Superconductor Breakthrough Replicated, Twice, in Preliminary Testing

[Mr. Sparkle]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by Lasher (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: Tomshardware.com

Humanity may be in the throes of another breakthrough that's every bit as impactful as the invention of the transistor and the advent (and eventual vindication) of quantum computing. LK-99, as it's been named, is a new compound that researchers believe will enable the fabrication of room-temperature, ambient-pressure superconductors. Initially published by a Korean team last Friday, frantic work is underway throughout the research world to validate the paper's claims. For now, two separate sources have already provided preliminary confirmations that this might actually be the real thing — Chinese researchers have even posted video proof. Strap in; this is a maglev-powered, superconducting ride.

Superconductors, a wild category of compounds that can conduct electricity without any losses, have been a metaphorical goose chase for years now, with multiple research teams claiming (and then retracting) papers and announcements of its achievement. The reason is simple: Few things come close to the potential of an actual superconductor discovery in terms of what it can do for humanity's current and future technology. Imagine if your 16-core mainstream CPU (which likely requires a competent watercooling solution to avoid incinerating itself) operated without power losses — no current leakage, no electricity waste in the form of heat. Superconductors mean almost perfectly efficient computing.

Scale that to the world's supercomputers, and you begin to get an idea of the performance impact when trillions of transistors based on superconducting materials work in tandem across GPU and CPU tiles to accelerate things like Artificial Intelligence (AI) workloads. Or scale it in the realm of consumer electronics, quantum computing (where superconductors are important for Josephson junctions), and magnets in general (maglev trains, tokamak fusion reactors, Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI), electric motors and generators...) If you can dream it and it features an electrical current or magnetism, it's likely a superconducting material would improve most aspects of it while leaving a surplus of previously-wasted energy within humanity's batteries. Environmental sustainability, then, is also a factor. There might be more to LK-99 than skeptics expected, as two research teams have already confirmed the superconductivity claims — albeit in preliminary testing. Researcher Sinéad Griffin from the U.S.'s Lawrence Berkeley National Lab pored over the original paper, taking advantage of the supercomputing capabilities within the Department of Energy to simulate the LK-99 material. This complex-yet-simple concoction results from combining the minerals lanarkite (Pb₂SO₅ and copper phosphide (Cu₃P), which are then baked within a 4-day, multi-step, small batch, solid-state synthesis process.

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Read more: https://www.tomshardware.com/news/superconductor-breakthrough-replicated-twice

[ProfessorGAC]

1. Hope There's Something To This

If it's true, it's kind of a big deal.
I'm intrigued by the scale-up because I spent 15 years figuring how to turn a one liter process into a 12,000 gallon one.

[FreeState]

19. Why would this not be true?

It's been verified twice now by an independent party. It's a huge deal - imagine how fast science will progress, really exciting times!

[ProfessorGAC]

22. I Didn't Say It Wasn't

But, scale is critical. So is grand scale manufacturing efficiency.
Neither have been proven, yet.
Hence "I Hope There's Something To This".
Not sure what you're disputing.

[FreeState]

25. I think I must have misread

I thought you were doubting the claim not the manufacturing

[Effete Snob]

30. Remember cold fusion?

It is not unknown for the cake not to be fully baked before something like this catches fire in the popular press.

And, yes, there were "confirmations" of cold fusion as well.

Big, if true.

[highplainsdem]

31. See replies 26-28 linking to articles that popped up on Google News as

soon as I did a keyword search.

[highplainsdem]

2. Torn between being happy about this and unhappy because of the unethical

uses of the supercomputers and AI we already have.

[Oopsie Daisy]

14. Choose happiness.

[highplainsdem]

15. Being a realist, I'll be aware of ethical issues involved with

technology, as well as the harm already being done.

[Oopsie Daisy]

16. Meh. Any new tech can be abused/misused.

I see this as fantastic news and a marvelous technological breakthrough that will benefit everyone. We can't simply freeze advancement because of irrational or obsessive fears that it will be misused/abused by someone. Certainly it will be, just as every technological advancement has been. But when considering the greater good and with the realistic expectation that more people will benefit than will be harmed, it's clear that this is is something that will far outweigh those types of fears. These are exciting and wonderful times that we live in. We're on the cusp of something great! I'm very much looking forward to what comes next and how this will be used to benefit mankind.

[cutroot]

23. You are so right. People abuse the wheel everyday and that was just a simple invention

We all benefit from it

[Effete Snob]

32. conductivity is not really the principal limiting factor in computing

ambient temp/pressure superconductivity would be great.

However, not all of the predictions about impacts are accurate.

Not all materials are compatible with, for example, semiconductor chip manufacturing techniques and tolerances, or even material incompatibilities.

Since a lot of the action in semiconductor chips occurs IN the silicon, you don't eliminate the heat generated by electrical current in the bulk material, and so the conductive material would still have to be able to run pretty hot. But, frankly, there's not a whole lot of advantage of improving the conductivity of metallic interconnections formed on semiconductor chips for the same reason.

[MayReasonRule]

3. Still Waiting On Definitive Yes - We've Produced Room-Temperature Ambient-Pressure Superconductors

After that, there are plenty more physics barriers to crash through, as always.

It's the very stuff of life after all!



Popcorn is ready!!

[Effete Snob]

33. Yep

Is it ductile? Can it be fabricated in two dimensional patterns in thin layers?

Lots of challenges going from "this stuff is interesting material" to "it can be used for motor windings" etc.

[FredGarvin]

4. Toms Hardware

All ya need to know

[BumRushDaShow]

9. Way before DU, I used to post there

Ars, and Anandtech.

[tinrobot]

5. This is possibly huge and Nobel-worthy

If this bears out, we'll see more efficiency in all sorts of areas.

Faster electronics/computers (that don't need fans)
Phones that could run for a week on a charge instead of days.
Up to 20% more efficient power transmission.
Cheaper MRI machines (that don't require liquid helium.)
More efficient EVs (that would need smaller batteries and be cheaper)

The list is endless. This could be a really, really good thing.

[cstanleytech]

6. I wonder if this might also help with building a *warp* drive spaceship since

the current theory they had for building one probably did not take into account such a development.

[tinrobot]

7. Warping the fabric of space/time? I think that's a stretch.

It may, however, have applications in things like ion drives, which use electricity to propel spacecraft.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ion_thruster

[cstanleytech]

12. I was thinking more about it maybe having an impact regarding the current theoretical

energy requirements.

[swong19104]

8. Propulsion in space

is solely action-reaction. You need to shoot something out one end to propel the object (spaceship) in the other direction. I guess superconductors can increase the magnetic field higher (for lower energy cost) so that whatever object is shot out the back end, it will be shot out faster, and thereby lend greater momentum to the spaceship going "forward".

Not sure if that would result in faster-than-light travel.

[Foolacious]

13. Acceleration in real space will not result in faster-than-light-travel.

But could superconductivity play a role in developing a so-called "warp" or "Alcubierre" drive? No way to know at this point.

[Happy Hoosier]

10. If it's true, it's an automatic Nobel.

Room temp, ambi pressure superconductors that can be mass-produced would have as much impact as the invention of the integrated circuit.

[Effete Snob]

35. It doesn't change the heat generated by conduction in silicon

The "work" in semiconductor chips is done in the silicon, not in the aluminum interconnections on the chip.

The silicon is still going to get hot, because that's where the heat is generated.

The heat is not generated by the metallic interconnections between the transistors on the chip.

[Warpy]

17. The real dream come true is that it doesn't use anything exotic

that can only be found in one small place ruled by an overly ambitious dictator.

It remains to be seen how cumbersome the process is to tun lanarkite in LN-99.

[hueymahl]

18. Unbelievably Amazing

This is truly world-changing if it proves to be as described. There is always a long way from lab to application, but we are starting to talk sci-fi tech possibilities. Imagine batteries that hold their charge indefinitely, ultra-long distance power transmission with virtually no loss. Levitating trains. Generational increases in nuclear fission and fusion. Cheap, virtually limitless power.

Truly a staggering achievement if it pans out.

[EarthFirst]

20. "Lowering the cost of an MRI..."

Let’s not get carried away now!

All snark aside; this is potentially monumental. Kudos.

[PurgedVoter]

21. Another quality of Superconductors is superconduction of heat

So if you have a heat sink down in the earth and it comes up to the walls of your house above, It is quite possible that in a lot of places, this could be a perfect and energy free way to climate control buildings. In others it could still work for one end of the heat spectrum.

[IbogaProject]

24. Wow

This sounds very interesting. The ground down 5 or 10 feet holds the average temperature. This used to be about 55 degrees at 40 lattitude, it's now going up. But it still allows heating and cooling up or down to that average ground temp.

[highplainsdem]

26. Daily Beast: Sorry, But the New LK-99 Superconductor Breakthrough Might Be Total BS

https://www.thedailybeast.com/why-the-room-temperature-lk-99-superconductor-might-be-total-bs

[C Moon]

34. Would you be able to review what the article says? Rather not create a username.

[highplainsdem]

36. ????? I wasn't asked to sign in.

Looking at it again... I can quote only 4 paragraphs, but these are key:

Those attempts to replicate the findings so far have largely failed or achieved only partial success. For example, a team at the School of Materials Science and Engineering at Beihang University in China used the process described by the LK-99 team but did not get the same results. Similarly, a team at the National Physical Laboratory of India failed in their attempt as well.

In one of the more novel attempts, an engineer named Andrew McCalip from space industry startup Varda Space attempted to replicate the material via livestream on Twitch. However, he too was unsuccessful.

However, one researcher at Lawrence Berkeley National Lab has released another preprint paper (not yet peer-reviewed), claiming that he was able to replicate the findings using a simulation. While not a direct replication of the experiment, it does add a fair bit of credence to LK-99 and its veracity.

As for the findings itself, there are a few things that give experts pause. For one, there’s the question of the Meissner effect, a phenomenon where superconducting material can fully levitate when put atop a magnet. If it occurs, it’s another big check in the box that the material is in fact superconducting. The LK-99 team published a video showing a piece of the superconducting material on a magnet. However, one edge remains in contact the entire time and, at one point, the entire piece even falls flat.

[highplainsdem]

27. Radical Superconductor Claim Sparks Concern Among Scientists. Here's Why.

https://www.sciencealert.com/radical-superconductor-claim-sparks-concern-among-scientists-heres-why

[highplainsdem]

28. DIY Scientists and Institutions Are Racing to Replicate the Room-Temperature Superconductor

https://www.vice.com/en/article/5d9yez/diy-scientists-and-institutions-are-racing-to-replicate-the-room-temperature-superconductor

[Backseat Driver]

29. Amazing breakthrough's been replicated - Just WOW!

K&R

[Lasher]

37. Locking on account of questionable source.

After a lengthy discussion, we don't think Tom's Hardware is a reliable source.