Harvard board bars 13 pro-Palestine student protesters from graduating, overruling faculty

[Jose Garcia]

Source: The Hill

Harvard University’s governing board rejected an effort from faculty Wednesday to allow a group of 13 students sanctioned due to their participation in pro-Palestine protests to receive their degrees and graduate.

The Harvard Corporation veto of the Faculty of Arts and Sciences (FAS) decision, which The Harvard Crimson described as “unprecedented,” underlines tensions between the university’s faculty and administration in the wake of mass pro-Palestine protests that have roiled college campuses this year.

FAS voted Monday to recommend that the 13 sanctioned students be allowed to receive degrees and graduate despite their disciplinary violations, going against a decision from the university’s administrative board last week. The corporation’s veto of that faculty vote again bars the students from graduating.

“Because the students included as the result of Monday’s amendment are not in good standing,” the corporation wrote in a statement, referring to the 13 students, “we cannot responsibly vote to award them degrees at this time.”

Read more: https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/homenews/education/4680598-harvard-board-bars-13-pro-palestine-student-protesters-from-graduating-overruling-faculty/amp/

[DENVERPOPS]

1. Wow

isn't that action in direct violation of the first amendment??????? Harvard,...... of all colleges??????

[XorXor]

9. It's not government doing it. So, not sure if it's a first amendment thing

As for it being a violation of the spirit of free speech, I think it really depends on the specifics of why these particular students had such actions taken against them. I don't think it is just that they participated in protests, because hundreds of others did without facing similar actions. I could be wrong, though. I need to look into it further.

[Ontheboundry]

12. How so?

First, it's a private school so there is no first amendment rightsm. 2nd, these 13 probably were the worst of the lot u n the destruction phase

[DENVERPOPS]

13. Could be..........NC

[Zilli]

16. Because this is a "private" school

The US citizens who attend this school do not have any 1st Amendment rights?

[Ontheboundry]

19. That's correct

What does the first amendment say "prevents the government". I can't even make this up.

[Silent Type]

2. Don't know about that. If they otherwise completed requirements, deserve a degree.

Maybe school is trying to avoid a problem at the ceremony. But just doesn’t feel fair.

[Comfortably_Numb]

3. Harvard Corporation, sharing Elon Musk's interpretation of freedom of speech. Bad look, but not surprising.

[sinkingfeeling]

4. Maybe the board members need a course on the Bill.of Rights.

[Prairie Gates]

5. "at this time"

Uh huh.

So they're definitely gonna get these degrees, but only when the sanction period ends. OK.

Basically, the Board is just denying them commencement ceremonies and trying to scuttle jobs/graduate/law/medical school, or whatever. They'll still get their degrees. This is deeply juvenile and petty behavior by the Harvard Board.

[Zilli]

17. Scholastic Merit is meaningless here

Only the petty attacks count. Anything this board can do to harm students who disagree with their petty disdain.

[GB_RN]

6. I'm Not Saying I Agree...

Last edited Wed May 22, 2024, 11:42 PM - Edit history (1)

With the board’s decision.

Perhaps my experience as a member of the Student Judicial Board (SJB) at my first undergrad school and as the student representative on the Student Advisory Committee for the College of Nursing at ECU can shed some additional light or give you a slightly different view..

I’m sure everyone remembers when you got to campus as a freshman/transfer student, you got a copy of the student handbook. That book contained the student code of conduct.

And here’s where my experience might help: No one ever reads it. Ever. No disciplinary infraction case I sat on did the defendant ever read the SCC. I know because we asked. We’d get around to asking the defendant “why” and “were you aware that you can be expelled for this?” and they had no clue. I think the same might apply to the students in question: no clue “x action/decision causes y-response as a result of not knowing/reading SCC). Because the article states this was done for “disciplinary violations”, I would guess this went to the SJB and that the sanction itself, if not actually is, then is the equivalent of expulsion or fees owed: Go straight home Do not pass go. Do not collect $200. No graduation, no diploma.

Doesn’t matter if you’ve completed all requirements for your degree, you’re shit outta luck if you had a job lined up that required a copy of your transcript to prove degree completion - unless - you’re NGS due to owing fees/fines. That…that you can do something about.

[yardwork]

21. So far, yours is the only post in this thread with facts.

I'd have to know what these students did before I decide if I agree with Harvard about this. However, as you state, Harvard is a private institution with specific, written rules that all students agree to comply with (whether they bother to know it or not). The First Amendment doesn't apply. Nor is there any guarantee that students enrolled at Harvard will receive a degree. Degrees are bestowed voluntarily by the institution at its discretion. The fact that most students do fulfill all requirements and receive degrees doesn't imply that it is a right. The diplomas themselves state this.

People seem to have lost sight of the transactional nature of our world. Just because one doesn't like the system doesn't mean it disappears. Don't like Harvard? Don't apply.

[Prairie Gates]

25. They happened not to be facts about this case, but whatever

In my anecdotal experience...

[tornado34jh]

7. Probably to make their donors happy. This looks fishy

I wonder who on the board has some secrets hiding. Is there a conflict of interest? By the way, Harvard, and really much of the Ivy League schools haven't exactly sent their best people who graduated (e.g. much of the Republican politicians and businessmen). So I have to be skeptical of what is going on.

[question everything]

8. Actions have consequences. This much they should learn

[Magoo48]

15. Yes, especially that small despots will generally bend a knee before the golden calf.

[muriel_volestrangler]

20. What were the "actions"? All the article says is being "pro-Palestine".

Obviously, that action shouldn't mean a degree is withheld. Now, if they are charged with assault, or some other criminal act, I could see withholding the degree until that charge is resolved. And no, putting up a tent on the grass shouldn't mean withholding a degree.

[Oopsie Daisy]

10. Good! I'm glad to know that they're standing firm on this. If consequences are threatened *

* then the punishment must be met out. If Harvard indicates that they are toothless, then this will only encourage other violations in the future if certain individuals believe (know) that they'll have zero accountability or repercussions. I have similar feelings about permissive parenting, and letting one's charge get away with just about anything, isn't really parenting at all IMHO. It's just asking for more trouble in the future.

[oldsoftie]

11. Welcome to reality kids! Actions have consequences.

If these were troublemakers, expell them & keep their tuition. I doubt Harvard, who is usually weak kneed about ANYTHING, would be doing this if they were simply protestors.

[womanofthehills]

32. - hundreds walking out during graduation in solidarity

Chanting “let them walk”

Link to tweet

?s=46&t=YZgyyp4w_z7vW3neKxa6cQ

[oldsoftie]

33. "Solidarity will bring down Zionism".Sure, kids. I'm sure their parents are so proud.

And they DIDNT walk. Very nice; disrupt everyone else's ceremony for your grandstanding. "For the martyrs". Yeah, right. The martyrs we're murdered Oct 7th.

[24601]

14. The overwhelming number of students who protested face no punishment. The ones affected by this action are the ones who

did not comply with the order to leave the encampment.

Who can be surprised that they didn't believe there would be consequences?

https://www.wgbh.org/news/education-news/2024-05-06-harvard-protesters-face-suspension

[RobinA]

18. This Is Performative

No way will this stand. It's just wrong. A diploma isn't an award for good behavior. Except those honorary degrees.

[yardwork]

22. It may be wrong and it may be performative, but diplomas aren't guaranteed.

Diplomas are bestowed voluntarily by institutions, at their discretion. Harvard is not under an obligation to bestow degrees if the institution determines that criteria weren't met.

I have no idea what these students are accused of doing and I don't know if I agree with Harvard about this or not. However, it's important for people to realize that earning a diploma is a transaction, not a guaranteed right.

[Prairie Gates]

24. They're going to get the diplomas anyway...they just have to wait until the "sanction period" ends

It's even more performative than you think!

[walkingman]

28. Did you read that or just your opinion? If so, it's not that big a deal.

[Prairie Gates]

30. From the article itself

"The corporation wrote that the impacted students may still be given degrees once their disciplinary cases go through the standard university process, dependent on outcome."

Five students were suspended. Twenty others were sanctioned. None were expelled or separated from the university, so any of them who have completed their degree requirements will receive their degrees at the conclusion of the sanction period. There's no "You don't get a diploma" sanction other than expulsion/separation.

The telling language is also the "at this time" in the Board's statement.

Let me know when they confirm expulsions rather than just playing at these petty and picayune games.

[walkingman]

31. Cool, thank you!

[oldsoftie]

35. Oh, so its just a show with no consequences. I hope donors pull their millions

I wonder how long Harvard could last on their paltry 50 billion endowment??
The Ivy League has always been a joke anyway. Its very similar to the con that trump pulls; make people think THEIR degree is FAR better than one from another universities. The truth is thats not the case at all; few Fortune 500 company CEOs are Ivy League grads. Some didnt graduate from ANY college. Tim Cook went to AUBURN.
Its a money grab.

[oldsoftie]

34. Most universits also have a Code of Conduct. I imagine Harvard is no different.

They were weak for months dealing with these useful idiots. Now they put ONE foot down & issued a few punishments. Deal with it, kids.

[harun]

23. I doubt Harvard graduate and degree holder Ted Kaczynski would agree with this

Oh well.

[Think. Again.]

26. The lesson today kids, is...

...how to keep the donors happy.

[walkingman]

27. That is just wrong...by any measure.