Switzerland basic income: Landmark vote looms

[inanna]

Source: BBC

17 minutes ago

Switzerland will become the first country in the world to hold a nationwide referendum on the introduction of a basic income on Sunday.

The proposal, if passed, would give every adult legally resident in Switzerland an unconditional income of 2,500 Swiss francs (£1,755; $2,554) a month, whether they work or not.

Supporters point to the fact that 21st-Century work is increasingly automated, with more and more traditional jobs, in factories, retail and even in finance and accounting, being done by machines. And they do not need salaries.

The campaign has staged some eyecatching demonstrations, including one in which hundreds of "robots" danced through the streets of Zurich, promising to "free" humans from the daily grind of Monday to Friday work, just to pay the bills.


Read more: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36443512

[PoliticAverse]

1. Seems unlikely that it will pass. n/t

[inanna]

2. Yes, according to what I've read

you're probably correct.

It'll still be interesting to watch though.

[trudyco]

3. Wow! Why oh why oh why are we always the least progressive.

Isn't Canada proposing this, too? Or some province in Canada?

[inanna]

5. Yes, Ontario

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2016/03/13/ontario-will-test-idea-of-a-guaranteed-minimum-income-to-ease-poverty_n_9451076.html

[KamaAina]

8. It actually happened in Manitoba many years ago

for a brief time.

Canada experimented with a guaranteed minimum income in Dauphin, Manitoba in the early 1970s. The so-called Mincome project found it did not discourage people from working, except for two key groups: new mothers, and teenaged boys who opted to stay in school until graduation.

The Mincome project also found an 8.5 per cent reduction in hospital visits in Dauphin during the experiment, said Martin.

"People had fewer visits because of mental health problems," she said. "There were fewer low birth-weight babies, so very concrete and immediate impacts in terms of people's health."

[inanna]

14. +1

Thanks for added info.

[trudyco]

15. Interesting. Why didn't it continue? /nt

[strategery blunder]

22. IIRC a conservative provincial government was elected and discontinued the experiment

for ideological reasons.

[Travis_0004]

6. It is very easy to get something on the ballot in switzerland

This is not going to pass.

[inanna]

10. Perhaps not THIS time.

But the topic is not going away.

Not now.

[jtuck004]

12. Even if it did, I don't see how they could sustain it. Much of their ecomomy is service work, which

doesn't produce more than it costs. It's mostly make work, nothing left over to support anyone, except for the far fewer professional jobs.

Their economy appears well balanced and managed well, but I don't see how that would lead to anything but massive inflation with our current economic schemes.

Cool idea on it's face, if you could unleash a whole population to go do or build anything they want.

Harder in the US. We are the sole source of the dollar so it's easily possible to simply inflate the supply, but that blows out the value (inflation). With our history of servitude , because we have nothing to base it on, any attempt would be turned on the people it freed immediately, much like slavery was met with sharecropping and lies, unless a massive training went on to try and forestall it. Even then, there are already businesses established to find ways to steal your guaranteed long-term income, and they would find it trivial to get this. Just one $35 congressperson...

[valerief]

7. One word: Jesus.

Oligarchs can't operate without religion.

[EdwardBernays]

4. It's gonna happen

Everywhere eventually.

It's either that dystopia.

[johnnyrocket]

9. This is absolutely the future. Automation will prevail...

....and society will have to adapt.

[jtuck004]

13. Take a look overseas - Vietnam, China - that is the future. Automation prevails, the people

can't breathe in their own major cities, and whole states are left with no income and no future. Not even up to poverty level in some cases, just invisible.

That is what we will adapt to. Not that we must, but it does seem the way the pendulum is swinging now.

[Arazi]

11. Yes! Even if it doesn't pass, this idea is getting international attention

Its the right thing to do

[Hydra]

17. They tried this once before

They'll keep going until they can get the votes they need. This is going to pass in other places in the world as well, and hopefully in the US. Since we can't seem to keep more than 65% of the workforce employed anyway now, even under threat of people dying, then something will have to give.

[hauckeye]

16. Where would the money come from to pay everyone this income?

I'm not understanding how this works. Would the people getting the basic income pay taxes?

[arithia]

18. found another article that answered that question

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2016/05/05/switzerland-referendom-monthly-income-tax-free/83940610/

"Under the proposed law, the government would guarantee that every Swiss adult has at least $2,600 in monthly income after taxes. So if a person has no income at all, he or she will receive the full amount. If the person earns $1,600 now, the supplement would be $1,000."

Someone who currently earns, say, $6,500 month would not receive any money from the government but $2,600 of it would not be taxed.

For those getting welfare or other social benefits, payments of up to $2,600 a month would be replaced by the new basic income. Anything over this amount would continue to be provided as a separate payment and taxed accordingly."

......

"He and other opponents also note that financing the scheme, estimated to cost about $200 billion a year, would strain the government’s coffers.

The initiative’s backers say the plan would be funded, among other sources of revenue, by increasing Switzerland’s 8% value added tax.

The government counters that other taxes would have to rise and spending slashed to afford such a generous giveaway.

“Considerable cutbacks or tax rises would be necessary to finance this basic income, which could not replace today’s social security system entirely,” the government warns on its website, urging voters to reject the initiative."

[Hydra]

19. No, usually basic income schemes make the minumum income non-taxable

Which is sort of a misnomer anyway- most places have sales taxes, energy tax, licenses, etc., so the Mitt Romneys of the world are idiots- everyone pays unless they are living illegally or are subsistence living.

As for where the money for the income comes from, the gov'ts with their own currency have a pool of money to use for whatever services they decide to provide. As long as the labor balance is there to fund it, anything can be done from welfare to warships. For countries that don't have their own currency...gets more complicated.

[appalachiablue]

20. Robots care about humans, aww..

[Doctor_J]

21. Meanwhile, people here work full time for half of that, with no healthcare, no vacation, no sick

time, and no pension.

USA! USA! God bless the corporations

[EX500rider]

23. So everybody who makes under $35,00 quits their jobs?

....and then who does all those jobs? And what stops the rest of Europe from moving there to live off the dole?

[AdHocSolver]

25. The U.S. could provide people with jobs to rebuild our crumbling infrastructure.

There is plenty of work to be done.

The oligarchs choose to deny gainful employment to the masses by stashing "their" profits (created by people who do have jobs who work for starvation wages) in offshore tax havens.

Most people want to work for a living. It is the oligarchy, with their phony economic ideology about the need for "austerity", that denies people useful employment.

[Onlaketime]

24. Would love to see this in the US.

Unfortunately, it would never happen because our system would never allow it. War is all that matters to those in power these days. The citizenry be damned in their eyes.