The U.S. Is Losing Badly In Afghanistan, But The Trump Administration Is Telling Americans Less

[DonViejo]

Source: Newsweek Magazine




BY TOM O'CONNOR ON 1/31/18 AT 2:53 PM

The U.S. and allied local security forces have failed to secure most of Afghanistan, according to a recent investigation that came shortly after the Pentagon refused to release unclassified data on the conflict for the first time ever.

Despite waging nearly 17 consecutive years of war and spending up to $1 trillion, the U.S.-led attempt to defeat the Taliban has left the insurgents openly active in up to 70 percent of Afghanistan, according to a BBC study published Tuesday. The report also found that a rival ultraconservative Sunni Muslim organization, the Islamic State militant group (ISIS), controlled more territory than ever, further complicating the beleaguered effort to stabilize the country.

What a federal watchdog chief found particularly "troubling" and a "worrying development," however, was that none of this information could be included in its mandatory quarterly report on the war. John Sopko, head of the Special Inspector General for Afghanistan Reconstruction (SIGAR), said he was instructed by the Department of Defense "not to release to the public data on the number of districts, and the population living in them, controlled or influenced by the Afghan government or by the insurgents, or contested by both."

Aa letter preceding SIGAR's report added, "SIGAR was informed this quarter that DOD has determined that although the most recent numbers are unclassified, they are not releasable to the public."

Read more: http://www.newsweek.com/us-losing-so-badly-afghanistan-trump-administration-hid-figures-796466

[YessirAtsaFact]

1. No foreign power that I know of has ever won in Afghanistan

Tribal culture, great terrain for guerilla warfare and stubborn fighters.

[AtheistCrusader]

3. W's legacy lives on.

And on and on

[EX500rider]

14. Many invaders have won, but there wasn't enough to keep them there.

Afghanistan partially fell to the Achaemenid Empire after it was conquered by Darius I of Persia.

Alexander the Great invaded what is today Afghanistan in 330 BC as part of war against Persia. Comprising the easternmost satrapies of Persia, Afghanistan provided some challenging battles in his conquest of the remaining lands of Persia. Renamed Bactria, and settled with his Ionian veterans.
Following the death of Alexander and the partition of his kingdom, the Province of Bactria was under the rule of Alexander's former general, Seleucus, who now formed the Seleucid Dynasty, with its capital in Babylon. But the Greek Soldiers in Bactria, based on the remoteness of their territory, declared independence, defeated Seleucid armies sent to reconquer them, and founded the Greco-Bactrian Kingdom, which lasted for more than three centuries in Afghanistan, and western India. This Greek Kingdom called Bactria carried on Greek culture while completely cut off from Europe for three centuries.

The last Greek Kingdom in Afghanistan was conquered by the Kushan invaders in the first century AD, a full three centuries after Alexander. But Greek language continued to be used by the Kushans in their coinage for the next several centuries.

In the seventh to ninth centuries, following the disintegration of the Sassanid Persian Empire and Roman Empire, leaders in the world theatre for the last four centuries and archrivals, the area was again invaded from the west, this time by Umar, second Caliph of the Rashidun Caliphate, in the Islamic conquest of Afghanistan, eventually resulting in the conversion of most of its inhabitants to Islam.

In the Mongol invasion of Khwarezmia (1219-1221), Genghis Khan invaded the region from the northeast in one of his many conquests to create the huge Mongol Empire. His armies slaughtered thousands in the cities of Kabul, Kandahar, Jalalabad etc. After Genghis Khan returned to Mongolia, there was a rebellion in the region of Helmand which was brutally put down by his son and successor Ogedei Khan who put all residents of Ghazni and Helmand to the sword in 1222 and their women were inslaved and sold. Thereafter most parts of Afghanistan other the extreme south-eastern remained under Mongol rule as part of the Ilkhanate and Chagatai Khanate.

From 1383 to 1385, the Afghanistan area was conquered from the north by Timur, leader of neighboring Transoxiana (roughly modern-day Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, and adjacent areas), and became a part of the Timurid Empire. Timur was from a Turko-Mongol tribe and although a Muslim, saw himself more as an heir of Genghis Khan. Timur's armies caused great devastation and are estimated to have caused the deaths of 17 million people. He brought great distruction on Afghanistan's south, slaughtering thousands and enslaving an equal number of women. Allied with the Uzbeks, Hazaras and other Turkic communities in the north his dominance over Afghanistan was long-lasting, allowing him for his future successful conquests in Central Anatolia against the Ottomans.

During the nineteenth century, Afghanistan was invaded twice from British India, during the First Anglo-Afghan War of 1838–1842 with the intention of limiting Russian influence in the country and quelling raiding from across the border. Unlike previous invasions of Afghanistan, the 1842 invasion failed. After the Indian Mutiny, they launched a second invasion for the same reasons in the Second Anglo-Afghan War of 1878–1880, and succeeded, capturing the major cities and forcing Afghanistan into a subservient quasi-client status. A final conflict emerged in the Third Anglo-Afghan War, when the Afghan government tried to use the aftermath of World War One to break with British overlordship, but after Afghan defeats on the field it ended with a compromise that saw Afghan control over its' foreign affairs be reasserted at the expense of having a permanent British diplomatic mission in Kabul.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasions_of_Afghanistan

[AtheistCrusader]

2. Vietnam 2.0 and nobody even seems to care anymore.

[hexola]

4. That's the sense I have too

These stories have not cut through all the domestic drama.

[YessirAtsaFact]

5. Its not on TV and there is no draft

Just a bunch of poor folks getting shot up over and over.

Sucks

[7962]

6. Depends on how you define "winning".

if they control a lot of countryside and mountains but no cities, then what do they really have? Every time they mount an offensive, they get slaughtered. So we dont need many troops in country to accomplish that, along with a few A-10s

[howardmappel]

20. Definition of winning

If you can't leave the security of your compound with a significant armed escort, if girls and women cannot go to school safely, if suicide bombers from allegedly friendly forces keep killing you and if you can't travel from city to city without being killed, I would say you are not winning. And to say that they don't control cities -- tell me they don't control cities when you can move about freely and they don't have immediate knowledge of all your movements. You need to stop thinking the first person shooter games are real. IRL the "bad" guys are just as brave the good guys, often have better intelligence and in this case they sure have a whole lot more of the population supporting them than us.

[7962]

24. See reply #10 for the biggest necessity.

But what are we to do; leave totally and let the Taliban retake the country and resume their "cleansing" of 1/2 the population? Go in full strength again and relate them back to the mountains?
I don't support the either option; especially #2. they're not worth it. But we also cant totally leave the country to them either.
But it will always be a shithole until the Afghanis, as a whole, want to take the effort to stop it

[Cold War Spook]

28. And they are more willing

to die for their country.

[gibraltar72]

7. Winning Bigly.

[UpInArms]

8. History will tell the story ...

The last winner in Afghanistan was Genghis Khan

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasions_of_Afghanistan

Mongol Empire

In the Mongol invasion of Khwarezmia (1219-1221), Genghis Khan invaded the region from the northeast in one of his many conquests to create the huge Mongol Empire. His armies slaughtered thousands in the cities of Kabul, Kandahar, Jalalabad etc. After Genghis Khan returned to Mongolia, there was a rebellion in the region of Helmand which was brutally put down by his son and successor Ogedei Khan who put all residents of Ghazni and Helmand to the sword in 1222 and their women were inslaved and sold. Thereafter most parts of Afghanistan other the extreme south-eastern remained under Mongol rule as part of the Ilkhanate and Chagatai Khanate.

The enduring legacy of the Mongols is the presence of the Hazara people, who are the descendants of Mongol soldiers of the Ilkhanate. As the Mongol rulers in the Middle East were mostly settled in Iran as a base to control their dominions in the middle-east, their conversion to Shiaism was quick as during that period their was a rapid Shiitization of Iran and the region around it. The Hazaras in Afghanistan too hence adapted Shiaism, however are a mixture of Mongol soldiers who intermarried with the local Uzbek, Pashtun, Tajik and Turkoman women. Mostly Turkomen and Uzbek, hence retaining their distinct Mongoloid facial heuristics - since Uzbeks and Turkoman are part of the larger Turkic family. The Hazara constitute the majority of Shia adherents in Afghanistan today. Additionally, many areas of Afghanistan are named after Mongol leaders, including Band-e-Timur (meaning "Timur's block&quot in Maywand District in Kandahar Province, the only district never taken from the Taliban throughout the western intervention of the 21st century, Jaghatu District (named in honor of Chagatai) in Wardak Province, and the village of Wech Baghtu in Shah Wali Kot District, named after Batu.[3]

[getagrip_already]

9. I for one am tired of winning.... n/t

[NCDem777]

10. At the end of the day, the Afghanis gotta want it

We can't hold their hand.

[7962]

22. Sums it up pretty well.nt

[zipplewrath]

11. Shoulda listened to Biden

For the life of me I don't understand why we are still there.

[neohippie]

12. Let's not forget Putin is supporting Taliban

Russia has been actively supporting and aiding the Taliban


More about this on stories by following the links

https://thediplomat.com/2017/02/4-reasons-russia-increasingly-favors-the-taliban-in-afghanistan/

Russia reminds the West not to ignore Moscow’s interests in discussions of the Afghanistan agenda at regional and international platforms. In January 2016, a Quadrilateral Coordination Group (QCG) was formed for to advance the peace process, with the participation of the United States, China, Pakistan, and Afghanistan. The four states conducted meetings on talks with the Taliban; Russia felt marginalized, thought the QCG’s efforts ultimately failed.

Moscow instead organized a trilateral meeting on Afghanistan attended by Russia, China, and Pakistan, later supported by Iran. By this, Moscow alerted the West to the fact that Russia can play a role in Afghanistan, including by forming another regional coalition. Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov, in his visit to Kabul last week, announced an international meeting on a peace process with the participation of Russia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, China, Iran, and India to be held in February this year in Moscow. Neither the United States nor any NATO member state has been invited yet.

Second, by supporting the Taliban, Russian policymakers intend to strengthen barriers to U.S. and NATO interests in the region. Since 2001, more than 2,300 American soldiers have died in Afghanistan in the fight against the Taliban and al-Qaeda. Moscow also intends to expand its influence beyond Central Asia — covering Afghanistan and Pakistan — apart from being involved in Middle East.

and



https://www.reuters.com/article/us-afghanistan-russia/ties-between-russia-and-the-taliban-worry-afghan-u-s-officials-idUSKBN13W2XJ

Afghan and American officials are increasingly worried that any deepening of ties between Russia and Taliban militants fighting to topple the government in Kabul could complicate an already precarious security situation.

Russian officials have denied they provide aid to the insurgents, who are contesting large swathes of territory and inflicting heavy casualties, and say their limited contacts are aimed at bringing the Taliban to the negotiating table.

Leaders in Kabul say Russian support for the Afghan Taliban appears to be mostly political so far.

But a series of recent meetings they say has taken place in Moscow and Tajikistan has made Afghan intelligence and defence officials nervous about more direct support including weapons or funding.

[7962]

23. That cant be true, because if it was Trump would call them out on it. RIGHT?

I bring that up anytime any friends talk about "nothing between Russia and trump".
He'd be all over any other country arming our direct enemy

[neohippie]

25. Yeah right... lol

Like there are reports that the North Koreans are using Ukrainian missile technology to advance there ICBM program, and guess who is suspected of providing that tech?

Also, Russia is aiding Iran, Syria, and China, Russia and Iran are all violating the sanctions and still doing business with North Korea.


And we also know that Iran and the Armenian mafia (with ties right back to Putin) are smuggling products like olive oil, almonds, even pomegranate juice illegally and some of those are getting dumped into the US and hurting our own farmers, by lowering the value of their goods,

Also we know that Russia is violating a missile treaty with the US by developing and advancing cruise missiles,


Do you think that the Trump State Department is raising any of these issues or that Trump himself discusses any of that with Putin?

They are only interested in one goal, to reset US Russia relations so that the Gas and Oil industry here can profit as well as to repay the Russian oligarchs by removing the sanctions that are effectively keeping the Russian economy from growing at the pace that Putin needs

Let's face it, Putin, and China are having a field day with the current American administration.

[dewsgirl]

26. Pretty terrifying isn't it? Especially since Russia is likely dictating

Our foreign policy/strategy.

[harun]

27. Let's not forget Pakistan's Role, Trump withheld aid and now it is payback time

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/01/04/trump-administration-pakistan-aid-325401

[ffr]

13. Wait, tRump lied, with Pence, Ryan and other conservatives applauding?

Liars!

Lock them up!

[procon]

15. Did Trump even mention Afghanistan in his SOTU speech...

Since we're still in a perpetual war over there, seems like the least he could would be to give them a shout out from behind the safety of his podium.

[Bradical79]

19. I think he did

Something about no timelines and not telling people our plans.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

16. Hold on now! Are these people implying that "Bombing the shit out of them." didn't

magically work.

[mwooldri]

17. So we find this out from... the British Broadcasting Corporation.

At least I know the BBC is in the "truth" business. Trump & Co? Just their alternative fact reality...

[mia]

18. Erik Prince has plans for Afghanistan: Military occupation for profit, not security

Erik Prince’s dark plan for Afghanistan: Military occupation for profit, not security

Lost in the cascade of stories of potential White House criminality and collusion with foreign governments is the Erik Prince affair. It is reported that Prince, the brother of controversial Education Secretary Betsy Devos who established his power in Washington with his mercenary army Blackwater during the Iraq war, met with Russian intermediaries in an obscure Indian Ocean archipelago to establish back-channel communication with Moscow, possibly in coordination with the efforts of Jared Kushner, who last week was reported to have sought a White House back channel to the Kremlin.

Bloomberg reports that during the presidential transition late last year “Prince was very much a presence, providing advice to Trump’s inner circle, including his top national security adviser, Michael T. Flynn.” While President-elect Trump, in reality show style, paraded administration applicants through the gilded front doors of of Trump Tower for the gauntlet of cameras, Prince “entered Trump Tower through the back,” reports Bloomberg.

Prince met at least several times with the Trump team, according to the multiply sourced reporting, including once on a train from New York to Washington, where Prince met with Peter Thiel associate Kevin Harrington, who would later join the National Security Council and be tasked with “strategic planning.” Prince is said to have advised Harrington, Flynn and others on the Trump transition team on the “restructuring of security agencies” and “a thorough rethink of costly defense programs.”

The account sounds innocuous enough as reported, but Prince’s recent appearance on Fox News’ “Tucker Carlson Tonight” sheds considerable light on what the series of furtive discussions likely entailed. The appearance might have been an effort to generate public support for what Prince advocated in private. The man who reinvented mercenary warfare described to Carlson a vision for a corporate military occupation apparatus that makes his infamous Blackwater look modest, despite its capturing of $1 billion in contracts during the Iraq war and occupation. Prince proposed nothing less than the revival of the British East India Company model of for-profit military occupation, wherein an armed corporation effectively governed most of India for the extraction of resources....

https://www.salon.com/2017/06/03/erik-princes-dark-plan-for-afghanistan-military-occupation-for-profit-not-security/

[howardmappel]

21. Erik Prince's plan for Afghanistan

Erik Prince's plan is very simple: acquire lots and lots of weapons and other resources from the US Government, along with lots and lots of money to buy off local warlords; build "secure" bases where he wants to conduct extractive mining of minerals (and buying off local warlords); not going into areas where there is not enough mineral wealth to make mining worthwhile; don't try to win an actual war, but focus on mining and making money; and last, and definitely not least, dump responsibility for the actual war, the other Afghan citizens and every else on the US -- and blame the US for anything bad that happens. Once he gets all the mineral wealth out that he can, Prince intends to simply walk away and dump the whole mess back to the US while he retires again to Dubai.

My prediction: The Afghan insurgents (rebels, patriots, what ever you want to call them) will infiltrate Prince's operations -- you do need physical bodies to run mining operations in that kind of geography (not like mining coal in the Powder River Basin), they will know when he comes to visit (he will undoubtedly not travel on the ground, but will use a US supplied Apache or something similar) and they will us a surface to air missle left over from when we supplied those weapons to fight the Soviet Union (or one acquired from the Syrian resistance or ISIS or just floating around) and Mr. Prince will be no more and the whole private army will be no more. Think of the US Army forts, e.g., Fort Apache, and the American Indians in the late 1800's, EXCEPT THIS TIME THE INDIANS HAVE THE SAME WEAPONS WE DO AND THERE ARE A WHOLE LOT MORE OF THEM AND THE GEOGRAPHY IS A WHOLE LOT WORSE FOR THE ARMY THAN ARIZONA, NEVADA, COLORADO, ETC.

[Cold War Spook]

29. The US and Russia are in Afghanistan for one reason only,

minerals, especially rare earth minerals.

[EX500rider]

30. Nonsense.

We've been there 17 years, how much mining have US companies done?
Zero u say...

We are there to prevent what happened last time when we dropped support for the Mujaheddin, the rise of the Taliban and the embracement of Al Qaeda leading to 9/11.

[Cold War Spook]

31. Osama bin Laden was a Saudi

along with most of the terrorists. Russia is already mining in Afghanistan and China is getting ready to do the same or has already started. They have a 30 year contract with the Afghan government. The USGA has determined that there is about 1 trillion dollars worth of rare earth minerals there.

[EX500rider]

32. So your theory is we are trying to pacify Afgh. so Russia & China can mine? lol

You at least could have gone with the much more popular "Oil pipeline!" lol

Why does it matter where bin Laden was from? He certainly wasn't welcome in Saudi.
He was based in Afgh when he planned and executed 9/11, given safe haven by the Taliban.

[Cold War Spook]

33. Take a course in reading comprehension.

No, the US wants a piece of the action. Ah, but you didn't say where the pilots were from. China has almost the whole market on rare earth minerals. Using lol when writing a rebuttal shows your lack of knowledge. So far you haven't written anything against my post. Try again.