Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

BumRushDaShow

(169,861 posts)
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 06:45 AM Aug 2025

Court allows Trump to end union bargaining for federal workers

Source: Aol/Reuters

Fri, August 1, 2025 at 7:40 PM EDT


(Reuters) -A federal appeals court on Friday lifted a judge's order blocking U.S. President Donald Trump's administration from stripping hundreds of thousands of federal workers of the ability to engage in union bargaining with U.S. agencies. A three-judge panel of the San Francisco-based 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals put on hold an injunction issued by a lower court judge that had been obtained by six unions including the American Federation of Government Employees (AFGE).

U.S. District Judge James Donato in San Francisco in June had issued the injunction blocking 21 agencies from implementing Trump's March executive order exempting many federal agencies from obligations to bargain with unions. Donato concluded Trump's order retaliated against unions deemed critical of the president and that had sued over his efforts to overhaul the government, including the mass firings of agency employees, violating their right to free speech under the U.S. Constitution's First Amendment.

But the 9th Circuit panel said Trump's order on its face "does not express any retaliatory animus," and it agreed with the Trump administration that the president "would have taken the same action even in the absence of the protected conduct." The 9th Circuit panel included U.S. Circuit Judge John Owens, an Obama appointee, and U.S. Circuit Judges Bridget Bade and Daniel Bress, two Trump appointees. Another federal appeals court in Washington, D.C., had in May paused a similar order that had also blocked Trump's order.

AFGE National President Everett Kelley in a statement called the Friday ruling "a setback for First Amendment rights in America." The 9th Circuit put the injunction on hold pending a further appeal, and Kelley said the union is "confident in our ability to ultimately prevail."

Read more: https://www.aol.com/news/court-allows-trump-end-union-234002741.html



Link to ORDER (PDF) - https://fingfx.thomsonreuters.com/gfx/legaldocs/zdpxkqroqvx/union.pdf
38 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Court allows Trump to end union bargaining for federal workers (Original Post) BumRushDaShow Aug 2025 OP
F*CK!!! no_hypocrisy Aug 2025 #1
Little point in appealing since the Bide-appointed judge appears to have agreed FBaggins Aug 2025 #19
Yep SickOfTheOnePct Aug 2025 #20
INFURIATING!! F***ing Basturds! lastlib Aug 2025 #2
I've never heard of that wonderful curse! chouchou Aug 2025 #23
The only way you could ever get on my bad side..... lastlib Aug 2025 #29
Then my life and itching is quite safe, Captain. (I'm watching Star Trek..Strange new worlds..now) chouchou Aug 2025 #32
From the man who said slaves had it like a vacation and the death camp guards were very nice. twodogsbarking Aug 2025 #3
... BumRushDaShow Aug 2025 #4
Thanks. I am missing someone. Haven't seen her in more than a week. twodogsbarking Aug 2025 #6
Justice! OldBaldy1701E Aug 2025 #5
WTAF? lonely bird Aug 2025 #7
Donato doesn't deserve... GiqueCee Aug 2025 #8
Huh? Donato was the one who issued the injunction. Wiz Imp Aug 2025 #9
I stand corrected... GiqueCee Aug 2025 #10
Oh well mdbl Aug 2025 #11
They will once their healthcare is cut back Javaman Aug 2025 #12
Nah, they won't see the connection. But their health care wiull be cut back. KPN Aug 2025 #15
I tend to agree. Ignorance is so prevalent today they won't get it. mdbl Aug 2025 #33
Right --100%. KPN Aug 2025 #35
Right out of Hitler's playbook outlaw unions. Botany Aug 2025 #13
Much like Ronnie did popsdenver Aug 2025 #14
Yep, Reagan's the one. Little did we know at the time where this was all leading. Not that the signs weren't KPN Aug 2025 #16
And with Reagan and Iran-Contra we saw the coming of age of right wing disinformation. Botany Aug 2025 #21
Good point. KPN Aug 2025 #26
Some people knew. I remember stopping at a rest stop in a FL trip as a child and seeing someone eating out of a garbage Iris Aug 2025 #38
Impeach Three rickyhall Aug 2025 #17
Impeach Three rickyhall Aug 2025 #18
Dark times indeed. Joe Biden knows and he's been warning us for years. So did Hillary. Evolve Dammit Aug 2025 #22
Is the reverse true? LatteLady Aug 2025 #24
A future president could certainly choose to negotiate with the unions FBaggins Aug 2025 #28
Under Janus v. AFSCME... SickOfTheOnePct Aug 2025 #31
Time to put up or shut up chicago guy Aug 2025 #25
GENERAL STRIKE NOW angrychair Aug 2025 #27
once again... myohmy2 Aug 2025 #30
We need a big ole strike, just saying. Not up to me, I'm retired. rickyhall Aug 2025 #34
The truth is federal civil servants are not permitted to strike Deminpenn Aug 2025 #36
As a former Steward, VP, and President of my office's AFGE local back in the day BumRushDaShow Aug 2025 #37

no_hypocrisy

(54,919 posts)
1. F*CK!!!
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 06:58 AM
Aug 2025

I know this can be appealed, but c'mon! With THIS SCOTUS? I don't think so . . . . .

Reminder of the difference between union protections and no collective bargaining:


Bargaining rights for compensation and benefits (health, retirement) for all union workers
No arbitrary dismissals and wrongful discharge. (Versus "At Will" Employment where you can be fired for any or no reason)
Job security

And the federal government with its agencies could only benefit from retaining employees who work for THE GOVERNMENT, NOT THE ADMINISTRATION, employees with experience in their department within the agency.

FBaggins

(28,706 posts)
19. Little point in appealing since the Bide-appointed judge appears to have agreed
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 02:02 PM
Aug 2025

It looks unanimous.

The painful reality is that the reason it's important to elect better presidents is because they have actual power to effect things. "That's bad policy" isn't a valid reason for a judge to block something.

SickOfTheOnePct

(8,710 posts)
20. Yep
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 02:54 PM
Aug 2025

And if you look at the case they referenced when they decided it wasn't retaliatory, I can see their decision making process even though I hate to see the result.

Before Trump was even elected, he was railing against federal unions (just like he did during his first term). There is little doubt he would have issued the executive order whether the unions had already filed suits against him for other orders or not, which met the test referenced in the decision. He hates unions, federal or otherwise, so of course he was going to do all he could to break them once he returned to office.

lastlib

(28,283 posts)
2. INFURIATING!! F***ing Basturds!
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 07:10 AM
Aug 2025

May the fleas of ten thousand camels infest his rotten crotch, and may his fingers be too short to scratch.

chouchou

(3,147 posts)
23. I've never heard of that wonderful curse!
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 06:11 PM
Aug 2025

You can guarantee that I will never, ever get on your bad side.

lastlib

(28,283 posts)
29. The only way you could ever get on my bad side.....
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 08:42 PM
Aug 2025

Last edited Sun Aug 3, 2025, 07:39 AM - Edit history (1)

....is to become a repuglikan!

chouchou

(3,147 posts)
32. Then my life and itching is quite safe, Captain. (I'm watching Star Trek..Strange new worlds..now)
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 09:11 PM
Aug 2025

twodogsbarking

(18,807 posts)
3. From the man who said slaves had it like a vacation and the death camp guards were very nice.
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 07:12 AM
Aug 2025

What next, Hiroshima was a fireworks show? No kooky or extreme comments? HTF can we comment on Trump? He is kooky and extreme and those are his best qualities.

lonely bird

(2,945 posts)
7. WTAF?
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 08:18 AM
Aug 2025

Does not express any retaliatory animus???

My right nut it doesn’t. Trump is driven by animus and revenge. He would dry up and die without them.

GiqueCee

(4,285 posts)
8. Donato doesn't deserve...
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 08:36 AM
Aug 2025

... the honorific afforded judges. He has no honor.

On edit: I misread a critical line and unjustly accused Judge Donato, for which I apologize. Righteous rage must be tempered by a careful reading.

Wiz Imp

(10,022 posts)
9. Huh? Donato was the one who issued the injunction.
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 08:55 AM
Aug 2025

Last edited Sat Aug 2, 2025, 09:30 AM - Edit history (1)

It was Bridget Bade and Daniel Press who sided with Trump.

mdbl

(8,661 posts)
11. Oh well
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 09:11 AM
Aug 2025

Does anyone think the dopey right-wing magat union members that voted for Dump will make this connection?

Javaman

(65,723 posts)
12. They will once their healthcare is cut back
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 09:41 AM
Aug 2025

Or something else is cut back or eliminated

mdbl

(8,661 posts)
33. I tend to agree. Ignorance is so prevalent today they won't get it.
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 09:30 PM
Aug 2025

No critical thinking - just weird propaganda.

popsdenver

(2,315 posts)
14. Much like Ronnie did
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 12:41 PM
Aug 2025

which started this mess............The PATCO Union firings declared war on ALL the Unions across the entire nation.....

DeJoy isn't out to just crash the USPS, but also to obliterate one of the largest Unions in the U.S.A........

Kiss the NLRB goodbye.....................

KPN

(17,379 posts)
16. Yep, Reagan's the one. Little did we know at the time where this was all leading. Not that the signs weren't
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 12:52 PM
Aug 2025

already there via McCarthy, John Birch Society and Nixon.

Botany

(77,339 posts)
21. And with Reagan and Iran-Contra we saw the coming of age of right wing disinformation.
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 03:25 PM
Aug 2025

Oliver North was completely crooked but the right wing sold the idea that he wasn’t a dirt
ball who sold weapons to the Ayatollah of Iran, put that money into Swiss bank accounts,
and then use that money in support of right wing dictators in a nice little civil war and a
healthy CIA/cocaine business. No Ollie in reality was a hero fighting for America.

Iris

(16,879 posts)
38. Some people knew. I remember stopping at a rest stop in a FL trip as a child and seeing someone eating out of a garbage
Sun Aug 3, 2025, 10:47 AM
Aug 2025

Can and my dad saying "You're going to see that a lot more now that Reagan is president"

And now look where we are.

FBaggins

(28,706 posts)
28. A future president could certainly choose to negotiate with the unions
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 07:22 PM
Aug 2025

But Congress would have to change the law in order to require union membership

SickOfTheOnePct

(8,710 posts)
31. Under Janus v. AFSCME...
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 09:09 PM
Aug 2025

...I'm not even sure Congress can force union membership on federal employees.

chicago guy

(48 posts)
25. Time to put up or shut up
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 06:34 PM
Aug 2025

When Regan fired the air traffic controllers Every union member should have shut the country down! Walked off their jobs till they were all rehired. The only way to deal with this is to fight as one cohesive unit what is done to one union member is done to all.

myohmy2

(3,721 posts)
30. once again...
Sat Aug 2, 2025, 08:43 PM
Aug 2025

...trump has shown you don't need congress or legislation to have your way as long as you're willing to use raw power and the levers of the executive branch to attack your political enemies...

...I will never again support any Dem not willing to do the same for us...

...we're in a political civil war and it's time to acknowledge it...

...if the assholes want a fascist state, so be it...

...

Deminpenn

(17,514 posts)
36. The truth is federal civil servants are not permitted to strike
Sun Aug 3, 2025, 07:53 AM
Aug 2025

Pay and benefits are set by Congress. Merit System hiring is also federal law.

Further, federal employees aren't required to join the union and don't.

There isn't a whole lot for unions to negotiate. At my activity, the president of our local was aggressive in trying to collectively bargain a new contract with our management, but had no success. The management just ignored the union or negotiated in bad faith. There were no consequences for doing that.

BumRushDaShow

(169,861 posts)
37. As a former Steward, VP, and President of my office's AFGE local back in the day
Sun Aug 3, 2025, 08:54 AM
Aug 2025

the MAIN (and very important) issues for negotiation were -

1.) Flexitime - i.e., the "working" day time range, with "core hours" (when all employees needed to be on the clock), where we eventually ended up with a 6:00 am - 6:00 pm "day", with employees options for arriving at 6:00 am (earliest, which was mostly a HQ thing), and 9:30 am (10:00 am for HQ, the latest arrival), with a depart time of 2:30 pm (earliest HQ) or 3:00 pm (most others), to 6:00 pm (most) or 6:30 pm (HQ). My office ended up with a 6:30 am - 3:00 pm range.

The "core hours" were 10:00 am - 2:00 pm (ET - adjusted through timezones, although those outside of ET were often stuck with "way too early" conference calls scheduled by the east coasters )

2.) Flexiplace - this was the "Work at Home" / "remote work" option (where there was also "hoteling" in HQ where they would go to some designated network-configured location to work)

3.) Timekeeping - I know at one time, some of our district offices had literal physical time cards that would need to be used with a punch clock for arrival/departure time stamps. This was not across the board (my office just had a "sign in book" for arrival/departure times). So eventually the punch cards went away, replaced by sign-in books, and eventually the whole system was automated for timekeeping (including incorporating the employees' selected "work schedule" time frame per the Flexitime agreement).

4.) Credit Hours - a biggy when I was first in the union early in my career where the option was heavily bargained, and was finally made available. It allowed an employee to work extra hours (up to a fixed amount per pay period - I think it was 10 hours) and be able to be used that time as the equivalent of annual leave, but it would not have been considered "overtime" (which would have required extra pay for the extra hours over 40 hours/week or 80 hours per pay period). IIRC, there was a max that could be earned (I think 24) before it needed to be used if any additional credit hour work was desired.

5.) Office space - this was particularly notable when an office moved within a building moved to a new building and/or if there was a renovation going on and/or new cubicles/workstations were being procured and installed, where the union could bargain on how much space each employee (who was not already in an individual office) would be allocated to make it "fair".

6.) Subsidized transit - that was something the national chapter was able to obtain, where employees who used public transit to get to work would get reimbursed for some portion of the monthly cost.

7.) Training (and training opportunities, including conference attendance, etc) - mostly to thwart favoritism and allow reasonable seniority considerations versus need to get newer employees up and running

So there ARE things to "bargain" - notably things related to "working conditions" and "employee advancement" (through training), which are beyond "salary/benefits" (which are guided by law).

THAT is "the truth".

Latest Discussions»Latest Breaking News»Court allows Trump to end...