Orlando terror attack live updates:Omar Mateen had been on terrorist watch list, bought guns recent

[ancianita]

Source: L.A. Times

What we know:

The gunman has been identified as 29-year-old Omar Mateen, an American citizen who was born in New York.

Dozens of victims remain hospitalized, many in critical condition .

He was killed by law enforcement after he took hostages during an hours-long siege.

He used a legally purchased assault rifle and handgun , which he had bought in the last 12 days. He also had another "device" but it's not clear what that was.

Mateen lived in the area of Fort Pierce, Fla., about 120 miles south of Orlando, and worked as a private security officer .

Investigators are operating under the theory that the attack was inspired by Islamic State .

Mateen had been interviewed by the FBI twice and had once been on a terrorist watch list .

President Obama called the shooting an act of terror that was an attack on all Americans.

Read more: http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-orlando-nightclub-shooting-live-updates-htmlstory.html

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[proverbialwisdom]

1. Employed by G4S since 2007 according to Jeremy Scahill quoting Palm Beach Post.

https://mobile.twitter.com/jeremyscahill/status/742080308439359489/

jeremy scahill
@jeremyscahill

Omar Mateen worked for G4S, one of the largest mercenary firms. Their operatives are deployed in scores of countries, including war zones.
12:45 PM - 12 Jun 2016

http://m.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/local/fort-pierce-apartment-building-evacuated-has-ties-/nrfFf/

1:56 P.M. The global security firm G4S, with offices in Jupiter, has confirmed that Orlando shooter Omar Mateen has worked for the company since 2007. Statement from G4S:

“We are shocked and saddened by the tragic event that occurred at the Orlando nightclub. We can confirm that Omar Mateen had been employed with G4S since September 10, 2007. We are cooperating fully with all law enforcement authorities, including the FBI, as they conduct their investigation. Our thoughts and prayers are with all of the friends, families and people affected by this unspeakable tragedy.”

[ancianita]

3. And whose bright idea was that.

[ancianita]

10. Good God, wikipedia says they're a Brit firm merged with a Denmark firm which makes them

a multinational mercenary firm,

In 2000 Group 4, a security firm formed in the 1960s, merged with Falck to form Group 4 Falck[5] and by 2000 the company was described as "the world's largest private security systems company".[6] In 2002 Group 4 Falck went on to buy The Wackenhut Corporation in the USA.[7]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G4S

making them a big fat fucking bureaucratic corporatocracy traded on stock markets.

This Mateen cut a deal based on his citizenship constitutional "privilege" and then betrayed his home country for fucking ISIS.

[ancianita]

13. I wonder if G4S even gets some Homeland dept's money though it's a Brit company.

We look pretty vulnerable to the internal processes of our mercenary "allies," which will complicate our control.

Bet Homeland heads are reviewing all this mess right now.

[AntiBank]

17. GS4 ran the security for the 2012 Democratic and Republican conventions

http://www.g4s.us/~/media/Files/USA/G4S-News/G4S%20Newsletter%20Fall%202012.ashx

BTW the shooter Omar Mateen is listed in that doc (for 5 years of service)

[ancianita]

18. Wonder what the GOP thinks of its company hire now. This guy's been floating through

terrorist watch lists for awhile now. Scary to contemplate who, of the 21,000 US citizens listed out of the 611,000 on the main terrorist watchlist, are floating around this country with guns.

Of that 21,000, 1,600 are classified as "selectees" targeted for enhanced screenings at airports and border crossings.

In 2013, the US designated 3,200 people as "known or suspected terrorists" associated with the war in Syria, of which this Mateen was likely one of the 41 Americans listed.

If Republicans are half as smart as they think they are they're probably shitting a brick over this.

[AntiBank]

19. perhaps, but we all know that the party who holds the POTUS gets the blame for shit

fair or unfair its just the way humans are hard wired
Trump is so gonna spin this hard

[ancianita]

20. Yep. It's on Obama's watch. He's got to zero in on how watch list people get off, among

other on-the-ground FBI monitoring concerns.

Trump is SO happy this happened. It's more from a "Make America 'Tough Guy' Great than it is to perfect Homeland Security for our protection.

The Big Campaign Deal should be that the GOP actually HIRED this firm for its conventions. THAT will freak out potential voters who see such bad vetting as a danger to everyday Americans.

[alcibiades_mystery]

25. When they said "security guard" I thought mall cop, not international mercenary army!

Jesus!

[HooptieWagon]

27. He was little more than a mall cop.

It sounds like he was an armed guard at a condo or gated community of some sort.

[Duckhunter935]

2. Is he still on the secret terrorist watch list?

just how do you get on or removed from the Bush secret terrorist watch list? Is there any due process?

[ancianita]

11. No. He leveraged credibility based on his citizenship to somehow work for an ally's mercenary

security firm. Any due process will have to call for his multinational employer's (G4S) hiring process.

How in hell does this government even exert any legal control over this company's colossal fuckup.

[Feeling the Bern]

4. Thank God he was on a watch list and still had his second amendment rights

After all, the people he killed should have known better and carried a gun to protect themselves.

Thank God for loose gun laws written by the NRA that do nothing.

[IronLionZion]

7. That watch list should be made public

so the rest of us can know who to steer clear of

[ancianita]

14. It's probably not so that people on the list are not forewarned of their surveillance.

[redstateblues]

5. He had also been in contact with a person who

Had been to Syria for training, returned to the US, then went back to Syria and killed 30 people with a suicide bomb. They should have surveiled him. Fail

[840high]

22. Huge fail.

[still_one]

29. In that case you are right, it was a complete break down that he was able to get around

the system

[Sancho]

6. People Control, Not Gun Control

This is my generic response to gun threads where people are shot and killed by the dumb or criminal possession of guns. For the record, I grew up in the South and on military bases. I was taught about firearms as a child, and I grew up hunting, was a member of the NRA, and I still own guns. In the 70’s, I dropped out of the NRA because they become more radical and less interested in safety and training. Some personal experiences where people I know were involved in shootings caused me to realize that anyone could obtain and posses a gun no matter how illogical it was for them to have a gun. Also, easy access to more powerful guns, guns in the hands of children, and guns that weren’t secured are out of control in our society. As such, here’s what I now think ought to be the requirements to possess a gun. I’m not debating the legal language, I just think it’s the reasonable way to stop the shootings. Notice, none of this restricts the type of guns sold. This is aimed at the people who shoot others, because it’s clear that they should never have had a gun.

1.) Anyone in possession of a gun (whether they own it or not) should have a regularly renewed license. If you want to call it a permit, certificate, or something else that's fine.
2.) To get a license, you should have a background check, and be examined by a professional for emotional and mental stability appropriate for gun possession. It might be appropriate to require that examination to be accompanied by references from family, friends, employers, etc. This check is not to subject you to a mental health diagnosis, just check on your superficial and apparent gun-worthyness.
3.) To get the license, you should be required to take a safety course and pass a test appropriate to the type of gun you want to use.
4.) To get a license, you should be over 21. Under 21, you could only use a gun under direct supervision of a licensed person and after obtaining a learner’s license. Your license might be restricted if you have children or criminals or other unsafe people living in your home. (If you want to argue 18 or 25 or some other age, fine. 21 makes sense to me.)
5.) If you possess a gun, you would have to carry a liability insurance policy specifically for gun ownership - and likely you would have to provide proof of appropriate storage, security, and whatever statistical reasons that emerge that would drive the costs and ability to get insurance.
6.) You could not purchase a gun or ammunition without a license, and purchases would have a waiting period.
7.) If you possess a gun without a license, you go to jail, the gun is impounded, and a judge will have to let you go (just like a DUI).
8.) No one should carry an unsecured gun (except in a locked case, unloaded) when outside of home. Guns should be secure when transporting to a shooting event without demonstrating a special need. Their license should indicate training and special carry circumstances beyond recreational shooting (security guard, etc.). If you are carrying your gun while under the influence of drugs or alcohol, you lose your gun and license.
9.) If you buy, sell, give away, or inherit a gun, your license information should be recorded.
10.) If you accidentally discharge your gun, commit a crime, get referred by a mental health professional, are served a restraining order, etc., you should lose your license and guns until reinstated by a serious relicensing process.

Most of you know that a license is no big deal. Besides a driver’s license you need a license to fish, operate a boat, or many other activities. I realize these differ by state, but that is not a reason to let anyone without a bit of sense pack a semiautomatic weapon in public, on the roads, and in schools. I think we need to make it much harder for some people to have guns.

[Person 2713]

33. It is mind boggling how easy it is to get a gun. Good start is the test and safety class. Can't we

all come together on that and licensing and insurance? It has the potential to kill
not a toy or candy collection
K&R this list

[ancianita]

8. One thing: FBI heads should roll for this. The FBI is the central manager of the TDSB, the

Terrorist Screening Database, at the FBI.

It's possibly problematic here that TDSB gets stripped of TIDE (Terrorist Identities Datamart Environment, which gathers terrorism info from sensitive military and intel sources around the world) classified information. Perhaps that would have helped the watchers of the FBI "Watch List," which might be the generic label for all the lists they keep, like the "No Fly" or other lists.

TIDE only exists within the intel agency world.

This is from Jeremy Scahill's The Assassination Complex, copyrighted this year.

[still_one]

30. Somebody let the ball drop

[winstars]

9. Sorry but maybe a few less FBI agents on email server watch and more on terrorist watch please...

[ancianita]

12. This kind of fuckup of intel/FBI communications now makes us appear vulnerable to the

world as a REAL battleground for ISIS now.

WTF.

[ancianita]

15. Not to politicize this myself, but this does look as if it could get TrumpTheFascist more votes.

This situation of ISIS taking responsibility on US soil makes this country officially a battleground, not just a legal label of the NDAA anymore.

[ancianita]

16. Of the more than one million entries in the TIDE as of 2013, around 21,000 are Americans.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

21. I wonder if the good folks at the gun forums are claiming "Obama False Flag" on this one too.

[bjo59]

23. He was also employed by global security firm G4s since 2007.

So much for "terrorist watch list."

[Cryptoad]

24. Thanks GOP ~NRA

Democrats passed a bill to outlaw gun sales to people on the list,,,,,, GOP~NRA blocked its passage.......

[NoMoreRepugs]

26. you cant stop crazy - not now - not EVER

I live in Florida and I have attended a gun show to see for myself - I suggest everyone here do the same

[romanic]

28. The watch list needs to be tweaked obviously.

So pissed, this somehow could have been prevented from happening.

[soilopen]

31. FBI too busy investigating emails nt

[cynzke]

32. SUNDAY QUARTERBACKING!

Bits and pieces of info are filtering out with little scrutiny. The FBI conducted two investigations on Mateen and there was no evidence this man was CONNECTED to/had ANY link to a foreign terrorist group or that he posed a terrorist threat to this country ("FBI Special Agent in Charge Ronald Hopper said today that the FBI had taken an interest in Mateen twice: first in 2013 after he made "inflammatory" comments to co-workers and then again the next year after he was linked to another U.S. radical who became a suicide bomber in Syria. Mateen was interviewed by investigators three times in relation to the probes but, in both cases, the FBI determined Mateen was not a threat and closed the investigations, Hopper said. He was not under investigation OR surveillance at the time of the shooting, Hopper said.&quot .

http://www.abc15.com/news/national/what-we-know-about-omar-mateen-suspected-orlando-nightclub-shooter

If you read the various news stories, Mateen is being HYPED as an Islamic Terrorist, whose motive was to commit terrorism against the US.......highly EXAGGERATED. In reality, so far, Mateen was a homophobic sicko who hated gays enough to carry out this heinous act of mass murder. In recent history he saw two men kissing and bought weapons. That is MORE relevant to his motives than trying to hype this into some international act of Islamic terrorism. Mateen, well aware of the issue, saw an opportunity to turn what was a HOMOPHOBIC, pathetic, sick HATE crime, get it hyped INTO a wild speculative act of international terrorism. He executed his IDEA while in the nightclub by calling 911. Look how well it worked. Instead of going down in history as a homophobic mass murderer, he will be infamous world wide as an Islamic terrorist. Mateen accomplished two things successfully. Murdered gays whom he hated and triggered America's paranoia which is now fueling this sad incident into something far more insidious. All this speculation/hype is playing right into the hands of ISIS. Their calls to the "lone wolves" are working And our paranoia and fear will ENCOURAGE true radical Islamic's to carry out attacks.

[sarcasmo]

34. FBI with a big Fail.