A modern city starves

[brooklynite]

Source: Axios

Many of Shanghai's 26 million residents are facing food shortages as the Chinese government's strict COVID lockdowns have ground one of biggest and busiest cities in the world to a halt.

Why it matters: Scenes of residents rationing vegetables and begging local officials to allow them to search for food has cast a shadow on the Chinese government's COVID response.

State of play: Shanghai reported more than 26,000 new infections on Sunday, as the number of new daily infections continues to rise despite the city's lockdown, which has lasted more than two weeks.

What's happening: Shanghai residents across the city are scrambling for food, as empty grocery shelves, unreliable government provisions, and strained food delivery services make it hard to secure enough to eat.

Read more: Link to source

[Efilroft Sul]

1. Shanghai residents went the full Howard Beale a few nights ago.

Link to tweet

?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1512974880463114241%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.democraticunderground.com%2F100216580719&fbclid=IwAR2IM44kixIqiTADshEFWvJ2W4jpTa6QQ9W2ZWcrqLyd38wW1FR1jmDLVkw

[AZLD4Candidate]

32. That looks like either Xuhui district or Puxi District

Mostly upper middle class to upper class section of Shanghai. I lived in Xuhui when I lived there..

[Efilroft Sul]

35. Thank you for your insight!

[Evolve Dammit]

2. As if the world doesn't have enough tragedy. I can't see how this is going to end for China. The

virus will run rampant if they don't lockdown, but 26 million people with food running out?

[AZLD4Candidate]

18. See post #17

It's what happens when you have megalomaniacal, unelected kelptocrats in charge of things that have no ability to admit self-fault or mistakes as that would be a loss of face.

Otherwise known as Chinese government since the Xia Dynasty. There is a reason I call him Emperor Xi the Flawless.

[Farmer-Rick]

3. So, starvation sets in after only 2 weeks?

"daily infections continues to rise despite the city's lockdown, which has lasted more than two weeks."

So more than 2 weeks........unless you are underweight, you can fast for 14 days with little affect. I've done it.

Shanghai must have been short of food anyway for 2 weeks to put them into starvation.

Hmmm, this makes me doubt the facts in the story.

[brooklynite]

4. "Starve" does not equate to "starve to death"

https://www.newfoodmagazine.com/news/163768/food-shortages-in-shanghai/

https://www.insider.com/shanghai-lockdown-china-twitter-weibo-censor-content-food-shortage-2022-4

https://www.ft.com/content/0fb2d57e-92d3-4d26-a0b1-a681727b0515

[Bernardo de La Paz]

10. Careful about projecting. All American cities are "short of food" by your definition

Grocery stores in the US have only about 3 days of fresh food on hand, warehouses about a week.

Canned goods, maybe a bit more.

Farmers would know this, since they are a production point in a supply chain that is vital to their income. Silos in the countryside are not shelves in city stores.

[Farmer-Rick]

26. What definition of short of food did I give?

I was just commenting on how quickly this city moved into starvation.

I don't trust the information because of that. I question it.

Questioning is good.

[Hortensis]

33. Agree. By far most are not starving. There isn't time. They are unaccustomed to

being hungry or worrying that starvation could be possible. Like us -- except that starvation under a frequently incompetent, ruthless totalitarian government must seem much less unthinkable. Many millions have died in famines, both inadvertent and engineered, under China's Communist Party. The lives of many or most of those living now would have been profoundly affected.

And, given previous shutdowns during this pandemic, it's likely many still had at least somewhat more food stored than usual. Like many Americans.

[colorado_ufo]

15. This is an assumption that everyone is like you.

There are children - especially small children - the frail elderly, the sick, pregnant women, and others who could not sustain two weeks without food. "unless you are underweight" - that is crucial; we Americans are generally very overweight. I suspect that the Shanghai residents may have a different body composition.

[AZLD4Candidate]

20. Women are until major social and cultural pressure to be 115 lbs or less

Last edited Tue Apr 12, 2022, 01:44 PM - Edit history (1)

While the average height is about 5'4"

Men have an average height of 5'9" and weigh about 180 lbs.

Their body composition is much different that ours. I'm almost 6'2" and about 265 and I'm man mountain over there.

[Farmer-Rick]

28. No it's not

Yes, it is not healthy for many people to go into a 14 day fast. But an entire city starving after 2 weeks?

Questioning is good.

[womanofthehills]

29. Many reports saying no one is allowed out of their apartments to buy food

In Shanghai, residents must order food and have it delivered but many deliveries not happening. They cannot shop in a grocery store. People are not allowed to go outside at all - not even to walk a dog. Reports the government was delivering food from food trucks a few days ago. No one really knows.

[AZLD4Candidate]

31. That is true. Most streets are empty and the city looks like a ghost town

The Chinese version of UberEats, 饿了吗, isn't making deliveries so no one can order in from a restaurant and no one can buy food at stores because the delivery drivers need to stay home.

[onetexan]

37. Yea that's draconian if they can't even go to the supermarkets to buy groceries.

R-A-M-E-N i always have some available for situations like this

[AZLD4Candidate]

16. Spoken like someone who has never

A) lived there (I have), and;
B) knows nothing about China or the Chinese people (I'm married to one)

Please keep this ignorance off DU.

[Farmer-Rick]

27. Ok, you are very funny

Just because I question going into starvation after 2 weeks as being difficult to believe?

Please keep this extreme reaction to questioning off DU.

Question everything.

[AZLD4Candidate]

30. Tell me what you know about the country or its people then

Where do you get off saying what you said?

China has gone through two horrific famines in the last 100 years and a major food shortage once when I lived there.

As another DUer posted, maybe healthy adults can, but infants, infirmed, and elderly can't.

But again, I'd love to know what you actually know about the country or its people. My wife is Chinese. We own a house there and I lived there for years.

I ask my wife constantly if he has enough to eat because if it's this bad in a major city, it will be even worse in the countryside.

Just because you are getting pushback doesn't mean I'm wrong in giving it.

As for question everything. . .I just questioned your knowledge of China, its people, or it's culture.

[NickB79]

38. The rule of 3

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_threes_(survival)

Lethal conditions are reached after:

3 minutes without air.
3 hours without shelter in harsh conditions.
3 days without water.
3 weeks without food.

After 2 weeks without food, you're getting close to the danger zone.

[Farmer-Rick]

39. Oh I agree 2 weeks is hardship but not starvation

Yeah 3 weeks could be a killer.

But is China really going to let these folks starve?

If they do, Wow, lack of food is one of the biggest reason for revolutions. The political leadership is stupid if they let this happen.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

5. Surprise, rich afford delivered vegs; no luck for poor & middle class. Communism or dictatorship?

[nycbos]

7. Communism is a form a dicatorship takes.

In communist states the party elites lived lives of luxury while everyone else struggled in the name of the "revoultion."


China is hardly a communist country now though. It's just a grotesque dicatorhsip.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

11. That's my point "China is hardly a communist country now though. It's just a grotesque dicatorhsip."

[nycbos]

12. Okay your post was unclear.

But there also has never been a communist country that was a demoracy.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

6. 60 years ago. The Chinese people remember

[nycbos]

9. Do they though?

. Many Chinese don't know what happened at Tiananmen Square in 1989. The party rewrites history. It's sensors the Internet. It's quite Orwellian.

[Jetheels]

8. China doesn't have an effective vaccine....

https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Coronavirus/COVID-vaccines/China-s-quest-for-mRNA-vaccine-hits-stumbling-block-in-omicron

[AZLD4Candidate]

19. But the Chinese people are convinced their vaccine is better than everybody else's

Because China is #1 and there is rampant nationalistic xenophobia. . .even more heighten now than when Emperor Xi the Flawless was selected as the heir apparent after Hu Jintao.

China is as much an oligarchy state as Russia.

BTW, the people who should read this never will. First, it's from the bad guy (Japan), and second, it will be blocked by the Great Firewall as this doesn't make the CPC or Emperor Xi look good in anyway. Gotta keep up that personality cult at all costs.

[Johnny2X2X]

13. I have many colleagues there right now

Just got off a call with several. City is shutdown, but food isn't a problem for the people in our business complex there yet. Food deliveries are happening.

One colleague had Covid and was removed from his housing with his family and placed into isolation for 2 weeks. He just got home today, took him 8 hours to get across the city back to home.

[AZLD4Candidate]

36. Businesses get first everything due to greasing palms and Party connections

[Warpy]

14. Restrictions were necessary in the beginning when there was no vaccine

The virus has shifted from pandemic to endemic, meaning it's going to be one of those things that keeps mutating and coming back, rapidly at first, then more slowly as immunity develops.

Instead of locking people down, they need to think aboutstrict masking requirements combined with mass vaccinations. Otherwise, they're going to lose more people to malnutrition than they would have to the virus.

[AZLD4Candidate]

17. From my wife:

They are not "requiring" but you will get a yellow QR code if you don't, mass testing every three days. So they are requiring it.

People have been whipped up into a terrified frenzy about being sick (more so than normal since they run to the hospital for a sneeze and a hangnail normally) that they are more germophobic than normal due to mass Chinese propaganda.

Media is saying that the American army, Moderna, and the Italians are responsible for COVID19 so xenophobic nationalism is running rampant.

Passports are being restricted (as I had to write a letter for my wife saying I was here and waiting for her) for her to get her new passport.

Entry can only happen with direct flights and China has restricted them to 21 flights a day from the US, along with exiting has been restricted as well (Chinese people need to prove that they have a reason to leave and vacation is not one of the accepted reasons).

They require a 14 day quarantine in hotel, followed by a 14 day in house quarantine where Chinese inmates have more freedom of movement upon entry and daily testing. This is all at the traveler's cost

They require masks EVERYWHERE, even if you are standing on your own porch outside.

They are burning through their treasury like a drunken sailor along with locking down cities where factories are, so they are spending at least twice as much a week as the country is taking in.

Finally, they are restricting all bad news, arresting those who try to spread reality, and putting even more behind the Great Firewall of China.

All the while Xi Jinping is still be lauded as the second coming of Jesus by everyone.

What more can the Chinese people put up with in the name of "protecting lives?" This isn't protecting lives. This is using medical excuses to terrorize people.

BTW, their vaccine is garbage and they don't recognize any foreign vaccines because "it wasn't made in China."

[Warpy]

23. Looks like Xi is taking the excuse to try to rehang the Bamboo Curtain

He's probably pretty successful, I haven't heard from the people I talk to in a long time.

Their vaccine gave 80% immunity after 3 shots (looked it up), but protection seems to be waning just as omicron is hitting them hard.

I suppose he thinks if people are locked indoors and starving, they'll be no position to get stuffy about that real estate collapse he's been trying to delay.

Note to Xi: China will keep all that industry it looted from the west only as long as they can ship orders. Idling factories to assert iron fisted control of the country is going to bite China hard.

[AZLD4Candidate]

34. Xi, with this illogically extreme policy of having zero cases, is bankrupting the country

Industry is at a stand still
Tourism is dead
Service industry is crippled
Retail is now in a downward spiral

Testing is all but mandatory. . .well, it's optional, but then if you don't it, you get a yellow QR code on your mandated cell phone covid app which means you are completely restricted to your community (not city) and cannot leave unless it's green. Testing is every three days.

So, let's say the overhead for each test is $5 a pop (35 RMB would be right). Even if you only test 800M every three days, that's $4B every three days and close to $8B a week.

China is already up to its ears in debt due to funding infrastructure with their version of T-bills.

This policy is going to bankrupt China and destroy is economy.

And yes, the real estate bubble is highly inflated and ripe for collapse. The only reason it hasn't is creative bookkeeping by those in charge to keep the Ponzi schemes going.

[marmar]

21. At this stage of the pandemic, I don't see the benefit of China's "zero covid" policy.

You're never going to get to that point. Seems like a more pragmatic approach is needed.

[Jetheels]

22. China is years behind on the pandemic. Their vaccines are not like what we have in the west.

And unfortunately their vaccine doesn’t need refrigeration so they send it all over the world. But it’s not nearly as effective as the mRNA vaccine technology.

[AZLD4Candidate]

24. As I say to my wife all the time: There's the right way, the wrong, and the dumbass

Last edited Tue Apr 12, 2022, 03:39 PM - Edit history (1)

Communist Party way.

Remember, it isn't about doing a job right. . .it's about the appearance of doing a job right.

Their vaccine, which they laud all day everyday as better than whatever the West has done, is all about appearance . . . while the government censors news that makes them look bad. You have to see what a joke the national 7PM news there is like. I call it "the Xi Jinping Comedy Hour."

[AZLD4Candidate]

25. Pragmatism died when Deng Xiaoping left office. Dogma and ideological purity are the way now.

[DonCoquixote]

40. I do not wish ill on John and Jane Q Chinese citizen

Indeed, I will not lie, there were lessons that Beijing used to have to teach us, namely living hard proof that yes, socialism can work and yes, keeping Billionaires on a leash can produce progress. If a France or England or the USA had managed to lift 70 million people out of poverty, there would be crowing that would deafen the heavens and demand worship!

THAT.....BEING.....SAID

China is heading headlong to the sort of abyss only Hubris could bring. No, you cannot lie to citizens and simply assume they will look the other way: that is easy when the money pours in; impossible when people starve. Yes Beijing is great at coordinating people, but that often means when the concrete begins to crack, people will panic harder because you kept screaming "concrete never cracks!" As America and Russia proved, sooner or later even the best of ringmasters and circus clown cannot hide facts anymore.

So, what does this mean? Just like in America and Russia, the country folk will probably laugh at the urban folk. And then the same blight will hit THEM, and harder, because they will have even LESS to threaten the well-connected with. Just as many of the well connected Russians and USA Americans live far removed from the people they feed off of, so do many the the Chinese elites ive in the same castles. BUT, when there is no more bread , no more circuses, then those who have much more in common with eahc opther, will face the same Guillotines.

The problem is, will it be too late to fix the cracking concrete?

[hueymahl]

41. This is some real dystopian shit going on

China is an evil place.