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Garthem

(128 posts)
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 05:24 AM Aug 2014

Death Row Inmate Michael Worthington Executed For Raping, Killing College Student

Source: HuffPo



BONNE TERRE, Mo. (AP) — A Missouri inmate was put to death Wednesday for raping and killing a college student in 1995, making him the first U.S. prisoner put to death since an Arizona lethal injection went awry last month.

The Missouri Department of Corrections said Michael Worthington was executed by lethal injection at the state prison and was pronounced dead at 12:11 a.m. He is the seventh Missouri inmate executed this year.

Worthington had been sentenced to death for the attack on 24-year-old Melinda "Mindy" Griffin during a burglary of her Lake St. Louis condominium.

The U.S. Supreme Court and Missouri's governor had declined on Tuesday to block the execution.

Read more: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/05/michael-worthing-execution_n_5652999.html

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Death Row Inmate Michael Worthington Executed For Raping, Killing College Student (Original Post) Garthem Aug 2014 OP
The Death Penalty needs to be abolished. It's nothing but legalized murder. (nt) stone space Aug 2014 #1
" It's nothing but legalized murder." im fine with that for those who do stuff like this leftyohiolib Aug 2014 #6
I'm not, but it seems that you have some company here. (nt) stone space Aug 2014 #9
agree we dont all see things the same way nt leftyohiolib Aug 2014 #10
You are hilarious. Anti-choice. Pro-death penalty. tenderfoot Aug 2014 #68
i am anti-abortion when it comes to my children what you do with yours is your business leftyohiolib Aug 2014 #79
Then I gather you are also fine with the occasional execution of innocent persons also . . . markpkessinger Aug 2014 #77
nope executing innocent people is bad leftyohiolib Aug 2014 #78
Right . . . markpkessinger Aug 2014 #80
there are people who are guilty beyond doubt leftyohiolib Aug 2014 #81
Sure there are . . . markpkessinger Aug 2014 #84
+1 SacoMaine61 Aug 2014 #12
it is not legalized murder - it's respect and dignity to the memory of victims samsingh Aug 2014 #29
Pft. It's Old Testament barbarism. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2014 #51
Putting them in prison doesnt bring back the victim either. nt 7962 Aug 2014 #55
no one's gloating over revenge. But there should be justice for the victim. samsingh Aug 2014 #72
I can't agree with you there. surrealAmerican Aug 2014 #65
it does not cheapen their memory - coddling a serial killer samsingh Aug 2014 #73
Saudi Arabia totally agrees! tenderfoot Aug 2014 #69
no i think that's a different issue samsingh Aug 2014 #74
I'm okay with that... FarPoint Aug 2014 #2
Me too bigwillq Aug 2014 #4
Me three 840high Aug 2014 #52
the only place where innocents don't get the death penalty CreekDog Aug 2014 #85
Shouldn't have taken 19 years to be rid of this guy. 7962 Aug 2014 #3
We need to expedite this shit! Found guilty, electric chair at the back of the court-room. Ed Suspicious Aug 2014 #5
They feel justified in their cold, calculated, clean-handed murders. - sticks and stone , sticks and leftyohiolib Aug 2014 #8
Hey, you're funny! I have no problem with appeals. They just shouldnt take 19 yrs. 7962 Aug 2014 #11
"No" doubt would permit insane doubt as a reason for acquittal. candelista Aug 2014 #16
Not sure I've ever seen that as a reason by a jury yet. Thats kinda reaching. 7962 Aug 2014 #54
????? heaven05 Aug 2014 #13
I don't think that was legal. stone space Aug 2014 #14
answer the question heaven05 Aug 2014 #15
What about it? stone space Aug 2014 #20
right heaven05 Aug 2014 #22
This execution does nothing at all to change that prospect, either. (nt) stone space Aug 2014 #24
awwww heaven05 Aug 2014 #26
What about justice for the victim? stone space Aug 2014 #27
never heaven05 Aug 2014 #31
What does this have to do with me? stone space Aug 2014 #34
I am not attacking you, personally heaven05 Aug 2014 #38
What do you mean "what about" it? candelista Aug 2014 #21
justice heaven05 Aug 2014 #23
So what should happen to drunk drivers? candelista Aug 2014 #33
false equivalence heaven05 Aug 2014 #36
Damn good point. 7962 Aug 2014 #56
An eye for an eye is unenlightened and without merit. LanternWaste Aug 2014 #44
true "justice" would be him working toward prevention of crimes like this by others. Righting the uppityperson Aug 2014 #95
Exactly Carolina Aug 2014 #70
That's like it works in China. candelista Aug 2014 #19
the 19 years is cruel to the convict leftyohiolib Aug 2014 #7
Depending on the killer, christx30 Aug 2014 #18
i agree samsingh Aug 2014 #30
should be easier to execute? CreekDog Aug 2014 #86
Maybe we should bring back crucifixion as a method of punishment. candelista Aug 2014 #17
no, but the guillotine would heaven05 Aug 2014 #28
Nothing is going to change your mind about this. It's personal. candelista Aug 2014 #35
just or unjust heaven05 Aug 2014 #37
Thats the usual response; bring in something absurd. 7962 Aug 2014 #57
Nothing absurd about it FiveGoodMen Aug 2014 #58
Life in prison could be considered cruel. delta17 Aug 2014 #60
Some people surely do deserve whatever they get FiveGoodMen Aug 2014 #61
I'm iffy on the DP. delta17 Aug 2014 #64
all this weeping heaven05 Aug 2014 #25
neither do i samsingh Aug 2014 #32
Does compassion for the one deny compassion for the other? LanternWaste Aug 2014 #46
i actually believe it does. If someone cares for the victim samsingh Aug 2014 #48
Compassion for the least among us is an indicator of a people's character and integrity. LanternWaste Aug 2014 #45
Which is why we try to kill them painlessly. Otherwise, we could burn them alive or stab them. 7962 Aug 2014 #59
Why can't our laws result in executions of some banksters? Trillo Aug 2014 #39
Lloyd Blankfein, Jamie Dimon, Dick Cheney, John Bolton, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Fei Garthem Aug 2014 #47
Because rapists and murderers are far worse than bankers. delta17 Aug 2014 #66
Deaths occurred from the foreclosure crisis. Trillo Aug 2014 #87
I oppose the death penalty in all circumstances, and it has nothing petronius Aug 2014 #40
+1 Ed Suspicious Aug 2014 #42
it is not a stain on society. it is justice. Are you against defending ourselves against foreign samsingh Aug 2014 #49
That doesn't make any sense. tabasco Aug 2014 #53
well i don't LOL in this matter as i take it very seriously samsingh Aug 2014 #75
I support a right to self-defense at both the national and personal level petronius Aug 2014 #63
It IS a stain on our society BuddhaGirl Aug 2014 #67
i think people in those other countries are put to death for being gay, talking against the samsingh Aug 2014 #76
there is no crime egregious enough BuddhaGirl Aug 2014 #82
Your opinion, fine. My family is worth it. Actually, theres plenty egregious enough 7962 Aug 2014 #89
Oh yes, I'm well aware of what people do to other people BuddhaGirl Aug 2014 #90
the death penalty is a deterrent samsingh Aug 2014 #93
IMO, because of the freedoms we are allowed, excessive punishment is warranted for these types 7962 Aug 2014 #91
IMO, BuddhaGirl Aug 2014 #92
Well, if it were really eye for an eye, we'd kill em in the way they murdered. 7962 Aug 2014 #94
This guy was some sob. Rhinodawg Aug 2014 #41
The criminal always has time on his side in these cases - the victims are forgotten! I'm all for th LibGranny Aug 2014 #43
exactly - i hate that so much - that victims are forgotten. samsingh Aug 2014 #50
I simply do not understand the rationale of the pro death penalty people. jaded_old_cynic Aug 2014 #62
In some cases, I'm ok with the DP christx30 Aug 2014 #71
It still makes no sense to me. jaded_old_cynic Aug 2014 #83
19 years later he's euthanized for a crime he freely admits. mackerel Aug 2014 #88
 

leftyohiolib

(5,917 posts)
79. i am anti-abortion when it comes to my children what you do with yours is your business
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 06:24 PM
Aug 2014

am I allowed to have an opinion that differs from yours?

as for How conservative of you. my voting record would say otherwise

markpkessinger

(8,887 posts)
77. Then I gather you are also fine with the occasional execution of innocent persons also . . .
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 06:20 PM
Aug 2014

. . . because under our system, there is absolutely no way to have one without the other.

markpkessinger

(8,887 posts)
80. Right . . .
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 06:28 PM
Aug 2014

. . . but given that our justice system sometimes wrongly convicts people, and that there is no way under our justice system to ensure that the death penalty is only used for "people we absolutely know are guilty," (because there is no such thing as varying degrees of certainty of guilt before the law), then no matter what you want to tell yourself, if you support the use of the death penalty in any instance, you lend de facto support to the execution of innocents. There is simply no getting around that uncomfortable reality.

markpkessinger

(8,887 posts)
84. Sure there are . . .
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 08:12 PM
Aug 2014

. . . But under our legal system, there is ONE standard for evidence of guilt (i.e., "beyond a reasonable doubt." In a criminal trial, a person is either found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt or he/she is not. There are no degrees of certainty (nor could there be, because it would throw the entire justice system into chaos). And, uncomfortable though it certainly is, under that single standard of evidence for guilt, people are sometimes wrongly convicted. Here's the problem:

Let's suppose we have two defendants, each convicted of the same heinous crime. The case against Defendant A was rock solid: there was clear, unequivocal evidence presented, including solid DNA evidence, that links Defendant A to the crime of which he was convicted. The case against Defendant B, however, doesn't have a lot of direct physical evidence, but the conviction was obtained on very strong circumstantial evidence and possibly an eyewitness identification (we know eyewitness identifications are extremely unreliable, but they also happen to be extremely effective with most juries.) Since the standard for finding either defendant guilty was evidence that demonstrated each one's guilt "beyond a reasonable doubt," and both met that same standard, equity and fairness demand that each defendant be subject to the the same range of punishments prescribed for the particular crime they committed. And IF you are going to say that Defendant A's guilt under the law is certain enough, relative to the certainty of Defendant B's guilt, to merit the possibility of the death penalty, then, by extension, you are suggesting that perhaps there was "reasonable doubt" as to Defendant B's guilt in the first place (when in reality, Defendant B might be totally guilty). This is why any suggestion that criminal sentences can or should be imposed based on degree of certainty of guilt is utterly unworkable, and is a complete and utter legal fiction.

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
29. it is not legalized murder - it's respect and dignity to the memory of victims
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:31 AM
Aug 2014

I have no sympathy for murderers (but I can't tolerate innocent people being called guilty).

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
51. Pft. It's Old Testament barbarism.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 12:30 PM
Aug 2014

Eye for an eye 'justice'.

Killing one person does nothing to bring back the prior person. All it does is let the victim's mourners marinate in hatred and revenge.

There's no dignity in seeing people gloat over their revenge.

surrealAmerican

(11,792 posts)
65. I can't agree with you there.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 05:25 PM
Aug 2014

Somehow I think killing in their names is not showing respect for the victims. It cheapens their memory and their dignity. It's revenge: nothing more, and nothing less.

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
73. it does not cheapen their memory - coddling a serial killer
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 05:56 PM
Aug 2014

and giving them a great life and a platform to talk about how they wronged in the past but want to change for the future is a disgusting slap in the face for the butchered victims.

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
74. no i think that's a different issue
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 05:58 PM
Aug 2014

I don't believe in chopping off hands if someone steals a loaf of bread.

by your logic Saudi Arabia also agrees with you - you can stone someone to death and be hailed a hero.

Ed Suspicious

(8,879 posts)
5. We need to expedite this shit! Found guilty, electric chair at the back of the court-room.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 07:42 AM
Aug 2014

People who want death are sick. This guy is sick . . . death penalty advocates are even sicker. They feel justified in their cold, calculated, clean-handed murders.

 

7962

(11,841 posts)
11. Hey, you're funny! I have no problem with appeals. They just shouldnt take 19 yrs.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 08:50 AM
Aug 2014

Its easy to "fix' the death penalty. Remove the "reasonable doubt" from jury decisions. To get a capital sentence, there should be NO doubt as to their guilt. There are PLENTY of those cases. Ted Bundy? There was NO doubt. Just as with this guy. Tim McVeigh only took a few yrs to get rid of.
But leave 'em in for life and just watch as these killers get older; then we'll be hearing that its "inhumane" to leave old men in jail and they're no longer a threat, etc, so let them out.

 

candelista

(1,986 posts)
16. "No" doubt would permit insane doubt as a reason for acquittal.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:07 AM
Aug 2014

E.g., if a juror believed the accused was demonically possessed, that would be a reason for acquittal, since there would be SOME doubt.

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
13. ?????
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 08:55 AM
Aug 2014

what about the person he raped and killed. What about the family of this victim, the friends, what about the terror of the crime?????????? Always worried about the perp. That's sick. Yeah, yeah I know the story. Innocent people get executed also, especially because of the racist, sick society we live in.....but what, I ask again, about justice for the victim?

 

stone space

(6,498 posts)
27. What about justice for the victim?
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:25 AM
Aug 2014

You still haven't answered. Your sarcasm is just a deflection from the question at hand.

When and how will the victim ever get justice?

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
31. never
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:32 AM
Aug 2014

if left up to you. Yeah the victim is dead. Nothing can change that. The murderer deserves to get what he gave. Period.

 

stone space

(6,498 posts)
34. What does this have to do with me?
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:38 AM
Aug 2014
never if left up to you.


I'm not even involved.

You seem to be attacking me in order to avoid answering the question.

Again, I ask you: What about the victim? When and how will the victim get justice?

Either you have an answer or you don't.

It's OK if you don't have an answer to the question. But simply attacking the person who asks you the question does not constitute an answer.

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
38. I am not attacking you, personally
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:51 AM
Aug 2014

just don't agree with your stand on capital punishment and never will. The victim never will see the justice, but maybe, just maybe capital punishment will make someone work through a problem instead of ridding themselves, through unnecessary violence, of a problem. Just maybe. That's only one solution to an age old problem of human existence. Now I will agree that not all violence is perpetrated because of the same motivation(s). Murder is complicated. Yet an individual such as this OP is describing is not a person who should be allowed to breath longer than necessary. I believe.

 

candelista

(1,986 posts)
21. What do you mean "what about" it?
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:16 AM
Aug 2014

Specifically, what are you asking? Or is it a rhetorical question? If so, what does it mean?

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
23. justice
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:18 AM
Aug 2014

is a balancing of the scales. He did this crime, he deserves to get what he gave. That's "what about it".

 

candelista

(1,986 posts)
33. So what should happen to drunk drivers?
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:36 AM
Aug 2014

Should they be put on the highway where a bunch of drunk drivers are driving?

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
36. false equivalence
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:41 AM
Aug 2014

the refuge of the unsure. And to answer your question. Maybe if a drunk driver was executed for killing a bunch of children in a van or while walking, maybe, just maybe some would think twice about putting themselves and others at risk because of their 'sickness' and disregard for human life.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
44. An eye for an eye is unenlightened and without merit.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 12:10 PM
Aug 2014

An 'eye for an eye' is unenlightened and without objective merit. Vendetta law has been found to be outdated by the concensus of civilization.

But I imagine it makes people feel good...

uppityperson

(116,002 posts)
95. true "justice" would be him working toward prevention of crimes like this by others. Righting the
Fri Aug 8, 2014, 01:19 PM
Aug 2014

wrong in a way that would make a difference, not simply bowing out of the picture.

Carolina

(6,960 posts)
70. Exactly
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 05:41 PM
Aug 2014

All this concern for the perp!

They say give these guys life in prison but nurse killer Speck thrived in prison, one of Sharon Tate's murderers married and had a baby, Ted Bundy escaped and went on to kill in Florida...

Some deserve the death penalty, especially someone like this who broke into a woman's home, raped her and strangled her. He is any woman's worst nightmare, there is no doubt of his guilt or a false confession because of DNA and he got what he deserved.

 

candelista

(1,986 posts)
19. That's like it works in China.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:14 AM
Aug 2014

They arrest you on Monday, try you on Tuesday and execute you on Wednesday. They sometimes used to do the execution in a train station. How would you like them apples?

christx30

(6,241 posts)
18. Depending on the killer,
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:12 AM
Aug 2014

I'm ok with that sometimes. Nidal Hassan is paralyzed from the waist down. And he's relatively young. Under the best circumstances, he would have a hard life. In prison, I think his life is going to be downright terrible. Plus, he wants to die. Keep him healthy and let him know every day he'll be there for 30 years. He can't escape, not even in death. He'll be in that room for a long time.

 

candelista

(1,986 posts)
17. Maybe we should bring back crucifixion as a method of punishment.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:09 AM
Aug 2014

That might satisfy the blood lust of some of the posters in this thread. Right?

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
28. no, but the guillotine would
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:29 AM
Aug 2014

a firing squad would. Why this concern for the criminal? All this it makes us as bad as the criminal is BS. I'm glad the murderer of my sister is dead. Period. If that makes me a baaaaadddd person, so be it. If he hadn't committed suicide, I would have liked to have been in the room when the 'chair' was turned on.

 

candelista

(1,986 posts)
35. Nothing is going to change your mind about this. It's personal.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:39 AM
Aug 2014

OK. I won't argue with you. But your reaction, by its personal nature, is not a reliable basis for deciding what is just or unjust.

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
58. Nothing absurd about it
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 02:21 PM
Aug 2014

If you're going to approve cruelty at all, then it's reasonable to ask where the lines are.

delta17

(283 posts)
60. Life in prison could be considered cruel.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 04:33 PM
Aug 2014

So could solitary confinement. I don't really care about this guy's quality of life. He made a horrible decision, he can live with the consequences.

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
61. Some people surely do deserve whatever they get
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 04:37 PM
Aug 2014

But WE deserve better than to create a barbaric society just so that we can stick it to the bad ones.

Yes, life in prison would be awful. If we can protect ourselves without that, we should.

delta17

(283 posts)
64. I'm iffy on the DP.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 04:59 PM
Aug 2014

The kicker to me is that this was a rape and murder. This wasn't over drug debt or territory, this was abject cruelty. I don't see this guy as ever being trustworthy.

I think once someone is convicted of a crime like this, we have a duty to keep them away from society. I don't think they should be tortured or suffer a cruel death, but other than that, I believe society's needs come before theirs.

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
32. neither do i
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 09:33 AM
Aug 2014

they should try to think of the horror the poor innocent girl felt when this monster brutally took her like, future children and dream away.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
46. Does compassion for the one deny compassion for the other?
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 12:16 PM
Aug 2014

"they should try to think of the horror the poor innocent girl felt..."

Does compassion for the one deny compassion for the other? If not, why presume what others may or may not think about the victim?

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
45. Compassion for the least among us is an indicator of a people's character and integrity.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 12:14 PM
Aug 2014

"I just don't get it..."

Compassion for the least among us (of which, an inmate is by its very definition) is an indicator of a culture's humaneness and integrity, regardless of the lack of empathy within the individual (whether murderer, or simply one who cheers dearth...).

Thou I can certainly understand why many may be confused and 'not get it...'

Trillo

(9,154 posts)
39. Why can't our laws result in executions of some banksters?
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 10:02 AM
Aug 2014

Or cops who kill innocents? Or for torturers?

There are at least two levels of justice in the U.S. Some are above being held responsible for their actions, while others are held responsible and cheered as they die.

 

Garthem

(128 posts)
47. Lloyd Blankfein, Jamie Dimon, Dick Cheney, John Bolton, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Fei
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 12:19 PM
Aug 2014

I could get behind that!

Trillo

(9,154 posts)
87. Deaths occurred from the foreclosure crisis.
Thu Aug 7, 2014, 01:31 AM
Aug 2014
http://www.wellsbankstersfargo.com/?p=120
"Wells Fargo Apparently Responsible for Another Death By Foreclosure"

http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=30070
"3 March 2009 – The global financial crisis sweeping through Wall Street and the European banking sector will touch the lives of the world’s most vulnerable, pushing millions into deeper poverty and leading to the deaths of thousands of children, according to a new United Nations study."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025255298
"$250 Billion Lawsuit against Big Banks"

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/17/business/economy/17regulation.html?_r=0
EPA set value of life at $9.1 million.


petronius

(26,695 posts)
40. I oppose the death penalty in all circumstances, and it has nothing
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 10:32 AM
Aug 2014

to do with the convict or the victim. Even setting aside the possibility of error, that fact that we opt to kill a human for vengeance is a stain on our society...

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
49. it is not a stain on society. it is justice. Are you against defending ourselves against foreign
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 12:25 PM
Aug 2014

invaders? they are humans too.

 

tabasco

(22,974 posts)
53. That doesn't make any sense.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 01:35 PM
Aug 2014

Last edited Wed Aug 6, 2014, 06:27 PM - Edit history (1)

You know there are countries without the death penalty that would readily defend themselves against a foreign invasion.

They choose not to give their governments the power to kill as a criminal penalty.

Do you believe our government and our justice system are infallible? LOL.

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
75. well i don't LOL in this matter as i take it very seriously
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 05:59 PM
Aug 2014

I don't think the system is infallible.

in this case there is no doubt about the killer's guilt.

petronius

(26,695 posts)
63. I support a right to self-defense at both the national and personal level
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 04:44 PM
Aug 2014

when necessary. But that's a false equivalency when it comes the DP, which is a deliberate choice to kill unnecessarily.

The DP is 'justice' only in the shallow sense of 'vengeance.' A civilized society should have the ability to move beyond that thinking; when it does not, it's a stain.

Claims that people are sobbing for the criminal or forgetting the victim are nonsensical - the DP is about a choice we make, as a society, and objecting to it is entirely about our morality and behavior...

BuddhaGirl

(3,701 posts)
67. It IS a stain on our society
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 05:37 PM
Aug 2014

The US is in good company with the likes of Iran, Saudi Arabia, China, Pakistan, Syria, Sudan etc.

Ugh.

No DP in Canada, Central, or South America.

It is a stain on our society.

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
76. i think people in those other countries are put to death for being gay, talking against the
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 06:01 PM
Aug 2014

government, having a different religion than the majority, sleeping out of wedlock.

I think executing a serial or brutal murderer is very different.

I hope you see the difference between murdering someone and saying you don't agree with the government.

 

7962

(11,841 posts)
89. Your opinion, fine. My family is worth it. Actually, theres plenty egregious enough
Thu Aug 7, 2014, 06:59 AM
Aug 2014

raping and murdering children. Killing the President. Holding someone as a sex slave before killing them. Do you read the news at all? DO you see just what people actually DO to other people?
But you think they deserve to be fed and housed for decades. Many of them arent fazed at all by the thought of prison.

BuddhaGirl

(3,701 posts)
90. Oh yes, I'm well aware of what people do to other people
Thu Aug 7, 2014, 03:12 PM
Aug 2014

and the death penalty is not a deterrent.

Yes, it's my opinion, and you have your opinion. I don't believe in state-sponsored murder and the death penalty is not "justice."

Also, see post #67

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
93. the death penalty is a deterrent
Thu Aug 7, 2014, 07:00 PM
Aug 2014

what to test it.

murders committed on even days get the death penalty
murders committed on odd days get life in prison

lets see what happens.

 

7962

(11,841 posts)
91. IMO, because of the freedoms we are allowed, excessive punishment is warranted for these types
Thu Aug 7, 2014, 03:42 PM
Aug 2014

they dont deserve to be fed and housed for 50 yrs

 

7962

(11,841 posts)
94. Well, if it were really eye for an eye, we'd kill em in the way they murdered.
Thu Aug 7, 2014, 08:09 PM
Aug 2014

A lot of folks would like that. For me, its enough to be rid of them. Otherwise, soon we will see people pushing for the release of these 'old harmless' inmates who are no longer a threat to society once they get in their 60s or 70s. Just wait and see.

LibGranny

(711 posts)
43. The criminal always has time on his side in these cases - the victims are forgotten! I'm all for th
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 12:03 PM
Aug 2014

death penalty but I'd like to see it expedited sooner after the verdict - not more than 5 years for appeals!

samsingh

(18,333 posts)
50. exactly - i hate that so much - that victims are forgotten.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 12:27 PM
Aug 2014

even when they are remembered, it's like 'oh yeah, poor victim' , and then all the energy is spent in defense of the violent criminal.

Murderers, when their is no doubt to their guilt, should be executed after due process.

jaded_old_cynic

(190 posts)
62. I simply do not understand the rationale of the pro death penalty people.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 04:42 PM
Aug 2014

The usual justification for giving the state the ability to kill people is “Justice” for the victim and the victim’s families.

As others here have said, the families are never going to get actual justice. Unless you want to call vengeance justice. The pain of their loss is never going to be healed.

IMHO all that the death penalty does is create more victims. I’m not talking about the accused, I am speaking of the family of the accused.

Almost everyone has someone in their lives who love and care about them. No matter how reprehensible that particular person or their behavior may be. All of us are aware of how difficult it is to have a family member die, no matter the reason. So what we need to ask ourselves is “Do we really want to cause pain for the families of the accused, who had nothing to do with the crime/crimes that were committed just to satisfy an overdeveloped sense of vengeance?”

To me, the only thing the death penalty accomplishes is to spread the pain around, rather than minimize it as much as is humanly possible.

Sure, lock them up, throw away the key, but let us try to evolve past visceral primitive emotions instead of creating more sorrow.

Just a thought.


christx30

(6,241 posts)
71. In some cases, I'm ok with the DP
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 05:52 PM
Aug 2014

and in favor of life in prison. For a vicious killer like this one, I'm ok with him dying. Prison is a very dangerous place and a guy like this has proven himself to be a threat to other people. This guy will never hurt anyone ever again. He won't be able to escape. He won't shiv some guy in the shower. He won't charm some judge into getting out of prison to kill again. It's not about revenge. It's about protecting human lives from this person.

jaded_old_cynic

(190 posts)
83. It still makes no sense to me.
Wed Aug 6, 2014, 06:56 PM
Aug 2014

People in prison hurt each other all the time and not every one of the perpetrators are convicted killers. Violence occurs within institutional walls on a daily basis. None of that is going to stop unless we decide to execute all criminals.

As for escape, when was the last time you heard about a successful escape from a maximum security prison? It doesn't happen quite as often as you may think. So what you're basically saying is that we should kill the prisoner on the remote chance that he may escape? The statistics say that prison escapes have been steadily falling with the advent of new technologies.

And to your third point about "Charming a Judge" I'm a paralegal by profession, and there aren't any judges I know of that would be "charmed" by a convicted killer. A judge's responsibility is to follow the law. If the prosecutors don't perform their job legally, or leave loopholes you can drive a truck through, it's the fault of the system, not the perpetrator.

I notice you never addressed my question about the prisoner's families and the pain and anguish they must be feeling, to not only have to live with the fact that their loved one committed a heinous act, but they will lose their life because of it.

I just don't believe that the state is thinking clearly when it sends the message that killing is wrong, by killing people.

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