Woman arrested in supplying of gun that killed Colo. prisons chief

[maddezmom]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by Tx4obama (a host of the Latest Breaking News forum).

Source: LATimes

HOUSTON -- —
Colorado authorities have arrested a woman accused of illegally transferring the gun allegedly used to kill the state prisons chief, according to the Colorado Bureau of Investigation.

Investigators believe Stevie Marie Vigil, 22, of Commerce City, Colo., legally bought the gun from a licensed dealer in the Denver suburb of Englewood before transferring it to Evan Ebel, 28, a felon barred from possessing a firearm, the CBI said in a statement posted on Facebook.

Ebel, who died last week after allegedly using the same gun in a shootout with officers in Wise County, Texas, is suspected in the shooting deaths of Colorado Department of Corrections head Tom Clements, 58, on March 19 and Nathan Leon, 27, who was shot March 17 while working as a pizza delivery driver around Denver. El Paso County, Colo., sheriff’s investigators have said ballistic evidence shows Ebel used the same gun in Colorado and Texas.

“Oftentimes referred to as a 'straw purchase,' investigators believe Vigil purchased the firearm from a licensed firearms dealer in Englewood, and allegedly transferred the weapon to Evan Ebel, a convicted felon who could not legally possess a firearm,” the CBI said in its statement. “The licensed firearms dealer has been extremely cooperative with investigators, and had no knowledge of Vigil's alleged actions following her legal purchase of the gun.”



Read more: http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-ebel-colorado-gun-20130328,0,4479434.story

[onehandle]

1. Track, Register, and Tax All Gun Sales Now!

So the gun nut response, as usual, will be that criminals ignore rules.

No shit.

Make the penalty for breaking the rules Substantial.

First Illegal Gun Sale: Five Years in Prison

Second Illegal Gun Sale: Twenty-Five Years in Prison

Third Illegal Gun Sale: Ninety-Nine Years in Prison

Edited to change the penalties.

[Thinkingabout]

2. K & R

[AtheistCrusader]

3. Nice prediction.

I too, support increasing the penalties for a straw purchase.

There are a range of possible current charges, but what you suggested is in some cases stronger. Bumping the first offense 1 level in the felony class would be good.

Wouldn't have to worry about that person acquiring a gun to sell ever again either.

http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf

[xtraxritical]

21. Maybe she did not know the gun was missing? They'll have a hard time convicting her.

[NickB79]

4. Are you talking about the dealer or the person making the purchase?

Because the woman who made the illegal gun transfer is already looking at years in prison, not a wimpy $10,000 fine. And that's how it should be.

Unless you can show that the dealer had clear knowledge that this was a straw purchase, you'd be SOL in court proving it. If the guy wasn't in the store with her when she made the purchase, I can't see how the dealer could be held criminally liable. It would have been a perfectly legal gun purchase in that case, and only became a crime after she left the store. I can recall one instance when I was working the gun counter at Gander Mountain in college where two guys came in, and one guy was asking all the questions. When I pulled out the background check paperwork so he could buy a shotgun, his friend started filling it out. This was a classic straw purchase scenario, so I called the store manager. I told him what I saw, and he told the two guys to get out of the store.

[onehandle]

10. My definition of an illegal gun sale...

A gun sold that is not registered in a national data base.

or

A gun sold that does not have a complete history of sales and owners.

or

A gun sold without being taxed.


Skip a step? You're a criminal.

Period.

[friendly_iconoclast]

22. Your work is cut out for you, then. Best get busy on it if you want it to happen.

Tearjerking photo-ops and choreographed legislative hearings persuasive to those that already agree with you will not suffice.

[premium]

5. Not only should she be charged federally for the straw purchase,

but CO. should also charge her with being an accessory to murder and put her away for a long fucking time.

She knew that this POS was barred from legally having a firearm, therefore, that makes her just as guilty of murder as him.

[freshwest]

8. I'm wondering what her defense will be. She knew what he was about, but let him have the gun.

She supplied lethal means. It's not like giving someone a car with gas, a suit of clothes or rent money to get a new start. She may have written to this guy in prison and that may tell the prosecutors why she did it.

You're right, no matter what the story is, she bears responsibility. I'm surprised to see the person supplying a weapon arrested and glad law enforcement acted on it. This should happen a lot more often.

[Blue_Tires]

13. I guess if she really wanted to try, she could say Ebel threatened her...

but that defense is a longshot...

[freshwest]

17. My first thought was that she's his girlfriend. I've heard of women who are pen pals with convicts.

If they didn't know each other, a defense of being threatened could come into play, but law enforcement may have come across something incriminating, not seeing her as a victim of a crime by Ebel.

The records are sealed and this may fade from the public's attention span quickly. It's the first time I ever heard of such an arrest which is interesting to me.

Maybe the record keeping is better than I imagined it would be, or the gun dealer who sold her the gun had suspicions and turned her in.

[AtheistCrusader]

14. There are ancillary charges on the books now for knowingly selling or straw purchasing to someone

who intends to commit a crime.

We can talk about increasing the penalty, but a penalty does exist today. Which she has learned.

[premium]

16. Those would be Federal charges right?

If so, than could CO potentially charge her with being an accessory to murder?

[AtheistCrusader]

18. I've seen the charges go the other way.

I've seen the recipient charges with aiding and abetting the straw purchaser in lying on the form. I haven't seen charges go the other way yet. There may be examples but I am not aware of them. You'd think Conspiracy and some other stuff would apply, but again, I have not yet seen it.

[premium]

19. Thanks. nt.

[DallasNE]

6. Might Not Be Able To Make Any Charges Stick

This woman was not required to do a background check so unless she had prior knowledge of his criminal background I'm not sure the authorities can make the charges stick, even if it was an open and shut case of being a straw type purchase. Nothing mentioned about whether she also purchased the ammo for Ebel or if he got that elsewhere.

[NickB79]

7. Good poster child for universal background checks then

Not sure if that would have actually stopped her, but it would have given the authorities more to charge her with.

[DallasNE]

9. Exactly

This is a poster boy for why private sales must be included in the background check. Also, perhaps every weapon sold needs to be fired and the ballistics captured as part of the records kept on that weapon.

Also, the NRA is constantly saying "enforce existing law". Unless the gun was captured the sale could not have been traced because the ballistics could not be traced to this weapon so it is rare that existing law can be enforced for what turned out to be an illegal sale like this. As it is the NRA will probably say "we told you so" and care must be taken to not allow that to happen.

[kestrel91316]

11. In a perfect world, she would face the exact same punishment that he does.

Just like the bank robber that DOESN'T fire the shot that kills the teller.

[freshwest]

12. Further googling shows this information:

Gun linked to Colorado prison chief slaying leads to woman's arrest

...Stevie Marie Vigil, 22, was arrested on Wednesday, the Colorado Bureau of Investigations said in a statement. Investigators say that she is suspected of illegally transferring the firearm to ex-convict Evan Ebel, 28, after purchasing it from an Englewood, Colo., firearms dealer...

Police have said that Ebel was connected to the 211 Crew, a white supremacist prison gang that is known for its violent behavior. The gang is thought to have as many as 1,000 members, many in Colorado prisons, according to Mark Potok, a senior fellow at the Southern Poverty Law Center...

Arrest records for Vigil are sealed. She was placed in the Arapahoe County Jail on Wednesday and bond was set at $25,000, the CBI said. She could face charges for the unlawful purchase of a firearm...

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/03/28/17501539-gun-linked-to-colorado-prison-chief-slaying-leads-to-womans-arrest?lite

Wonder when '...after purchasing it from an Englewood, Colo., firearms dealer...' she bought the gun. If it was after he was released from prison, that would be a problem.

If she bought a gun for him and not just had it on hand for a while and sold to a stranger for profit, it puts it in a different light.

I don't know if there is any way for an individual to do a legal background check, it seems as if they wouldn't have access to a data base.

The article uses the term 'transferred.' It doesn't say if it was a gift or a sale. Since the records are sealed, we may never know. We're all just speculating. This may be her mug shot:



It's terrible there isn't sufficient prevention for this kind of crime. AFAIK, since he served his sentence he wouldn't be on parole and was unsupervised despite his violent history. I'm not sure how to prevent this.

[bettyellen]

20. It doesn't really matter how long she had it to the person who got shot by the felon....

It may show more direct intent, but she was equally wrong and equally endangering others no matter what.
If she bought others, I'd be concerned that their were more transfers and she should be investigated for that.
But who cares how long she had it- maybe she was going to give it to a different gang member, or bought it the minute he asked her too, instead of waiting for him to be released.

[truthisfreedom]

15. Make an example of her.

Put the fear into straw purchasers, whether or not she was one.

[Tx4obama]

23. Locking, sorry. LBN Dupe. Please continue discussion on LBN link below

LBN OP here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014437311

Thanks