'It's Going To Be Hard': A New West Point Leader On Confronting Extremism In Military

[mysteryowl]

Source: NPR

Brig. Gen. Mark Quander is taking a new leadership role at the prestigious military school of West Point at a time that the spotlight has returned to the problem of extremism in the military.

Quander was appointed last month to be the next commandant of cadets, equivalent to a dean of students. Many graduates of West Point go on to leadership roles in the military.

"It's hard and it's also very challenging," Quander tells Michel Martin on All Things Considered about confronting extremism. "Because I think if it was easy, we would have fixed it a long time ago. But I do think that everyone is committed to addressing it."
[snip]
His family has a long military history. His extended family is the only Black family to produce four general officers in the U.S. military, according to the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers.

Quander's extended family is also believed to be the oldest documented African American family in the U.S., with roots going back to at least 1684. Nancy Carter Quander was formerly enslaved by George and Martha Washington at Mount Vernon.


6-minute Audio interview is at the article link.

Read more: https://www.npr.org/2021/02/13/967665837/its-going-to-be-hard-a-new-west-point-leader-on-confronting-extremism-in-militar

---

He sounds like a nice man from his radio interview. Well worth listening to!

Fascinating family ancestry that goes back to 1684!

[brewens]

1. Some of these military and ex military terrorists being rounded up might be helpful.

Same with any of the cops that are also ex military. At least some police departments are recruiting these white supremacists. There may be some incentive available to get those guys to tell us what connection they may have to extremist groups in the military. They need to be rooted out and banned from the military and law enforcement.

[ouija]

10. Had a friend in the Army Rangers, they're all racists

Think of themselves as Viking raiders

[PatSeg]

17. That is really disturbing

[Dustlawyer]

28. I had a friend there as well.

While he is not racists per se being from Philippine decent, he is a far right nut job now. I guess he overlooks the racism as he overlooked what Trump did to the troops. I would watch his FB posts after Trump put the troops in danger from Turkey when he abandoned the Kurds, crickets is all I got.

In HS we were friends, though he loved Reagan being from California. Once he went to the military everything changed. He was brainwashed as part of his training.

[ChazII]

29. Even Pat Tillman? n/t

[mezame]

12. Hand Me Downs

Perhaps we could also stop selling police departments the military's cast-off or second-hand weaponry.

[ananda]

14. Understatement of the year...

great use of litotes!

[The Roux Comes First]

2. It Feels Like We Will Be Rewarded in Getting to Know This Gentleman Better

And bettered for it.

[oasis]

23. +1,000,000

[AverageOldGuy]

3. This nation has never come to grips with . . .

. . . Reconstruction and Redemption.

Most of us are familiar with the term "Reconstruction" that refers to the period roughly 1865-1877 in which the Union was supposed to be "reconstructed" after the Civil War.

However, "Redemption" is not well-known. After the collapse of Reconstruction in the late 1870's, white Southerners (and I'm an old white Southerner) decided we would restore ourselves to our rightful place and put those people whom we used to own back where they belonged -- we would "redeem" our beloved South from "them." The result was that between 1880 and 1902, every state of the old Confederacy rewrote their constitutions to block blacks from voting, and, established the Jim Crow Black Codes. As a result between 1880 and 1906, voting by blacks in the South plummeted from 60% to 2%. Sharecropping, Jim Crow laws, disenfranchisement, and the Klan put us white folks on top and kept us there -- to this day.

The nation has never come to grips with this history.

I'm reading:
-- "Stony the Path" by Prof. Henry Louis Gates,
-- "Reconstruction," by Eric Foner, and,
-- "Black Reconstruction," by W.E.B. DuBois.

I recommend all three.

Meanwhile, I wish BG Quander all the best. It won't be easy, turning around 400 years of history.

[Hekate]

6. Welcome to DU, AverageOldGuy...

I look forward to some interesting conversations with you.

[NBachers]

8. Welcome, AOG, to Democratic Underground. Your first post is a great contribution.

[lunatica]

9. Thanks for joining DU.

Welcome! I hope you spend plenty of time here.

[llmart]

16. Thank you for that interesting insight into our history.

There's an awful lot of real history we were never taught in our history classes. By the way, I absolutely adore Henry Louis Gates Jr., but the correct book title is "Stony the Road. He's a national treasure as far as I'm concerned. I watch his series on PBS "Finding Your Roots" and learn so much history just from watching his show.

Welcome to DU.

[MadLinguist]

20. Gates' title is taken from a line in the 'Black National Anthem' Lift Every Voice and Sing

Such a great song

Lift Every Voice and Sing
Song by J. Rosamond Johnson and James Weldon Johnson

Lift every voice and sing
Till earth and heaven ring
Ring with the harmonies of Liberty
Let our rejoicing rise
High as the listening skies
Let it resound loud as the rolling sea

Sing a song full of the faith that the dark past has taught us
Sing a song full of the hope that the present has brought us
Facing the rising sun of our new day begun
Let us march on till victory is won

Stony the road we trod
Bitter the chastening rod
Felt in the days when hope unborn had died
Yet with a steady beat
Have not our weary feet
Come to the place for which our fathers sighed?

We have come over a way that with tears has been watered
We have come, treading our path through the blood of the slaughtered
Out from the gloomy past
Till now we stand at last
Where the white gleam of our bright star is cast

God of our weary years
God of our silent tears
Thou who has brought us thus far on the way
Thou who has by Thy might Led us into the light
Keep us forever in the path, we pray
Lest our feet stray from the places, our God, where we met Thee

Lest, our hearts drunk with the wine of the world, we forget Thee
Shadowed beneath Thy hand
May we forever stand
True to our God
True to our native land
Our native land

[JI7]

18. A post on "Redemption" would be worth an OP

as you say we hear about reconstruction but not much about the redemption .

[rpannier]

4. Especially since a certain number get in with the support of their House or Senate Rep

Wanna guess who people like Johnson, Paul or Kennedy (LA) recommend

[jmowreader]

11. The vast majority of a West Point class comes in under congressional nomination

Here's how it works:

There are five service academies in the US: the US Military Academy, West Point, NY (trains Army officers), the US Naval Academy, Annapolis, MD (trains Navy and Marine Corps officers), the US Air Force Academy at Colorado Springs, CO (trains Air Force and Space Force officers), the US Coast Guard Academy at New London, CT (trains Coast Guard officers) and the US Merchant Marine Academy at Kings Point, NY (trains officers for US-flagged merchant vessels). To gain entrance to any of them, you must be nominated by one of four people: the Representative serving the congressional district you live in, either of your state's senators, or the Vice President of the United States. Each of those people receives five nominations for each academy. 536 people (435 Representatives, 100 Senators and the VP) x 5 academies x 5 nominations per academy = 13,400 possible nominations.

Now, here's where it gets fun: Everyone who is planning to go to one of these academies is encouraged to apply to all five and to all four of the people who can nominate them. The more nominations you can get, the more likely it is you'll go to an Academy. This is not overly likely to happen, but there is absolutely nothing preventing one candidate from receiving 20 nominations.

There are some other ways to get in. Active duty people can apply to an academy preparatory school and go from there to the academy. Children of Medal of Honor winners who are academically qualified will receive automatic admission. (Yes, this means that if Dakota Johnson fathers a child with Bristol Palin and he or she is smarter than the rest of his or her relatives, we'll be hearing from Caribou Barbie about her "cadet grandbaby" until the end of days.) But for the most part, if you're a cadet or midshipman you got that way because someone in Congress liked your packet.

[COL Mustard]

21. JMO, Excellent Synopsis Of The Admissions Process

I went through part of that many years ago (was not successful, much to the benefit of the USMA). One point of protocol, though...please don't refer to "Medal of Honor winners". As I've been told on enough occasions to correct my point of view, one wins a prize at the circus, one wins the lottery, but they are recipients of our highest valor awards.

Thanks!

[jmowreader]

33. Sorry, it was late.

I normally write “Medal of Honor recipients.”

I have wondered: where did you serve? For me...

Basic training at Fort Dix and first AIT (I have two MOS) at Fort Devens...then:

101st Airborne at Fort Campbell
Korea
III Corps at Fort Hood
New MOS at Goodfellow AFB, TX
Berlin (I was there during reunification)
10th Mountain at Fort Drum

Add-on: While I was a soldier and enjoyed it greatly, the Merchant Marine Academy seems like the most interesting one. First, they don’t have that up-or-out thing in the merchant service; once you become a ship’s officer on a merchant vessel you can remain as such until you start nailing gold doubloons to the side of the pilothouse. Second, the academy is on Long Island, so if you get off-base liberty you can take the Long Island Railroad to Penn Station and dine in New York’s finest restaurant, that being Sarge’s Deli. And best of all, part of your training is a year as part of the crew of a cargo ship.

[COL Mustard]

34. I Was Primarily In (West) Germany In The Early '80s

Then Army Reserve until 2000, got recalled and served until 2003. Started working off and on as a DAC in 1987 and still doing.

I would have done Merchant Marine if I'd been smarter but thought I wanted the Army. Hard life in a lot of ways, but a good one if you play by the rules.

Thank you for having served!

[jmowreader]

36. And thank you!

[Hekate]

5. You're right, he does sound very interesting!

I wish him all the best — this is a problem of long-standing. One of the scandals DU was talking about in our earliest days was the inroads Christo-fascists had made into the Air Force Academy.

[burrowowl]

7. I wish him luck for the sake of our country!

[mahatmakanejeeves]

13. There's a Quander Road south of Alexandria and north of Mount Vernon. NT

[OldBaldy1701E]

15. But

The type of people he is referring to are the type of people the military wants. Easy to control, always does what they are told without question, carries things way too far, wears their patriotism on their chest... the reason the types of people they are concerned about go into the military is that the military wants them, gives them an outlet, and convinces them that they have merit. Good luck with your efforts General, but your numbers are going to diminish greatly once those racist psychos realize you are not going to allow them to live their twisted fantasies. (Not that this is a bad thing...)

[GOPistheEnemy]

26. Hate to burst your bubble but that is not who the military tries to recruit.

Do those types join, sadly yes, just about anyone can join up and give Uncle Sugar a blank check with their life.

The military's top "gets" are smart jocks and intelligent people who don't have money for college or don't want to go to college and are looking at options. Those are the hardest people to get an intelligent kid who is into hacking and all things cyber is worth a heck of alot more then some dipship who wants to come in a kill mooslums fer jaysus, those morons are a dime a dozen, cheap to train and treated accordingly. Intelligent jock's because they are used to working as a team and are good Special Forces prospects because they generally are physically fit, obesity in recruits is a huge problem for the military today.

The military is representative of everyone in America today not just a few brainless morons who thump their chests with phoney bravery.

[GOPistheEnemy]

39. That's fine I fault nobody for joining for whatever reason they have the

very first person I met was coming back in, after being out 6 months, he needed to get out of dodge so to speak. I even met folk's whose choice was jail or military, all the ones I knew were righteous dudes, loved to work with them.

I needed a job, no real money for school, would have partied it all away if I went so I was smart enough to know that so, not knowing what else to do joined up for the training and $, so I sold my soul and went on the adventure of a lifetime. I was the underachieving loner in HS and thankfully Uncle Sugar had no problem with me preferring to be a loner and not so much into the pomp and circumstance or similar nonsense and put me with my own kind, it was a win/win in a way, except he got more then his money's worth out of my ass. Giving back to the country was a free be. What is the saying Army dudes like...All gave some, some gave all, yeah I think that's it , sort of sums it all up.

[OldBaldy1701E]

43. And you are a good person for doing that.

The problem is those who are like you get pretty disillusioned with the military once they see what is going on. So, people like you are difficult to recruit and difficult to retain. The military needs people like you. Unfortunately, your kind are a dying breed around here.

[OldBaldy1701E]

44. With all due respect.

It appears your time in the military was very different than mine. (Of course, mine was 40 years ago... who knows, maybe things have changed?)

[Marthe48]

19. Maybe they can screen applicants before they are accepted

Last edited Mon Feb 15, 2021, 11:21 AM - Edit history (1)

No racists need apply.

I'd like to see some kind of mandatory civil service for all teens, where they have to work in groups on a project that enhances their county seat. It doesn't have to be a big project or expensive, just planting a flower bed, cleaning up monuments. Just to have teens meet and work with other teens across all of the social descriptions, doing something for their community.

[OldBaldy1701E]

45. After the wealthy spent the last 100 years

creating barriers so that they can be with 'their own kind'? After these same people tuned into 'I can do this because I am rich!"? Good luck with that. I agree with you but our country is just too fractured these days in my opinion.

[Marthe48]

46. I talked with my daughter last night

she also pointed out that the military will take what they get. We remembered incidents of people going into the military rather than jail

I know my idea of community effort is an ideal. Maybe not impossible.

[OldBaldy1701E]

47. It is sad that it is this way

I still hold that it is not impossible, no matter how cynical I may be when I post stuff. I guess that naive kid is still trying to hang on for some reason...

[Marthe48]

48. Be positive :)

People who don't support an impeached traitor, people who aren't racist, people who want democracy are not in the wrong. We aren't going to change sick minds, but as long as we keep doing what we are doing, we are on the right side of all that matters.

[OldBaldy1701E]

49. Thank you. (n/t)

[TryLogic]

22. How long has Rush Limbaugh been on Armed Forces Network ?

[paleotn]

24. It's got to be done. I don't care how hard it is.

On a side note, I found this statement in the article amusing...Many graduates of West Point go on to leadership roles in the military.

Well, yea, you could say that. You know, like Grant, Sherman, Pershing, Ike, Patton, MacArthur, Bradley, Mark Clark, virtually the entire Abrams clan, Westmoreland, Ridgeway, Taylor, Wes Clark, Schwarzkopf, Petraeus...just to a name a few.

[SharonAnn]

32. And many leave as soon as they can for lucrative defense industry or other jobs.

[paleotn]

37. You bet. Worked with one a few years ago.

He figured corporate politics for more money was better than Army politics for less money. He also got tired of the regimen, said West Point was a struggle, but he survived, did his time and couldn't wait to get back to civilian normalcy. Some folks just don't find a home in the Army.

[AllaN01Bear]

25. getting rid of rush limpaugh and his ilk off of armed forces radio will help.

[llashram]

27. it really is a

Last edited Sun Feb 14, 2021, 02:14 PM - Edit history (1)

goddamn shame that the military didn't take care of it's racism-underground white terrorist problem when I was a soldier. I dealt with the "south will rise again" crowd over 50 years ago in my military service. Both here in America and in Vietnam. Black soldiers showing little pride in our race were immediately harassed. White flying/wearing their confederate flags? Not a peep. Now the fascist racism is ingrained further into the structure/systems of the military than ever before. But what can I expect. Racism of Americans was revealed when 70million plus racist miscreants voted for the ex-potus POS. And that racism is over 300 years old.

We have always had the ability to try to change some systemic/institutional racism of Amerika, just ain't enough willing to put their lives on the line for true equality of ALL Americans, especially in the courts and Senate. I knew trump the white man was going to walk. HE did. And will, try to walk all over democracy until he or his successor are able to install a dictator.

[llmart]

30. +1

They looked the other way when black recruits were tormented and harassed by their so-called "brothers in arms". They also looked the other way when superiors harassed and/or sexually abused women in the military and that problem is still alive and well to this day.

[maxrandb]

31. I respect this man, but IMHO, he's wrong. It doesn't need to be hard.

Hard is landing 200,000 troops on a beach under heavy enemy fire.

Hard is fighting a Class DELTA fire on the Flight Deck.

Hard is taking a fortified hill.

I joined the Navy in 1983 as an E1. I retired in 2012 as an O5.

There were assholes in my commands in the 80s and 90s, but there was a perceptible change in the 2000s and 2010s.

This does not need to be "hard".

We didn't give up ALL of our Rights as Americans when we joined the military, but we were governed by something civilians were not, the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ). There are many Articles of the UCMJ that can be used to clear this "extremism" out of the military.

We can start by Courts Martial for ANY and ALL Active Duty, or Retired military that participated in the attack on our nation's Capitol. Nothing sends a message to the troops like some Dishonorable and "Big Chicken Dinner" Discharges and confinement in Federal Prison.

But we can do more than that.

We already have standards that must be met for entry into the military. You already are rejected for service for association, or membership with white supremacist and other hate groups or gangs.

Just as you have to be subjected to a physical to be approved for entry, that screening must now also extend to a review of Social Media activity. You can refuse that, but just as if you refuse a physical, you will be rejected.

But again, that's not hard.

Which brings me to that perceptible change I saw in the 2000s.

Extreme views are NOT the problem. The problem is what we have allowed to become "normal".

Requiring a woman to carry her rapists baby to term used to be "extreme". Now it's Retrumplican Party policy.

Gerrymandering minorities into Picassoest districts to limit their rights and freedom used to be racist and extreme. Now it's Retrumplican Party policy.

Demanding the Birth Certificate of the nation's first African American President used to be racist and extreme. Now it's Retrumplican Party policy.

Storming the nation's Capitol at the behest of an authoritarian dipshit used to be extreme. Now it's Retrumplican Party policy.

This didn't happen in a vacuum. It didn't happen overnight.

For the first 20 years of my Navy service, our shipboard entertainment was pretty sparse. On my first ship, we had Movie Night on the Mess Deck with a reel-to-reel projector. We eventually got two channels of CCTV with 3 movies a night on each channel to choose from.

It's funny, but as the amount and type of entertainment expanded, a strange thing happened in my Navy.

I walked into a gym in Lemoore, CA that had 5 TVs. All tuned to Fox News.

I don't remember any "hard" discussions about the gym manager deciding that's what he wanted.

I don't remember any "hard" discussions when the CO, Master Chief or Leading Chief Petty Officer making sure that the Wardroom, Chief's Mess, or Workshop TV was continuously tuned to Fox News.

I don't recall any "hard" decisions when Armed Forces Radio was mandated to broadcast the likes if Rush and Hannity.

I don't recall any discussions on the impact of African American troops "good order and discipline" when they had to hear "Barack the Magic Negro" song courtesy of Rush, or hear Hannity describe Obama as a "Kenyan born terrorist".

Yes, there has been an increase of extremism in the military. It's cause is the same thing that has increased extremism throughout America.

Ridding it from the military is going to be easy in comparison.

[FakeNoose]

35. This is valuable info that deserves its own OP

Thanks Maxrandb...

Many of us on DU (myself included) have never served in the armed forces.
Many of us have assumptions about military service that need to be corrected.

[oasis]

40. Thanks maxrandb, for this inside info, and for your service to our country.

[greenjar_01]

41. "My institution is a festering shithole of stupidity and danger...sorry bout that y'aaaaaallll!"

Ooooof.

[pfitz59]

42. Gott mit uns

Think of Josh Hawley, and all the Talibornagain Congress critters. They each send their 'preferred' candidates to the Service Academies. The student body is tainted from the get-go. The selection process is tainted. The end result is cadets and graduates in the image of their sponsors. Its an ugly business. Imagine a cadet with Boebert or Greene's stamp of approval.