Cops: Norton woman, 66, accidentally shot by hunter

[sasha031]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by Rhiannon12866 (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

A hunter mistook a 66-year-old Norton woman walking her two dogs for a deer and shot her at 4:55 p.m., 17 minutes after sunset yesterday in Norton, a preliminary investigation indicated, police said.The hunter, also a Norton resident, immediately called 911 to report the shooting, Norton police said. Fire, police and rescue personnel responded.

“Norton fire personnel extracted the woman from the wooded area and transported her to Rhode Island Hospital,” a police statement said late last night. A hospital spokeswoman refused to discuss the victim’s condition.The hunting accident occurred off Oak Street and remains under investigation by Det. James Franco, along with state and environmental police.

The deer hunting season for blackpowder muzzle-loading guns ended yesterday at 5:08 p.m., 30 minutes after sunset, according Catherine Williams, a spokesman with the Massachusetts Environmental Police. Williams would not discuss what weapon was involved or what time the woman was shot.
http://bostonherald.com/news/regional/view/20220101cops_norton_woman_66_accidentally_shot_by_hunter

[bluedigger]

1. Hunter who shot Norton woman in apparent accident is a state trooper

http://www.boston.com/Boston/metrodesk/2012/01/hunter-who-shot-norton-woman-apparent-accident-state-trooper/BZBQywDHvjPznYDY7bga9O/index.html?p1=News_links

[sasha031]

3. they always get away with it

If you are just a regular person walking your dog, hanging out laundry and get shot and killed by a hunter, you and your family have no rights.

[happyslug]

13. In Pennsylvania any such shooting is manslaughter...

It can not be murder, no intent to do any harm.

Most such cases are resolved without a trial, the hunter serves some time, put on probation, banned from hunting for the rest of your life (this ban exist even if the victim does not die, just wounded). For this reason almost never reported by the news, old news by the time of the sentencing.

[Marnie]

15. Actually there is intent to kill and harm.

Its just that the target is wrong.

Also, I wonder if his hunting after dark is not itself illegal which ties the shooting to another crime and may up the penalty.

[happyslug]

22. Issue is LEGAL intent as defined under the law

No such intent exists in this case, BUT Strict liability also applies, i.e. you are held STRICTLY liable for things fired down range. i.e. if you do ANY shooting, you are liable for bullets fired. For this reason in almost any shooting most insurance companies just pay up, and for that reason you never hear of these cases (His home insurance should pay for this, just to protect the home from any sale to pay off any judgement, most dog bite cases are handle this way).

Remains me of people are robbed or otherwise in hotels or motels, another strict liability situation. happens all of the time, but you never hear of it, people are just paid off. Same in most shooting cases, insurance companies just pay off.

[AtheistCrusader]

27. Yes, there are fixed hours of hunting, tied to the available daylight.

Sounds like he screwed up many ways. This sort of accident is WHY we don't hunt in the dark, because it's harder to identify your target.

As a hunter, I will say, that guy should never touch a firearm again, so long as he lives.

[panzerfaust]

31. At least he is well trained in the use of firearms, and, as it turns out

{
... Bergeron is an experienced hunter who lives in the area. He did not see the woman and mistook the tails of the two dogs as the tail of a deer he had seen earlier in the afternoon. Investigators said the shot that hit the victim was the only one he fired all afternoon. He had all proper gun and hunting licenses.
...
}

So it is all OK.

Tough about the old lady though.

Just the risk she took though, walking her dogs when she knew that Men would be out trying to put meat on the table. Heck, she should have been 'carrying.'

[ellisonz]

75. My eyes, my eyes...

...oh why did you have to do that to my eyes.

[Kingofalldems]

2. Deer savages. An overpowering bloodlust for deer is dangerous to others.

[bahrbearian]

5. +1

[sasha031]

7. +1 k/r

[Peregrine Took]

19. +1.

[Politicub]

67. +1

[aikoaiko]

4. Negligence -- not an accident. The hunter clearly did not indentify the target.

1. All guns are always loaded. Even if they are not, treat them as if they are.
2, Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy.
3. Keep your finger off the trigger till your sights are on the target.
4. Identify your target, and what is behind it. Never shoot at anything that you have not positively identified.

There needs to be consequences for this type of negligence.

Best wishes to the victim.

[BOHICA12]

20. Jeff Cooper would be proud of you ...

Keep quoting THE RULES and maybe they'll sink in!

[Mojorabbit]

28. +100 ..Basic shooting rules. He knew better. nt

[Botany]

33. as a deer hunter and dog owner his story is b.s.

He said he mistook the dog tail for a deer tail

dog tail


deer tail


Besides you almost never shoot @ the deer's tail .... the heart and lungs are what you go for.

[Paladin]

40. Good Rules. Remember To Post Them Down In The Guns/RKBA Group Site......

...the next time yet another thread appears, advocating gun ownership and use by the sight-impaired (there have been several such threads in the past)........

[friendly_iconoclast]

42. He was negligent, not sight-impaired- so what's your point?

[Paladin]

48. Think About It Real Hard---It'll Come To You...... (n/t)

[aikoaiko]

46. Will do because these rules apply to people with 20/20 vision or impaired vision.

[petronius]

53. There are safe and easy accommodations to allow sight-impaired persons

to use firearms. (As for mere ownership, I can't think of anything that visually-impaired persons should be prohibited from just holding title to).

I'd be surprised if you're unaware of this fact as it comes up in all of those threads you reference, so you need to ask yourself: why are you so willing and eager to unjustifiably deny a freedom and a pleasure to sight-impaired persons? Why does your dislike of firearms take precedence over the fair and equal treatment of differently-abled people?

[Paladin]

56. I Rest My Case. (n/t)

[petronius]

58. Indeed you do. Although it's unfortunate to see a case for discrimination against the disabled

even being made at DU, however obliquely it's expressed.

My suggestion to you was a serious one; it's possible that your posts are simple attempts to rile people up (as silly as that is), but if your comments are meant in good faith then you would benefit from a little reflection about where your thoughts and biases are leading you...

[moriah]

74. I would have a hard time saying a person should be able to carry concealed ...

... if they were too visually-impaired to drive even with corrective lenses.

And that's a reasonable standard, IMHO.

As far as home defense with a shotgun, I can see a person who is legally blind doing quite well defending their home and property. The pattern is large enough to be able to aim by sound.

----
Edited because I phrased things wrong.

[moriah]

73. +100 n/t

[proud2BlibKansan]

6. How the hell do you mistake a woman for a deer???

[masshole]

8. Well, it was around 5pm

and sunset was at 4:22pm that day, so it was dark.

It would appear Mr. Troopershooter was breaking another law too.

[aikoaiko]

9. The reports are being careful about the time.

Apparently the black powder hunting season ended 30 min after sunset.

[hedgehog]

50. That's the part I don't get - 30 minutes after sunset?

[aikoaiko]

52. There is usually a decent amount of light after technical sunset.

We're just not used to the noticing the technical time of sunset and the amount of light.

They call it civil twilight (the brightest part of twilight). The sun is only just below the horizon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twilight#Civil_twilight

[hedgehog]

54. Thanks for the clarification!

[petronius]

10. Perhaps he was watching the time, knowing the season was over in ~20 minutes,

and in a rush to get his deer - so he shot at the first thing that moved. The article says he thought he saw a deer's tail, which means he didn't take the time to make sure it was even a deer, if it was a deer that was a legitimate target, and whether he could get a humane shot.

No excuse for this; while it may not be criminal I really think he should lose his hunting license for good. (Heck, I'd take his fishing license, birdwatching binoculars, hiking boots, and ban him from ever again setting foot off pavement... </exaggeration for emphasis> )

[Marnie]

16. You don't give a damn.

[Dr_Scholl]

23. That's why I never hunt on public land.

Too many idiots like this guy around.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

25. Private land isn't much better. My father in law forbids us from....

.... hiking/walking the dog on their back acreage during the season. He says the hunters are always "slipping under the wire."

[greiner3]

71. "6. How the hell do you mistake a woman for a deer???;"

I am shocked, I say, shocked to see I'm the first one to say that Cheney mistook an asshole for a quail.

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

11. I would expect a state trooper to be more careful than your average hunter.

[izquierdista]

12. Careful, nah. More arrogant? I'd bet on it.

[Marnie]

14. How do you spot a target after sunset unless you are using a night vision or infrared scope?

Which is probably not legal for hunting?

I guess spot light or headlight hunting would also be a possibility and is illegal.

[ManiacJoe]

18. Many (most?) states run time time limits of

30 min before sunrise to 30 min after sunset. Within those 30 minutes, there is plenty of light.

Using a light is illegal in many (most?) states.

[PavePusher]

47. Sunset =/= dark.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunset

[tclambert]

17. Using the Dick Cheney precedent, the 66-year-old woman should apologize to the hunter.

[Charlemagne]

24. +1

[dimbear]

21. We often see sneaky deer walking dogs here. Crafty bastards. n/t

[Historic NY]

26. She must have had some large dog....

my neighbor told me yesterday that my resident deer are camping out under my bedroom window...2 big bucks and their herd. I don't feed them, they are the same family that have been born and raised in the woods behind my garage.

I think I will go clean up the pipe & stuff behind the garage so they can head back there. Could be too much temptation to some idiot trying to go for a shot.

My uncle used to tell us the story of the hunter who shot as cow thinking it was a deer.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

41. You might want to harden your bedroom walls and window.

Or sleep in the basement.


Only half kidding.

[canoeist52]

29. The woman and the hunter are neighbors and well known to each other

This is my home town. I know these people.

local update http://norton.patch.com/articles/hunting-shooter-identified-as-state-trooper

[Ineeda]

30. Normally I'm 100+% on the side of an accidental shooting victim but

as much as I hate to acknowledge it, it seems this victim bears some responsibility. Walking her dogs in a hunting reserve during hunting season when light conditions are iffy, is not very smart, IMO.

[Gormy Cuss]

38. No, she bears no responsibility unless she was dressed in a really good deer costume.

The hunter shot without having sight of his target. It's wholly his responsibility even if she walked right by signs for the hunting reserve (and from the links it sounds as if it's doubtful that there was sufficient signage at that edge of the reserve so she probably didn't do that.)

[UpInArms]

44. see my post #43 - she was walking on her own property - not a "hunting reserve"

conditions don't seem so iffy when you have a bit more info

[Ineeda]

49. That's true.

I based my comment on the info provided in the OP's link. New info can certainly change things.

[sasha031]

55. maybe she should apoligize to the hunter for getting in the way of the bullet

looks like the husband doesn't have a problem with his wife being shot in the stomach.

[roguevalley]

65. it is always the responsibility of the gun handler

[BOHICA12]

32. Orange Vests save lives

This isn't an indictment of Ms. Williams - hope she fully recovers and sues the pants off the idiot.

[tabasco]

34. LOL. Yes, everybody in the vicinity of hunting areas should wear orange vests.

The Monongahela Forest, where I live, is 1 million acres.

[Historic NY]

35. Sometimes you need bells, whistles, flashing lights & sirens...

where I live they are finally going to switch to shotgun over rifles. Several tragedies of people including chldren killed in their homes and trailers, from wayward shots.

I used to manage a 200+ acre historic site, you couldn't get me into the woods until spring. I heavily posted it and still had hunters even with the adjoining posted state lands.

[fascisthunter]

36. why should the victim be responsible for someone else's negligence?

will hunters be pooling funds to buy vests for everybody in the area? I doubt it.

[BOHICA12]

39. Like seat belts, vests give you a better opportunity to survive someone's stupidity.

Again - she did nothing wrong except fully understand the level of idiots in the woods.

[Marnie]

62. Except as light fades, color vision fades.

So an orange vest, or the green she was waring wouldn't have mattered much.

I am curious as to how one sees the elongated body of a quadraped in the form of a human standing upright.

[BOHICA12]

69. The florescent orange of a hunting vest - will stand out well past ....

the 1/2 hour after sundown. I do not know how such a mistake is made, but was the bag limit both bucks & does? Often the trigger happy idiots will shoot a anything large - thinking a deer is the only thing out here! Way stupid.

[Bucky]

37. If she'd been carrying her own gun, she could've protected herself.

And then this tragedy wouldn't have occurred. Remember how Rick Perry was able to protect himself while he was out walking his dog. A well armed society is a polite society. Obviously, if more dog walkers and more deer packed heat these days, we'd all be safer.

[UpInArms]

43. update: Kin want probe in mom’s shooting

http://bostonherald.com/news/regional/view.bg?articleid=1392590

The family of a Norton grandmother accidentally shot by an off-duty state trooper stalking deer after dark are calling for a further probe of the incident that left her clinging to life.

“My mother was shot. This is not OK,” Kristen Mayer told the Herald as 66-year-old Cheryl Blair lay in the -trauma intensive-care unit of Rhode -Island Hospital recovering from her New Year’s Eve surgery for a fractured pelvis.

<snip>

Blair was shot by her neighbor and -veteran trooper John Bergeron, 50, who called 911 at 4:55 p.m. -Saturday. Under state law, hunting is permitted for 30 minutes after sunset, which was at 4:24 p.m.

<snip>

Blair, who has hunted with Bergeron in the past, said his wife was shot on a wooded trail on their four-acre property, where the champion golden retriever breeder has “been walking her dogs for the past 20 years.”

Mayer, 28, said her mother was wearing a bright green coat.

...more...

[aikoaiko]

51. They really are rushing to say its not a crime.

In some states, I think Maine for example, intentionally shooting someone when you thought it was deer is always a crime.

[chelsea0011]

59. That was my feeling yesterday when I heard there would be no charges.

I live near Norton and heard of the story while driving around at the same time the shooting happened (albeit, a day later), and I will tell you it was quite dark outside. So when I heard their would be no charges, I was befuddled. I just couldn't imagine anyone hunting at that time of day.

[Marnie]

63. Speaking of Maine.

I lived there for 3 years. Their deer are huge compared to a retreiver and are a much darker color.

I don't think even the much smaller and lighter colored white tails in Texas that I am more accustomed to could be confused with a dog.

[magical thyme]

72. not in Maine

A teenager (17) was shot in the chest and killed with a bow & arrow on her own property a couple years ago, while out walking with her brother on the last day of bow hunting. The guy who shot her mistook her white mittens for a deer tail.

There apparently was some disagreement over whether or not he had permission to hunt on their property and it led to a change in the law requiring written permission.

Yet there were no charges brought against him. The general feeling in the neighborhood was sorry for him because he has to live with this for the rest of his life. Turned my stomach...the guy should have been indicted for manslaughter and should have lost his hunting license, gun license, whatever, for life.

Instead, they felt sorry for him.

[roguevalley]

66. at her age this could be a desth sentence

Broken pelvis. I would be posses too if my little mom was shot i hope they get it and the cops don't close ranks

[tawadi]

45. Dick Cheney strikes again?

[octothorpe]

57. I'd say such negligence is deserving of jail time, aye?

He should for sure never be allowed to have a hunting license again.

[BobbyBoring]

60. This makes me sick

I don't hunt, but if I did I would not shoot something without knowing what it was. A friend's daughter was killed two years ago by an idiot who didn't even see anything. He just shot at a sound, killing my friends daughter and injuring another student.

http://www.readthehook.com/69459/first-ever-game-dept-sees-ferrums-only-collateral-killing

This dope only got a year. I doubt the cop will get anything.

[JenniferJuniper]

61. My understanding is that the bullet broke her hip; the trooper will be sued civilly

and it won't be cheap. If he doesn't have sufficient personal liability coverage, he may have to cough up some of his own funds.

My parents live about a mile away from this location and 4:55 pm is almost complete darkness this time of year.

[RebelOne]

64. There are dumbass hunters who will shoot at anything that moves.

It was getting dark and this idiot wanted to bag a deer before hunting time was over.

[Politicub]

68. Deer hunters frequently seem to be unhinged

so it's not a surprise the grandmother was the victim of this particular hunter's poor judgement or eyesight.

According to some of the replies, it's the grandmothers fault for walking her dogs during hunting season.

At a minimum, the perpetrator should be barred from ever owning or using another firearm.

[Fourier]

70. Your first point is exactly right. I and every one of my friends who hunt are fanatical about safet

and caution and it makes us crazy to see how inconsiderate and stupid some "hunters" really are.
We don't call them hunters at all, we call them "killing jerks"...

[Rhiannon12866]

76. Locking, does not meet criteria for LBN, feel free to repost in Guns or the state forum. Thanks!