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onehandle

(51,122 posts)
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:19 PM Jul 2013

Four Zimmerman jurors release statement

Last edited Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:54 PM - Edit history (1)

Source: MSNBC

We, the undersigned jurors, understand there is a great deal of interest in this case. But we ask you to remember that we are not public officials and we did not invite this type of attention into our lives. We also wish to point out that the opinions of Juror B-37, expressed on the Anderson Cooper show were her own, and not in any way representative of the jurors listed below.

Serving on this jury has been a highly emotional and physically draining experience for each of us. The death of a teenager weighed heavily on our hearts but in the end we did what the law required us to do.

We appeal to the highest standards of your profession and ask the media to respect our privacy and give us time to process what we have been through.


Read more: http://www.mediaite.com/online/four-zimmerman-trial-jurors-release-statement-anonymous-juror-on-cnn-does-not-speak-for-us



Gun nut culture is responsible for the laws that let George Zimmerman get away with murder.
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Four Zimmerman jurors release statement (Original Post) onehandle Jul 2013 OP
I was wondering how long it would take them to do this montanacowboy Jul 2013 #1
... n/t jtuck004 Jul 2013 #3
well, at least on the one that mattered - the verdict - they were in lock step tomm2thumbs Jul 2013 #2
Wonder how she managed to convince them.. lolly Jul 2013 #12
Did B37 say she was the jury foreperson? Would make sense. JimDandy Jul 2013 #20
she was not the foreperson. She said that in her interview. Justice Jul 2013 #24
Judge's instructions can be quite limiting. I was on a trial that lasted a while years ago. freshwest Jul 2013 #22
I recently went through the same thing. It was a short list of questions to be answered. Kablooie Jul 2013 #29
"Our legal system is pretty screwed up." tofuandbeer Jul 2013 #33
I too served on a jury once. ReRe Jul 2013 #39
I think the way evidence was allowed or denied made a big difference, too: freshwest Jul 2013 #49
I don't get that, freshwest... ReRe Jul 2013 #54
I served, too. Demoiselle Jul 2013 #70
The judge is a Republican. You might be on to something. Ash_F Jul 2013 #44
It sounded like she had two others on her side from the beginning. n/t whopis01 Jul 2013 #71
She was probably a harpie. Myrina Jul 2013 #75
Yep, she represents ALL of their opinions -- NOT GUILTY. JimDandy Jul 2013 #17
Is that right? tblue Jul 2013 #32
we've been taught that a hung jury is an unacceptable outcome. uncle ray Jul 2013 #37
Unfortunately a hung jury is often equivalent to a not guilty verdict. whopis01 Jul 2013 #72
True. Sadly true. panzerfaust Jul 2013 #62
more like goose step DonCoquixote Jul 2013 #42
No... they weren't in lockstep JeaneRaye Jul 2013 #48
in heaven05 Jul 2013 #53
I'd said in another thread Blue_Tires Jul 2013 #64
it sure is looking that way noiretextatique Jul 2013 #67
Except for the only opinion that matters, where they did agree with her. (nt) enough Jul 2013 #4
I just read B37's remarks and it makes me wanna puke. nt BootinUp Jul 2013 #5
My hubby called this yesterday skeewee08 Jul 2013 #6
Can't discern Juror B-37 when they're all wearing white sheets. Tutonic Jul 2013 #7
True skeewee08 Jul 2013 #8
They all agreed on the final verdict mindwalker_i Jul 2013 #9
Yep. Tutonic Jul 2013 #21
4 JURORS: She Doesn't Speak for Us cal04 Jul 2013 #10
Here is their statement in full Tx4obama Jul 2013 #16
Thank you for the links Tx4obama cal04 Jul 2013 #18
Awww... the poor dears need time to process what they've been through. calimary Jul 2013 #45
This message was self-deleted by its author Tx4obama Jul 2013 #11
Coward Peaceplace80 Jul 2013 #13
Welcome to DU, Peaceplace80! calimary Jul 2013 #46
The argument that this decision was based on law and reasonableness is in shambles alcibiades_mystery Jul 2013 #14
Here is their statement in full Tx4obama Jul 2013 #15
"give us time to process what we have been through"- translation: we should have deliberated longer wordpix Jul 2013 #19
Exactly. As soon as it was revealed that they deliberated through lunch, JimDandy Jul 2013 #23
Or more likely ... 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2013 #26
that's how I read it too nt Tumbulu Jul 2013 #51
"... in the end we did what the law required us to do" The "law" did not require you to give him a jtuck004 Jul 2013 #25
Poor widdle jurors, feel inconvenienced by the consequences of their decisions. Cry me a river. nt thereismore Jul 2013 #30
Didn't I read/hear ... 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2013 #27
Zimmerman lucked out big time. Hissyspit Jul 2013 #28
Boy Howdy, So did Casey Anthony,..... Grassy Knoll Jul 2013 #34
B37 is my bet on how it's done. And I've been on juries and there can be a lot of bullying. freshwest Jul 2013 #36
Here are the instructions. avaistheone1 Jul 2013 #50
My only real problem ... 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2013 #61
I believe it was 3 to acquit, 2 manslaughter and 1 2nd degree Blasphemer Jul 2013 #43
That is what B37 John2 Jul 2013 #56
I'm not a fan of guns and I even support bans on things like semiautomatic weapons or cstanleytech Jul 2013 #31
Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #38
"Fucker should have never left his car, or just not profiled in the first place." SoapBox Jul 2013 #40
Hmmmmm... angrychair Jul 2013 #35
They were unanimous. I'll respect their rights like they respected Trayvon's delrem Jul 2013 #41
Amen. calimary Jul 2013 #47
I just wonder which juror was for second John2 Jul 2013 #58
Message auto-removed Name removed Jul 2013 #59
The Legal System Uses Jurors as Scapegoats LarryNM Jul 2013 #52
When I was 16 the small grocery store I worked in got robbed. Lobo27 Jul 2013 #55
did they have record of previous crimes, 20-25 years for robbing grocery store is way too JI7 Jul 2013 #57
b29 wasn't part of that memo (the black and/or hispanic woman from ChicagoO Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #60
That would be a good guess. JimDandy Jul 2013 #68
Most of that - but I had posted that evening Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #69
"...we did what the law required us to do." AndyA Jul 2013 #63
Bullshit! Juror B-37 does represent those 4.... Little Star Jul 2013 #65
ZIMMERMAN TRIAL JUROR BREAKDOWN Tonight at 9!! Evasporque Jul 2013 #66
Why should we listen to what these racist assholes have to say? Hugabear Jul 2013 #73
Exactly nt abelenkpe Jul 2013 #76
The six voted, they agreed, it's over, lets move on to something that we may be able to change! SCUBANOW Jul 2013 #74
Yeah.. Fringe Jul 2013 #77
Everyone of those terrible jurors has innocent blood on their hands workinclasszero Jul 2013 #78

montanacowboy

(6,696 posts)
1. I was wondering how long it would take them to do this
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:21 PM
Jul 2013

I know I would be totally pissed having heard B37 on AC. I say good for them.

tomm2thumbs

(13,297 posts)
2. well, at least on the one that mattered - the verdict - they were in lock step
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:24 PM
Jul 2013

or did I miss something

lolly

(3,248 posts)
12. Wonder how she managed to convince them..
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:44 PM
Jul 2013

They are saying they had to follow the law--how much of their interpretation of the law came from their fellow juror, who just happened to be the wife of an attorney and could give them expert advice?

JimDandy

(7,318 posts)
20. Did B37 say she was the jury foreperson? Would make sense.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:54 PM
Jul 2013

These four act like followers who simply allowed B37, who seems to have gotten on the jury with a preformed verdict, to push her opinion on them.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
22. Judge's instructions can be quite limiting. I was on a trial that lasted a while years ago.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:07 PM
Jul 2013

It was a civil suit. A person rear ended a car causing spinal injury to the plaintiff and had insurance. We felt the plaintiff should get payment for medical bills and lost wages.

But when the judge gave us our instructions, it was in the form of a questionnaire on points that didn't touch on the truth of the matter and what happened.

We felt we'd been used to save the insurance from paying a fair claim as there was not denial of the fact that they injury had occured and the defendant wa at fault. The injured person did not get a dime, and there was nothing we could do about it.

Judges can screw things up, and I fault her most of all.

Kablooie

(19,087 posts)
29. I recently went through the same thing. It was a short list of questions to be answered.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:42 PM
Jul 2013

They were very restrictive and didn't allow any maneuvering room.
Once you answer each question, the judgement is set.

We had one big problem, though.
We all agreed that the defendant should be charged penalties and we thought we answered the questions correctly but after the trial we talked to the lawyers and found we had chosen NOT to charge penalties.

One legal sentence had two possible interpretations and we had understood it exactly the opposite of what it legally meant.
All 12 of us misinterpreted the clause without realizing it.
We asked the judge for clarification on other terms but this one seemed easy to understand.

Our legal system is pretty screwed up.



ReRe

(12,183 posts)
39. I too served on a jury once.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:51 PM
Jul 2013

Sure, the judge gave the jury instructions to guide us in the right direction of deliberation. But as soon we got in the jury room, we chose our foreman and took a vote, then and there. Can't remember what the break-down was, but it wasn't unanimous. So what we did was go around the table and discussed the evidence. After once around the table, we took another vote. Not unanimous, but closer, so we went around the table again and discussed the evidence. We did this over and over until we finally had a unanimous decision. We put a man in jail for 10 years for raping a girl in a pizza joint. (They were both employees, arriving early before everyone else.) And NONE of us trailed out of the jury room in fucking tears! Of course it was not as serious as the GZ trial. I would gladly serve jury duty again if ever called.

I do think Judge Wilson's instructions were too specific and very confusing.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
49. I think the way evidence was allowed or denied made a big difference, too:
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 01:03 AM
Jul 2013
Zimmerman’s Old Myspace Account Reveals Racist, Sexist, Violent Behavior

By Randa Morris July 16, 2013

A Myspace account, which has been confirmed by several sources as belonging to George Zimmerman, describes arrests/felony ATF charges, and accusations of domestic violence against Zimmerman, in 2005. The page also contains racist statements that reference “Mexicans”, and sexist comments directed as his ex-fiancee, whom he refers to as the “ex-hoe”. On the account, “onlytobekingagain”, Zimmerman uses the name Joe G. His attorney confirmed to the Miami Herald that the 2005 myspace page does belong to his client.

On August 24, 2005, Zimmerman posted this comment “ Im still free! The ex hoe tried her hardest, but the judge saw through it! Big Mike, reppin the Dverse security makin me look a million bucks, broke her down! Thanks to everyone for checkin up on me! Stay tuned for the A.T.F. charges...”

Court documents obtained by MSNBC.com* in 2012 show multiple run ins with law enforcement during this same period of time.

While Trayvon Martin’s facebook page was allowed into evidence during the trial and was used to help the defense paint a picture of someone who would be seen as intimidating or threatening, for some reason the prosecution did not bring up Zimmerman’s myspace page. On this public page Zimmerman implicates himself in more than a single violent crime, and also demonstrates that he has strong prejudicial feelings about members of minorities groups. One is left to wonder why this information was not brought out during the trial.

Disgusting. Read more:

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/07/16/zimmermans-old-myspace-account-reveals-racist-sexist-violent-behavior/#ixzz2ZGLUiKWL

*Zimmerman accused of domestic violence, fighting with a police officer

There are details, including his lengthy arrest record on file with the Sanford Police Department which comes up as a pdf.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/03/27/10894561-zimmerman-accused-of-domestic-violence-fighting-with-a-police-officer?lite

And this is who the court freed to walk among the public. A criminal in every sense of the word, and damn proud of it.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/11873554#post6


ReRe

(12,183 posts)
54. I don't get that, freshwest...
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 02:00 AM
Jul 2013

... if the Defense can use that info, why can't the prosecution? Evidence seemed to be handled differently in this trial. And all those hearings during the trial? I thought those things should have been taken care of before trial. Well, I hope those Sanford wives have hit the internet and checked up on that thug they believed in so much. That they all cried after reaching a verdict made me want to puke. No wonder they cried... they just committed the crime of the century. Three of them were bullied into acquiescence, so they had their own hell to weep about. I've got to get off here. My ears are ringing, like I just got through driving a thousand miles to meet a deadline, and I started out late.

Demoiselle

(6,787 posts)
70. I served, too.
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 06:32 PM
Jul 2013

There were 12 of us, which I think is a much better number than 6 for real discussion, etc. I was very glad I served, and was very proud of our jury. We were a varied bunch, and we worked extremely well and respectfully together. We chose a foreman and took a vote right off the bat, too. And then we settled down to arriving at an agreement. The judge had given us a bit of guidance, too, which helped.

Ash_F

(5,861 posts)
44. The judge is a Republican. You might be on to something.
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 12:40 AM
Jul 2013

I would've hung that jury though.

Myrina

(12,296 posts)
75. She was probably a harpie.
Thu Jul 18, 2013, 10:37 AM
Jul 2013

She sounds like one of those "bitchy soccer moms" that you ultimately just shake your head at & let have their way because they're going to make every minute of everyone's life miserable until things are the way THEY want.

Couple that with her husband being a lawyer who is an acquaintance of O'Mara and the defense basically had a ringer in the jury room, with no other juror willing/able to stand up to her.

JimDandy

(7,318 posts)
17. Yep, she represents ALL of their opinions -- NOT GUILTY.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:47 PM
Jul 2013

They had a chance to do what was right, and it appears they let this person bully them, then and now.

One was for murder 2 and two were for manslaughter. Way to hold the line.

tblue

(16,350 posts)
32. Is that right?
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:56 PM
Jul 2013

If so they should have hung it. I would have voted exactly what I decided.

uncle ray

(3,330 posts)
37. we've been taught that a hung jury is an unacceptable outcome.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:36 PM
Jul 2013

i experienced it first hand when i was a juror. we were hung on a few charges out of many, and to be honest, in the deliberation room even though many were intelligent people, we questioned ourselves, and the bailiff if that was OK. of course it was, but your options are not made clear. you can't get an answer from the court and of course, you can't do your own research.

whopis01

(3,915 posts)
72. Unfortunately a hung jury is often equivalent to a not guilty verdict.
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 09:03 PM
Jul 2013

In the majority of the cases of a hung jury, the state will not choose to have another trial.

Which puts extra burden on the first jury because taking the path of "we can't decide" may end up being no different from a "not guilty" decision.

 

panzerfaust

(2,818 posts)
62. True. Sadly true.
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 07:44 AM
Jul 2013

These fine folks all agreed that it was lawful for someone to chase down a kid, then kill him when the kid felt threatened and tried to defend himself.

I wonder if they would have felt the same if the killer had been black?


White justice, for a black man: Jesse Washington.

Note, that these fine Christian Texans smiling proudly in the background "...castrated Washington, cut off his fingers, and hung him over a bonfire. He was repeatedly lowered and raised over the fire for about two hours. After the fire was extinguished, his charred torso was dragged through the town and parts of his body were sold as souvenirs."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching_of_Jesse_Washington

Racism is alive and well in Florida, the rest of the South, indeed, if the media response Trayvon's killing are anything to go by, in the rest of the country as well.

Shameful.


JeaneRaye

(541 posts)
48. No... they weren't in lockstep
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 12:54 AM
Jul 2013

3 voted "not guilty", 2 voted for manslaughter and one voted for 2nd degree murder. The 3 were a majority and that is why Zimmerman walked, but I certainly wouldn't say the three jurors who voted for the other charges were in lockstep with them.

 

Blue_Tires

(57,596 posts)
64. I'd said in another thread
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 08:40 AM
Jul 2013

Reading between the lines, B37's increasingly crazy interviews keep hinting towards the possibility that the trial was a sham with a pre-determined acquittal...JMHO

The other jurors, the judge, the cops, attorneys from BOTH sides, and Sanford residents just want this whole thing to go away now that it's finished...They can NOT afford to have journos snooping around, or attract increased scrutiny from the Justice Dept....

skeewee08

(1,983 posts)
6. My hubby called this yesterday
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:26 PM
Jul 2013

after B-37 spoke to AC hubby said I wont be surprise if the other jurors don't come out against her.

mindwalker_i

(4,407 posts)
9. They all agreed on the final verdict
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:32 PM
Jul 2013

B37 seems to be a racist fuckwad, but the decision of the entire jury makes them all seem like a bunch of racist fuckwads. Maybe they should have distance themselves from said fuckwaddery earlier. Maybe when it made a difference.

I'm going to bet they are afraid that B37 is going to get harassed, and they don't want it to happen to them too.

cal04

(41,505 posts)
10. 4 JURORS: She Doesn't Speak for Us
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:32 PM
Jul 2013

(snip)
Shortly after the interview segment Tuesday, four other jurors released a statement responding to her comments.

"We, the undersigned jurors, understand there is a great deal of interest in this case. But we ask you to remember that we are not public officials and we did not invite this type of attention into our lives," they said.

"We also wish to point out that the opinions of Juror B37, expressed on the Anderson Cooper show were her own, and not in any way representative of the jurors listed below."

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/16/us/zimmerman-juror/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Tx4obama

(36,974 posts)
16. Here is their statement in full
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:45 PM
Jul 2013
Here is their statement in full:

We, the undersigned jurors, understand there is a great deal of interest in this case. But we ask you to remember that we are not public officials and we did not invite this type of attention into our lives. We also wish to point out that the opinions of Juror B-37, expressed on the Anderson Cooper show were her own, and not in any way representative of the jurors listed below.

Serving on this jury has been a highly emotional and physically draining experience for each of us. The death of a teenager weighed heavily on our hearts but in the end we did what the law required us to do.

We appeal to the highest standards of your profession and ask the media to respect our privacy and give us time to process what we have been through.


http://www.mediaite.com/online/four-zimmerman-trial-jurors-release-statement-anonymous-juror-on-cnn-does-not-speak-for-us/


Statement released from Eighteenth Judicial Circuit Court: http://media.cmgdigital.com/shared/news/documents/2013/07/16/Jurors_Statement.pdf


calimary

(89,543 posts)
45. Awww... the poor dears need time to process what they've been through.
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 12:45 AM
Jul 2013

Bless their hearts.

How much time does Trayvon Martin get?

"...Serving on this jury has been a highly emotional and physically draining experience for each of us. The death of a teenager weighed heavily on our hearts..."

Awww, gee whiz. I'm touched. Do tell how heavy your hearts are. Tell that to Trayvon's mom and dad. Tell that to all parents of black teenagers in this country. Go ahead. Help them all understand. I'm sure they'll be comforted.




Response to onehandle (Original post)

Peaceplace80

(38 posts)
13. Coward
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:44 PM
Jul 2013

If she is at peace with her decision then why hide her identity? What a coward! She said she believed that Zimmerman had the right to shoot Trayvon but that he shouldn't of followed him?! WTH? Where did they find these jurors? Does she not understand if he wouldn't of followed him the first place and listened to the dispatch Trayvon would still be alive! I am just stunned at some people's lack of common sense.

calimary

(89,543 posts)
46. Welcome to DU, Peaceplace80!
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 12:48 AM
Jul 2013

Glad you're here. Great question you ask. If she's at peace with her decision, then by all means step up into the light and show yourself. Face up to what you did. George Zimmerman won't have to. You've certainly seen to that.

 

alcibiades_mystery

(36,437 posts)
14. The argument that this decision was based on law and reasonableness is in shambles
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:44 PM
Jul 2013

What else are they going to say now? They let a killer walk out the door. Their decision has been exposed as racist stupidity that didn't even follow the judge's instructions. They've seen the shit storm that attended the thoughts of their co-deliberator, who surely made her feelings known in the jury room (did anyone say anything to her about her racism or idiocy then?).

So what else would they possibly say?

They are clearly not as stupid as B37. They're going to cloak their collusion with that imbecile behind law and reasonableness. But what choice do they have? They let a murderer walk the streets.

Tx4obama

(36,974 posts)
15. Here is their statement in full
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:44 PM
Jul 2013
Here is their statement in full:

We, the undersigned jurors, understand there is a great deal of interest in this case. But we ask you to remember that we are not public officials and we did not invite this type of attention into our lives. We also wish to point out that the opinions of Juror B-37, expressed on the Anderson Cooper show were her own, and not in any way representative of the jurors listed below.

Serving on this jury has been a highly emotional and physically draining experience for each of us. The death of a teenager weighed heavily on our hearts but in the end we did what the law required us to do.

We appeal to the highest standards of your profession and ask the media to respect our privacy and give us time to process what we have been through.


http://www.mediaite.com/online/four-zimmerman-trial-jurors-release-statement-anonymous-juror-on-cnn-does-not-speak-for-us/


Statement released from Eighteenth Judicial Circuit Court: http://media.cmgdigital.com/shared/news/documents/2013/07/16/Jurors_Statement.pdf




wordpix

(18,652 posts)
19. "give us time to process what we have been through"- translation: we should have deliberated longer
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 09:53 PM
Jul 2013

The time to process this case is over and the jury deliberated very little considering the importance of this case. NOW they need time to process - a bit late, don'tcha think?

JimDandy

(7,318 posts)
23. Exactly. As soon as it was revealed that they deliberated through lunch,
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:09 PM
Jul 2013

it was clear they were determined to be in their beds that night, so they simply all voted 'not guilty' just to get the hell out of there.

Not a one of them is deserving of respect in the bunch. They say they don't want to be disturbed by the public, the very people who trusted them to use their common sense and carefully deliberate, oh no...but watch them spill their guts for the exclusive rights to their info on the case in coming book deals.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
26. Or more likely ...
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:21 PM
Jul 2013

the translation would be: "Give us time to make peace with our letting someone(s) talk us into changing our decision."

 

jtuck004

(15,882 posts)
25. "... in the end we did what the law required us to do" The "law" did not require you to give him a
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:20 PM
Jul 2013

pass.

That's on you.

thereismore

(13,326 posts)
30. Poor widdle jurors, feel inconvenienced by the consequences of their decisions. Cry me a river. nt
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:51 PM
Jul 2013
 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
27. Didn't I read/hear ...
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:27 PM
Jul 2013

that Juror B-37 stated that the initial polling of the jurors had 2 voting to convict on 2nd Degree and 2 voting to convict on Manslaughter and 2 voting to acquit? If so, I have three questions:

1) Can we guess where these 4 fell in the initial polling?

2) How does the jury go from 4 to convict to 6 to acquit?

3) I wonder who the alpha dog (read: bully) on the jury was?

Grassy Knoll

(10,118 posts)
34. Boy Howdy, So did Casey Anthony,.....
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:11 PM
Jul 2013

Reminds me of a pre-selected jury, like "Run Away jury" Movie.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
36. B37 is my bet on how it's done. And I've been on juries and there can be a lot of bullying.
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:29 PM
Jul 2013

Combine that with the judge allowing everything to slander Trayvon and help Z, and the instructions given, I think some of the jury was overwhelmed.

I'd love to see what those instructions were. All kinds of things they heard that effected them, told to ignore, and the entire tenor of the trial. The defense started off by insulting the jury and the prosecution wan't allowed to put enough to show the case. And a lot of fear and stress affects people.

All I can say honestly if that I'd been on the jury it'd have been a hung jury at least. No logic to Z-THUG getting out of the car. I'd have been as relentless on that as I am on anything else.

AFAIK, there is no punishment for being pigheaded on jury. Just call me OINK!!

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
61. My only real problem ...
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 07:26 AM
Jul 2013

jury system is that it ignores/denies everything that sociologists know about social/group dynamics ... in every group, if given enough time and the opportunity, the position opinion of dominant person in the group becomes the position/opinion of the group. And research shows that, the more "stressed" or will bend the group to his/her pressured that group feels, this effect is enhanced.

This is fine when/if the dominant person is of noble and right purposes; not so much whe/if that person is not.

Blasphemer

(3,618 posts)
43. I believe it was 3 to acquit, 2 manslaughter and 1 2nd degree
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 12:29 AM
Jul 2013

I've never served on a jury so maybe it's easy to say what I would or would not do, however, I have a hard time believing I'd be able to be talked out of a decision to convict. It's one thing to be convinced of manslaughter instead of 2nd degree but to go from guilty to not-guilty? A hung jury would make sense given the case as presented and the makeup of the jury but I just don't understand the three that were convinced to acquit.

 

John2

(2,730 posts)
56. That is what B37
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 03:31 AM
Jul 2013

claims. B37 appeared to be convinced George Zimmerman was a good person and Trayvon was a bad person. She called them both men. Trayvon was a kid, that just turned 17 and was a junior in high school. Zimmerman was a 28 year old man with a criminal record of violence.


Apparently she thought it was OK for Zimmerman to follow a kid at night with a loaded gun and not identify himself to that kid. I don't know if that woman have any young kids but would she like me to follow her kid at night if I thought that kid didn't belong in the neighborhood. I'm Black and over 200 pounds.

Now suppose I also carried a gun and had loaded it with the safety off. Suppose I had called 911 and they asked me if I was following this kid and advise me not to. Suppose I had called her kid a punk, Ahole and up to no good in that call and looks like he had a problem because he came towards my vehicle while I was watching him. Then I tell the caller he is circling my vehicle,and I never say anything to the kid or ask if he needed help. Now suppose that kid, starts running out of fear after that and I tell the caller "Oh shit he is running," and I open the door and start out after him with a loaded gun and the safety off.

Her excuse was Trayvon got mad and hit Zimmerman out of anger and not fear of Zimmerman.She also believed Zimmerman's life was in danger and the omly thing he could to save his life from this kid was to shoot him. Of course only after the kid went for a gun that he didn't know was even loaded. She just viewed Trayvon Martin as the bad guy and Zimmerman as the good guy period. She called him the "Colored Boy," and Zimmerman, "George." So she identified with "George." Trayvon was just that "Colored Boy." Not only that, when she justified both making bad decisions, she then called both of them men.

She seem like the type that would persuade the other jurors that she was right. She claims two were for manslaughter and the other one was for second degree murder. Now remember, this woman's husband is a high priced legal analyst, so she probably used that to her advantge in persuading other jurors. So apparently they had a stake in the outcome according to her actions right after the verdict.

There is also the added fact these women were white, and lived in the coummunity or surrounding area. There was no Blacks on the jury, so they don't matter. So that would be an added pressure on those women to come up with a certain verdict.
















Now suppose I continue in the conservation and tell the caller, that I didn't want to give out my address because that kid might hear me, after the caller asked if I was following him.

cstanleytech

(28,365 posts)
31. I'm not a fan of guns and I even support bans on things like semiautomatic weapons or
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 10:52 PM
Jul 2013

at a very minimum require extensive background checks before allowing someone to purchase them however I am tired of people pulling out the "gun nut culture" meme to blame these type of thing on.
Zimmerman could have used a number of different weapons from a dagger to a sword or even a crossbow but he used a gun, so what?
The point isnt the weapon its that the asshole killed a kid after disobeying the 911 operator and followed him and then he gets away with.
As for the jury I wouldnt give two pennies for their having any common sense because its clear they lack any because Zimmerman was clearly guilty of manslaughter because he choose to follow Martin as Martin wasnt following Zimmerman thus Zimmerman instigated the whole thing in the end regardless.

Response to cstanleytech (Reply #31)

SoapBox

(18,791 posts)
40. "Fucker should have never left his car, or just not profiled in the first place."
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:52 PM
Jul 2013

Absolute ditto.

And what about Martin's rights? He was unarmed, doing nothing wrong, was accosted by the creep and wound up dead.

What about his rights to "Stand His Ground"?

angrychair

(12,045 posts)
35. Hmmmmm...
Tue Jul 16, 2013, 11:21 PM
Jul 2013

lets seeeeee.....do I give a shit what these ladies have to say? No, can't seem to care. Every word this lady uttered are your words. No matter how hard you scrub ladies, the blood is never going to wash off. You will get no tears from me.

 

John2

(2,730 posts)
58. I just wonder which juror was for second
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 03:52 AM
Jul 2013

degree murder and why she retreated from that position? We have heard from five jurors but what about number six? It was second degree murder because Zimmerman displayed ill will towards Martin in his words. When he shot him, it showed a disregard for the taking of a human life. Zimmerman showed no remorse before or after he took this kid's life. He didn't see a human being at all, just a suspect and a criminal. He has no guilt whatsoever and the jury justified his actions.

Response to delrem (Reply #41)

Lobo27

(753 posts)
55. When I was 16 the small grocery store I worked in got robbed.
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 02:43 AM
Jul 2013

In the end the three guys that robbed the store got caught. There was a trial in which I had to testify.
Two of the guys got 20 years, they entered a plea deal. The last guy got 25 years.

At the time in the store there were five people in the store. Four white people, and myself a hispanic. The robbers were black, and what they did was horrible. I have no sympathy for them.

What I'm getting at is that during the trial, it took the jury less then one hour to find them guilty. These last few days I have thought to myself, what have happened if the robbers were white or hispanic.

The jury was all white every single last one of them. I don't know if it was done that way for a certain reason. Maybe they didn't want a hispanic in the jury because a 16yr old hispanic would be testifying. And no black jurors because of conflicting interests perhaps.

JI7

(93,419 posts)
57. did they have record of previous crimes, 20-25 years for robbing grocery store is way too
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 03:38 AM
Jul 2013

much. but they were black so i can see why they would get so many years.

Ruby the Liberal

(26,620 posts)
60. b29 wasn't part of that memo (the black and/or hispanic woman from ChicagoO
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 07:21 AM
Jul 2013

I wonder if she is planning to speak out. I also wonder if she was the initial Murder 2 vote and the lone holdout requiring them to request manslaughter clarification.

JimDandy

(7,318 posts)
68. That would be a good guess.
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 12:18 PM
Jul 2013

The initial vote broke this way: (1) murder 2; (2) manslaughter; (3) not guilty. So are you thinking that, near the end, 5 of them were for not guilty, and B29 came down from murder 2 and was the one requesting clarification on manslaughter?

Ruby the Liberal

(26,620 posts)
69. Most of that - but I had posted that evening
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 12:59 PM
Jul 2013

when the story broke about the clarification request that I hoped it wasn't being asked of the judge to try to convince holdouts to vote "not guilty". I don't like the way the law is written (burden of proof on Prosecution to prove a negative).

AndyA

(16,993 posts)
63. "...we did what the law required us to do."
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 08:01 AM
Jul 2013

That tells me that they may have wanted to issue a guilty verdict, but couldn't due to the instructions they were given.

I read that Florida law doesn't allow a self defense claim if a person takes any aggressive act prior to then claiming self defense when the other person responds to that person's action. (Not an exact interpretation, of course.)

I think the judge is responsible for the incorrect jury verdict due to the jury instructions that were given (along with some important omissions), and it sounds like the jurors realize that as well.

Little Star

(17,055 posts)
65. Bullshit! Juror B-37 does represent those 4....
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 09:33 AM
Jul 2013

"We also wish to point out that the opinions of Juror B-37, expressed on the Anderson Cooper show were her own, and not in any way representative of the jurors listed below."

They made her representative of them, not when she spoke out on AC but when they voted the same way she did. They could have done different but made the choice to vote the same as her.

They should come out like she did and explain exactly why they claim she is does not represent them, how they are different from her.

Nope, not buying! Without an explanation of how and in what way "she doesn't represent them" are we to believe them? After all, they voted guilty just like her and that's all that matters. I'm not buying any statement without explanation of just how she doesn't represent them.

Evasporque

(2,133 posts)
66. ZIMMERMAN TRIAL JUROR BREAKDOWN Tonight at 9!!
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 09:51 AM
Jul 2013

In Your Face News has exclusive footage of Juror 38B's garbage, laundry and them entering and leaving their home!

Hugabear

(10,340 posts)
73. Why should we listen to what these racist assholes have to say?
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 09:25 PM
Jul 2013

Because of their racism, a murderer walks free.

 

SCUBANOW

(92 posts)
74. The six voted, they agreed, it's over, lets move on to something that we may be able to change!
Wed Jul 17, 2013, 11:31 PM
Jul 2013

Fringe

(175 posts)
77. Yeah..
Thu Jul 18, 2013, 09:15 PM
Jul 2013

They don't want to me outed as racist. Now days even racist get upset when you call them racist.

 

workinclasszero

(28,270 posts)
78. Everyone of those terrible jurors has innocent blood on their hands
Thu Jul 18, 2013, 09:44 PM
Jul 2013

When Zimmerman pulled the trigger and snuffed out an innocent teens life, each one of those racist women pulled it right along with him.

I hope it haunts their lives till the day they die.

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