Poland to be 1st NATO member to give Ukraine fighter jets

[BumRushDaShow]

Last edited Thu Mar 16, 2023, 04:26 PM - Edit history (4)

Source: AP

WARSAW, Poland (AP) — Poland said Thursday it plans to give Ukraine about a dozen MiG-29 fighter jets, which would make it the first NATO member to fulfill Kyiv’s increasingly urgent requests for warplanes to defend itself against the Russian invasion. Warsaw will hand over four of the Soviet-made warplanes “within the next few days,” President Andrzej Duda said, and the rest needed servicing but would be supplied later.

The Polish word he used to describe the total number can mean between 11 and 19. “They are in the last years of their functioning, but they are in good working condition,” Duda said. He did not say whether other countries would follow suit, although Slovakia has said it would send its own disused MiGs to Ukraine. Poland also was the first NATO nation to provide Ukraine with German-made Leopard 2 tanks.

On Wednesday, Polish government spokesman Piotr Mueller said some other countries also had pledged MiGs to Kyiv, but did not identify them. Both Poland and Slovakia had indicated they were ready to hand over their planes, but only as part of a wider international coalition doing the same. The government in neighboring NATO member Germany appeared caught off guard by Duda’s announcement.

“So far, everyone has agreed that it’s not the time to send fighter jets,” German Defense Minister Boris Pistorius told reporters. “I don’t have any confirmation from Poland yet that this has happened.” The White House called Poland’s move a sovereign decision and lauded the Poles for continuing to “punch above their weight” in assisting Kyiv, but it stressed the move would have no bearing on President Joe Biden, who has resisted calls to provide U.S. F-16s to Ukraine.

Read more: https://apnews.com/article/ukraine-poland-russia-war-jets-migs-6d843ccbd50fef5f96091a5bff8f3e01

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Poland has taken the bulk of the refugees.

Article updated.

Previous articles/headline -

WARSAW, Poland (AP) -- Poland's president said Thursday that his country plans to give Ukraine around a dozen MiG-29 fighter jets, which would make it the first NATO member to fulfill the Ukrainian government's increasingly urgent requests for warplanes. President Andrzej Duda said Poland would hand over four of the Soviet-made warplanes "within the next few days" and that the rest needed servicing and would be supplied later.

The Polish word he used to describe the total number can mean between 11 and 19. "They are in the last years of their functioning, but they are in good working condition," Duda said of the aircraft. He did not say whether other countries would follow suit, although Slovakia has said it would send its own disused MiGs to Ukraine. Poland also was the first NATO nation to provide Ukraine with German-made Leopard 2 tanks.

On Wednesday, Polish government spokesman Piotr Mueller said some other countries also had pledged MiGs to Kyiv, but did not name them. Both Poland and Slovakia had indicated they were ready to hand over their planes, but only as part of a wider international coalition doing the same. The government in neighboring NATO member Germany appeared caught off guard by Duda's announcement. "So far, everyone has agreed that it's not the time to send fighter jets," German Defense Minister Boris Pistorius told reporters. "I don't have any confirmation from Poland yet that this has happened."

The White House called Poland's providing Ukraine fighter jets a sovereign decision and lauded the Poles for continuing to "punch above their weight" in assisting Kyiv. But the U.S. administration stressed that Poland's move would have no bearing on President Joe Biden, who has resisted calls to provide U.S. F-16s to Ukraine.

Poland plans to grant Ukraine's request for fighter jets

WARSAW, Poland (AP) -- Poland's president said Thursday that his country plans to give Ukraine around a dozen MiG-29 fighter jets, which would make it the first NATO member to fulfill the Ukrainian government's increasingly urgent requests for warplanes.

President Andrzej Duda said Poland would hand over four of the Soviet-made warplanes "within the next few days" and that the rest needed servicing and would be supplied later. The Polish word he used to describe their number can mean between 11 and 19. "They are in the last years of their functioning but they are in good working condition," Duda said of the aircraft.

Duda did not say whether other countries would be making the same move, although Slovakia has said it would send its disused MiGs to Ukraine. On Wednesday, Polish government spokesman Piotr Mueller said some other countries with MiGs also had pledged them to Kyiv, but he did not name them.

While Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has pleaded for Western supporters to share fighter jets, NATO allies have expressed hesitancy. Before Russia's full-scale invasion, Ukraine had several dozen MiG-29s it inherited in the collapse of the Soviet Union, but it's unclear how many of them remain in service after more than a year of fighting.

Poland plans to grant Ukraine's request for fighter jets

Original article -

WARSAW, Poland (AP) -- Poland's president says his country plans to give Ukraine a dozen MiG-29 fighter jets, becoming the first NATO member country to fulfill the Ukrainian government's increasingly urgent requests for warplanes.

President Andrzej Duda said Thursday that Poland would hand over four of the Soviet-made warplanes in the coming days and the rest need to be checked and would be supplied later.

Duda did not say if other countries would be making the same move, although Slovakia has said it would send its disused MiGs to Ukraine.

On Wednesday, Polish government spokesman Piotr Mueller said some other countries with MiGs also had pledged them to Kyiv, but he did not name them. While Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has pleaded for Western supporters to share fighter jets, NATO allies have expressed hesitancy.

[Best_man23]

1. Poland also knows if Ukraine Falls

They (or the Baltic states) are likely next.

[2naSalit]

4. +1

And it's already gone on too long.

[SheltieLover]

6. Absolutely!

[sheshe2]

17. True.

[maxsolomon]

18. I don't think that's accurate.

Poland is a member of NATO. As are the Baltics. That's a line Putin doesn't need to cross, and he's not dumb enough to cross it and start WW3. Which is that that would mean.

There's lower hanging fruit. If Ukraine falls, Moldova is next. Or Belarus will be absorbed. Or Georgia.

I'm not under the impression he wants any of the Muslim former SSRs.

[EndlessWire]

26. I think it's accurate in terms of intentions.

Moldova has been vulnerable for some time. I believe Moldova has it in their Constitution to be neutral; they never could expel Russia from the land that Russia stole from them. And yet, they have started the process to become part of the EU, much like Ukraine has. I think they see the writing on the wall.

In order to control the entire seaboard and Odesa, taking Moldova would be advantageous for Russia, as well as enabling protection of Crimea. Crimea is going to be retaken by Ukraine.

There are three other countries on the seaboards. but Moldova would be a prime holding. Putin DOES want all the former countries, but will have a harder go at them. I think he effectively controls Belarus anyway.

I wouldn't be surprised if those planes are intended to help maintain Moldova.

And, he IS dumb enough to cross the line. Better to show him that Ukraine will not give up, so he doesn't think he can cross the line. That's what he did when we did nothing in 2014.

[maxsolomon]

29. That's not making a case for "Poland is next".

You're making a case for "Moldova is next", which is what I'm saying too.

Crimea is not Poland:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transfer_of_Crimea_in_the_Soviet_Union

The transfer of the Crimean oblast to Ukraine has been described as a "symbolic gesture", marking the 300th anniversary of the 1654 Treaty of Pereyaslav, called the "Reunification of Ukraine with Russia" in the Soviet Union.[11][17][18] It was also attributed to Communist Party first secretary Nikita Khrushchev, although the person who signed the document was Chairman Kliment Voroshilov, the Soviet Union's de jure head of state.[19]

Mark Kramer, professor of Cold War Studies at Harvard University, also claimed that the transfer was partly to help Khruschev's then-precarious political position against the Prime Minister Georgii Malenkov through winning support of the First Secretary of the Ukrainian Communist Party Oleksiy Kyrychenko. Kramer believed that the transfer also aimed to greatly increase the number of ethnic Russians in the Ukrainian SSR which itself was going through problems integrating previous Polish territory due to organized Ukrainian nationalist resistance.[20]

Nina Khrushcheva, a political scientist and the great-granddaughter of Nikita Khrushchev, said of his motivation, "it was somewhat symbolic, somewhat trying to reshuffle the centralized system and also, full disclosure, Nikita Khrushchev was very fond of Ukraine, so I think to some degree it was also a personal gesture toward his favorite republic. He was ethnically Russian, but he really felt great affinity with Ukraine."[11] Sergei Khrushchev, Khrushchev's son, claimed that the decision was due to the building of a hydro-electric dam on the Dnieper River and the consequent desire for all the administration to be under one body.[21] Since Sevastopol in Crimea was the site of the Black Sea Fleet, a quintessential element of Soviet and then of Russian foreign policy, the transfer had the intended effect of binding Ukraine inexorably to Russia, "Eternally Together", as a poster commemorating the event proclaimed. Other reasons given were the integration of the economies of Ukraine and Crimea and the idea that Crimea was a natural extension of the Ukrainian steppes.[22] There was also a desire to repopulate parts of Crimea with Slavic peoples, mainly Russians and Ukrainians, after the peninsula was subject to large-scale criminal deportations of Crimean Tatars to Central Asia by the Soviet regime in 1944.[23]

[ananda]

2. Well, USA and other countries, it's time to step up!

Send them some fucking planes!

[BumRushDaShow]

10. They don't know how to fly our planes

These guys ain't like Lt. Sulu who can jump into any craft and just work it (and even then, that didn't always go well).





They used to be part of USSR so have experience with Russian-built planes like the MiGs.

We have their pilots here right now in the U.S. learning about our planes -

Two Ukrainian pilots are in the U.S. for training assessment on attack aircraft, including F-16s


March 4, 2023, 4:52 PM EST
By Courtney Kube and Carol E. Lee

Two Ukrainian pilots are in the U.S. undergoing an assessment to determine how long it could take to train them to fly attack aircraft, including F-16 fighter jets, according to two congressional officials and a senior U.S. official.

The Ukrainians’ skills are being evaluated on simulators at a U.S. military base in Tucson, Arizona, the officials said, and they may soon be joined by more of their fellow pilots. U.S. authorities have approved bringing up to 10 more Ukrainian pilots to the U.S. for further assessment as early as this month, the officials said.

Their arrival marks the first time Ukrainian pilots have traveled to the U.S. to have their skills evaluated by American military trainers. Officials said the effort has twin goals: to improve the pilots’ skills and to evaluate how long a proper training program could take.

(snip)

https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/two-ukrainian-pilots-are-us-training-assessment-attack-aircrafts-f-16s-rcna73426

[Rhiannon12866]

33. Excellent point!

And I thought that was Lt. Sulu!

[BumRushDaShow]

34. He needed it to transport some "transparent aluminum" panels

so they could make a tank inside a confiscated Klingon Bird of Prey to transport some humpback whales - "George and Gracie" to the future (so they could communicate with an alien species that was destroying everything in it path and was ready to take out Earth)!

He was actually Commander then...

[Rhiannon12866]

35. Wow! Thanks so much for the whole story!

LOL! And a good one!

[doc03]

3. Are they still talking about that? It's been a f-----g year. nt

[SheltieLover]

7. Yup

[Cheezoholic]

12. Flying isnt the issue

Ground operations are. They may not be saying so but I'm willing to bet they've been getting trained on ground operations here and in Europe for at least 6 months. Training experienced jet pilots in new aircraft isn't nearly as difficult as training ground crews to maintain them.

[samsingh]

5. Poland and the US have led the effort to protect Democracy

and by the US i mean Democrats.

i think the republicans are actually agents of russia, china, and possibly saudi arabia

[SheltieLover]

8. No doubt in my mind where qpukes' loyalties are.

And it's not with the USA!

[mitch96]

15. Like the pukes before WW2 were all in for Hitler and Nazi Germany...uff it all about $$$$$$ nt

[SheltieLover]

16. Yup

[Igel]

13. When the Russians rolled across the border a year ago,

they were met with a bunch of Stingers.

Russians knew they had them--back in 2017 and 2018 the Russians had to move their tanks away from the LOC in the Donbas. Used to shelling from a close distance and being met by the occasional mine or gun fire, they started exploding. Had a marked effect on the death rate of Ukraine soldiers and civilians

[EX500rider]

38. To be fair only 11 GOP's voted against the last Ukraine Supplemental Appropriations

Roll Call Vote 117th Congress - 2nd SessionXMLVote Summary
Question: On Passage of the Bill (H.R. 7691 )
Vote Number: 191Vote Date: May 19, 2022, 12:31 PM
Required For Majority: 1/2Vote Result: Bill Passed
Measure Number: H.R. 7691 (Additional Ukraine Supplemental Appropriations Act, 2022 )
Measure Title: A bill making emergency supplemental appropriations for assistance for the situation in Ukraine for the fiscal year ending September 30, 2022, and for other purposes.
Vote Counts:YEAs86
NAYs11
Not Voting3


https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1172/vote_117_2_00191.htm

[ancianita]

9. Great. More help.

Since Russia's losing the ground war, air war is its next campaign.

While Ukraine has downed 67 Russian drones, these should help improve its air power.
Looks like it's had to deal with the 'fog of war' air activity by Belarus, Hungary, Azerbaijan and Romania.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_losses_during_the_Russo-Ukrainian_War

[FoxNewsSucks]

11. Good news! Although it should have happened sooner

Let's hope this speeds up the asskicking they are giving Putin.

[orangecrush]

14. Bless Poland

They have learned history's lessons well

[Dustin The Wind]

19. Right on!

Forget our testicularly-challenged Republicans, Duda! Just duda right thing!

(I deserve any and all opprobrium cast down upon me for that pun.)

[republianmushroom]

20. like it

[blue-wave]

21. The Ukrainian

offensive will begin in 5-4-3-2-1....very soon. Fighter jets are the last piece of the puzzle, a very important piece, for an offensive.

More jets will follow, not necessarily F-16's. I'm still not 100% convinced the Ukrainians need them. There are enough MiG 29s and others out there which the Ukrainian pilots have a working knowledge. Even so, a big THANK YOU Poland!!

[Rhiannon12866]

32. Excellent news - here's hoping that this is the beginning of the end of this unprovoked war

[FakeNoose]

22. These are to be used for defensive purposes only, am I right?

Thanks Poland!

[XorXor]

28. It's seems unlikely they would be flying them into Russia.

But if to some reason they did, wouldn't that still be for defensive purposes?

[Biglinda 52]

23. Finally, Ukraine is getting fighters

I understand the hesitancy of NATO countries getting involved. Why can't Israel give them some fighters? It's not a member of NATO and since Russia is courting Iran, it would be in Israel's interests to do so.

[BumRushDaShow]

24. "Why can't Israel give them some fighters?"

Because Israel's planes are American planes and they can't fly those... at least yet. They have mainly been trained on and used/use MiGs - even before the war, which is what Poland has (and a few others), and are giving them.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=3046733

[iluvtennis]

25. This is excellent news!!! n/t

[dalton99a]

27. Poland is getting a lot of weapons from South Korea

[oasis]

30. Bootin' Putin squarely in his ass!

[Crowman2009]

31. Hopefully the Russian manufacturing defects have been repaired.

Unlike the Russian Air Force's newly made aircraft.

[yagotme]

37. HA!

Maybe that's what took so long...

[Kennah]

36. Seems that blowing up the Kerch Bridge leaves Russian forces in Crimea unsupplied

[JanMichael]

39. Neither Russia or Ukraine has air superiority. Hence the artillery war.

HIMARS tenches missiles ammo and drones.

Both sides have significant surface to air defense systems. That's why those a10s would not make any sense there at this point.

I've read some reports that say that Western Powers have been watching this closely because of our reliance on air superiority. Surface to air technology has grown by leaps and bounds. Is cheaper than planes and pilots. So everybody spending their money on surface to air technology.

A few more planes are not going to make a difference at this point. Armored personnel carriers mobile howitzers and few well protected tanks are needed. I say well protected tanks and that's where a10s usually came in.

Like I said the United States needs to think about this. In Iraq we spent what 6 months or 6 weeks bombing their antiquated surface to air system? Then we went in with troops after firing a million cruise missiles that's an exaggeration but.

Surface air systems have grown in leaps and bounds since Iraq.