Hofstra Student in Home Invasion Was Killed by Police Gunshot: Officials
Source: WNBC
The 21-year-old Hofstra student who was killed during a Long Island home invasion was shot dead by a police officer as the gunman had her in a headlock and was trying to drag her out of the house, officials said Saturday.
Nassau County Police said at a news conference Andrea Rebello was killed by police, not by the armed gunman who was trying to rob the off-campus house where she was living with her twin sister, Jessica, and several others.
Rebello, a Hofstra junior studying public relations, and suspect Dalton Smith, 30, were both shot and killed as he was trying to back away from police with a gun to her head, police said.
An officer fired eight rounds, seven of which hit the suspect and one that hit Rebello in the head, police said.
Read more: http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Hofstra-University-Student-Killed-Shot-Andrea-Rebello-Long-Island-207993511.html
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DRoseDARs
(6,810 posts)*slow ironic clap*
He'll be on paid administrative leave for a few weeks, then back on the job in no time. And the girl will still be dead.
Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)to pick up ANY of the cost of the funeral for your family member that we killed. That's only reserved for officers that are killed.
socialsecurityisAAA
(191 posts)Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)DRoseDARs
(6,810 posts)At the very least, the suspect's family should sit with the victim's family during the court proceedings.
Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)He was on parole, with a long rap sheet, committing a crime and pointing a gun at a police officer.
Its tragic what happened to the homeowner though. I imagine her family will win the lawsuit, perhaps against the police, and the suspects estate.
DRoseDARs
(6,810 posts)Maybe re-read my post?
Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)Assuming the article is factually correct, I don't think the suspects family deserves to win a lawsuit either.
LisaL
(44,967 posts)And if suspect were alive, he'd likely be charged with felony murder. Even if he didn't pull the trigger. I am amazed somebody would suggest his family is somehow entitled to something.
Duckhunter935
(16,974 posts)number of rounds to seven, eight is obviously too many
MrModerate
(9,753 posts)otohara
(24,135 posts)and racists.
Happened to my nephew...nice kid wanted to help people, ended up being just another douchebag cop.
MrModerate
(9,753 posts)"Tribal influences"?
DRoseDARs
(6,810 posts)
Cirque du So-What
(25,902 posts)gungeon humor (attempted) falls flat.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)it doesn't matter because bullets do not differentiate between good and bad. . .they just kill.
Fuck you, NRA. . .you dickless lunatics.
JustABozoOnThisBus
(23,314 posts)Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)Stupid cop = good guy with gun. Victim of crime dead due to good guy with gun.
NRA debunked. Fuck the NRA, dickless lunatics.
RobinA
(9,884 posts)For ALL involved. Disgusting comments not necessary but I guess to be expected here from armchair quarterbacks.
Historic NY
(37,449 posts)dballance
(5,756 posts)If there were any facts presented in the article that described the officer as reckless or negligent I missed them. He walked up the steps and the perp pointed a gun at him. What was he supposed to do? Stand there and just take the bullet?
Read the article. . .
RILib
(862 posts)8 shots are excessive when there's a hostage there too? That pretty much guaranteed the cop would kill her.
I've heard so many stories like this, I would really hesitate to call the police in such a situation.
dballance
(5,756 posts)I'm not a trained LEO and I wasn't in that particular situation at that time. Nor do I have any better information about the shooting than does probably everyone commenting on this thread who is ready to charge the officer with murder and sue the city for wrongful death. I have seen some followup stories to the initial one. No where in them have I seen it suggested that the officer was a "cowboy" or had a history of over-reacting or that he over-reacted in this situation.
I have heard, at multiple times, that when an officer fires their weapon it is not uncommon practice, and they may even be trained, to empty the weapon in a close fire situation like the one we're discussing. Namely, self-defense from an armed gunman. Trained LEO or not, the officer is human. There is some level of adrenaline and panic that must set in.
By the time he started firing he was no longer really firing to stop the perp with the hostage. He was firing in self-defense at a gunman who aimed the gun at him with the apparent intention to disable or kill the officer. You have to look at that a whole different way than just stopping a perp with a gun and a hostage.
Don't forget there was another officer there too that the officer who fired was trying to protect as well as the hostage. The officer who fired made the decision to defend three lives as best as possible as he could at the time. His, his partner's, and the hostage's. It is a real tragedy that the hostage lost her life. But two other people walked away alive. Nope 2/3 is not as great as all three (I discount the gunman in the numbers because I feel once you pull a gun on a the police in that situation you've forfeited your life). If he'd ducked, or not fired we don't know what would have happened. We don't even know if it was possible for him to take cover. We do know the gunman would have still had a live weapon and three targets.
Certainly, there are situations where officers act like cowboys, act negligently and people get injured or killed. As investigations are done and the information comes out this may turn out to be one of those situations.
Until the investigation is done I think it's just so many opinions on a an discussion board. Both sides need to be represented in the discussion though. So I'm trying to make people ask questions based on the real information they have rather than simply jump to conclusions.
RILib
(862 posts)and without waiting for hostage negotiators on the way. Error, death of victim. Criminal negligence at the least.
FarCenter
(19,429 posts)The officer then fired the fatal shots, police said.
Smith was released on parole in February after serving time for first-degree robbery and has a lengthy criminal record that includes assault, police said. A warrant for his arrest was issued last month for parole violation.
No more three strikes in NY?
alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)DCKit
(18,541 posts)alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)I don't think you have firm grasp on how our legal system works. There are no federal habitual offender sentencing enhancement for state level offenses. That is handled by each state. Numerous states do have habitual offender sentencing enhancements but NY is not one of them.
DCKit
(18,541 posts)Please forgive me.
alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)It was a complete misunderstanding of the federal - state division, which is more along the lines of 8th grade civics.
Starboard Tack
(11,181 posts)alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)included a habitual offender clause, but I don't think it did.
By "three strikes," I'm referring to the very specific sentencing enhancements generally dated to the Washington State and (more famously) California statutes of the early 90's. They differ from previous similar enhancement "options" by mandating the enhancement for any person convicted of three felonies (on three separate occasions).
Starboard Tack
(11,181 posts)Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)
Recursion
(56,582 posts)There's not a good solution in that situation.
ForgoTheConsequence
(4,867 posts).
Recursion
(56,582 posts)Cops have that right too
davidn3600
(6,342 posts)Recursion
(56,582 posts)Last edited Sun May 19, 2013, 09:41 AM - Edit history (1)
In a gunfight situation the average is 10 shots to hit someone, so he was doing somewhat better than most.
The blame lies with the criminal who hid behind her while trying to kill the cop.
Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)officer's bullets, she would still be alive. Or if she locked her door. Anyway, we are trained to defend ourselves even if it puts the victim in harms way. Being a police officer is a hard job. And after all, we are trained to empty our clips. Normally, it takes 10 shots. Our officer only needed eight, and 87.5% hit the target.
Sorry for your loss. The funeral we caused is on you. And the officer that shot the girl will just get a talking to."
Badge sniffers are as annoying as gundamentalists.
Response to Recursion (Reply #24)
atreides1 This message was self-deleted by its author.
presscac
(15 posts)to stop the threat. Not one bullet more or one bullet less.
premium
(3,731 posts)I was trained to shoot until the threat no longer existed, now whether the perp lived or died wasn't a concern, the concern was to nullify the threat.
However, the only things I shot during my career were injured animals, and a couple of bears that had become a menace to humans.
Supply Side Jesus
(2,528 posts)Not one of them ever been through a Law Enforcement Academy...
Not One of them ever been through a Citizen Academy
not one of them ever had to tell a mother that her child had just killed herself
Not one ever had to sit through autopsy of 4 month old after being shaken death
Not one of them had to help track down human remains after an explosion
Not one of them had to hear a child talk about how they sexually assaulted
not one of them can't be bothered to acknowledge the thousands of horrors LEOs are exposed to in a career that leads to high numbers of suicide, alcoholism, depression....
instead they'll sit in judgement with ignorance of ALL facts and factors...
Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)Obviously, you never taught. I got that story a few times. And when I told the child I was legally obligated to contact the police, the child would break down and threaten suicide if I told anyone.
"Please, Mr. (name redacted)."
Don't let me get in the way of your logic though.
I had to tell a mother her child just killed himself because the 15 year old kid left his suicide note on my desk.
I had to talk a few of my drug addicted student out of their psychosis because I was the school's quasi psychologist because I have an MA in Psychology.
I can acknowledge the horrors LEOs fact because I was exposed to alot of it as a teacher and it still haunts me at night, wondering if there was more I could do.
My student that left the suicide note. . .I almost took my life because Ifelt I could have done more. I spent that summer inside a bottle trying to forget and atone, even though I didn't do anything. I felt completely responsible because the student opened up to me.
Depression? Don't get me started.
I'll sit in judgement over the fact that the officer was careless and killed the victim of the crime. Don't you DARE tell me I don't know what it's like.
You have no damn right to do that. Not now, not ever!
Logical
(22,457 posts)ForgoTheConsequence
(4,867 posts)I don't think so.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)ForgoTheConsequence
(4,867 posts)And its easier to defend when your lips are firmly attached to their boots.
She wasn't pointing the gun at him, if this happened with anyone else who wasn't a cop they wouldn't have the benefit of different standards.
Th1onein
(8,514 posts)He went in there like Rambo, and ended up at the wrong end of the perp's gun. If he had followed proper protocol, the girl would still be alive. They're glossing overs this on the "news" today, but that's what the deal is, and they should fire that cop.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)must note that the Nassau Country police department has nothing to do with the much better trained NYC police department.
but if they reinterpret the 2nd, and ban all bullets from the hands of any individual that are not on duty law enforcers, then the perp would not have been in the street with a bullet
in his gun.
JI7
(89,233 posts)out based on what i read about his record.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)NYPD has the best hostage negotiating team in the world.
(though an error can happen.)
and not to anyone in particular-just a general-
People who dislike the police/firedepartment/ems/lawenforcement should realize that the police/fire/ems/law/ will come and save them too when they are in trouble and don't stop and think is this person who called someone who has put down law enforcement 100 times over in the past.
as for the perp - that is what happens when a gun is brought into a situation.
Guns and bullets are manufactured to kill, and again, they have.
Had the perp not had a gun, the situation would not have ended this way
(assuming of course the article above is correct. Can they ascertain that info so quickly?)
markpkessinger
(8,392 posts)Sean Bell . . . Amadou Diallo . . . Eleanor Bumpers . . . Reynaldo Cuevas . . . nine innocent bystanders wounded last August by police shooting at a man with a knife in Herald Square . . . Manuel Chametla . . . Timothy Stansbury . . . Patrick Dorismond . . . Gideon (Gary) Busch . . . Kimani Gray --- yep, that training sure makes all the difference alright.
Or perhaps we're talking about some different NYPD in another universe . . .
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)those days are long over.
and all of the above were different situations as there was no hostage involved
and of all the above, only one would remotely be 10% of the Hofstra situation.
markpkessinger
(8,392 posts)Under Bloomberg/Kelly, there have been:
-- the 9 from Herald Square
-- Sean Bell
-- Kimani Gray
-- Reynaldo Cuevas
-- Manuel Chametla
-- Timothy Stansbury
Wanna try again?
presscac
(15 posts)Oh, you didn't read the article
Response to presscac (Reply #46)
graham4anything This message was self-deleted by its author.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)christx30
(6,241 posts)Doesn't make it go away. Laws aren't magic. Most likely the bad guy would still have the gun and bullets. I'm not arguing against better laws. I just think its a little too hopeful to say that banning bullets would have stopped this from happening.
Want pot? It's illegal. But you can still get it.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)wellness is in.
80-20
20 is out.
premium
(3,731 posts)Last edited Mon May 20, 2013, 08:20 AM - Edit history (1)
You mean this NYPD.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/25/empire-state-building-shooting-nypd-bullets-shot-all-nine_n_1830007.html
New York Police Commissioner Ray Kelly said all nine bystanders wounded in Friday's Empire State Building shooting had been hit with police gunfire, CNN reported Saturday morning.
According to Kelly, of the nine wounded, three suffered gunshot wounds and six were hit by fragments.
They are very good at brutalizing unarmed citizens.
Question for you, how do you outlaw bullets? It's very easy to make your own bullets in a garage, shed, room, and, how would you get thugs to turn in their bullets?
jeff47
(26,549 posts)At a minimum. And abuse by the relevant police force would be far better.
You had a nice rant going, but completely sabotaged yourself by going with an easy-to-find picture.
premium
(3,731 posts)I'll edit it.
hughee99
(16,113 posts)can't get them.
heaven05
(18,124 posts)
FlynnArcher72
(12 posts)Having read the comments to the news feeds n this, there seems to be very little blame being handed down in the direction of the officer. There are those who believe better training would have helped the situation and perhaps Andrea Rebello would still be alive, but training only goes so far. A gun battle of any kind is not like a Hollywood movie or television show. In these bits, yoou have the tough action hero ducking, diving, driving recklessly, and doing all manner of other crazy stuff while usually pegging the bad guys with perfect shots every time he pulls the trigger. In reality, there are so many stressors and variables involved that can affect the situation. There is fear and confusion, unexpected movements, unfamiliar environments, worry, adrenaline, and so forth. I have no doubt that the police officer who shot both this poor girl and the criminal was trying to do the best he could to do his duty. It would be a poor cop indeed who would enter that scenario with anything but the mentality of protecting and saving the innocent involved. According to a couple of news articles, the perp turned the gun on the officer at the scene, which prmpted the officer to open fire. The cop has just as much of an obligation to protect his own life as well as the lives of others. Had the officer not chosen to pull the trigger, he could have been killed, leaving the criminal in the position to continue holding Angela hostage, possibly leading to her deat as well anyway. Perhaps not. There are so many "what-ifs" and they are all effectively moot at this point. The officer, a 12 year veteran on the force, is likely beating hmself up at this point, running every possible scenario through his head, wondering himself what he could have done differently.
Here is the thing, though, there is another person possibly kicking herself and wondering if she could have done something different. The criminal, under threat of killing Angela, forced an unnamed woman at the house to go to the bank to withdraw money. She had 8 minutes to return or the criminal would kill Angela. On the way to the bank, she called the police. She has to be wondering if she had simply gotten the money and returned if the man wih the gun would have simply left once satisfied and Angela would still be alive. This is not to say she is at fault, not at all. But I mention this only to illustrate how "what-ifs" can dig into us and drive us crazy. We need to keep focused on the facts and the reality of what happened. What if the criminal had never been relaesed? What if there were stricter controls on guns? So on and so on. None of this matters. What matters is that we discover the truth of the matter and then work to correct the inequities that led to this in future cases to prevent it from happening again, which is a tall order considering there will be people on all sides pointing fingers, some with genuine concern, and others trying to promote some agenda. The investigation as to the officer's liability and performance is only beginning, so we will have to wait for the official report on this.
As for myself, I look at this situation and understand that the officer is not Robocop or some fancy action her. He is a human being who made a critical error that tok the life of a young woman. I do not believe he intended this, he was not the criminal holding the girl in a headlock and threatening to kill her. The officer did his best and failed. The criminal's actions are what created the situation, a point that evokes zero sypathy in me for his demise. If there is anyone to blame her, it is the actionas of the man who entered the home with his threats and his gun to begin with.
LisaL
(44,967 posts)In Dr. Petit case, two criminals who invaded the home allowed the mother to go into the bank and get the money. After she returned from the bank, she was killed along with her two daughters (despite the fact that she gave them the money).
I agree with your point. There was never any guarantee that the woman would have lived, much less any of them, had she returned from the bank with the cash and not called the cops. The human mind will sometimes place the blame for tragedy in places where it does not belong. The woman is probably wondering if calling the cops was a good idea or not. "Did I make the right choice? Would she still be alive had I just gotten the stupid cash and gave it to him?" There is going to be a lot of psychological damage resulting from this and we need to remember that these people not only need answers to why this happened, but help and support in dealing with the emotional backlash as well.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)It's not complicated
Poll_Blind
(23,864 posts)The police in my area are trained to fire two into center of body mass. It is almost certain that a police officer would NOT have been able to place two shots into the suspect's body mass with a hostage held as was (apparently) reported in the article.
Any time a policeman uses deadly force, the application of the deadly force used should and will be examined in an investigation afterward. If the policeman is found to have used deadly force recklessly or at least without due care, there is every possibility that their use of deadly force may be found to be lawful but their application of deadly force may have been negligent in some way.
I'd be curious to know if the shot that hit the victim was near the first or last shots fired. I am inclined to believe, giving the officer the benefit of the doubt, that it was near the end of the series of shots and that does give legitimate concern as to why the officer felt the situation needed so many bullets in the criminal.
PB
Supply Side Jesus
(2,528 posts)They should be trained until the threat stops...regardless of how many shot it takes.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)"Protect and Serve."
I wish!
rickyhall
(4,889 posts)
24601
(3,955 posts)AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)take the robber's gun away, yet there are those who will reason that the cops should take away the guns of those who are not armed robbers or other criminals.
Is the public going to buy this logic?
Anyone who thinks that the public is going to buy this logic, all they have to do is run for office.
marshall
(6,665 posts)Gun stores should be forced to follow the law about who can and cannot buy firearms.
christx30
(6,241 posts)got the gun at a gun store? People will always be able to get weapons. I'm assuming this asshole got contacts while in prison. Scumbag friends can get a gun with one phone call, never having seen the inside of a gun store.
Yes it's illegal. Doesn't matter to them. Money is money.
Bay Boy
(1,689 posts)...is the least likely place this gun got his gun, at least as far as him buying it directly from a gun store himself.
raccoon
(31,105 posts)"The unknowing can talk about training forever, you just don't have a scintilla of knowledge as to what it is like to be inbolved in a gunfight. It is a totally harrowing situation. I don't think there is any type or amount of training that can prepare you for it. Your heart comes up to your throat, your hand is probably shaking and making it almost impossible to aim properly, and all you can think about is your family. You're too busy silently praying to God that you live through it, and shooting at paper targets that aren't shooting at you is laughable training."
"Terrible tragedy indeed, but how about this spin on the story. Bad points gun at cop. Cop holds his fire. Bad guy kills cop. Bad guy kills hostage. Bad guy goes back upstairs and kills rest of hostages because he now knows he will not get out of this situation alive. Everyone putting blame on the cop has never been in this situation. He fired 8 rounds, 7 hitting the bad guy and one hitting the hostage. Now granted nobody know which bullet hit the hostage whether it was the first or the last?"
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Anyone can concoct some fantasy scenario about what else could of happened if x number of shots were or were not fired...
As for the first comment, I get it, being a cop is tough, yadda yadda yadda...It still won't bring the girl back, doesnt excuse his lack of judgement, and the cop belongs in jail as a result...
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)You can bring up all the extenuating circumstances you can imagine, and it still doesn't change the bottom line...Take "cop" out of the equation, and say it was two civilian CCW holders involved...Should they still be immune from punishment?
I know he'll *never* actually get jail time; unarmed innocents have been fatal victims of more egregious "unforeseen accidents" than this, and the worst punishment I've ever known a cop to get was dismissal...
Beacool
(30,245 posts)I was telling a friend that it wouldn't surprise me if it turned out that the police shot her by accident. This was a hostage situation. Why didn't they send a negotiator, instead of running into the house?
Poor girl, may she rest in peace.
olddots
(10,237 posts)n.t.
