Pence to Kaine at VP debate: 'You whipped out that Mexican thing again'

[EricMaundry]

Source: Yahoo News

Near the end of Tuesday’s vice presidential debate, Mike Pence had had enough of Tim Kaine’s attacks on Donald Trump’s controversial comments about Mexican immigrants.

“When Donald Trump says women should be punished, or Mexicans are rapists and criminals, or John McCain isn’t a war hero, he is showing who he is,” Kaine said.

“Senator, you whipped out that Mexican thing again,” Pence said.

“There was clearly an audible gasp in the room when it happened,” Rep. Ruben Gallego, D-Ariz., the son of Mexican and Colombian immigrants, told Yahoo News in the spin room after the debate. “We’re not a ‘thing’ — we’re U.S. citizens.”

“You would never say ‘the black thing’ or ‘the Jewish thing’ but you somehow feel free to say that Mexican thing — that shows what your priorities would be for the Latino community,” he said.


Read more: https://www.yahoo.com/news/pence-that-mexican-thing-vp-debate-034257523.html

[Frank Cannon]

1. Well, it WAS National Taco Day.

"Is that a taco in your pants, or are you just happy to see me?"

[Coyotl]

42. This is the Mexican Thing Kaine kept whipping:

[center]

And even Pence got in a really good whack, "... and, you know, so his words don't always come out exactly the way he means them."

[Beartracks]

51. "Trump doesnt say what he means." Yeah, THAT'S a quality...

... I want in a President!



==============

[Coyotl]

66. Can't wait for that ad to come out!

Maybe with a B-roll of a pinata bursting and nothing falling out.

[retrowire]

2. i know I cant stop the Democratic freight train here but

You know how we get accused of taking Trump out of context when we're not?

In this instance, we are taking Pence out of context. "That Mexican thing" means, "that Mexican topic" here. He's not calling people things.

I know it looks like juicy ammo, but let's restrain ourselves from looking stupid and lets continue using the ammo that isn't taken out of context.

Just tread lightly.

[msanthrope]

4. Um, no. Your concern that Mr. Pence not be taken out of context completely ignores the reaction of

actual Latinos who heard the remark.

[blue cat]

7. I agree

Very strong point. I'm Latina.

[Tempest]

54. Exactly. And they are not happy.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mike-pence-that-mexican-thing_us_57f4844be4b0325452626fbc?section=&

[BumRushDaShow]

5. Neither Trump nor Pence consider POC as "people"

The fact that Pence refused to denounce what Trump said over and over is what was being highlighted by Kaine.

There is nothing "stupid" in calling out the entire tenor of the GOP campaign, including Pence's dismissive retort about it. And anyone coming on DU to minimize this persistent denigration of POC by that campaign and it being called out, makes one wonder what their agenda is.

[retrowire]

10. sigh. big fucking sigh.

No fucking shit they don't see PoC as people. That's apparent from every other action of theirs.

But this one line isn't it. Jesus fucking Christ people.

Be suspicious of me all you fucking want. I'm seriously getting sick of this bandwagonning, lemming like behavior everybody seems to take without fucking holding their shit together and thinking for a moment.

Our candidate is the best, but needling at shit that actually can be considered out of context does not help our cause. That's right, OUR CAUSE.

If you don't like me, put me on ignore ffs.

ETA: Go see nightmaar's post #8

[BumRushDaShow]

13. Many of us are FUCKING SICK OF THIS SHIT

and you can keep defending it whether it was "one line" or a whole campaign of it.

During the previous election cycles, I had 3 pages of ignored. But I actually have none now since much of the ilk were either PPRd or went off to Discussionist or JPR. You haven't quite reached that level.

[retrowire]

16. i didnt defend it.

Just corrected the misinterpretation of it.

It's still wrong. And just as nightmaar explained, it comes off as if he's treating the topic as an annoyance. But I didn't defend it.

[BumRushDaShow]

18. The fact that you are assigning an "interpretation"

that favors the GOP candidate's response in some benign way, IS "defending it".

You have no idea what he "meant". But those of us who are POC heard what WE perceive as a dog whistle, loud and clear.

[retrowire]

21. i assigned that he meant topic

And that it was disrespectful of the topic in treating it like an annoyance.

That's favors it... How?

Did you have your coffee yet today?

[BumRushDaShow]

22. How the hell do YOU know that he "meant topic"?

Did you talk to him afterwards? Do you have some clairvoyance that others do not possess?

This is "opinion" being passed off as some "fact".

[retrowire]

24. why arent you arguing with nightmaar about this?

We have the same opinion. Seriously, I wanna know. Give a good answer, please.

[BumRushDaShow]

27. You did not go on to acknowledge the perceived insult

You are continuing to defend Pence's remarks as some "misspeak".

[retrowire]

29. when did I say he misspoke?

Ya know, I'm beginning to think you have trouble with context in general since you keep inferring I meant something else.

After all, your interpretation of my words is only opinion after all and bares no weight in regards to fact. So, I'm just going to carry on. I can't explain context to you all day. Take care.

[BumRushDaShow]

31. When you post

Does it make any fucking sense for Prince's response to be "you brought up that Mexican people/person again".

It suggests that you agree that he had an option but chose not to use it, and then you go on to defend the use of a statement that is as loaded as can be given the current societal baked-in bias.

As people have often noted - "Words have meaning".

[JTFrog]

67. Well said. n/t

[zonkers]

38. It's a perfect bookend to trump's "Miss Housekeeping" remark.

[JTFrog]

65. Talk about someone not holding their shit together.....

FFS.

It was the standout line of the debate. Defending this crap is beyond the pale.

[retrowire]

75. where did I defend it? I'll wait. nt

[LanternWaste]

73. I pretend the same thing when I'm dramatically and demonstrably wrong and everyone calls me on it.

"bandwagonning, lemming like behavior everybody seems to take without fucking holding their shit together..."

I pretend the same thing about people when I'm dramatically and demonstrably wrong and everyone calls me on it, regardless of any allegations of sincerity on your part.

[retrowire]

76. You're right

I never should've implied that we should attack the comment for what it is and be careful not to take it out of context lest we lose the credibility of our original argument.

Good work.

[lonestarnot]

12. For shit sakes. That is what he said. Why would you minimize or defend it?

[retrowire]

14. see nightmaar's post #8

I'm not the only one.

Seriously use your brain. Tim Kaine brought up the immigration topic. Does it make any fucking sense for Prince's response to be "you brought up that Mexican people/person again".

No. It doesn't. He is deplorable. There are many reasons his statement is wrong and dismissive and just gross. But he did not mean people as things. He meant the topic as a thing.

[lonestarnot]

15. Zactly.

[Tempest]

59. Latinos WERE gasping. Read it for yourself.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mike-pence-that-mexican-thing_us_57f4844be4b0325452626fbc?section=&

[retrowire]

62. when did I doubt they were gasping? I'll wait. nt

[brush]

33. Are you serious? You don't get that "that Mexican thing" is a belittling insult to Latinos?

WTF?

[retrowire]

34. see post 8. Nightmaar explained my meaning much better.

Thing meant topic. Not person or people. Still disrespectful to the topic and the people. But not referring to people as things.

Thank you.

[brush]

36. No one thought he was referring to people as things.

He was belittling an entire ethnic group by dismissing Trump's insult of Latinos as "that Mexican thing".

That came through loud and clear to most people.

[retrowire]

39. I've seen it taken that way. nt

[awoke_in_2003]

81. Seems pretty simple

doesn't it? I don't know how some can't understand it, but we see people, even here on DU, that can't see past their privilege. I am a white man married to a Mex Am women, and the tRump campaign against Latinos (and everyone else not white) has been screamingly loud and clear for some time.

[Tempest]

61. It doesn't matter what you think. Latinos were offended.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mike-pence-that-mexican-thing_us_57f4844be4b0325452626fbc?section=&

[retrowire]

63. i never said it wasnt offensive. #barkingupthewrongtree nt

[vlyons]

41. Mexican "thing" implies that Trump's

comment about Mexicans being criminals and rapists is insignificant, not important. Let's not bring it up. Let's not talk about it. Well making a derogatorey blanket statement about a whole nation of people is much more than just a "thing," and needs to be addressed.

[retrowire]

44. Totally agree.

But why did you say we shouldn't talk about it? Sarcasm?

Weird, because I never implied we shouldn't talk about it.

It was wrong and belittling.

[vlyons]

50. yes sarcasm

It's Pence who thinks we shouldn't talk about it.

[Coyotl]

46. ^^^ THIS ^^^

[Coyotl]

69. It's like saying, "Hey, that's just Donald talking shit, ignore what he says and listen to me."

As if that's going to sell to the American public ...

They seem to think they can take a whole country down an Orewllian rabbit hole and we won't notice reality is upside down.

[ecstatic]

43. Meanwhile, the MSM and right wingers take Bill Clinton and every other democrat out of context

all the time. Sorry, not going to give Pence a break here.

[retrowire]

45. Two wrongs dont make a right. lets be better than that. nt

[treestar]

57. exactly

It's like they want us to be handicapped.

[Tempest]

52. What matters is how Latinos saw it.

And they completely disagree with you.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mike-pence-that-mexican-thing_us_57f4844be4b0325452626fbc?section=&

[retrowire]

60. they seem to be on the same page as me

Seeing that they inyerpreted "thing" meant the topic of them and not "thing" as they are individually things.

I totally agree with them all.

[Tempest]

64. They're obviously not on the same page as you

They were offended. You're not.

[retrowire]

68. yes i am.

I'm offended that he treated the topic as an annoying thing. I've stated that several times in this thread.

Please continue, I love facepalming myself until my ability to see color fades.

[Tempest]

70. Use a sledgehammer, it's more effective

It'll make it easier for you to forget what you wrote earlier.

See post #18.

[retrowire]

71. post #18 is someone elses post?

Corrected by my reply, post #21.

Oh. There goes the color blue. I liked that color. The facepalming continues.

[treestar]

53. this is DU and you'd expect a Democratic train

since the media does not play fair, it's fair enough. How many times have Democrats' words been taken out of context? It was a mistake for Pence to put it that way. He's deplorable.

[retrowire]

56. That he is. lets keep the train rolling accurately. nt

[Beartracks]

72. Agreed.

I thought it was akin to the "taco trucks on every corner" statement: an inadvertently humorous phrase that brings attention to their overall attitude and policies toward Latinos. But it in no way was it a reference TO Latinos themselves.

==============

[ProfessorGAC]

3. However, Eric. . .

. . .even folks here at DU were apoplectic when Obama used the word "folks" over the Guantanamo issue. So, choice of words is critical, even when people are on the same side.

[n2doc]

6. Excuse me

[Funtatlaguy]

32. Classic line

From a classic movie.

[TexasBushwhacker]

82. That's what I thought of too! n/t

[knightmaar]

8. Maybe you were gasping

I mostly heard giggling.

Regardless of the fact he meant "thing" as "topic", it was still rude, much like McCain pointing at Obama and saying, "that one". It was a weird, dehumanizing moment, in which every black person listening or watching felt a little sting of "that negro over there".

The disregard in his voice is key. "That Mexican Thing", he said, as if to say, "That minor piffle when my running mate slandered a whole ethnic group of people with a broad generalization."

[retrowire]

11. THIS.

Thank you. This is why Pence is wrong. THANK YOU for disseminating the offending context without twisting it to something else.

Hey bumrushdashow you wanna be suspicious of this guy?

[BumRushDaShow]

17. You refuse to accept what post #8 actually described as a reason for why people disagree with you

and merely continue to whine about Pence being taken out of context about what he "meant". You don't know what the fuck he "meant" when he said it. In fact, when under pressure, people often really DO express what they are really thinking (in private) when forced to blurt out an answer, and Pence exposed himself when he did just that.

[retrowire]

19. uhhh

"Regardless of the fact he meant "thing" as "topic", it was still rude, "

That's all my point was.

[BumRushDaShow]

20. Claiming something as a "fact" when it is YOUR "opinion"

is MY point. We disagree and that's that.

[retrowire]

23. from another post

Seriously use your brain. Tim Kaine brought up the immigration topic. Does it make any fucking sense for Prince's response to be "you brought up that Mexican people/person again".

No. It doesn't. He is deplorable. There are many reasons his statement is wrong and dismissive and just gross. But he did not mean people as things. He meant the topic as a thing.

So really... Does it really make factual sense to you that Pence would reply, "oh you brought up that Mexican person/people again" when they were discussing a topic?

[BumRushDaShow]

26. Pence was asked multiple times to answer the questions on immigration

and he continually deflected all night. And it wasn't just "immigration" but it was also the entire Trump dismissal and insulting of anyone other than straight, white (western-European descended), (pseudo)-Christian, non-disabled males.

I.e., it wasn't just the "Mexicans are rapists", it was also Trump's insisting that a Mexican-American judge could not decide a case against Trump because his parents were from Mexico.

So the issue DID resonate throughout the debate, through almost every one of the subjects.

[Tempest]

58. Latinos were gasping.

Read it for yourself.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mike-pence-that-mexican-thing_us_57f4844be4b0325452626fbc?section=&

[knightmaar]

77. Some crowds are less mature ...

"Pulling out your mexican thing ..." ... okay it was really immature. The phrase "pulling out your thing" has a specific, crude meaning among certain people. It took a second to realize we weren't in the middle of a dick joke (which, let's admit it, has been part of this campaign.)

[marble falls]

9. Pence was trying to have a Reagan campaign moment. I hope he keeps on trying. Ironically...

he had a Dan Quail campaign moment: Pence is no John Kennedy, either.

[Nitram]

25. Not fair! You accurately quoted our candidate! Again!

There you go with that accountability thing again!

[Gothmog]

28. New hat

[geardaddy]

49. LOL

Excellent!

[Jim Dandy]

30. Kaine won this debate

Pence is getting clobbered this morning in the press and on-line. That was what Kaine was trying to set up, and he succeeded marvelously.

[nolabels]

35. More like going through the litany of garbage that has been tossed out at all of us

Something stuck, and it's not looking good for that side. Say goodbye to Florida Mr. Trump

[ecstatic]

40. Exactly. I saw it that way last night as well

and the post debate clips/ soundbites prove it. It's OK with me that the media thinks otherwise, especially if Trump is left feeling upstaged by his VP.

[ecstatic]

37. And then Pence proceeded to LIE about what Trump said:

Pence lied when he said that Trump said (regarding undocumented immigrants) "many of them are good people."

Here's what Trump actually said:

“When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.”

"Many of them are good people" is NOT equivalent to "some, I assume, are good people." The word "some" obviously indicates a much smaller amount, but Trump couldn't leave it at that--no, he had to add the phrase "I assume," meaning he wasn't even willing to declare with confidence that some were good people.

There's no way around it: Trump's statement was utterly offensive and racist and Pence is a jackass for defending it.

[Jade Fox]

47. Pence was trying to do the Reagan "There you go again...."

response but, he blew it by adding racism, which even Reagan could figure out not to do.

What an oily creep Pence is.

[truthisfreedom]

48. Ahh, I love the smell of Mexican things being whipped out in the morning...

Smells like... victory.

What a great moment in that debate, huh? Totally redeeming. Somebody give me a boo-yeah!

[Tempest]

55. Latinos react. And they're not happy.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/mike-pence-that-mexican-thing_us_57f4844be4b0325452626fbc?section=&

[bucolic_frolic]

74. Mexican thing?

Trump piñatas are popular on eBay I hear

[dbackjon]

78. I have a new line to say to my Mexican-American Husband :)

[Old Vet]

79. LOL, Your naughty dbackjon..........

[SunSeeker]

80. Pence revealed himself to be every bit the racist as Trump. nt