Cops were sent to Maine gunman's home weeks before massacres amid concern he is going to snap and commit a mass shooting

[mahatmakanejeeves]

Source: CNN

CNN INVESTIGATES

Cops were sent to Maine gunman's home weeks before massacres amid concern he 'is going to snap and commit a mass shooting'

By Shimon Prokupecz, Mark Morales, Linh Tran and Rachel Clarke, CNN
7 minute read * Updated 6:09 AM EDT, Mon October 30, 2023

Sagadahoc County, Maine CNN -- The Maine National Guard asked local police to check on the reservist who killed 18 people after a soldier became concerned he would "snap and commit a mass shooting," according to information shared with CNN. ... Officers from the Sagadahoc County and Kennebec County Sheriff's Offices responded and tried to contact Robert Card on September 16, less than six weeks before Wednesday's massacres in a bowling alley and a bar, documents say, according to a law enforcement source.

The information obtained by CNN describes how the Sagadahoc County sergeant called for backup, tried without success to talk to the reservist and then received disturbing details from the Maine National Guard and the shooter's family.

The responding sergeant from the Sagadahoc County Sheriff's Office was told "when [he] answers the door at his trailer, in the past he usually does so with a handgun in hand out of view from the person outside," according to the source familiar with the welfare check report. ... The responding officer learned later in a letter from the National Guard that a fellow guardsman "is concerned that [the reservist] is going to snap and commit a mass shooting," according to the report filed in connection with the wellness check.

The 40-year-old went on two shooting rampages in Lewiston, Maine, on Wednesday night, killing 18 people at Just-in-Time Recreation and at Schemengees Bar & Grille.

{snip a lot}

Read more: https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/29/maine-shooting-robert-card-investigation/index.html

[FailureToCommunicate]

1. Sounds like several officers and agencies are busy trying to cover their ass...

And the shooter was able to buy more firearms after being referred for mental health check, for being possibly a great danger to others!


From the article:
"Maine has a “yellow flag” law that can be used to assess an individual with access to weapons. The first step is for law enforcement to take someone believed to be dangerous into custody and then have them evaluated by a medical professional. After a diagnosis, a judge can approve an order to temporarily remove firearms, according to the law."

( Mainers voted down a tougher "red flag" law)

"CNN started raising questions about what information law enforcement in the state had about threats and the mental health condition of the shooter on Thursday. But when CNN asked State Public Safety Commissioner Mike Sauschuck about it, he replied: “I won’t answer.”
"A spokesperson for the state police on Sunday said the organization was the lead agency for the manhunt and homicide investigations but no other aspect, directing CNN to ask questions about what was known before to Sagadahoc County Sheriff Joel Merry.

“The Department of Public Safety (DPS) nor the Maine State Police requested a teletype on Robert Card prior to October 26. It should also be noted that no bulletins or assistance was requested from MSP’s Maine information and analysis center. DPS has no regulatory authority over law-enforcement agencies in Maine,” she said, declining to give any elaboration.

CNN was unable to reach Merry on Sunday. A woman who answered the door at his home said he was “done,” indicating he did not want to speak."

[Woodwizard]

2. A friend of mine family called the police about her sister,

she was being erratic and suicidal and had a handgun, they specifically said to the police she is threatening to use it. The police did nothing to remove the firearm. A week later her boyfriend came to her house to find arrows painted on the wall heading to the bathroom where she had killed herself with the handgun in the bathtub.

This happened in PA.

[maxsolomon]

3. Yellow Flag laws are weak sauce.

Puts a mental evaluation in the hands of cops. They didn't have a reason to detain him for a judge to order evaluation, although someone did. And then they turned him loose.

I doubt they knew he was buying new weapons.

[Grins]

4. Yes. You're right.

The article tries to argue police could have done something when the reality is they can’t. It all sounds good, but in actuality - feckless. By design.

[maxsolomon]

5. Only law that would be passed by the Gunners in the legislature.

Anything with teeth is a 'fringment.

The real American Carnage will just keep rolling.

[CaptainTruth]

6. There's no Baker Act in Maine, I guess?

People here rag on Florida all the time but one of the good things FL has IMHO is the Baker Act:

"Florida's Baker Act law is a means of providing individuals with emergency services and temporary detention for up to 72 hours for mental health examination pursuant to Florida Statute Chapter 394."

Note that "temporary detention" can be forced & involuntary, for the person's own safety & the safety of others.

I know a couple who used it on their daughter when she became violent & suicidal (she had mental health issues). She refused to come out of her apartment so police kicked in the door & took her to a mental health facility for 72 hour detainment per the Baker Act. Her doctor examined her, changed medications & got her stabilized. Being able to invoke the Baker Act probably saved her life.

Her parents called me to repair damage to her apartment before she was released (she stayed in care a few more days voluntarily) & there was blood on the walls from her fighting off her father when he tried to get her out of the apartment.

A sad episode, but afterward she was much better & I'm convinced the Baker Act probably saved her life & prevented further harm to others, & if Maine had a similar law, & if those involved had invoked it, it could have prevented a tragedy.

[moniss]

9. However the Baker Act

is interpreted/enforced with wide variation between jurisdictions in Florida. I knew of a case of a woman who was living alone, had a known history of mental illness and was not eating or taking her medication. She had dropped in body weight to the point where her bones were apparent through her skin. Despite neighbors and family calling for the police and social services to intervene because she was an obvious danger to her health they instead did nothing. In fact social services in that jurisdiction said they would only act upon referral by the police and the police in that jurisdiction said they would only act upon referral from social services. After a few more weeks she was found dead in her home of "natural causes". A danger to themselves is too narrowly interpreted as being imminent self harm with a knife or gun etc. Suicide can happen quickly or over a longer period. What will result from the behavior is the same.

I know the Baker Act has helped some but many jurisdictions don't want to deal with it and so they shift responsibility until it is just a finger-pointing exercise. Sadly when it's combined with a lack of training it is why so many instances of people experiencing a mental health crisis end up with police shooting to death the person involved.

[elleng]

10. 'Her doctor examined her, changed medications & got her stabilized.'

[RussBLib]

7. some rather shocking stats

It appears that most police would like to see assault weapons removed from the citizenry, but they face the NRA, fanatic gun-loving politicians and citizens, and aggressive lawyers. Not a good spot to be in.

Found an interesting article from UC-Davis below. To recap it, killings from mass shooting counted for 0.2% of total US firearm deaths in 2019. 0.2%! (and look at the media coverage.) 39,707 firearm deaths in the US in 2019. 60% of those (23,941 in 2019) were from SUICIDE. That's 65 people PER DAY committing SUICIDE with a firearm. And where is the media coverage? It would seem that suicide by gun should be getting a lot more media attention that it does.

A subset of the age breakdown of suicide would have been interesting. If the "victim" is in poor health and elderly, suicide becomes a more-understandable option. Suicide for depression should also be listed, as those are much more likely to be preventable.

Facts and Figures
The human toll

There were 39,707 deaths from firearms in the U.S. in 2019. Sixty percent of deaths from firearms in the U.S. are suicides. In 2019, 23,941 people in the U.S. died by firearm suicide.1 Firearms are the means in approximately half of suicides nationwide.

In 2019, 14,861 people in the U.S. died from firearm homicide, accounting for 37% of total deaths from firearms. Firearms were the means for about 75% of homicides in 2018.

The other 3% of firearm deaths are unintentional, undetermined, from legal intervention, or from public mass shootings (0.2% of total firearm deaths).

There are approximately 115,000 non-fatal firearm injuries in the U.S. each year.

The economic cost
The estimated annual cost of gun injury in 2012 exceeded $229 billion—about 1.4% of GDP.2

Prevalence of ownership
31% of all households in the U.S. have firearms, and 22% of American adults personally own one or more firearms.3

Compared with other countries
The U.S. has relatively low rates of assaultive violence but high firearm mortality rates in comparison with other industrialized nations.4

Risk and safety
Research has found that individuals with risk factors for firearm injury and death are less likely to safely store their firearms when compared to firearm owners without these risk factors.5,6

https://health.ucdavis.edu/what-you-can-do/facts.html

[RSherman]

8. A guest on Freakanomics yesterday talked about mass shooters

The guest specifically talked about one school shooter and the many, many red flags that happened and there were so many places the young man could have been stopped. But every single person/system failed.

[jvill]

11. The point of Minority Report is that...

Predicting future crimes doesn’t work.

[IcyPeas]

12. The press conference today with Gov. Mills was a clusterf*ck

She gets asked repeatedly by different reporters about law enforcement knowing he was a danger. The reporters questions start at 15 minutes in. The link also contains this video.

Gov. Janet Mills refused to answer numerous questions Monday afternoon about the investigation into the Lewiston shooting and reports that police officials had been notified of the suspect’s mental health crisis months before he shot and killed 18 people.

https://www.pressherald.com/2023/10/30/gov-mills-calls-for-more-conversations-on-gun-violence/


https://www.youtube.com/live/9sNqHgiksrY