Concern of Progressive Purge as Bernie Wing 'Left in the Cold' at DNC

[yurbud]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by muriel_volestrangler (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Common Dreams

Sparking concerns that party leadership is making the same mistakes that have rendered them increasingly powerless and without an inspiring vision, the Democratic National Committee (DNC) is reportedly carrying out a massive staff shake-up in which veteran progressives are being purged and "left out in the cold."

"This doesn't bring the party together, it deepens the divide at a time we need all hands on deck," James Zogby, president of the Arab American Institute and prominent Sanders supporter who was ousted from the DNC Executive Committee, wrote on Twitter Thursday.

According to Alex Seitz-Wald of NBC News, Zogby is hardly alone.

"[S]everal key longtime officials have lost their posts" since the staff changes began," Seitz-Wald writes, a fact that many have interpreted as "retaliation for their opposition to DNC Chairman Tom Perez."

Read more: https://www.commondreams.org/news/2017/10/19/concern-progressive-purge-bernie-wing-left-cold-dnc

---

Do Democrats think they can win by further turning their back on progressives and double down on corporate compliance?

Hillary DID win the popular vote, but did party leaders notice their crushing losses in the House, Senate, and state houses?

If party leaders continue with this behavior, they may find they're escorting their own base out the door and into a third party along with progressive politicians who put their constituents who voted for them ahead of Wall St's demands for bailouts, trade, deals, no prosecutions, wars for them, and austerity for the rest of us.

[LisaM]

1. This is sourced from Common Dreams.

I used to like them, but they've gone really, really hard left. Just saying.

[Merlot]

19. I've read the same info elseware

The purging of Sanders supporters really did happen.

[emulatorloo]

44. See Fsogol's post below from another source and summary

Sounds more accurate:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10141893417#post31

CommonDreams is more about click-bait these days than accurate reporting. I take them w a big grain of salt. Jmho ymmv

[LisaM]

47. This article references four people.

It also has lots of phrases like "interpreted as" and "optics".

The optics are not being created by the rank and file of the Democratic party, (in my opinion). A lot of people basically got shoved aside for supporting Hillary too - right before the convention, and if you don't think that was an attempt to undermine the DNC and weaken the message at the convention, then you and I just see this differently.

[Wellstone ruled]

79. That was my take on this.

After all the crap,still jumped into the trenches and supported Hillary.

Have to say this,there was communication issues with Headquarters during the last four or five days of the campaign.

[SergeStorms]

82. Not for nothing...

but I hate the insertion of the word 'optics' into every conversation lately. Sorry to interrupt, I just had to get that off my chest.

[LisaM]

84. LOL, well, I just quoted it.

I don't love it either, but we get stuck with the jargon of our times, unfortunately.

[SergeStorms]

90. I wasn't blaming you...

I don't think any Democrat would personally turn that word loose on an unsuspecting public. It was probably someone like KellyAnne Conway who's to blame.

[delisen]

99. How many people ?

[samnsara]

32. i hear ya.

[Ken Burch]

67. There was a link at MSN last night that covered it essentially the same way.

It's not as simple as saying "oh, it's Common Dreams".

[coolsandy]

2. I don't give a crap!! Just put together a winning coalition to get rid of the slime in the WH and

in the House and Senate now.

[jrthin]

3. Bingo. nt

[lagomorph777]

13. A coalition without progressives already exists.

It's called the GOP.

[bettyellen]

14. So you're sliming all Dems except the "revolution" here? Duly noted.

[lagomorph777]

25. Uh, no. You seem a little on edge.

I would hope that it's not even arguable (post-FDR) that Dems are supposed to stand for the working person, the oppressed, the downtrodden, and basic moral decency. That is my definition of progressivism. Notice the "B" word is not in there anywhere.

[Bradical79]

58. Obviously not

But a purging of progressives would certainly move the Democratic Party in that direction.

[FiveGoodMen]

39. Thank you!

[Chasstev365]

86. Ding Ding Ding Ding: We have a winner!

[Duppers]

107. Yes !!

Thank you.

[Ken Burch]

18. Firing progressives and replacing them with bland, tame centrists can't help us do that.

The only votes we can win over are people as far to the left as we are now or further.

None of the "socially liberal, fiscally conservative" types(assuming such people exist anymore)voted for Trump.

[emulatorloo]

46. See other links in thread

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10141893417#post31

https://www.democraticunderground.com/10141893417#post31

IMHO CommonDreams is more about clickbait these days than accuracy.

[Johnyawl]

4. "[S]everal key longtime officials have lost their posts"...

..."did party leaders notice their crushing losses in the House, Senate, and state houses?" Well, perhaps they did notice the loses and got rid of those responsible.

[Ken Burch]

20. No one on the left of the party was responsible for that.

Everything that such people suggested in the fall was disregarded.

[red dog 1]

64. + 1

[Johnyawl]

89. No one on the left of the pafrty...

...bears any responsibility whatsoever for the lose the of the House, Senate and state Houses? Not even a little bit of responsibility for what has befallen the Democrats over the past three election cycles?

"Everything that such people suggested in the fall was disregarded" What was suggested that was disregarded, and who suggested it?

[Ken Burch]

94. Centering the fall campaign on the platform rather than on shouting "Stop Trump!" was disregarded

Consistency on TPP was disregarded.

The advice to send the candidate to Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania, rather than to states everyone knew we weren't going to carry, was disregarded.

We ran a lesser-evil campaign when we didn't HAVE to. We didn't need to run as though the right had already won the argument and all we could do was call for tinkering around the edges.

I say this as someone who, when I wasn't out canvassing(and doorbelling, which is the same thing as canvassing)for the ticket was doing all I could to get people to our left to vote for the ticket on anti-fascist grounds. They SHOULD have voted for us(I don't defend their not doing so)and I'm convinced that had we made those small changes they WOULD have.

[WhiteTara]

5. Symone Sanders is kicking the BnBs to the curb?

Someone doesn't want the Democrats to be unified. More shit stirring. I hope few take the bait.

[YOHABLO]

6. This is not what I want to hear. It's divisive and it's going to play right into the GOPs hands.

[red dog 1]

61. + 1

[obamanut2012]

7. I'm a Dem and a progressive -- why do you use the terms exclusive of one another?

I see this all the time. Why?

[Steven Maurer]

10. Because to the Busters - they're the only real progressives

Basically, as far as they're concerned, unless you agree that Democrats are corrupt and basically as right wing as Republicans are, notwithstanding all evidence to the contrary, you're not a progressive.

The stupid part of this is that they're hurting real progressivism almost as much as the NAZIs are hurting the GOP. You would think our people would be smarter, but nope.

They do make for some stinky shit-stirring though. And that drives page-clicks, which is why you see these articles all out of proportion to their actual numbers, even among the people who strongly supported Sanders in the primary.

[pangaia]

26. They They They They.

Who is this THEY of which you speak?

Me?

[The Mouth]

35. Me, too, I think.

Healthcare as a right, marriage equality, and an absolute support for the right of a woman to choose regarding pregnancy seem to be "hard left" to some.

I'll give Perez the benefit of the doubt, for now, though.

[LanternWaste]

48. People who use the terms

"Who is this THEY of which you speak?"

People who use the terms Democrat and progressive exclusive of one another seems the obvious inference of the "they" object. (object, subject, predicate, etc...)

[Steven Maurer]

65. Did you (holding your nose or not) vote for Hillary in the general?

Like Senator Sanders asked you to do?


Answer that question, and the answer to your own will become obvious.

[Bradical79]

76. It was said directly in the title who "they" are

Busters aka "Bernie or Bust" voters that pushed an anti-Clinton, and anti-Democrat, agenda even after the primaries.

[Bradical79]

72. I'd even say a good chunk of the vocal BoB castoffs are frauds

I've seen enough RT posts and Russian (and anti-Democratic authoritarians) apologists on their forums (and here pre-primaries) to know they aren't lacking in actual Russian operators.

A lot seem to be just anti-American in general, or Russophiles.

[murielm99]

100. You need to throw around a few of their buzzwords.

Corporate, establishment, third way, economic justice, social justice, identity politics. Don't forget to whine about the DLC, which has not existed for years.

Any party, or faction of a party that has to use jargon to express itself, jargon that needs explanation to the general voter, is a lost cause. They are boring, juvenile and not worth my time.

[Steven Maurer]

106. Actually, I myself am 100% in favor of social and economic justice

I just define it as putting mechanisms in place to discourage racist policing, racist and sexist hiring practices, and other sorts of bigotry, that keep so many people from fulfilling their true potential. And getting rid of tax loopholes that are turning the US into a plutocracy.

I also want to make people's lives better, not immediately start screaming about Democrats being "corrupt" because they didn't prosecute the bankers for activities that (however unsavory they were), were still technically legal at the time. That would have gotten us nowhere.

I just don't get how anyone can think that letting Republicans take over all levers of the government is going to "teach" anyone anything.

[Bradical79]

69. Depends on who's talking

The Progressive caucus is a sub-group in the Democratic party, a term used to denote Democrats and independents with progressive values seperately from the party structure, and also has been used by some extreme Clinton fans as a pejorative because the Bernie or Bust voters call themselves progressives. Some also don't like the way progressives tend to criticize some Democrats if they say or do something deplorable or harmful. Absolute unquestioning loyalty is important to a few here.

Edit: There's also the self segregation of the "Bernie or Bust" crowd, Greens, and some other supposed left wing progressives.

[Me.]

8. This Doesn't Represent The Changes Being Made Correctly

"The diversity that is being introduced? And while The party is doubling the representation of millennials and Native Americans on the DNC and increasing the number of Puerto Ricans.

Larry Cohen, a labor liaison for Sanders. Two other former Clinton campaign workers, Emmy Ruiz and Craig Smith, are also among Perez’s slate of new at-large members, along with Sanders’s former press secretary, Symone Sanders.

The slate includes 21 union representatives, an increase from recent years. Among them: Randi Weingarten of the American Federation of Teachers, Lily Eskelsen Garcia of the National Education Association, and Lee Saunders of the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees.

Others chosen to be at-large members are Ellie Perez of Arizona, an undocumented immigrant who arrived in the United States as a child and is enrolled in the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program; Marisa Richmond, a transgender African-American woman; and four people from Puerto Rico."

[bettyellen]

16. It's anti-Dem propaganda.

[Me.]

37. Precisely

A lot of nonsense being spread around

[Eliot Rosewater]

54. Designed to insure GOP retains power in lieu of them not having power.

[byronius]

23. Thanks for that burst of fact.

[GaryCnf]

34. Thanks

It's amazing how a little dose of truth changes the story AND gets us away from each others' throats.

[blaze]

45. Thank you nt

[Eliot Rosewater]

56. You are correct, btw do you know who LOVES to see the Democratic Party attacked like this?

[msongs]

9. nice analysis and opinion piece from a blog nt

[Blue_Adept]

11. Only Bernie Progressives Are Real Progressives

[Ken Burch]

24. No...but if you replace a Sanders person with someone else

what else can it be but a swing to the right in that position?

[Fresh_Start]

40. It could be a swing to the left representing other members of the democratic base

like minorities, women, LGBT, immigrants, etc.

[Ken Burch]

43. Sanders supporters are equally in solidarity with all of those groups.

And plenty of them were and are minorities, women, LGBTQ, immigrants.

In reality, we are ALL equally supportive of social justice.

There was never any difference between Sanders and Clinton SUPPORTERS on that.

[LanternWaste]

50. Simplistic allegations lacking objective evidence. Again.

Simplistic allegations lacking objective evidence. Again.

[Ken Burch]

57. The simplistic allegation is the assertion that Clinton supporters backed social justice

but Sanders supporters didn't. There was never any basis for the claim that Sanders supporters didn't care about people of color, or women, or LGBTQ people(or that the only people who backed Bernie were privileged young white men).

A lot of people from all demographics backed BOTH candidates...and it's time to admit that, among supporters, there was never a difference on commitment to social justice.

I say that as a person who thinks Bernie shouldn't run. He personally got it wrong on his expression of some things-but his supporters were never to blame for that and never shared his shortcomings on that.

OK?

[mdbl]

96. Personally, I think that narrative was spread by russian trolls

or kellyanne trolls, take your pick.

[Me.]

41. Nonsense

[lancelyons]

12. One side of the Bernie supporters face they say we need new Blood. On the other side of their face..

One side of the Bernie supporters face they say we need new Blood. On the other side of their face they get pissed when the old blood are their guys.

We lost the last election and we need a new run at this. Doesnt mean you dont ask experienced people what to do but you take a different approach.

The DNC voted perez in to turn things around and shake it up. That is what he is doing.

[Ken Burch]

21. "Shaking it up" doesn't mean moving further to the right.

And that's the only thing that removing somebody like Jim Zogby could mean.

We didn't lose because of anything the chair of the Resolutions Committee did.

[pangaia]

27. In my view it is not shaking up anything.

it is doing just the opposite.

I could be wrong.

[leftofcool]

36. How is adding diversity wrong?

[stonecutter357]

15. you seem very concerned !

[Sam McGee]

17. Do you understand . . .

. . . the major reason for GOP "crushing" wins in the House and states is gerrymandering after the 2010 census?

Read: "Ratf###ed: The True Story Behind the Secret Plan to Steal America's Democracy."

[Cryptoad]

28. Welcome to DU,,,,,Comrade!

[Tarheel_Dem]

22. Yup. They noticed. Hence the dismissals.

[samnsara]

29. we shouldnt have ANY wing! we need to be united! dammit!

..UNITE NOW unless you want fat cheeto man to be YOUR president again.

[Ken Burch]

52. "Unite" can't be code for "shut up and do what you're told, dammit!".

Unity can't ever be built by ordering discussion to stop.

[H2O Man]

30. That's self-defeating.

Just the opposite of what is needed.

Recommended.

[FSogol]

31. The Hill had a good summary of the changes:

Americans currently represented at the DNC. It will also increase the DNC’s LGBT presence and representation from Puerto Ricans, at a time when Trump has been criticized for his response to the hurricane that has devastated the island territory.

Perez’s delegate slate also includes Ellie Perez, a so-called Dreamer — an immigrant brought to the U.S. without legal permission as a child — from Arizona, and Marisa Richmond, a transgender African-American woman. If Perez’s slate of delegates is approved, it would bring the total number of unions represented by at-large DNC members to 21, which the source said was the highest mark in years.

“This year’s slate of at-large DNC member nominees reflects the unprecedented diversity of our party’s coalition,” DNC national press secretary Michael Tyler said in a statement to The Hill......................................

Perez’s slate of delegates also includes several names that will be familiar in Washington and in Democratic circles, including former interim DNC chairwoman Donna Brazile.

Several supporters of Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) are also on Perez’s list, including former Sanders spokeswoman Symone Sanders.
...............
Two people who challenged Perez for DNC chair have been nominated — Rep. Keith Ellison (D-Minn.) and former South Carolina Democratic chairman Jaime Harrison. ..........................

Labor leader Randi Weingarten, who backed Ellison in the DNC chair race over Perez, is also nominated.

Common Dreams is nothing more than malcontents that want to divide us.

[Ken Burch]

49. Nobody's against diversity.

But it's not as though the only way to get diversity was to fire nobody but Keith supporters.

[emulatorloo]

53. FSogol's post mentions several Keith people who are nominated

[Ken Burch]

59. I hope it all works out.

But can you understand the distrust this creates?

The Zogby thing particularly bothers me. Why blame the guy who chairs the Resolutions Committee for anything? And does this mean the party is going to get totally Likudnik on I/P issues?

[emulatorloo]

60. Sure. But I want more information

[Ken Burch]

62. Think we'll get any?

[emulatorloo]

63. Yes

Other sources than CommonDreams will report on this

[Ken Burch]

93. I didn't learn about it from Common Dreams. There was a link on MSN about it last night.

n/t.

[emulatorloo]

83. This article a little more detailed

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/10/18/16489504/democrats-perez-dnc-unity

[FSogol]

87. The list shows Sanders supporters who were added also.

SOP: divide, divide, divide!

[emulatorloo]

51. Can you add a link?

agreed CommonDreams has lost their way. Lots of Clickbait

[FSogol]

88. Link:

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/355954-dnc-chairman-aims-for-diversity-with-delegate-nominations

[zentrum]

33. Well said, yurbud.

[snowybirdie]

38. Bernie

isn't a Democrat.

[samnsara]

42. i dont like the centrist vs progressive lable.. its leaving a lot of people out...

..who the fuck knows me and how dare ANYONE label my ideas progressive or centrist or what ever the fuck? I AM A DEMOCRAT! I have a whole range of likes, ideas, preferences, druthers...all an accumulation of my lifetime of experiences and personal values..... I am totally ProChoice but on the other hand, I LIKE and own guns....and frankly I can see where the death penalty is sometimes the only answer. What I DONT like are bullies and I saw a LOT of that on the Dem side during the campaign. ..against EACH OTHER... and frankly I'm still waiting for an apology. But don't you DARE try to pigeon hole me into some convenient compartment. If you are a Democrat then dammit you're a Democrat. What's the alternative? We will NEVER have the perfect candidate but I see a lot of ppl willing to sacrifice possibility for perfection....

[Sunlei]

55. Nope I love Bernie Sanders and that man is one of D party's HUGEEE Friend, we love all of them

no one gets him, he's ours forever.

[jmowreader]

66. Well, we do need an inspiring vision

That vision has to also be an achievable vision. Quite a bit of the Progressives' "inspiring vision" is not achievable. The Progressive Triumvirate seems to be the $15 Nationwide Minimum Wage, Free College For All and Free Healthcare For All. We won't get any of them and demanding our politicians adopt them is a sure-fire recipe for disaster in November.

If you want to see what unachievable vision does to a party, look at the one Trump is in. He's not going to be able to get rid of Obamacare. He can't get rid of abortion or gay rights and he probably won't be able to cut taxes as severely as he likes. Bubba, if you thought Democrats were unkind to President Obama when he didn't give them everything they wanted the second he got into office...well, you ain't seen nothing yet.

[Vinca]

68. This is a recipe for disaster.

Split the party and guarantee 2 terms of Trump and a continuing GOP majority.

[red dog 1]

70. DNC Chairman Tom Perez needs to be replaced with someone who wants to UNITE the Party,

and not divide it.

If Hillary Clinton had united the Democratic Party by choosing either Sanders or Warren as her running mate, Trump would be in his Tower today, instead of in the Oval Office, imo.

But she chose Tim Caine, a ConservaDem from Virginia, and that led to her defeat, imo.
(Plus Comey's letter, plus GOP voter suppression, plus voting machine tampering, plus Putin)



(NOTE: These are only my OPINIONS, and I'm entitled to them!)

[MrsCoffee]

95. Oh please.

Because that would have made up for the collusion, Comey, gerrymandering, voter suppression and theft of the election.

And it's rich to see some folks talking about replacing anyone with someone who wants to UNITE the party. You mean as opposed to someone out there bashing the party daily? Like the guy you wanted her to choose for VP? Give us a break.

[PSPS]

71. LOL. The reaction to this post sure demonstrates how effective russian trolls are in sowing division

[LisaM]

77. Precisely.

There may have been other reports of these changes, but I tend to avoid Common Dreams now, because of their slanted headlines, narrow focus, and hatred of the Democratic party. Which is too bad, because ten or twelve years ago, I liked them.

[red dog 1]

92. So you think that anyone who disagrees with DNC Chair Tom Perez is a Russian troll?

Are the millions of Democrats who voted for Bernie Sanders, and who were disappointed that HRC didn't choose him as her running mate all Russian trolls too?

LOL?
There's nothing funny about the fact that Comb-Over Boy is in the White House, instead of Hillary Clinton.

To me, "the reaction to this post" shows that the Democratic Party is still a divided party, and a divided Democratic Party probably won't do well in next year's midterm elections.

[mdbl]

97. why not? a divided GOP seems to do well

so what's the impetus there? could it be the trolls were on their side?

[PSPS]

103. LOL. Thanks for proving my point!

[Justice]

73. the one person replaced I disagreed with was Ray Buckley from New Hampshire

Ray has been exceptional - and NH Democrats delivered for Senate and President in the last election.

Lost the governorship but will work to get that back next year.

[Honeycombe8]

74. That doesn't seem like a progressive purge. It's a purge of those who worked against the new leader.

I don't know about the past. Have past leaders had members of the board who worked against the new leader, and then the party kept those members on the board, knowing they worked against who is now their new leader? I don't know. It sounds like maybe that's a normal thing to do. But I don't know.

More infighting does not bode well for the party, though.

[left-of-center2012]

75. Are they telling Sanders supporters to "Take a hike- we don't want you"?

[hatrack]

78. Crushing losses in the House and Senate in 2016? +2 Senate, +6 House

https://ballotpedia.org/United_States_Congress_elections,_2016

Of course, I'm guessing that winning neither house may be your point here.

[delisen]

101. Crushing Losses happened in 2010

[hatrack]

105. True, but to quote directly from Yurbud's post:

Hillary DID win the popular vote, but did party leaders notice their crushing losses in the House, Senate, and state houses?

I hear what you're saying, though.

[SergeStorms]

80. Here we go.......round 3,278 of the...

eternal Hillary/Bernie championship fight.

[Lunabell]

81. Double down and lose again.

Sigh.

[Lil Missy]

85. This is a good sign IMO. Purging the most

Far left will actually improve the Democratic Party. Less divisive without them.

[Loyd]

91. .

[delisen]

98. Those crushing losses started in 2010.

The self-style progressives who think there was a sudden turning against the Democratic Party in certain states in 2016 apparently were not paying attention between 2010 and 2016.

The Wisconsin upset for example happened in 2010, not 2016.

In 2008 Wisconsin was a blue state. Passage of ACA yielded Tea Party Scott Walker and Republican legislators way back in 2010.

[Blue_Tires]

102. It's funny because the prominent Berniestans on twitter

have been talking about nothing but purging out the "Establishment" Dems and Blue Dogs like Pelosi and Feinstein for months (But don't ask them about their efforts to unseat purple district republicans because they'll act like you lost your goddamed mind)... For all their bullshit 'unity' rhetoric, they sure as shit haven't learned how to play well with others, have they? Over a year later, it's still their way or the highway and nobody has clued them in to the fact that there's only ONE FUCKING WAY and that road is still being constructed. Over a year later they're still attacking Black Twitter and Obama with impunity and then have the nerve to wonder why black folks aren't leaping at the chance to kiss the ass of their glorious 'revolution'... Over a year later with no significant gains or leverage they're still discussing a total party takeover the way the French discussed storming the Bastille... Over a year later their "I hate every Dem who doesn't have Bernie's blessing!/I hate Trump!" ratio of tweets is still hovering around a 90%/10% split... Right now I'm this close to telling the whole lot to fuck off and form their own party so they can at least officially stop pretending to be Dems...

Sorry if I'm stepping on toes, but I'm calling it exactly like I fucking see it... And once again I'll say for the record that Bernie Sanders could make a lot of this go away by joining the party, telling his biggest influencers on social media to fall in line, and having those people rein in the most vocal nutbars who don't fall in line... But who cares -- I only pointed out every major strategic mistake that the Sanders campaign was making in real time, but what the hell do I know??

Oh and by the way, Zogby isn't exactly an impartial party in this, and there are probably some honestly legit reasons why he isn't going...

EDIT: For the record, I *DID* vote for Sanders in the VA primary, so think twice before trying to start shit....

[Binkie The Clown]

104. Ask me again why the Dems keep losing.

Establishment Dems are their own worst enemies. And when we lose again in 2020 don't go scratching your heads wondering why.

[muriel_volestrangler]

108. Locking - this is opinion, not news

The news was covered in an earlier LBN thread: https://www.democraticunderground.com/10141892818

Please either continue this discussion there, or repost in GD. Thanks.