personnel, etc. who have TONS of information for you in one handy place. They are experts---you don't need to rely on people who don't have correct information.

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Response to merrifield (Reply #138)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:45 PM

139. I understand how the towers fell

I am very familiar with the studies.

I am simply challenging that poster's notion that the towers collapsed from the basement first.

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Response to hack89 (Reply #110)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:14 PM

123. Living in Denial

They didn't collapse from the bottom, so your creating a straw man argument. The explosive charges started at the top and proceeded down the buildings, taking out columns from top to bottom in a sequential manner over a very brief period.

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Response to 13Dogs (Reply #123)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:16 PM

126. " yeah, because building always collapse from the basement first when they are hit at near the top."

before jumping into a thread, how about taking the fucking time to read what I was initially responding to. Ok?

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Response to hack89 (Reply #126)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:20 PM

130. Hey dude, the buildings didn't collapse from the basement. You're confused. nt

 

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #130)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:21 PM

132. I know they collapsed from the top. nt

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Response to 13Dogs (Reply #123)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:18 PM

127. I like how he tries the old hollergrams, nucular weapuns, and teeny-tiney nukes bullshit. nt

 

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #40)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:45 PM

91. Anti-science, that's a good one.

Because science knows for sure that open air fuel fires can bring down steel frame buildings...and when they come down it is in their own footprint...three of them.
The laws of physics do not apply to fire...and if you think so they you are anti-science climate change denier.

Thanks, I needed a good laugh.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #40)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:10 PM

118. Your comment makes no sense at all

In the engineering community it's been known for quite some time that the planes didn't bring down the Twin Towers. They were brought down via controlled demolition using explosive charges to disable the structural columns. The buildings would have never fallen into their own footprint otherwise.
For further proof that it was a false flag operation, you should study what happened to World Trade Center # 7 which also collapsed without anything hitting it.
Unfortunately, most Americans can't handle the truth, so they live in denial, but the rest of the world knows what happened.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #22)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:24 PM

38. Was the Iraq war a conspiracy?

 

Did the US invade a sovereign state that had not attacked the US, benefitting defense contractors and Big Oil? 'Cause something like that would have required thousands of people to be involved. Way too big to keep secret.

Nah. Must've just been "bad intelligence."

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Response to OnyxCollie (Reply #38)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:35 PM

39. The Iraq war was foreign policy, 9/11 perpetrated by the US government, fantasy conspiracy theory.

There is a difference.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #39)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:42 PM

41. The Bush crime family are banking on everyone believing they did it is fantasy.

That most Americans just can't wrap your head around it. A plan to do something like that has been on the books since around 1960. Google 'Operation Northwoods'.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #39)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:53 PM

46. LOL! "Foreign policy?" LOL!

 

Did Paul Wolfowitz, one of the biggest proponents of the Iraq war, write the Defense Planning Guidance in 1992, advocating a US invasion of Iraq, unilaterally if necessary? Did Wolfowitz become head of the World Bank, failing to stop the corruption in Iraq?

Did $12 billion dollars "disappear" in Iraq?

Did Cheney have secret NEPDG meetings with oil companies, in violation of the Federal Advisory Committee Act, to divvy up Iraq's oil fields?

Did Cheney take Justice Scalia and his son duck hunting before Cheney v US District Court was reviewed by the SCOTUS?

Did the US rendition Abu Zabaydah to other countries to be tortured? And were his confessions made under duress used link Al Qaeda to Iraq?

"Foreign policy" is a pretty weak theory.

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Response to OnyxCollie (Reply #46)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:55 PM

73. Huge +1!

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #39)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:05 PM

55. The selling of the Iraq war was a conspiracy resulting in mass murder.

A conspiracy involving the collusion of executive branch, military, intelligence agencies and the mainstream media for obvious reasons - controlling world's 2nd largest oil reserves and geo-political positioning.

It certainly was "policy" as the Downing Street Memo revealed, but not public policy.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #39)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:28 PM

136. False Narrative


Really pushing your false narrative pretty hard. Makes one wonder if you're getting paid to continue to try an obfuscate the true facts of how the buildings came down. Most architects and engineers have already concluded that the planes didn't/couldn't bring down the Twin Towers. The fact that the official narrative is BS, doesn't necessarily mean the US Government was the culpable party, just that some entity carried out the planned destruction of the Twin Towers and WTC #7, which by itself is the biggest indicator that the official narrative is fantasy.
Steel frame buildings don't fall into their footprint unless controlled demolition with explosives is used.

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Response to 13Dogs (Reply #136)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:55 PM

141. Wow Accusations means you have nothing factual and are pushing a false narrative.

Every person in those buildings would have seen the buildings being prepared for demolition for months. It would have taken a huge workforce to prepare those buildings.

Fantasies and conspiracy theories.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #22)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:04 PM

54. If you believe that, you need to read this:

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #22)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:06 PM

56. People don't "invent" conspiracy theories.

They theorize that, based on an abundance of conflicting, contradictory, and unexplained facts, that there may have been an act of conspiracy between a group of people for political and/or financial gain.

I also take issue with the "required thousands". There could have been a handful of those at the top of the chain in the US, and Saudi Arabia, and more beneath them on progressively less security clearances. It may have been only hundreds that knew enough to put it together, and I don't think its unbelievable that the neo-cons could have garnered that many true believers who will never talk.

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #56)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:19 PM

80. Well

 

I'd say contrails spewing out aluminum dust and Obama's concentration camps and anything Alex Jones features on his show can be put down to stupid people's paranoia. BTW I use stupid people extremely rarely but there are so many of them lately.

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Response to greiner3 (Reply #80)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:49 PM

93. Which is a perfect place to hide

real stories of interest, amongst the crazy talk. The true stories mixed in with the crazy stuff get slimed by proximity, and thus lose credibility. One of the oldest tricks in the book, in which most people who do this kind of research are perfectly aware of.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #22)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:12 PM

59. Doesn't have to be a conspiracy to have participation by the

 

Bush administration.

Bush et al so steadily ignored all indications of an attack against the United States that their motivation for doing so is somewhat difficult to explain.

The Project for the New American Century group was looking at a variety of ways to bringing about American military action in Iraq.

The following concerning the PNAC group is from Wikipedia:

"Written before the September 11 attacks, and during political debates of the War in Iraq, a section of Rebuilding America's Defenses entitled "Creating Tomorrow's Dominant Force" became the subject of considerable controversy. The passage suggested that the transformation of American armed forces through "new technologies and operational concepts" was likely to be a long one, "absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor."[45] Journalist John Pilger pointed to this passage when he argued that Bush administration had used the events of September 11 as an opportunity to capitalize on long-desired plans.[48]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_for_the_New_American_Century

Sure not difficult to see how Bush, Cheney, and Rove could welcome the attack.

It sure helped Bush get elected in 2004, helped Rove portray democrats as spineless, and helped Cheney make billions for his company, Halliburton.

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #22)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:55 PM

72. But I Thought It Was Just A Few Guys With Box Cutters?

 

Now it's thousands? Your coincidance theories are rubbish. Shit happens. Criminal conspiracies happen. Keep trying to convince everyone they don't and label people tin foil hat wearers though. We could easily claim you're sitting in your moms basement in your underwear in your quest to defend the flag.

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Response to forest444 (Reply #16)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:35 PM

86. People also make things up and pretend it's real.

People also make things up and pretend it's real. If you really think otherwise, I'd invite you to dust off any of your Humanities textbooks.

(six of one, half a dozen of the other and each as irrelevant (and somewhat petulant) as the other...)

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #13)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:55 PM

96. Conspiracy Theories are all the rage here at DU these days.

 

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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #3)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:06 PM

75. So WHY Did Schemer Do THIS???

Chuck Schumer quietly guts JASTA bill

"Sen. Charles Schumer slipped in an amendment letting the State and Justice departments halt lawsuits by 9/11 families against terror sponsors."

It turns out that just before the vote, Sen. Charles Schumer and other proponents of the Justice Against Sponsors of Terrorism Act stuffed an amendment into the final draft allowing the attorney general and secretary of state to stop any litigation against the Saudis in its tracks.

Yes, JASTA would remove the statutory restrictions that have prevented 9/11 families from taking the Saudi kingdom to court. But Schumer helped craft an entirely new section to the original bill, giving the Justice and State departments the power to stay court action indefinitely. All they have to do is inform the judge hearing the case that the US government has engaged with ­Riyadh in diplomatic talks to resolve the issue.

The quiet, behind-the-scenes watering-down of the controversial bill explains why it passed without a single Republican or Democratic objection. The White House had lobbied senators heavily to kill the bill.


http://nypost.com/2016/05/24/sneaky-schumer-added-loophole-to-halt-911-saudi-suits/

It's utterly obvious why a version of this bill - with teeth - can never and will never be allowed to pass, and since playing politics with 911 is still very popular in DC I guess the only option left was illusory victory.

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Response to ChiciB1 (Reply #75)

Wed May 25, 2016, 07:43 PM

148. this post of yours

is the most important part of the conversation.

K&R, but mostly for your comment ChiciB1...



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Response to Agnosticsherbet (Reply #3)

Wed May 25, 2016, 03:38 PM

103. Exactly.

If the US planned and executed this, how did they get these Devout Radical Muslims to agree to their own death by flying the planes? They will die for their own causes, but not for ours.

This is so absurd, it's funny.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:24 AM

4. seriously - the "Inquisitr" as the source????

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Response to NoMoreRepugs (Reply #4)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:27 AM

7. Do you think they made his speech up?

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Response to NoMoreRepugs (Reply #4)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:29 AM

9. Secondary source.

They are merely recounting the article published in London's Al-Hawat.

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Response to forest444 (Reply #9)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:37 AM

15. As far as I can tell

This is totally nonsense. Al-hayat never published that article. Go check their website. The source of the claim is also Israeli intelligence... So... Grain of fucking salt.

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Response to NoMoreRepugs (Reply #4)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:29 AM

10. What is interesting is a rightwing rag, the 2nd one is saying that the Bush administration

had something to do with 9/11. That is why it is interesting.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:25 AM

5. Inquisitr.com

 

okay.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:26 AM

6. I ask myself this question

 

who really benefited more from the 9/11 attacks, US or Saudi Arabia? Also even if you believe Saudi benefited from the US taking out their enemy in Iraq, how could they have predicted that the US would try to make war with Iraq when the attackers came from Saudi and Egypt. You could also say they did it to raise oil prices, but then they have been depressing oil prices for a couples of years now so we know that its unlikely they would risk their friendship with the US just to boost oil prices.

This is why I don't understand this whole hoopla about the redacted 28 pages. I think the documents would be released and it would reveal no damning information about Saudi Arabian govt involvement because they have no good reason to attack their strong ally the US.

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Response to jamzrockz (Reply #6)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:31 AM

11. Israel benefitted the most. They wanted Iraq destroyed, but so did Saudi Arabia.

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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #11)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:34 AM

14. As well, definitely.

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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #11)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:41 AM

18. So the US blames the Saudi's

 

The Saudi's blame the US and the far left blames the Israeli's. I guess that's par for the course.

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #18)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:43 AM

20. As long as poor Halliburton and others do not get critiqued.

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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #20)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:45 AM

25. You think Halliburton

 

flew those jets into buildings?

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #25)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:00 PM

29. Very warm.


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Response to LiberalArkie (Reply #11)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:03 PM

52. There's enough to criticize Israel over.

 

Please don't make up B/S. Israel didn't do 9-11.

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Response to jamzrockz (Reply #6)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:33 AM

12. Both, really.

Not the U.S. of course - but Bush, to whom 9/11 gave everything he wanted and could not otherwise have gotten (from the Afghanistan and Iraq Wars, the trillions in corruption therefrom, the Patriot Act, a second term, etc.).

And the Saudis? They got $100-a-barrel oil for most of the last decade; it had been floundering for years at around $30 or less before that.

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Response to jamzrockz (Reply #6)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:39 AM

17. re: "how could they have predicted that the US would try to make war with Iraq"

GWB could have given them such an assurance.

Not that I'm buying into all this, but I'm not ruling it out, either. The PNAC references to a "new Pearl Harbor" being a positive thing toward accomplishing their goals, along with so many PNAC people being in power when 9/11 happened, makes it hard to simply dismiss claims that there were elements in the U.S. who were aware of or perhaps even behind the attacks.

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Response to thesquanderer (Reply #17)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:45 AM

24. Well said. They're the very people who waged one (possibly two) huge wars on false pretenses.

One wouldn't put anything past them, frankly.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:42 AM

19. Gonna call BS

First - this claim - that al-hayat published this article - comes from MEMRI - which provides no link to an article and which is a front for Israeli intelligence. It's not a trustworthy site.

Second - the article doesn't exist on the al-Hayat website... Go look for yourselves.

Third - within about an hour after this went live on MEMRI it somehow completely saturated the right-wing conspiracy leaning media (breitbart, infowars, etc.) - odd to say the least.

Finally - Saudi Arabia and Israel have a pretty long standing partnership. Why this angle is pushed out like this I don't know, but... Caveat emptor.

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Response to EdwardBernays (Reply #19)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:59 AM

28. Good work. n/t

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:44 AM

21. Perhaps this is not the most appropriate thread for my comment

BUT, as I said in 2000 among friends - if GWB becomes prez we are going to war - I will make the same prediction here - right now - IF a Republiklan gets into the WH they will bring all the same players from the GWB admin and once again..go to war - pick a reason - henny reason -

WE the American people, Can prevent this - I applaud those in NM last night....a con man should not get anywhere near our WH...

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Response to asiliveandbreathe (Reply #21)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:48 AM

27. I told my Republican best friend at the time the very same thing: Bush means war and recession.

January 30, 1999.

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Response to forest444 (Reply #27)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:12 PM

35. Keep in mind that Bush's honeymoon period was almost non-existent

By September of his first year in office, his poll numbers were sinking like a stone.

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Response to RufusTFirefly (Reply #35)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:19 PM

37. And would have continued to sink...

but for 9/11.

The Romans said it best: cui bono.

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Response to forest444 (Reply #37)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:47 PM

42. When 9/11 happened, I cried

Not out of fear of terrorism or out of sympathy for the innocent victims (although there was certainly some of that), but because I knew henceforward that to question the legitimacy of an illegitimate president would now be condemned as an unpatriotic act. I feared that my country's democracy had been mortally wounded that day.

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Response to RufusTFirefly (Reply #42)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:41 PM

88. well... you weren't wrong

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Response to forest444 (Reply #27)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:53 PM

47. When that second plane hit the towers, I said to my coworkers, "What is Bush doing to us?"

It was clearly his people's handiwork. Of course, "his people" extends to the Saudis as well as the PNACers.

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Response to valerief (Reply #47)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:17 PM

79. my first thought

was "inside job". of course, we couldn't say that because NUTCASE.

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Response to valerief (Reply #47)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:13 PM

106. And our MSM helped the Administration.

 

Repeating the images of the towers coming down, time after time, day after day, to keep us "afraid".

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 11:47 AM

26. This is a mainstream view outside of the United States

 

About 20 percent of folks across seventeen different countries believe that either the US or Israel was responsible for 9/11.

The numbers are highest in the Middle East.

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Response to oberliner (Reply #26)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:42 PM

90. 20% is not a majority, thus not a mainstream view.

Mainstream requires, by its very definition, a majority to consider a thing acceptable, customary or acceptable. The alleged figure of 20% is not a majority, thus not a mainstream view, rather more accurately, 'heterodox,' or simply irregular.

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #90)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:26 PM

107. Good point

 

Mainstream was not the right word. A view held by 1 out of 5 people around the world (and higher in the Middle East).

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:03 PM

30. Well duh.

Many people have known this for over a decade.

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Response to PeteSelman (Reply #30)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:14 PM

36. Alas, the power of denial.

That's what they were probably counting on the most - even for something so much in plain sight.

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Response to forest444 (Reply #36)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:54 PM

48. Yep, the bigger the lie the more people will believe it. nt

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:07 PM

31. Republican treason - most foul

Why do Republicans hate America?

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Response to Scientific (Reply #31)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:12 PM

34. Probably because they've turned it into a business.

Every time they've harmed the country since the 1920s, you'll notice, it was done in a way that lined their pockets (to say the least!).

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Response to forest444 (Reply #34)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:09 PM

58. Sadly, I must agree with your observation


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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:09 PM

33. Well, the U.S. didn't conduct the 9-11 attacks

I believe it was done by Islamic terrorists from Saudi Arabia exactly the way, and for the reasons, discovered by the 9-11 commission.

BUT...I do believe the U.S. has, indeed, used the attack to - as the article says - "...create a shadow enemy – terrorism. It then allowed the U.S. government to blame terrorism for “all their mistakes” and to use the “phantom” terrorist threat as an excuse for military operations and covert secret wars the world over." That much is definitely true.

But, the conspiracy theory that Bush did it is just stupid and untrue. It was real, unforeseeable, terrorism plain and simple.

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Response to SpankMe (Reply #33)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:57 PM

97. Too much of a coincidence. We know who the Neo-Cons were. We witnessed their influence

at the time.

The US was definitely involved in some tangible way. Maybe they only encouraged the operation and fostered it along behind the scene.

It was an act of treason. The greatest treason in the history of the nation.

Remember who these people were. They thought it was perfectly alright to torture. That tells me all I need to know. That and a stolen 2000 election. These aren't boy scouts. They would and have done about anything and everything. Think Iran-Contra on steroids.
This is the MIC Eisenhower warned us about.

They can deny but the deniability isn't plausible.

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Response to Enthusiast (Reply #97)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:37 PM

109. ^^ This ^^

 

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:47 PM

43. I've always been LIHOP but will look at all MIHOP evidence w an open mind nt

 

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #43)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:54 PM

49. You have the right approach

As horrible and nefarious as we think some people are, we should never draw conclusions without assembling evidence.

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Response to RufusTFirefly (Reply #49)

Wed May 25, 2016, 03:02 PM

98. Right before the collapse you can see the massive fires in the windows..........

Last edited Wed May 25, 2016, 05:10 PM - Edit history (1)

weakening the structural steel elements. Just look at that raging inferno!

Throughout history tall buildings have collapsed in their own footprint after catching fire. Think Dresden Germany when all the buildings fell straight down creating a level uniform field of rubble.

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Response to Enthusiast (Reply #98)

Wed May 25, 2016, 06:31 PM

144. With just a few moments on the Google

 

you can find videos of the large fires in WTC7 that burned for hours, and you can see that the building did not fall into its own footprint. But that's too much research for a"truther."

A few moments on a conspiracy site does not equal years of study by scientists and engineers. Don't quit your day job.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:50 PM

44. Dick Cheney and his oil buddies were divvying up Iraq oil fields before 9/11. He was in a position

MIHOP/LIHOP. Haliburton profited fantastically from the Iraq war and went from the toilet to a market shooting star. He refused to testify in front of the 9/11 commission unless it was behind closed doors, not under oath, and no recording devices or hand written notes were allowed. Same for GWB.

The official government account is a laughable, pathetic joke. If 90% of the inconsistencies magically resolved themselves, the remaining 10% would still be ample proof that the "official" government story is a bullshit conspiracy theory.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 12:52 PM

45. A new Pearl Harbor. Yeah, we knew this from the PNAC papers. It would't be the first time

the U.S. attacked its citizens. What the fuck does the U.S. govt. care about U.S. citizens? I mean, just look at fuckin' Congress.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:01 PM

51. Would Dick Cheney have thought up 9/11?

I doubt "W" had the brain width.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:04 PM

53. Hard to argue that the US government has NOT used terrorism as a reason to expand its presence and

power at home and abroad. Proving who was involved and to what extent is a whole other thing. This Saudi / US rift is like a version of the prisoner's dilemma playing out between 2 superpowers.

Adam Curtis made a series of documentaries which aired on the BBC in 2005. He details what is known about the American Neocons and the Islamic Extremists without going into the logistics of 9/11/01.

The first three minutes here discuss the dynamics of terrorism and the WOT:

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:06 PM

57. Kick

 

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Response to forest444 (Original post)


Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:30 PM

61. It's nice to know Saudi has truthers too, lol nt

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Response to Gore1FL (Reply #61)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:41 PM

64. Please read this:

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Response to merrifield (Reply #64)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:46 PM

67. That doesn't prove anything. It merely infers things.

The Bush Administration was not competent enough to pull off an inside job.

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Response to Gore1FL (Reply #67)


Response to silvershadow (Reply #69)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:35 PM

87. In any event. Until I see evidence I don't tend to believe conspiracy theories. nt

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Response to Gore1FL (Reply #87)


Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:32 PM

62. But we CAN'T SUE BushCo for the all of the loss of life and treasury BushCo caused.... NT

 

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:40 PM

63. It was both people inside the US Govt. and Saudis w/help from the Saudi Royals and Govt.

On the morning of 9/11 Dick Cheney was helping to run war games that simulated
an attack on the US using hijacked planes, members of the bin Laden family were
meeting w/HW Bush, Marvin Bush's former company had the security contracts on
the WTC and Boston's Logan Airport, and three of the hijackers had been "taken care
of" by a Saudi intel person and from $$$ from the account of the wife of Saudi Arabia's
ambassador to the USA. w just happened to be in front of a classroom at the time of the
attacks ..... how timely.

Fun fact in the history of the world only three steel frame buildings have collapsed in their
own foot print because of fire and they were WTC #1, #2, and bldg #7.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:45 PM

65. I see the Saudis as accomplices only.

I seriously doubt the concept of a 9/11 attack originated with the Saudis.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:45 PM

66. Bush and Saudi's covering for each other - Nah, no way - show me some proof



That's a lotta love - and I ain't got notin' wrong with that kinda love


You know, Daddy Bush sent Junior over to Saudi Arabia during the younger Bush years for "growth". Wonder what went on?

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:50 PM

68. This is latest breaking news?

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 01:55 PM

71. But didn't Obama say that we shouldn't be looking back

but forward? Or some shit like that? Either way don't look for him to prosecute anyone.

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Response to d_legendary1 (Reply #71)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:49 PM

94. that comment really pissed me off

if that is true at all, then why bother to prosecute anyone for any crime they committed "in the past"?

A statement like that made me suspect that Obama was in on the deal.

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Response to RussBLib (Reply #94)

Wed May 25, 2016, 03:37 PM

102. You're not the only one

Powell stood in front of Congress with that yellow cake he swore up and down that Saddam was cooking. We were lied into war, several people made it out rich after their tenure, and lots of people both here and abroad lost their lives.



Someone should be in jail for this.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:03 PM

74. Who should we invade next? Is Saudi Arabia on the list?

I'm joking.

I wonder how Saudi Arabia plans to prove this in court.

Because Republicans passed the bill to allow the Saudis to be sued. And if Obama really does prevent the release of the information, that will become an important election issue to many Republicans.

Obama can't let that happen. He is caught between a rock and a hard place.

Best to out all the evidence and let the people of the world and a court decide.

If the Saudis have proof that the US government actually brought down the towers or can disprove that they were accomplices, they should be allowed to exonerate themselves. Because this is a horrible accusation whether made at the US government of George W. Bush or Bill Clinton or the Saudis.

I do not have a crystal ball that enables me to distinguish lies from truth on this one.

The 28 or so pages should be released, and the Saudis should be given a chance to clear their name as should the US government.

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #74)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:28 PM

84. No, you don't have a crystal ball

But you have a brain and many many resources to follow this thread to its unraveling. Start with many of the excellent books by David Ray Griffin and the link I've posted twice above.

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Response to merrifield (Reply #84)

Wed May 25, 2016, 03:13 PM

100. I was being a bit sarcastic! I don't know who was behind 9/11 for sure, but there

are now some good possibilities.

I've always wondered whether maybe there was some structural flaw in the building, maybe a lot of asbestos or something. Halliburton was on the hook for a lot of asbestos liability at the time or shortly before. It's just a conspiracy theory. I have not crystal ball or evidence. I am simply asking questions.

But the Saudis were involved. There is no doubt about that. And certain factions in Saudi Arabia may have been the sole perpetrators.

One thing we know is that the buildings did not fall down without some sort of external help.

The plot is unravelling as we write.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:12 PM

77. Well the Saudi's would be wrong. But it is U.S. related.

Cheney arranged through his oil buddies to blow it up. Who knows? That might be the truth.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:14 PM

78. well,well, well

how interesting is this? and such timing...

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:47 PM

92. fuel for the conspiracy theorists

I still believe the Bush admin, if they didn't make the 9/11 attacks themselves, knew about it and did nothing to stand in the way. It's an example of how ruthless the GOP can be.

I will probably go to my grave suspecting the worst.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 02:49 PM

95. All I see is smoke. (Smoke clears) And a red herring! eom

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 03:02 PM

99. Despite my cynicism over Bush and Cheney's every action and my hatred for

Saudi Arabia's sponsoring terrorism worldwide and committing war-crimes in Yemen right now ... I really, really hope it wasn't known of by anyone but those already dead and punished. But, what a sick, complicated relationship.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 04:00 PM

105. It is past time for the truth to come out.

 

I don't know where this will lead, but I hope it puts a few people behind bars and I'm not talking about Saudi Arabia.

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Response to Duval (Reply #105)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:11 PM

119. Yes! Past time!

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:21 PM

133. Bwaaahaaalhaha

The truth comes out. Finally!!!!

World Trade Tower Seven had all the ENRON, evidence in it. It was imploded, for sure.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)


Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:31 PM

137. But at least 2 Senators are traitors to the 9/11 survivors who want to sue. They put a clause in

the bill that allows the state department to delay all law suits. Senators from Texas and New York added the text. What were they paid by the Saudia for protecting them from law suits. When will America charge for treason?

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:54 PM

140. Free Fall Velocity Proves Buildings were Demolished with Explosives

WTC #7 proves the official government narrative was total BS. Steel framed buildings don't fall at free fall velocity unless ALL of their structural columns are compromised. WTC #7 fell at free fall velocity indicating a controlled demolition. Fires or even debris falling on the building would never be pervasive enough to make a building collapse as this one did.
As a previous poster stated, 911 looks like a false flag operation because it was one.

The fact that most Americans can't face the truth, doesn't mean squat as far as what actually happened. Listen to the experts, architects and engineers, who have pretty much concluded the buildings were intentionally brought down. Who was responsible is another question entirely.

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Response to 13Dogs (Reply #140)

Wed May 25, 2016, 05:59 PM

142. How could the towers be falling at free fall velocities

when the video clearly shows debris falling faster than the collapse zone? One would think that free falling chunks of steel would fall at free fall velocities.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 06:23 PM

143. Honestly, I wouldn't put ANYTHING past Cheney.

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Response to OregonBlue (Reply #143)

Wed May 25, 2016, 06:32 PM

145. Nor I - least of all the very thing that gave them EVERYTHING they wanted.

The first thing the Romans would ask when initiating any investigation: Cui bono.

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Response to forest444 (Original post)

Wed May 25, 2016, 07:03 PM

146. Hey Saudi Arabia, I have an idea---------------------lets go into the Hague

and bring "all" parties, that haven't been hanged or shot yet, and lets find out--------------my bet is that when I got off work that morning from United and saw the FLT 93 crew off , and came back into work that night and saw the smoldering pile from across the Hudson, I saw my passion of being an aircraft technician going up in smoldering flames.

I have always wanted know about the intelligence briefing's from August when George and the gang decide to go and play golf, and and had been warned about this "stuff" and then was sitting in class reading MY GOAT, when a total of three aircraft slammed into the buildings, and one augured into the ground, if he and his criminal gang, should be indicted along with Prince Bander and your regime at the Hague for starters------------lets go and play that silly game shall we------------go to the Hague and plead your case along with appointed criminals in the Bush team , just to clear everything up once and for all





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