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Tue Jan 18, 2022, 11:19 PM

Manchin: Primary me if you want, I won't go 'nuclear'

Source: Politico

Joe Manchin made clear that his party’s push to isolate him and fellow centrist Kyrsten Sinema won’t force his hand on rules changes, once again rejecting Democrats' proposed reforms to the Senate’s filibuster rules.

The West Virginia Democrat actually seems to welcome the isolation. He told reporters ahead of a Democratic Caucus meeting he would not go along with instituting a talking filibuster, which could be used to evade the Senate’s 60-vote threshold, nor would he entertain a rules change by a simple majority.

Asked about his party's priorities, Manchin said people are most worried about inflation and coronavirus right now. He added that he’d welcome a primary challenge over his filibuster position if he runs again for reelection: "I've been primaried my entire life. That would not be anything new for me.”

“The majority of my colleagues in the Democratic caucus have changed their minds. I respect that. They have a right to change their minds. I haven’t. I hope they respect that too. I’ve never changed my mind on the filibuster,” Manchin said.

Read more: https://www.politico.com/news/2022/01/18/senate-dems-filibuster-showdown-election-reform-527308

33 replies, 2921 views

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Reply Manchin: Primary me if you want, I won't go 'nuclear' (Original post)
Polybius Jan 2022 OP
qazplm135 Jan 2022 #1
Mawspam2 Jan 2022 #16
qazplm135 Jan 2022 #20
Septua Jan 2022 #2
dem4decades Jan 2022 #6
Efilroft Sul Jan 2022 #3
JohnSJ Jan 2022 #4
FBaggins Jan 2022 #8
JohnSJ Jan 2022 #10
SKKY Jan 2022 #5
BootinUp Jan 2022 #7
AZLD4Candidate Jan 2022 #9
Traildogbob Jan 2022 #11
GB_RN Jan 2022 #12
MichMan Jan 2022 #14
GB_RN Jan 2022 #18
DENVERPOPS Jan 2022 #21
GB_RN Jan 2022 #22
oldsoftie Jan 2022 #28
FBaggins Jan 2022 #26
Efilroft Sul Jan 2022 #13
JI7 Jan 2022 #15
Bayard Jan 2022 #17
KPN Jan 2022 #23
JI7 Jan 2022 #24
KPN Jan 2022 #30
we can do it Jan 2022 #31
yaesu Jan 2022 #19
airmid Jan 2022 #25
cstanleytech Jan 2022 #27
we can do it Jan 2022 #32
cstanleytech Jan 2022 #33
LiberalFighter Jan 2022 #29

Response to Polybius (Original post)

Tue Jan 18, 2022, 11:24 PM

1. I'll be surprised

If we don't see him go independent after the 22 elections. He will probably still caucus with Dems but he seems very comfortable with the idea that he is no longer on the same page as the rest of the party.

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Response to qazplm135 (Reply #1)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:52 AM

16. If he goes indy, he loses his Energy committee chair.

He won't go Pub cuz they'd never trust him with anything. Sorry to say, we're stuck with him for a while.

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Response to Mawspam2 (Reply #16)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 01:23 AM

20. If he still caucuses with us

Why would he lose his chair? Particularly if it's another 50/50 Senate?

And if we lose the Senate, no chair.

I think he'd wait til after the election but real chance he goes Indy.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Tue Jan 18, 2022, 11:38 PM

2. I wasn't much expecting him to have...

..a change of heart. He's (and what's her name) got something keeping him steadfast with the filibuster besides his arguments, which lack any political or common sense logic. I can only guess it's contributor related.

But when the country falls to fascism, we'll still have the filibuster.

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Response to Septua (Reply #2)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:02 AM

6. Do you really think the Republicans will honor that? Doesn't matter anyway

The Supreme Court is cutting the country anyway.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Tue Jan 18, 2022, 11:40 PM

3. Hey, Joe, tell us how you're committing sabotage without saying you're committing sabotage.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Tue Jan 18, 2022, 11:50 PM

4. Manchin and Sinema are not going to change their position. This was clear weeks ago. Those

that think it advantageous to characterizing them with negative aspersions may do just the opposite of what they want.

It only takes one to caucus with the republicans, to make the republicans the majority in the Senate, and lose the chance for judicial appointments.

The goal should be to win enough seats in the midterms to make Manchin and Sinema irrelevant




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Response to JohnSJ (Reply #4)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:07 AM

8. Weeks ago? Try a year ago

Both made it crystal clear before the Senate power-sharing agreement passed.

Neither has budged in the slightest… though tons of wishful thinkers have speculated on a change dozens of times.

One particularly optimistic reporter continues to opine on it almost weekly despite getting “what part of never don’t you understand?” As a response ten months ago

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Response to FBaggins (Reply #8)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:13 AM

10. You are right

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Tue Jan 18, 2022, 11:52 PM

5. I'm sorry, but I think our Democracy is screwed...

...Democrats play by the rules, or at least try to, and Republicans will burn the whole thing down for a SC Justice to be confirmed. We're done unless we get Democrats elected and quickly.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:04 AM

7. nucular schmuchular. nt

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:09 AM

9. Challenge accepted, pal.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:23 AM

11. I wonder

If there is a way to take away the right for republican senators to vote like they are in states for the general. If we block or not allow them access we could win with 48 to Maybe two dozen of them we allow to vote or count their vote. Goose and Gander right?

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:23 AM

12. Yeah, No...

He says he hasn't changed his mind on the filibuster, but there's video/audio of him back in 2011 or so, stating that the filibuster was just a tool of obstruction by the Republican Party and it needed to go.

I heard the audio while I was eating dinner this evening and while can't find it online right now, I did dig up this article, which is linked from his OWN web site, dated 10/13/2011, stating his opposition to the filibuster. The quote in it is pretty much word for word what he said in the audio from TV tonight.

So, before anyone goes and reports me for bashing Democrats, using Republican talking points or any of that, I'm not. I'm just pointing out the man's clearly stated position in the past, and that he's contradicting himself now. If I wanted to bash him, it would be quite obvious, as there would be a lot of four-letter words.



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Response to GB_RN (Reply #12)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:42 AM

14. There are also videos from Schumer and others how the filibuster is critical & necessary

The views can change depending upon which side of the majority someone happens to be on at any given time.

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Response to MichMan (Reply #14)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 01:03 AM

18. I Get People's Views Can Change...

But the Democrats were in the majority in 2011. So, Manchin can't try and make the CYA argument that he made that statement from the minority's side of the aisle & POV back then. He was quite literally making it from the viewpoint of the frustrated majority's side.

From the start of Obama's first term through the middle of his second term, the Democrats had control of the Senate. Moscow Mitch didn't take over until 2015. The Repukes filibustered every thing Obama tried to do. That's why they passed the ACA through reconciliation, instead of regular order: Mitch and his merry band would have filibustered it, otherwise.

From the Senate's History page:

111th Congress (2009–2011)
Majority Party: Democrats (57 seats)
Minority Party: Republicans (41 seats)
Other Parties: 1 Independent; 1 Independent Democrat (both caucused with the Democrats)
Total Seats: 100


112th Congress (2011–2013)
Majority Party: Democrats (51 seats)
Minority Party: Republicans (47 seats)
Other Parties: 1 Independent; 1 Independent Democrat (both caucused with the Democrats)
Total Seats: 100

113th Congress (2013–2015)
Majority Party: Democrats (53 seats)
Minority Party: Republicans (45 seats)
Other Parties: 2 Independents (both caucused with the Democrats)
Total Seats: 100

114th Congress (2015–2017)
Majority Party: Republicans (54 seats)
Minority Party: Democrats (44 seats)
Other Parties: 2 Independents (both caucused with the Democrats)
Total Seats: 100

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Response to GB_RN (Reply #18)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 01:54 AM

21. I would love to still see

an audit of Senate Votes in the States of Maine, Kentucky, and S. Carolina for 2020.....and investigate if they are still using the proven corruptible EIS voting machines and that they were still being used.......

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Response to DENVERPOPS (Reply #21)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 02:03 AM

22. Pretty Sure That...

Maine and Kentucky are…or were as of 2020’s elections. I remember reading about the same brand of non-auditable electronic voting machines being used in both states.

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Response to DENVERPOPS (Reply #21)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 08:59 AM

28. There is NO EVIDENCE that any voting machines were corrupted in any election anywhere

That's a trump lie. Anything electronic CAN be hacked, but it would have to be connected to the internet for it to happen. NO evidence that any machine was.

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Response to GB_RN (Reply #12)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 07:04 AM

26. Your link does not support your stated position

Voting for cloture (i.e., to end a particular filibuster) us not the same thing as wanting to get rid of the filibuster rule.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:32 AM

13. Manchin lies about not changing his mind on the talking filibuster.

On March 7 of last year, Manchin stated he would support altering the filibuster rules. He said, "If you want to make it [the filibuster] a little bit more painful, make him stand there and talk. I’m willing to look at any way we can."

Keep digging that hole, Joe. Maybe you'll even find coal.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/07/us/politics/joe-manchin-filibuster-stimulus.html

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:44 AM

15. I wish people would ignore him and focus on winning

more Senate seats.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #15)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 01:00 AM

17. OR,

Convince a couple of rethuglicans to try being good humans, and see the look on our two renegades faces when they become irrelevant.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #15)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 02:09 AM

23. What -- can't people chew gum and walk at the same time. Come on.

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Response to KPN (Reply #23)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 03:13 AM

24. No, he likes the attention . Stop giving it to him. We need him because a Republican wins without

him. BUt that doesn't mean we have to give him so much attention. We need to try to win more Senate seats so he loses his power .

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Response to JI7 (Reply #24)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 12:57 PM

30. I disagree.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #15)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 03:22 PM

31. Yes the more energy we waste on him the worse he gets.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 01:04 AM

19. Maddow showed Manchin talking to a reporter about how the government is already in place to

protect peoples right to vote, like totally ignoring what the red states are doing, just blowing smoke.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 06:22 AM

25. This man goes on and on about compromise yet appears to only be willing to do

so when it involves caving to Republicans. The irony is astounding.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 08:01 AM

27. If we can find a replacement that has as good a chance at winning

then I have zero objections to accepting his challenge.

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Response to cstanleytech (Reply #27)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 03:22 PM

32. In bright red WV, doubtful.

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Response to we can do it (Reply #32)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 05:09 PM

33. Well, people at one time said we would never have a black President either.

Now maybe we won’t find someone able to replace Manchin but we won’t know if we don’t try.

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Response to Polybius (Original post)

Wed Jan 19, 2022, 10:45 AM

29. The best threat is to work to add more Democrats to the Senate.

Get two or more Democrats in the Senate will take away the power Manchin and Sinema have.

Wisconsin and Ohio seem to be doable. Don't know about others.

Once we get two more elected Manchin can be assigned to a different committee. Possibly a minor sub-committee.

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