Trump Retreats From Flavor Ban for E-Cigarettes
Source: NY Times
WASHINGTON It was a swift and bold reaction to a growing public health crisis affecting teenagers. Seated in the Oval Office in September, President Trump said he was moving to ban the sale of most flavored e-cigarettes as vaping among young people continued to rise.
We cant have our kids be so affected, Mr. Trump said. The first lady, Melania Trump, who rarely involves herself publicly with policy announcements in the White House, was there, too. Shes got a son, Mr. Trump noted, referring to their teenager, Barron. She feels very strongly about it.
But two months later, under pressure from his political advisers and lobbyists to factor in the potential pushback from his supporters, Mr. Trump has resisted moving forward with any action on vaping, while saying he still wants to study the issue.
Even a watered-down ban on flavored e-cigarettes that exempted menthol, which was widely expected, appears to have been set aside, for now.
Read more: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/17/health/trump-vaping-ban.html
3Hotdogs
(12,332 posts)I believe it was on a Sirius channel, a Stamford professor had accumulated data on tobacco ads that targeted children. They were printed and appeared on radio and tv during the '50's and 60's.
The president of Juul had visited the archives and used the basis of those ads to target today's kids.
Maxheader
(4,370 posts)fond of allowing companies to market junk food to poor countries..
Wingers would find a market for mothers blood if they could..
rickford66
(5,521 posts)RandiFan1290
(6,221 posts)jberryhill
(62,444 posts)They put flavors in alcohol that appeal to kids.
RandiFan1290
(6,221 posts)duforsure
(11,885 posts)Was funneled to his campaign then into his pockets for this change? He didn't switch his position for nothing.
mpcamb
(2,868 posts)Hope someone, somewhere has time to pursue it.
Bernardo de La Paz
(48,965 posts)JonLP24
(29,322 posts)Is because smoking cigarettes is at an all time low.
I don't support flavor bans and that will lead to a rise in traditional cigarettes.
Baclava
(12,047 posts)"Vaping is cutting into our profits, quick, round up some concerned doctors"
Javaman
(62,504 posts)WTF?
cstanleytech
(26,242 posts)About the only thing that really should be done should be making sure that the people that are using it are using something that is safe.
Ford_Prefect
(7,872 posts)There are only degrees of less toxic... And 2nd hand exposure is still as dangerous as has always been.
eggplant
(3,908 posts)https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4565991/
The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)Not sure where you are getting your research but you should really tell whoever told you "2nd hand exposure is still as dangerous as has always been" they have absolutely no idea what they are talking about. Saying 2nd hand vape is dangerous to the dangerous is like saying going to a rock concert and breathing in the fog that they blow off stage is hazardous to one's health. Saying "There are only degrees of less toxic" is like saying an albuterol inhaler is "only degrees of less toxic".
Because THAT's all it is.
cstanleytech
(26,242 posts)Take Beijing where the air is literally toxic for example or Flint Michigan where the water is polluted with lead.
My point is that the government needs to make sure the vap or whatever you call it is a safe as possible or in other words just make sure people are not inhaling truly toxic stuff.
Ford_Prefect
(7,872 posts)Nicotine is an addictive substance that makes smoking and vaping so hard to stop. It has side effects.
1. Chewing or snorting tobacco products usually releases more nicotine into the body than smoking.
2. Nicotine is at least as difficult to give up as heroin.
3. The side effects of nicotine can affect the heart, hormones, and gastrointestinal system.
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/240820.php
From the Mayo Clinc
Nicotine dependence ― also called tobacco dependence ― is an addiction to tobacco products caused by the drug nicotine. Nicotine dependence means you can't stop using the substance, even though it's causing you harm.
Nicotine produces physical and mood-altering effects in your brain that are temporarily pleasing. These effects make you want to use tobacco and lead to dependence. At the same time, stopping tobacco use causes withdrawal symptoms, including irritability and anxiety.
While it's the nicotine in tobacco that causes nicotine dependence, the toxic effects of tobacco result from other substances in tobacco. Smokers have much higher rates of heart disease, stroke and cancer than nonsmokers do.
If you intend to abuse an addictive substance do not insist that I tolerate that abuse nor participate at whatever distance.
C_U_L8R
(44,990 posts)It's a simple racket. But effective.
The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)I see some posters making the absurd claim that trump was somehow paid off not to install this ludicrous flavor ban. There was no pay-off I can guarantee you that. The reasons why vaping was attacked is because it's lack lobbying presence, the disorganized nature of the leading advocacy groups, and advocacy being mainly consumer based instead of producer based like all other industries with a strong lobbying presence. trump changed his mind for two reasons (and the left would do well to learn this lesson): 1) there was a massive rally in DC just last weekend where vapers protested the vape ban and 2) a significant portion of his constituents vape. As a matter of fact there were a TON of people I know who voted for trump ONLY because of the vaping issue. These people would have normally voted for a democrat. I'm not a single issue voter, but because of the vape issue alone had a Kasich or a Bush had won the nomination I may have been tempted to take a second look. The left seems oblivious to the fact of a) just how many vapers there are and b) just how many of them they are alienating with this silly war on vaping, people who would normally vote for a democrat.
Pick your battles well fellow liberals, progressives, centrist and even conserve-dems, fighting vaping is not a battle you can win.
CTyankee
(63,892 posts)The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)1) It helped me quit a 30 year cigarette smoking habit and I wasn't even trying to quit. I started vaping what we vapers call "cig-a-likes" in order to increase my productivity as I had just started a new business and I saw that I wasting a lot of time needing to go out and smoke a cigarette in order to get my nicotine fix. After a while I noticed that I was no longer smoking cigarettes (about three months of using a vape product called an "ego pen" . It just happened.
2) After quitting smoking I noticed a DRASTIC improvement in my cardiovascular health. I had more energy, and could now run again. I also noticed that my sense of taste and smell were sharpened.
3) I REALLY enjoy the flavors. I manufacture e-liquid myself. Not for a major market, but for the one vape shop that I own (this is in addition to my other business that I own, a real estate brokerage) and for myself. I have some awesome creations and I really enjoy vaping them. But I learned how to make complex flavored e-liquid from tasting and enjoying those made by major manufactures.
I DON'T recommend to anyone who has never smoked to take up vaping. It's a tool for quitting smoking and maintaining abstinence. But for those who use it for such it's a very enjoyable pastime with drastically reduced adverse health effects than smoking.
CTyankee
(63,892 posts)at the Yale Bowl. It doesn't seem to bother anyone but of course we are outdoors.
I quit smoking after having smoked for 20 years. The motivation was that I was separated and dating a nice man who could not bear cigarette smoke. It was a powerful motivation (we are now married 34 years!).
Does vape smoke get into your clothes or have a residue odor or color on your skin (two big reasons for me to quit smoking)?
Hope you don't mind my asking...
The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)We vapers always say it's not smoke it's vapor, and it's true. No it's not water vapor, but rather a vapor of vegetable glycerin, propylene glycol and flavoring agents. You will smell like the e-liquid you are vaping, but a lot (not all) of people find someone smelling like a cinnamon bun or fruit quite pleasant. It's not unlike being perfumed, some people will like others won't. It does not stain your teeth or skin as nothing is burned only vaporized.
CTyankee
(63,892 posts)LeftInTX
(25,141 posts)Was Hillary against vaping?
The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)for the history of democratic involvement in the disruption of the vaping industry.
KY_EnviroGuy
(14,488 posts)which is to stop smoking deadly cigarettes.
The Chinese vaping industry is to blame for the problems here, for their designing and selling high-power personal vaporizers. I've helped literally hundreds of people get of cigarettes using low-power units, somewhat like the originals from Joye.
As a e-liquid mixer I can assure people from experience that if you remove all flavoring, it creates a rather nasty vape that hardly no one would stick with long enough to break the cigarette addiction, and it only takes a small amount of natural extracts in the blend to make it pleasant.
If they want to pass a law to keep kids away from e-cigs, just make it illegal for youngsters to buy them and limit the power output to around 10 watts. That removes the "fun" and "show your ass with a huge cloud of vapor" part of vaping, thereby making it much less attractive to youth. It also returns vaping to the exclusive purpose for which it was originally intended.
KY rant done...........
The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)KY_EnviroGuy
(14,488 posts)I was hell-bent to quit a 50-year addiction and ordered a bunch of parts and juice sample from Liberty Flights out of California. There was not many vendors around the US back them, but I ordered samples from several to find something I could vape all day. I found one with a tobacco-like aromas from LF that was perfect but they couldn't seem to keep it in stock. Bummer.
So, I used my experience as an instrumentation tech and engineer, got all the apparatus for mixing and began experimenting. Ordered a ton of natural flavorings from The Perfumer's Apprentice and started experimenting until I very nearly matched that magic aroma from the LF juice. I still vape that recipe today, along with a cola recipe for variety.
In the long run, I made juices for a bunch of folks and many of them gladly helped me with trial runs for each new recipe I came up with. I gave them juice at my cost and all they had to do was call or write me with their suggestions on the recipes. Sometimes, it might take up to a month to get a recipe right but it was worth it.
At one point, I was making juice for a couple hundred people and all at my cost. I therefore learned a lot about people's requirements in the long term. The most astounding finding was that within a year's time, almost everyone would request their nicotine level be reduced gradually and did it on their own. Many kept vaping a "zero" nic juice thereafter just because they enjoy it.
It was a ton of fun for about four years, but I've slacked off for a while due to family health issues. I hope to get back at it soon 'cause some friends are bugging me wanting juice. They hate the stuff they buy in local shops.
Thanks for sharing and allowing me to blow off a little frustration!..........
The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)Namely that the experience of vaping normally leads folks to reduced nicotine dependence. I stared at 2.4% nicotine now I vape at .03% or if testing new e-liquid creations then I'm at zero nic. I tell people this all the time, it's a lot easier to quit vaping after one has quit smoking than it is to just quit smoking, and it's due to the phenomena of nicotine reduction over time.
IronLionZion
(45,380 posts)didn't seem like an issue that got much discussion here on DU or in the media/rallies.
The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)Perhaps you are not a vaper. I have to assume that (and please excuse me for assuming) because if you were you would know just how huge the issue was. In 2011 the FDA was pushed hard by Democratic members of congress led by Henry Waxman, Diana DeGette, Frank Pallone, and John Digell to heavily regulate and restrict access/availability of e-cigarettes, primarily through the banning of flavors as well as other means. In 2014 the Obama FDA released it's deeming regulation which included the much dreaded (for the vape industry and vapers) PMTA (Pre Market Tobacco Application). The PMTA requires nearly a 1 million dollar investment PER PRODUCT approval to sell vape products manufactured after 2007 (essentially the start of modern vaping). The GOP sensing (rightly so) massive overreach by the FDA had people like Duncan Hunter crucifying Democrats on the House floor over the issue (Don't you remember him vaping on the House floor?), and FOX News featured several news story relating to this over reach.
atreides1
(16,067 posts)First off a few hundred people does not equate to a "massive rally"!
If any company might be positioned to navigate or moderate the policy, it would be Juul. Its staff and consultants include a whos who of Trump world, including Josh Raffel, a former spokesman for Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump; Johnny DeStefano, a former counselor to the president; Rebeccah Propp, former director of media affairs for Vice President Pence, and Tevi Troy, who worked in the George W. Bush administration along with Alex Azar, the Secretary of Health and Human Services!
I'm inclined to believe that it was these former members of Trump's inner circle, who had more to do with changing his mind then just a few hundred people on a Saturday in November.
Just my humble opinion...Pax
The Liberal Lion
(1,414 posts)JUUL was actually set to benefit from a flavor ban. If it were a complete vape ban perhaps you'd be right, but JUUL had already changed it's flavor line up to conform with the tobacco only flavor model the WH was set to roll out. And you are right it was more than just a rally, but the rally and the millions of calls that clogged up the WH switchboard with the simple message "I vape and I vote".
truthisfreedom
(23,140 posts)Knee-jerk pretending to care, then stalling, backtracking, and saying it requires more thought. HE DOES NOT KNOW HOW TO THINK. He relies on the public memory hole.
Brainfodder
(6,423 posts)louis-t
(23,273 posts)He'll listen to Hannity and all of the deep staters who tell him to let JUUL make money off killing people.